Jedi Arena 3.5 PvP One-shot (AKA: Wow, that's a lot of jargon for a thread title.)

[TroubleBrewing]

Thank you, Shneeky, for giving me the motivation to get off my butt and do this thing.

I'm running a 3.5 arena-style PvP game for a friend's birthday in a couple of weeks, and I told him that as I've got the most book knowledge/access to material/experience/system mastery out of our group that I'd make a list of characters for everyone to choose from for this game.

As stated in the title, the theme is going to be "Jedi Arena", and he specifically requested a PvP focus.

I'm making a list of ten builds, which I will either a) write backstories for or b) request that the immensely talented Playground provide at a later date (or now, if you like).

I have several kinks to work out thusfar, and they are as follows:

1) Level. I'm thinking around 7, mainly because I don't want it to turn into a grind because players have TONS of health, and I also don't want it to be a game of rocket tag.

2) Balance. I'm shooting for Tier 3 with the builds, because it's a great "feel useful and have interesting abilities, while not being able to tear the Earth asunder" point. Also it's the region with the most classes on the Tier list (not including Tier 5. Ugh. :smallannoyed:)

3) Variety. Shneeky, in one of his many, many brilliant moments, posted this in the thread that inspired me:
Psy-War is a *MUCH* better Jedi class. They can do everything a Jedi can without having to leave their own little list of powers known.

Swordsage is also very jedi-ish. For that matter, Incarnate can look a lot like a Jedi, with the right binds.

Having said that, Soulborn do get a couple of things that are vaguely jedi-like...

Crystal Helm: bind it for Force damage.

Impulse Boots: Go ahead, TRY hitting him for area-effect stuff.

Lucky Dice: Trust in the Force

Bluesteel Bracers: Yes, I *AM* going first. Also, more damage per swing.

Silvertongue Mask: Jedi mind Trick

Wind Cloak: Deflect Projectiles? Check.

Necrocarnum [anything]: I find your lack of faith... disturbing.

Mind you, an Incarnate does all these melds earlier, better, with more essentia to play around with... but a soulborn *CAN* somewhat mimic some of the abilities of the Jedi.

I'm looking for ten different builds, with totally different powers and abilities, and this is an excellent start. Re-fluff is 100% going to happen, because I have to turn all of this D&D fluff into STAR WARS FLUFF (so excited. Feel free to chip in.) Not every Jedi needs a lightsaber, some might be entirely Force-based. (Beguiler would be a good one here...)

As a departure from my usual policy of "no homebrew, ever, no exceptions", I'm looking into allowing homebrew classes for this challenge, if only because of the class in the list below. If there are other 'brewed classes that work well as Jedi-ish types, could someone point me in their direction? I've a dreadful lack of experience with homebrew, and as I said, balance is important for this one because the players will be choosing their characters from a list. I'd rather not have one of the characters be Batman while the others get to play Aquaman, if you catch my drift.

Just as a jumping-off point, here are the classes I've had in mind so far for potential Jedi candidates:

Swordsage
Crusader
Warblade
Psychic Warrior
Beguiler
Duskblade
Person Man's War Soul (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156441)
Maaayyybe Totemist.

4) Weapons. I want each 'Jedi' to have his/her own distinct lightsaber. Think the "weapon crystals" from Force Unleashed. With all of the enhancements from the MiC at my disposal, and all of the refluffing in the world available to me, this should not be challenging.

5) Gotta have at least one Warforged Jedi, because it always bothered me that droids can't be Jedi in Saga edition. (If we can find a way to make a Wookie [re-fluffed Half-Giant? Goliath? Probably Goliath, Wookies don't seem especially Force-sensitive], that would be awesome.]

6) I'm hoping to make at least one Jedi focused around each ability score, just for variety's sake. If this doesn't happen, meh.

The arena will be a 200ft-wide circle with a slight hill in the center, and a few areas of fallen pillars and other debris for cover. There will be creatures released into the arena once every ten rounds, and the creatures actions will mostly be "attack the closest player". I'm probably just going to be using re-fluffed Animals and Vermin for this bit. The players will have to make temporary alliances to prevent the critters from killing them, but they also have to be the last man standing.

If there is anything I've missed or been unclear about, just let me know.

[Sarco_Phage]

5) Gotta have at least one Warforged Jedi, because it always bothered me that droids can't be Jedi in Saga edition. (If we can find a way to make a Wookie [re-fluffed Half-Giant? Goliath? Probably Goliath, Wookies don't seem especially Force-sensitive], that would be awesome.]

There are several Wookie Jedi, though, and if I recall correctly, Zuckuss' amoral bounty hunting partner 4-LOM was a force sensitive.

Also posting to watch the development of these builds, seems cool.

[TroubleBrewing]

That reminds me:

Purely in the interest of preventing arguments that are not conducive to the thread goal, none of the builds, items, powers, races, or fluff has to be "correct" in terms of Star Wars canon. I'm only interested in thematic and fluff elements, not specific source material correctness.

On any other thread dedicated to the purpose, I'll happily join in any kind of Star Wars factoid donnybrook. Not in this thread. :smalltongue:

[DeAnno]

This is sort of a goofy idea, but maybe choose an appropriately CRed Star Wars alien-ish monster as one of the characters? If you do level 8, you could have one of them just be a Mind Flayer :smallwink:

[Gwendol]

I'd give the Wookie reach.

Also, do the lightsabres strike against AC or touch AC?

[Sarco_Phage]

I'd give the Wookie reach.

Also, do the lightsabres strike against AC or touch AC?

That's a good question, true. Are you using them like Brilliant Energy enchanted weapons, except capable of harming undead and constructs?

[TroubleBrewing]

That's a good question, true. Are you using them like Brilliant Energy enchanted weapons, except capable of harming undead and constructs?

I was thinking just re-fluffed magic weapons. Probably not brilliant energy, seeing as that's a +4 bonus, and the party is only level 7-ish.

I'm not looking to re-create star wars. I'm looking to re-fluff.

Wookie as Half-Ogre instead of Goliath, then?

[Gwendol]

Low INT, normal WIS? Why not just give the goliath reach? You can take away all the high altitude adaptation nonsense to compensate.

I was more thinking along the lines of the Flame Blade spell.

[TroubleBrewing]

Low INT, normal WIS? Why not just give the goliath reach? You can take away all the high altitude adaptation nonsense to compensate.

Again, not really looking to do any mechanical changes. I like the Half-Ogre suggestion, and it seems like it'd be worth +2 LA to me.



I was more thinking along the lines of the Flame Blade spell.

For what, the lightsabers? Not a bad idea for one of the builds.

[Gwendol]

:-) To me, a druid wielding a Flame Blade is sooooooo Ol' Ben Kenobi

[TroubleBrewing]

Hm... Trade out Wild Shape and the Animal Companion... I'm not sure if it balances out at Tier 3, which is kind of where I want it. Is it Druid-only, or is there another way to get that spell?

[Cespenar]

Psion (Kineticist) 7 can imitate a Force user pretty accurately, in my opinion. Throw in Earth's Embrace for lulz' sake and you can grapple anyone in range using Telekinesis and inflict your unarmed + 1d12 damage every round you maintain a pin.

[Gwendol]

Cast it in a hilt for an X/day effect?

[TroubleBrewing]

If I'm trying to dial back the crazy a bit, would going Wilder 7 instead be better for balance? Like I said, I'm looking for Tier 3 as a balance point... Is Psion (Kinetecist) 7 something that 'plays nice' with Tier 3?'


Cast it in a hilt for an X/day effect?

... Artificer Jedi? I like this line of thinking.

[Cespenar]

Blasters are usually weak choices for their level/class unless they're specifically optimized for it, so I don't think you'll have much trouble with a Kineticist.

And Wilder gets 4th level powers one level after Psion, so you'd need Wilder 8 to have Telekinesis.

[Retech]

Pathfinder has a lot of interesting material, such as the new magus class. (Gish in a can basically)

It's conducive to many different kinds of builds, like a "Yoda" build or one of the more aggressive ones in the form of dex-based magus and str-based magus.

The dex-based magus would take dervish dance to get dex to hit and damage for a scimitar (which could be refluffed). The cool thing about this is that a magus can make a full round attack that involves hitting with one hand and casting a spell with another hand. So this "Yoda" character could be buffing with shield and jump enchantments, to leap above the opponent. Combine with the mocking dance feat + death from above, allowing Yoda to leap into battle on a charge with a huge attack bonus (though generally low damage in comparison), strike, then leap away before the opponent's next turn. This works well with the new feats in Psionics unleashed like sidestep charge, which gives +4 bonus to AC against charges and allows an AoO against the charger.

Alternatively, Yoda could come in and unleash spell combat in a buncha full attacks, dealing more damage but at the cost of AC (which is like when Yoda goes flipping mad and starts jumping and swinging around, as part of the Ataru style).

Strength-based magus would probably be more like a traditional melee combatant, except in the mean time, it has the ability to cast third level spells, which could be used as force effects. (Reach shocking grasp or lightning bolt, anyone?)

I tested both of these out and they are roughly equal. On the plus side also, these builds make combat last longer (five to eight rounds), but there isn't the annoyance of rolling hundreds of d6s and such.

[TroubleBrewing]

Pathfinder has a lot of interesting material

Euuugghh... I'm just not a pathfinder fan. I can't explain it, I just have this aversion to the material. I'm trying to stick to 3.5 with some homebrew (but I'd like to keep even that to a minimum).


Blasters are usually weak choices for their level/class unless they're specifically optimized for it, so I don't think you'll have much trouble with a Kineticist.

I'm building them, so I'll avoid the craziest stuff for blasters. Seems good then. Got one locked down!

EDIT: In the interest of disclosure, our first fighter is a Jawa Force-user! (He's a Gnome Psion (Kinetecist) 7.) No lightsaber to speak of, but his power selection is as follows:

1st

Force Screen
Inertial Armor
Mind Thrust
Defensive Precognition
Vigor

2nd

Energy Missle
Energy Push
Levitate, Psionic
Ego Whip

3rd

Body Adjustment
Energy Bolt
Energy Cone
Eradicate Invisibility

4th

Telekinetic Maneuver
Energy Ball

If anybody wants to write up a backstory on this little bugger while I'm sleeping (it's 8AM where I am, and frankly, being up this late suuuuucks), I wouldn't be opposed. G'night, and I'll check back with you in the morning!

[Zonugal]

Grey McBannert, two questions:

1. Would you allow, through magic/psionic transparency, Human Paragon to progress psionics instead of magic for it's 2nd & 3rd level?

2. Are you searching for only Jedi or can we throw in some dark Jedi/Sith?

[Z3ro]

Expanding on an idea you've already presented:

Totemist could actually make a very good tribal or primitive jedi (think Dathomir witches or Shak-Ti in force unleashed). You can take shape soulmeld (incarnate weapon) for your lightsaber, then other soulmelds to taste. There are plenty of melds that allow for things like big bonuses to jump, hide, move silently checks.

[Talentless]

5) Gotta have at least one Warforged Jedi, because it always bothered me that droids can't be Jedi in Saga edition. (If we can find a way to make a Wookie [re-fluffed Half-Giant? Goliath? Probably Goliath, Wookies don't seem especially Force-sensitive], that would be awesome.]


I hate to be that one guy.:smallfrown: But I'll say it anyway. Wookies can't be Jedi. George Lucas came out and retconned them into unable to be force sensitive. And droids aren't "alive", therefore, no force sensitivity ever.

That said, if you're going for a Star Wars feel without being Star Wars, you can safely ignore that little issue.

As for the rest of it, how are you going to handle HP and lightsabres? Because technically speaking, a lightsabre hit is either an instant kill or limb removal. Which doesn't really work with the HP system, and makes it rocket tag that you want to avoid.

[Kaje]

Since you're open to homebrew, the Esper Knight (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169532) is a fantastic homebrew Jedi class that uses incarnum without soulmelds to create Jedi powers.

[Zonugal]

As for the rest of it, how are you going to handle HP and lightsabres? Because technically speaking, a lightsabre hit is either an instant kill or limb removal. Which doesn't really work with the HP system, and makes it rocket tag that you want to avoid.

HP can always represent fatigue or minor wounds from a fight. Just watch the battle between Obi Wan and Anakin. None of them, until the end, gets hit by a lightsabre but they sure do get hurt/tired.

[Olo Demonsbane]

We have two Jedi-fluffed characters in our current campaign.

One is a Azurin Psion 5//Incarnate 1/Duskblade 3/Warblade 1; uses Twinned Synchronicity to get two standard actions that can be used to interrupt enemies actions/swat missiles out of the air/take total defense actions. Has a Psicrystal that can cast Vigor at ML 5, and uses share pain combo. A deep crystal greatsword provides a lightsaber equivilent. Channels Hostile Empathic Transfer when he's low on hp.

The other is a Human Warlock 3/Hellfire Warlock 3//Ghost Progression 1/Warblade 5. Uses early entry to get into Hellfire Warlock early. Eldritch Glaive dealing 8d6 damage is his lightsaber. A ghostly Sith.

Hope one or both of those gave you some ideas.

[TroubleBrewing]

Thanks for the great contributions! Here's my responses!


I hate to be that one guy.:smallfrown: But I'll say it anyway. Wookies can't be Jedi.

Don't care. Here's my second post in this thread: "Purely in the interest of preventing arguments that are not conducive to the thread goal, none of the builds, items, powers, races, or fluff has to be "correct" in terms of Star Wars canon. I'm only interested in thematic and fluff elements, not specific source material correctness. "


George Lucas came out and retconned them into unable to be force sensitive.

REALLY don't care about this. Lucas has pretty much ruined the franchise as far as I'm concerned, so anything he's said on the subject since... roughly 1983, I've ignored.


And droids aren't "alive", therefore, no force sensitivity ever.

Again... Don't care. See my above quote. I appreciate the interest in keeping things all "official" and whatnot, but as I've said, I'm not interested in this for my purposes.



As for the rest of it, how are you going to handle HP and lightsabres? Because technically speaking, a lightsabre hit is either an instant kill or limb removal. Which doesn't really work with the HP system, and makes it rocket tag that you want to avoid.

I'm going for sort of an Assassin's Creed thing, where even when you fail to deflect a blow with the controller, Altair still just barely puts up his weapon. HP is going to a combination of luck, bare avoidance, and proper health. When you die, you finally take that one final thrust to the heart/head/torso/whatever.

I don't mean to sound hostile, I'm just trying to avoid this line of thinking. All I'm doing is re-fluff, and deliberately ignoring canon in several instances. Outside of that, not relevant to my interests.


Grey McBannert, two questions:

1. Would you allow, through magic/psionic transparency, Human Paragon to progress psionics instead of magic for it's 2nd & 3rd level?

2. Are you searching for only Jedi or can we throw in some dark Jedi/Sith?

1: Oh, totally. I'm 100% for transparency, and for the purposes of re-fluffing, it's all "the Force" anyways. Different access methods for different people is all.

2: I just realized that everywhere I used the word "Jedi" I really meant "Force user". Alignment is subjective; I want there to be a few characters of every stripe. The Jawa presented above is most likely an evil little bugger.


Since you're open to homebrew, the Esper Knight (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169532) is a fantastic homebrew Jedi class that uses incarnum without soulmelds to create Jedi powers.

I'll take a look. Thanks for the link!


Expanding on an idea you've already presented: *Totemist stuff*

Thanks so much for this. I really wanted to include Totemist in the list of builds, but I couldn't think of a way to do it. This is an excellent suggestion!

@ Olo Demonsbane: Sadly, I can't stand gestalt. Interesting idea with the Eldritch Glaive, though. Is it viable at level 7? I'm only passingly familiar with Warlock stuff.

[Greenish]

Hm... Trade out Wild Shape and the Animal Companion... I'm not sure if it balances out at Tier 3, which is kind of where I want it. Is it Druid-only, or is there another way to get that spell?Spirit Shaman could get it.


Question: Shouldn't lightsabres be rods? I mean, press a button, blade swooshes on, treat as a +X (sword of choice), ignores hardness below 20 and all material-based DR.

[TroubleBrewing]

Question: Shouldn't lightsabres be rods? I mean, press a button, blade swooshes on, treat as a +X (sword of choice), ignores hardness below 20 and all material-based DR.

Not a bad idea for a proper 3.5 D&D Star Wars game, but I think just re-fluffing lightsabers as weapons with different enhancement* types will be easier and work just as well. Like I said, I want next to no mechanical changes, and I'm working purely from a re-fluffing standpoint. I cannot make that clear enough. It's less work for me, and I think my players will appreciate this more. Plus, I can show off the fact that 3.5 can be re-fluffed into ANYTHING.

*Different enhancements depending on the individual style of the Force user wielding it. +1 Longsword of Shock reflects that the user channels small amounts of Force lightning into each blow, while a +1 Vicious Longsword is one that the user "turns up to 11", and it's unstable so it deals a small amount of backlash to the user.

EDIT: Update on total progress. I bounced ideas around with a friend of mine who will not be involved in the game, and here's what we came up with so far:

1) Duskblade: Force-user who focuses on amplifying lightsaber strikes with Force energy.

2) Psion: Pure Force user. No lightsaber at all. FINISHED.

3) Psychic Warrior: Vanilla Jedi.

4) Half-Ogre Warblade: Wookie Jedi with little Force access, but immense lightsaber proficiency.

5) Dvati Swordsage/Crusader: Re-fluffed as a Jedi couple who are linked on a deeper-than-romantic level (i.e. not twins. Ew.) Based off of a Star Wars short film script we wrote in college. One tanks while the other skirmishes. This choice is included to give the players the choice of a tactical team as opposed to an individual.

6) War Soul. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156441) Seems cool. I've yet to do a balance audit on this class. Can anyone provide an opinion on power level for this one? I'm always a little leery of homebrew for this reason...

7) Esper Knight (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169532) was suggested to me. Same goes for this one as went for the War Soul.

8) Totemist: Z3ro had an excellent suggestion with regards to a feral Force user. I think I'll take him up on that suggestion!

9) Beguiler: A Force user much like Obi Wan from A New Hope: He barely ever uses any obvious Force powers, demonstrates "invisibility", Jedi mind tricks, and is a fairly skilled negotiator. Stealth Jedi, if you will.

10) Warforged Warlock with Eldritch Glaive, as suggested by Olo Demonsbane. Droid that has embedded lightsaber. Some Force capability, but as it's on a Warlock chassis, likely limited utility.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Build ideas:

Darth Disedea: Warlock6/Binder1. He's dedicated himself to various physical manipulations of the force, although he's also started the process of learning how to manipulate minds as well.

Abilities:
Eldritch Force Blast. While perhaps not as deadly as the Force Lighting which the Emperor had access to, he's also still growing.

Detect Magic Force. He can sense when another magic force user is around.

Eldritch Glaive Lightsabre. Fairly painful, touch attack, no immunities known other than SR.

Beguiling Influence Jedi Mind Trick.

Binding Nabereous also affects the Jedi Mind Trick. By being able to Take 10 on social skills, which he gets enormous bonuses on, he can quite easily convince most people of just about anything he wants to. Yanno, in addition to setting himself up to take levels in hellfire warlock Sith Master.

Entropic Warding Jedi Blurred Movement. He has a 20% miss chance chance of deflecting any projectile shot at him.

Hellrime Blast Force Lighting. Not only does it do damage, it also makes it harder to move around as easily. After all, if you want to be a hellfire warlock sith master, you gotta learn it, yo.


Chausible of Fell Power is refluffed as an amulet with a lightsabre crystal which helps him focus and augment his Force powers (increasing damage by 1d6).

[TroubleBrewing]

I like it. This build relies a bit on Charisma. Is it still possible to make this one a Warforged?

I feel that it is necessary to point out that these characters have no hope or opportunity for advancement, as after this one-shot, all but one of them will be dead. :smalltongue:

[Zonugal]

I feel that it is necessary to point out that these characters have no hope or opportunity for advancement, as after this one-shot, all but one of them will be dead. :smalltongue:

Don't worry. If they should strike me down, I shall become more powerful than they could possibly imagine.

[Keithicus]

I feel that it is necessary to point out that these characters have no hope or opportunity for advancement, as after this one-shot, all but one of them will be dead. :smalltongue:

Why not kill off the winner? Have him fight Darth Vader or some other appropriate Force-User they would recognize and probably enjoy trying to fight or run away from (especially since this is a one-shot they probably don't care too much about actually surviving... more about "I won because I lived longest")

Anyway, I was going to suggest Duskblade as well, could be a dark jedi of some sort since Blade of Blood (refluffed to be force related of course) sounds more on the evil side "I'm going to drain my own health just to hurt you more"

[Kaje]

I hate to be that one guy.:smallfrown: But I'll say it anyway. Wookies can't be Jedi. George Lucas came out and retconned them into unable to be force sensitive.No, what George Lucas did was say there couldn't be any Wookiee Jedi in Revenge of the Sith, as then it wouldn't make sense why Yoda was sent to Kashyyyk instead of one of them. It was Leland Chee who decided to go crazynuts and sideline the existing Wookiee Jedi and ban future ones.


And droids aren't "alive", therefore, no force sensitivity ever.Tell that to Skippy.

[Zonugal]

Alright, so here are three builds I put together between yesterday & today. They each represent different archetypes or characters as portrayed in Star Wars.

Basic Jedi: Human Male Human Paragon 1/Ardent 2/Human Paragon 2/Ardent 1/Warblade 1; CR 7; Medium Humanoid (human); HD 3d8+6, 3d6+6, 1d12+2; hp 52; Init +1; Spd 30 ft. (20 ft. in armor); AC 16 (10 +5 armor +1 dex), touch 11, flat-footed 15; Base Atk +5; Grp +7; Atk +8 melee (1d10+4+1d4 sonic/19-20x2, lightsaber); SQ Adaptive Learning (Iaijutsu focus), Psionic Mantle (Knowledge, Guardian & Destruction), Battle Clarity (reflex saves), Weapon Aptitude; AL LG; SV Fort +6, Ref +3, Will +9; Str 14, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 16, Cha 10.
Skills, Skill Tricks and Feats: Concentration +12 (10 ranks +2 con), Diplomacy +8 (8 ranks +0 cha), Iaijutsu Focus +14 (10 ranks +0 cha +4 insight bonus), Knowledge (Local) +12 (10 ranks +2 int), Knowledge (Nature) +10 (8 ranks +2 int), Psicraft +11 (9 ranks +2 int), Read/Write/Speak (Common, Draconic, Undercommon) and Tumble +4 (7 ranks +1 dex –4 ACP); Collector of Stories; Combat Expertise, Fearless, Martial Weapon Proficiency (Short Sword), Knowledge Devotion, Stand Still and Steady Concentration.
Powers (ML 5; 32 power points/day): Defensive Precognition, Detect Hostile Intent, Mindlink, Psionic Suggestion, Read Thoughts and Vigor.
Maneuvers (IL 4; 3 readied): Action Before Thought, Moment of Perfect Mind, Mountain Hammer and Stance of Clarity.
Variants: Substitute Powers [Mind’s Eye]
Powers
Mind link: You forge a limited mental bond with another creature.
Defensive Precognition: Gain +1 insight bonus to AC and saving throws.
Vigor: Gain 5 temporary hit points.
Psionic Suggestion: Compels subject to follow stated course of action.
Read Thoughts: Detect surface thoughts of creatures in range.
Detect Hostile Intent: You can detect hostile creatures within 30ft. of you.
Maneuvers
Stance of Clarity: [Stance] Gain +2 AC against one foe, -2 against all others.
Moment of Perfect Mind: [Counter] Use Concentration check in place of Will save.
Action Before Thought: [Counter] Use Concentration check in place of Reflex save.
Mountain Hammer: [Strike] Deal +2d6 damage, overcome DR and Hardness.
Equipment: Lightsaber and Breastplate

Ancient Jedi: Male Venerable Kobold Ardent 4/Swordsage 1/Ardent 1/Swordsage 1; CR 7; Small Venerable Dragon (reptilian); HD 5d6+0, 2d8+0 ; hp 93; Init +5; Spd 15 ft.; AC 24 (10 +4 inertial armor +4 dex +1 natural armor +1 size bonus +4 wis), touch 19, flat-footed 16; Base Atk +4; Grp -2; Atk +7 melee ((1d8+5+1d4 sonic/19-20x2, lightsaber); SQ Darkvision (60ft.), Light Sensitivity, Slight Build, Psionic Mantles (Knowledge, Guardian & Destruction), Quick to Act (+1), AC bonus; AL LG; SV Fort +1, Ref +8, Will +11; Str 6, Dex 18, Con 10, Int 18, Wis 18, Cha 12.
Skills, Skill Tricks and Feats: Concentration +10 (10 ranks +0 con), Diplomacy +6 (5 ranks +1 cha), Hide +15 (3 ranks +4 dex +8 racial bonus), Knowledge (Arcana) +8 (4 ranks +4 int), Knowledge (Local) +14 (10 ranks +4 int), Knowledge (Nature) +14 (10 ranks +4 int), Knowledge (Religion) +8 (4 ranks +4 int), Psicraft +13 (9 ranks +4 int), Read/Write/Speak (Common, Draconic, Undercommon), Ride +5 (1 ranks +4 dex) and Sense Motive +14 (10 ranks +4 wis); Collector of Stories; Dragonwrought, Epic Toughness (x2), Improved Unarmed Strike, Shadow Blade, Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus (Setting Sun weapons).
Traits and Flaws: Frail, Slow
Powers (ML 5; 35 power points/day): Clairvoyant Sense, Empathy, Inertial Armor, Psionic Suggestion, Read Thoughts and Vigor.
Maneuvers (IL 4.5; 4 readied): Action Before Thought, Child of Shadow, Counter Charge, Drain Vitality, Emerald Razor, Moment of Perfect Mind, Mountain Hammer, Shadow Jaunt and Step of the Wind.
Variants: Substitute Powers (Mind’s Eye) and Unarmed Swordsage (Tome of Battle).
Powers
Empathy: You know the subject's surface emotions.
Inertial Armor: Tangible field of force provides you with +4 armor bonus to AC.
Vigor: Gain 5 temporary hit points.
Psionic Suggestion: Compels subject to follow stated course of action.
Read Thoughts: Detect surface thoughts of creatures in range.
Clairvoyant Sense: See and hear a distant location.
Maneuvers
Moment of Perfect Mind: [Counter] Use Concentration check in place of Will save.
Action Before Thought: [Counter] Use Concentration check in place of Reflex save.
Mountain Hammer: [Strike] Deal +2d6 damage, overcome DR and Hardness.
Child of Shadow: [Stance] You gain concealment as long as you move.
Emerald Razor: [Strike] Turn melee strike into touch attack.
Shadow Jaunt: Teleport 50 ft. through shadows as a standard action.
Drain Vitality: [Strike] Attack deals 2 points of Constitution damage.
Step of the Wind: [Stance] Ignore difficult terrain, gain bonus against foes in such terrain.
Counter Charge: [Counter] Ruin charge attack, force charging foe to move away from you.
Equipment: Lightsaber

Basic Sith: Human Male Human Paragon 1/Ardent 1/Human Paragon 2/Ardent 2/Thrallherd 1; CR 7; Medium Humanoid (human); HD 3d8+3, 3d6+3, 1d4+1; hp 40; Init +1; Spd 30 ft.; AC 11 (10 +1 dex), touch 11, flat-footed 10; Base Atk +4; Grp +5; Atk +6 melee (1d10+2+1d4 sonic/19-20x2, lightsaber); SQ Adaptive Learning (Iaijutsu focus), Psionic Mantle (Knowledge, Death & Destruction), Thralls (1 6th-level cohort and 5 1st-level followers); AL LE; SV Fort +3, Ref +3, Will +11; Str 12, Dex 12, Con 12, Int 14, Wis 16, Cha 14.
Skills, Skill Tricks and Feats: Concentration +11 (10 ranks +1 con), Bluff +9 (7 ranks +2 cha), Diplomacy +13 (7 ranks +2 cha +4 synergy), Iaijitsu Focus +12 (10 ranks +2 cha), Knowledge (Local) +12 (10 ranks +2 int), Psicraft +12 (10 ranks +2 int), Read/Write/Speak (Common, Undercommon and Infernal) and Sense Motive +9 (6 ranks +3 wis); Collector of Stories; Able Learner, Hardened Criminal (Diplomacy), Inquisitor, Martial Weapon Proficiency (Short Sword) and Knowledge Devotion.
Powers (ML 5; 32 power points/day): Crisis of Breath, Defensive Precognition, Mind Link, Psionic Suggestion, Read Thoughts and Vigor
Variants: Customize Powers (Mind’s Eye)
Powers
Mind link: You forge a limited mental bond with another creature.
Defensive Precognition: Gain +1 insight bonus to AC and saving throws.
Vigor: Gain 5 temporary hit points.
Psionic Suggestion: Compels subject to follow stated course of action.
Read Thoughts: Detect surface thoughts of creatures in range.
Crisis of Breath: Disrupt subject's breathing.
Equipment: Lightsaber

The Mantles

Knowledge Mantle (The Force)
Granted Power: While psionically focused, you can make Knowledge checks as if trained. You can expend your psionic focus to gain a +5 bonus on one Knowledge check.
1. Detect Psionics (1): You detect the presence of psionics.
2. Mindlink (1): You forge a limited mental bond with another creature.
3. Vigor (1): Gain 5 temporary hit points.
4. Clairvoyant Sense (2): See and hear a distant location.
5. Psionic Suggestion (2): Compels subject to follow stated course of action.
6. Read Thoughts (2): Detect surface thoughts of creatures in range.
7. Telekinetic Maneuver (4): Telekinetically bull rush, disarm, grapple, or trip your target.
8. Psionic Divination (4): Provides useful advice for specific proposed action.
9. Correspond (4): Hold mental conversation with another creature at any distance.
10. Remote Viewing (4): See, hear, and potentially interact with subjects at a distance.

Justice Mantle (The Light Side)
Granted Power: You can expend your psionic focus as an immediate action to make an attack of opportunity against a foe that attacks one of your allies.
1.Empathy (1): You know the subject's surface emotions.
2.Bestow Power (2): Subject receives 2 power points.
3.Empathic Transfer (2): Transfer another's wounds to yourself.
4.Sustenance (2): You can go without food and water for one day
5.Serenity (2): Pacify a creature and stop it from fighting.
6.Restore Extremity (5): Return a lost digit, limb, or other appendage to subject.
7.Psionic Restoration (5): Restores level and ability score drains.
8.Psionic Revivify (5): Return the dead to life before the psyche leaves the corpse.
9.Suspend Life (6): Put yourself in a state akin to suspended animation.
10.True Metabolism (8): You regenerate 10 hit points/round.

