Arcane Anti-Necromancer

[Kerrin]

I've been pondering how to go about building an arcane character whose life mission is to rid the world of undead abominations and hunt down and kill anyone who creates undead creatures.

I originally started down the wizard/sorcerer path by checking out the necromancy spells themselves to see if any of them could be used to destroy undead creatures, but that doesn't look all that promising.

I know there's always the divine route, but I am interested in something arcane for this character.

Any suggestions on approaches to this character concept?

[Drachasor]

Hmm, Disintegrate?

That's not good for them in mass or for a bunch of levels though.

There's also Undeath to Death.

[Flickerdart]

Effigy Master, build an army of robots to combat the armies of undead?

[Drachasor]

Effigy Master, build an army of robots to combat the armies of undead?

Robots vs. Zombies is classy at least.

I'd propose having the DM let you make a Dread Necromancer variant that uses undead control rules and variants on the spells to make Golems at no XP cost; The Grand Constructor!

I bet coming up with a spell list would be pretty easy.

[Silva Stormrage]

Ironically command undead would work wonders here. Its a no save you die to mindless undead. Refluff it as a spell where the undead have to attack themselves for 1 day a level no save if they are mindless.

[Fouredged Sword]

See if you can convince your DM to let you reserch a Greater Disrupt undead and a Mass Greater Disrupt undead.

Base them on the Welm spell, except normal damage, fortitude for half, non-mind effecting, and only effecting undead.

- Pure DM creation area here, but it always bothered me that Necromancy had disrupt undead as a necromancy spell, but didn't make anything higher than a cantrap! It's like they forgot that they put anti undead spells in necromancy.

[Feytalist]

Straight-up damage tactics work well enough against undead as well. There's no reason to just be a crippling over-specialised undead hunter. Orb spells / fireball / whatever should do the trick nicely.

If you can shoehorn Turn Undead in somewhere that might work as well. Arcane disciple with Sun domain or something?

[poignant123]

What, no Sacred Exorcist? It's open to arcane classes and grants turn undead. It's not the best PrC for this but it's a start.

[Kerrin]

Effigy Master, build an army of robots to combat the armies of undead?
Command an army of constructs to defeat an army of undead constructs, oh the irony!


I'd propose having the DM let you make a Dread Necromancer variant that uses undead control rules and variants on the spells to make Golems at no XP cost...
Command an army of golems to defeat an army of undead constructs, oh the irony! (I'm seeing a pattern)


Ironically command undead would work wonders here.
Command Undead would definitely have its uses. I could command an undead creature to attack itself or another undead creature.


See if you can convince your DM to let you reserch a Greater Disrupt undead and a Mass Greater Disrupt undead. Base them on the Welm spell...

- Pure DM creation area here, but it always bothered me that Necromancy had disrupt undead as a necromancy spell, but didn't make anything higher than a cantrap! It's like they forgot that they put anti undead spells in necromancy.
I like the Welm spell variant idea.

I think Wizards of the Coast wanted to give all the anti-undead spells to the clerics so that's why they aren't in the wizard/sorcerer spell list.


What, no Sacred Exorcist?
I'll have to look up that one!


Thank you all for the advice so far!

[Eldariel]

Disintegrate is the classic Undead destruction spell. They have terrible Fort-saves, it dusts most of the pesky recurring types and overall, just so happens to be exceedingly efficient for the job. I suppose it could be chained or whatever. But it's particularly efficient for wiping out hard-to-kill and strong undead.

Undeath to Death isn't terrible either; ironically, I'm pretty sure you want access to Necromancy yourself. And yeah, I'd go just plain classic Wizard; they're plenty good at it.

[Kerrin]

Undeath to Death isn't terrible either; ironically, I'm pretty sure you want access to Necromancy yourself. And yeah, I'd go just plain classic Wizard; they're plenty good at it.
Yeah, that is a huge irony I wanted to intentionally build into the character ... using necromancy to fight necromancy (specifically undead). :smallbiggrin:

Though I'll definitely give the non-necromancy wizard spells a good poring over too.

[Pechvarry]

I think sor/wiz actually get a decent chunk of defense vs incorporeal spells. Looking at Libris Mortis, I see Ghost Touch Armor (self explanatory), a damage return spell vs incorporeal attacks, spell to strip away incorporeality, and a death attack vs incorporeal.