Destruction Mantle (Battle)
Granted Power: You have the Improved Sunder feat as long as you are psionically focused. If you expend your focus as part of a sunder attempt, the hardness of the object you are sundering is treated as 4 less.
1.Inertial Armor (1): Tangible field of force provides you with +4 armor bonus to AC.
2.Force Screen (1): Invisible disk provides +4 shield bonus to AC.
3.Defensive Precognition (1): Gain +1 insight bonus to AC and saving throws.
4.Detect Hostile Intent (2): You can detect hostile creatures within 30ft. of you.
5.Hustle (3): Instantly gain a move action.
6.Psychic Containment (3): Temporarily disallow the use of psionics for a single creature.
7.Touchsight (3): Your telekinetic field tells you where everything is.
8.Schism (4): Your partitioned mind can manifest lower-level powers.
9.Energy Adaptation (4): Your body converts energy to harmless light.
10.Psychic Crush (5): Brutally crush subject's mental essence, reducing subject to -1 hit points.

Death Mantle (The Dark Side)
Granted Power: You can expend your psionic focus to kill a dying creature, as the death knell spell.
1. Brian lock (2): Subject cannot move or take any mental actions.
2. Crisis of Breath (3): Disrupt subject's breathing
3. Death Urge (4): Implant a self-destructive compulsion.
4. Mindwipe (4): Subject's recent experiences wiped away, bestowing negative levels.
5. Energy Current (5): Deal 9d6 damage to one foe and half to another foe as long as you concentrate.
6. Crisis of Life (7): Stop subject's heart.
7. Insanity (7): Subject is permanently confused.
8. Mind Seed (8): Subject slowly becomes you.
9. Bend Reality (8): Alters reality within power limits.

The Lightsaber

Basic Model Lightsaber ($11,350 gp or $2,769 with a dedicated Lightsaber crafter)
Sunsword with the Sonic, Focus and Deflecting enchantments with a Lesser Crystal of Return coupled with a Glove of the Master Strategist.
A +1, Masterwork Bastard Sword (treated as a Short Sword whenever advantageous) which does a extra 1d4 points of sonic damage on a successful hit and bestows a +4 insight bonus to the wielder's Iaijutsu focus checks while carrying the weapon, even if the weapon is sheathed. The lightsaber may be drawn as a free action and you may call it to your hand from 30ft away as a move action. In addition you can try to knock projectiles aimed at you out of the air. Once per round when you would normally be hit by a ranged weapon, you may make a DC 20 Reflex saving throw (if the ranged weapon has a magical enhancement bonus, the DC increases by that amount). If you succeed, the ranged weapon or projectile deflects away harmlessly. You must be aware of the attack and not flat-footed. Intrinsically connected to the Lightsaber is the mystical handling glove which allows you to store and retrieve held items into the glove as free actions as well as activate True Strike 1/day.

With a dedicated lightsaber crafter we can knock that price from $11,350 to
$2,769 by using the Extraordinary Artisan, Magical Artisan (Craft Arms & Armor), Apprentice (Craftsman) and Blazing Forge planar touchstone feats in addition to restricting it to only those with a rank in Knowledge (Religion) and those of the Ardent Class (I'm just selecting for all practical intentions).

$7,750 gp / 50% (3,875 gp) = 3,875 gp / 30% (1,162 gp) = 2, 713 gp / 25% (678 gp) = 2,035 gp / 25% (508 gp) = 1,527 gp / 10% (152 gp) = 1,375 gp / 10% (137 gp) = 1,238 gp

$3,600 gp / 30% (1,080 gp) = 2,520 gp / 25% (630 gp) = 1,890 gp /10% (189 gp) = 1,701 gp /10% (170 gp) = 1,531 gp

Eh?

[TroubleBrewing]

Wow, those are INCREDIBLE. Really well done. Thanks so much for contributing to my cause! :smallsmile:

[TroubleBrewing]

Got a couple of builds finished, and I figured I'd post them here for perusal.

NOTE: I'm building these characters in the way of the Soviet Union: Quick, cheap, and clunky. They're meant for arena use. They've each got two or three pieces of equipment that adds up to close to 27k, average HP, some skills that might come in handy, and that's about it. They're not meant to be clean and streamlined.

Wookie Jedi (http://pifro.com/pro/view.php?id=7206): Goliath Barbarian 2/Warblade 5. Walks the line between the Dark and Light side. Rages out much like Mace Windu.

Jawa Sith (http://pifro.com/pro/view.php?id=7185): Gnome Psion 8. Pure blaster, no lightsaber at all. Power summary provided at the bottom of the sheet.

Human Jedi (http://pifro.com/pro/view.php?id=7207): Human Duskblade 8. Specialized in shield use.

Human Sith (http://pifro.com/pro/view.php?id=7208): Dvati Swordsage 6/Rogue 1. Two Swordsages, working as a team. TWF Kukris, very Shadow Hand focused.