[HunterOfJello]

The Silver Pyromancer (Five Nations) is an arcane spellcaster PrC that's effective at taking out undead. The class requires the turn undead feature and uses it to do damage to undead. They add all of the paladin spells to their arcane spell list (unless they're a warmage type caster). All of their fire spells have caster level = character level. They can turn their fire spells into partial and eventually full sacred energy to avoid fire resistance and immunity. Finally, they can use a Smite ability through their spells that helps overcome SR and acts as if it was Empowered if its used against an evil enemy.

The PrC is specifically designed to be used against undead and not necromancers, but it is pretty cool.

[Eldariel]

Hm, Sacred Exorcist/Silver Pyromancer actually isn't all that bad. You get mini Disintegrates against Undead outta your turning (you cap out at 30d6; Sacred Exorcist increases your turning level and your arcane caster level) which, I suppose, isn't terrible. Though I suppose you need to be Charisma-based so this would work better on a Sorcerer-chassis.

Only problem with this is that Silver Pyromancer is sorta terrible; only helps your Fire-spells and loses a caster level. Persistent Fire...meh, +1d6 damage, epic. Turning it into divine damage is convenient, sure, but still you're casting damage spells. Smiting Spell is only a couple of times per day and still only a damage spell multiplier. Paladin spells are nice in theory but the list frankly doesn't contain too many spells useful for a dedicated caster as opposed to a gish.


But it would get you a pseudo-turning mechanic without dipping a divine class if that's your thing so it can be intriguing (Sacred Exorcist gains you turning and then you can take Silver Pyromancer; for purposes of the Purge Undead you count as a cleric of your effective turning level + your arcane casting level). If it stacked your arcane casting level for normal turning, I'd be sold; that'd make you an arcane turning machine. But as it stands, it only gives you a big nuke and costs you a caster level (all the really good anti-undead spells like Disintegrate, Force Manifest and company are rather high level so this hurts).

[Fouredged Sword]

An interesting take on a sorrceradin though? Doesn't paladin get turn undead? Mix with fireball/orb of fire/scorching ray for direct damage goodness. It really helps the workablility of a direct damage spellcaster to resist damage immunity.

[Eldariel]

An interesting take on a sorrceradin though? Doesn't paladin get turn undead?

Only on level 4, and at Level-3. There's also no way to stack it with Sorcerer levels making it rather useless.

[Psyren]

Exalted Arcanist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031004b) (BoED) is another good one - it adds all Sanctified spells to your spells known, including goodies like Luminous Armor, Constricting Chains, Celestial Aspect and Curtain of Light. It also gives you even more undead-fighting spells to choose from beyond the sorcerer list, such as Bolt of Glory, Consecrate, Hallow, Holy Word/Smite/Aura, and the Planar Ally line.

[Pechvarry]

They add all of the paladin spells to their arcane spell list (unless they're a warmage type caster). All of their fire spells have caster level = character level.

Apologies for being off-topic, but that bothered me the moment I read it. It would've been an awesome Warmage PrC, but they had to call out the class specifically to break it. So the Warmages have no choice but to go back to spontaneously casting all cleric spells ever in the history of the universe.

[Fizban]

Exalted Arcanist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031004b) (BoED) is another good one - it adds all Sanctified spells to your spells known, including goodies like Luminous Armor, Constricting Chains, Celestial Aspect and Curtain of Light. It also gives you even more undead-fighting spells to choose from beyond the sorcerer list, such as Bolt of Glory, Consecrate, Hallow, Holy Word/Smite/Aura, and the Planar Ally line.

It doesn't help against undead, but as a bonus you can then apply Purify Spell to Bolt of Glory and deal 3d6/level against evil outsiders (since you already have Purify if you entered Exalted Arcanist).

Other spells in the Spell Compendium include Greater Disrupt Undead (which can chain if you kill the first target), Life Bolt (use like you would Scorching Ray, but undead only and with full medium range), and Incorporeal Nova (basically Circle of Death without the material component, but only against incorporeal stuff).

The Holy Scourge Prc from Complete Mage gives you a little extra damage on all your spells against evil creatures and a smite, but it loses a caster level and is basically not worth it at all. While the other necromancy esotericas only boost undead, the 7th level one for Master Specialist gives you immunity to ability damage, drain, energy drain, and negative levels in general. Pretty dang good thing to have when fighting undead. Back to BoED, Celestial Mystic is hard to get into, but gives you a nice set of immunities and damage reduction, and caps out with an aura that repels undead of 10HD or less (protecting you from Shadow swarms for example).

[Jayh]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=212484&page=2 Im trying to build a wizard killer here - you might get some ideas for your necro killer

[Kerrin]

Wow! Thank you all for the many and varied suggestions! You all rock. :smallsmile: