[3.5] Level 5 Wizard Help.

[Conchobear]

Hello Forum, I am asking for help with building my wizard.

Edit: I've re-written a lot of my character sheet but I'm pretty busy so I didn't get it all done but this is what I have so far:

Str: 8 Dex: 18 Con: 14 Int: 20 Wis: 10 Cha: 10
Alignment: Neutral Class: Wizard Race: Sun Elf Familiar: Hummingbird
Skills: Bluff: 4 Diplomacy: 4 Intimidate: 4 Knowledge (Arcana): 8 Knowledge (Religion): 8 Sense Motive: 4 Spellcraft: 8 (These are without the Synergy and Ability Modifiers.)
Domain Wizard - Conjuration Domain

That's all I've decided on. I'm going to go into Mindbender for 1 level for the Mindsight.

Feat suggestions are welcome!

I'm not really worrying about Offense until a lot later in the game. I eventually want to kill Gods but that can wait as I am much more useful as being a Battlefield Control Wizard that a ridiculous Blaster.

I think I've learned a lot about what it means to be a Wizard and it's all thanks to you guys! I still want feedback on how I'm doing as I stil lam a noob at being a Wizard but I'm progressing I think.

/Close Edit.

So I have basically only played a Fighter throughout my playing of D&D and I was pretty young at the time so I was a Big Stupid Fighter but I've been inspired by Vaarsuvius. I wanted to be a jack of all trades and be helpful kinda like V but also be destructive with Fireballs and Disintegrates (eventually) but I have read about a lot of people who don't use Evocation spells at all or that much. My current situation is that nobody likes my character and think he's a jerk (especially the Big Stupid Fighter) so I'm trying to show them that I can be useful by dueling the Big Stupid Fighter and either winning or dealing a massive amount of damage but I'm starting to think this is the wrong way to go. I have my character semi made but my DM is allowing me to change him throughout the first campaign because it's my first time playing a Wizard. I have read a lot of 'Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards: Being a God' and I really like the way he thinks. My character is a God Hater and wants to become powerful enough to slay Gods so he isn't that nice to Religious Characters such as our Paladin. So the problem I had with the guide was it wasn't descriptive enough for me. I want to know What feats are good and why and good spells to use in certain situations and how important certain buffs/debuffs are. My current thinking is that Mage Armor isn't that great because the Wizard shouldn't really need the AC if he's careful enough.

Anyways, Here's what I have for my character so far.

Str: 10 Con: 13 Dex: 18 Int: 20 Wis: 10 Cha: 8
Alignment, Good. Class: Wizard. Race: Elf. Familiar: Hawk
Weapons: Staff Implement, Short Bow.
Spells: 1st, Alarm, Shield, True Strike, Magic Missile, Ray of Enfeeblement, Charm Person, Shocking Grasp. (I'm thinking of dropping Charm Person but it seems useful if I want to ignore what my Paladin says and do something against his Religion. I will also probably drop Alarm.)
2nd, Flaming Sphere, Invisibility, Protection From Arrows. (I'm almost certain I'm going to drop Flaming Sphere and maybe Protection From Arrows but we were attacked by many ranged units before I got the spell so it seemed like a good idea.
3rd: Fireball, Magic Circle Against Evil. (The Magic Circle is to be used on my Hawk Familiar and then be flown around protecting our minds from evil.)

I have looked into spells more and have noticed the uses of Glitterdust and Web and such and will most likely swap some spells out for them.

Feats: Scribe Scroll (Comes with Wizard), Spell Penetration, Enlarge Spell, Extend Spell. (I was thinking of using ranged touch spells like Shocking Grasp as damage dealers because it's so good currently but I'm not sure anymore. Enlarge person was going to be one of my next spells to learn as well.)

Other Info: My DM is allowing me to be a Domain Wizard but I'm not 100% sure on what they are, the guide said I should take it if the DM allows it but is there any drawbacks? I've been a Generalist so far and the guide said it was better than a generalist but a more detailed explanation on what it is would be nice.

So the way the guide made it sound with being a God and molding the world into a pleasurable outcome sounds awesome but it seems reliant on the teammates which I don't really like doing especially if they dislike my character quite a bit but I am willing to change if it is really for the better and will bring me closer to killing Gods.

I also saw someone here post something about Polymorphing you and your familiar into a Wyvern and then Enlarging it or something and then mirror image just to add to the fun and that seemed like a cool idea but i think I want to be more helpful than make the battlefield into chaos for everyone.

Thanks in advance for anyone who helps me, Just know that I am quite a newb so detailed explanations are required ^^;

[vampire2948]

Hey,

Definitely swap out for Glitterdust & Web. They can end encounters by themselves, far more effective than 2d6 fire damage a round from your flaming sphere.

Other than that - Consider swapping out Alarm for Mage Armour. It stacks with your shield spell, and you're not wearing regular armour anyway, because you're a wizard. That'd give you something like 22 AC before magic items. Shocking grasp seems a bit useless, you don't want to be close enough to use it. Take one of the Lesser Orb of X spells from the spell compendium instead.

Neat idea with the magic circle against evil! What does the Hawk Familiar give you? You might consider the hummingbird familiar instead, since that gives a very useful bonus to initiative - combined with your high dex, you'd often go first, making that glitterdust or web spell more likely to end a fight before it does any damage to you or the team.

Protection from Arrows is useful, but... I'd get a couple of potions of it instead. They're pretty cheap.

As for your feats: I'd leave spell penetration out. You're a generalist, just pick up some spells that ignore Spell Resistance [For example, the Orb of X line in the Spell Compendium - Really nice conjuration blasty spells with secondary effects like blind, set on fire, stuff like that, that ignore SR. Also they work on attack rolls, and your +to hit with ranged is pretty good with your dex score.]

For your third level spells, take a look at the spell 'Unluck' from the Spell Compendium again. target enemy has to reroll everything, and take the lesser roll. Can make harder enemies much easier to beat, more so that a few D6 damage from a Fireball, which you could get a wand of.


If you like the idea of having a Wyvern chewing up the enemy, take a look at the Conjuration (Summoning) line of spells, and the prestige class 'Malconvoker'. Can be pretty ridiculously useful. Your resident Paladin might have something to say about the Malconconvoker bit though, since it basically involves twisting evil summoned creatures to your will - The PrC tells you that it should be for good... but whatever. ^_^



About the Evocation part of your post. People don't use Evocation because, as described above with some of the spells I suggested, you can end fights much faster than by spamming a few D6s of fire damage into the enemy. Your party can do the damage through melee, if you shut them down with entangle, blinding, unluck, or various other effects that you're capable of.


As for the god-slaying part, take a look at the Ur-Priest class. Basically involves stealing power from deities, aswell as 9th level divine spells over 10 levels of the PrC. You could dip for one level, then head into a Theurgic Class like Mystic Theurge. Would increase your spells per day greatly, letting you help your party out with buffs a lot more. Though mystic theurge is considered a weak option.. I like it :smallfrown:


Anyway, good luck.

Vamp,

[Conchobear]

Shocking grasp seems a bit useless, you don't want to be close enough to use it.


First, Thanks for the REALLY helpful reply! It makes a lot of sense and will most likely influence my choices! And as for the Shocking Grasp, My DM tends to rush me if my teammates leave openings which they ALWAYS do because they never listen to my combat advice (because they dislike my character) so I find it useful to quickly blast an enemy back if they try getting near me. I like a little power so I can defend myself decently instead of fully buffing/debuffing people. I might switch it out though. But yea, Thanks again for the advice! ^_^

[EvilJoe15]

This is Domain Wizard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizardVariantDomainWiz ard). It's basically a free spell, and slot each level.

Consider Elven Generalist(RotW pg #157) For another free slot that moves up as you level.

Grey Elf (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/elf.htm#grayElf) gets you +2 Int for -2 Str.

I'd drop SP, and Enlarge, and take Collegiate Wizard(Complete Arcane pg #181) At level 1. That Gets you 6+Int spells at first level, and four more after that. Counting Domain Wizard, and Grey Elf that's 12 spells at first.

Are you allowed Flaws? If so take Sanctum Spell(Complete Arcane pg #82). Combined with Extend this let's you extend all you buffs for free.

If you don't plan on crafting much trade Scribe Scroll for Improved Initiative via Martial Wizard (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizard).

Another thing to look at is trading your familiar for an Animal Companion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererWizard).

For spells, Nerveskitter(Spell Compendium pg #146) means you go first.
Power Word Pain(Races of the Dragon pg #116) is death. No save. Period.

Alter Self (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/alterSelf.htm), and Rope Trick (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/ropeTrick.htm) are mandatory.

As mentioned Glitterdust, and Web are great battlefield control, and debuffs, but for a little more offensive power go with Summon Swarm (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonSwarm.htm). That's no save "death to everyone" death.

Fly (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/fly.htm) is a giant F you to melee, and Haste (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/haste.htm) consistently out damages fireball.

Granted Domain Power[Luck] (Complete Champion pg #52) is great. Failed a save? No you didn't.

If you drop the good alignment, and max out Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Sense Motive you can take Mindbender(Complete Arcane pg #54) at level 6. Only take one level though, that's enough to get 100ft Telepathy. Which means you can take Mindsight(Lords of Madness pg #126), and be instantly aware of everything within 100ft.

Mindbender is also a great way into Ur-priest if that's the way you're going.

Wow, that's a lot of text.

Edit: Can't believe I forgot this, but I think you'd be a better Batman then a God. Logicninja's Guide to Wizards: Being Batman (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104002)

[Greenish]

Instead of trying to publicly humiliate the fighter, has your wizard considered not being a jerk?

[Conchobear]

Wow, that's a lot of text.


Yes it is and it's all very helpful, thanks!


Can't believe I forgot this, but I think you'd be a better Batman then a God.

I checked it but it seems like a more generalist approach which I know I said that's kinda what I wanted but being a God seems so much cooler and in Character since my character doesn't think the current Gods deserve to be Gods.


Instead of trying to publicly humiliate the fighter, has your wizard considered not being a jerk?

He isn't exactly the most cooperating so I've kinda been forced to do something about it or have him push me around. He's a Dragon-born Fighter so he assumes he's better than everyone and marks his kills on his sheet. He is very reluctant to obey my sensible advice and makes me seem like the jerk to the rest of the party which I can be but he is kinda acting the same as me except he kills more and expects people to heal him and risk their lives whenever he needs heals.

[Urpriest]

He isn't exactly the most cooperating so I've kinda been forced to do something about it or have him push me around. He's a Dragon-born Fighter so he assumes he's better than everyone and marks his kills on his sheet. He is very reluctant to obey my sensible advice and makes me seem like the jerk to the rest of the party which I can be but he is kinda acting the same as me except he kills more and expects people to heal him and risk their lives whenever he needs heals.

Remind him that his character doesn't have that sheet.

[Safety Sword]

Instead of trying to publicly humiliate the fighter, has your wizard considered not being a jerk?

Is that the same as targeting him with a Will save Save or Die and laughing at him? :smallamused:

No? :smallbiggrin:

Yeah, you could both stop being jerks for "roleplaying reasons" and get along like the super happy fun fairy party.

[Conchobear]

Is that the same as targeting him with a Will save Save or Die and laughing at him? :smallamused:

No? :smallbiggrin:


I'm thinking that I'm not gonna worry about it that much as long as he doesn't become a great hindrance to the party. I do have some ideas that don't require a lot of offense magic such as using a spell against him to debuff him when he's fighting a creature. But anyways, that's gonna be a last resort.

I'm not going to worry about offense currently. The only reason why I wanted offense is for when I attempt to kill a God but i figure I'm gonna be pretty high level when that happens so I can put skills into offense later. I'm also going to redo my sheet and write it up myself instead of using a program so I have a good understanding of exactly why this stat is this. Thanks for all the help so far! I still don't really know what Flaws are.

[EvilJoe15]

These are Flaws. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/characterFlaws.htm) They're basically free feats.

[Conchobear]

These are Flaws. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/characterFlaws.htm) They're basically free feats.

Aren't most of them bad? Sanctum Spell doesn't seem like it would work that well for me.

Another question though, (Thanks for being so helpful everyone!) Are the only Spells that count as Domain Spells under the categories in the link you sent me?

Example: The only Conjuration domains are; 0--acid splash; 1st-- mage armor; 2nd-- web; 3rd-- stinking cloud; 4th-- summon monster IV; 5th-- wall of stone; 6th-- acid fog; 7th-- summon monster VII; 8th-- maze; 9th-- gate.

[EvilJoe15]

No, read them again. noncombatant is nothing for a wizard, that's a free feat. Inattentive is nothing if you're getting mindsight, another free feat.

Sanctum is one of the better metamagic reducers. Free extend is one of the more reasonable uses of it, use it right, and you can get infinite spells per day.

Yes that's right.

[Esgath]

Flaws are from Unearthed Arcana. Basically, you can take 1 flaw and get 1 feat in return. How many flaws you can take is up to your DM, so you'd have to ask about them and they are worth it every time. Only some of them you don't want to take.
Humiliating a fighter with a wizard is easy, either summon/call something that hits harder than him, or polymorph yourself or a summoned creature into something bigger than him if he takes pride in killing things.
Btw, Treantmonks "A Guide to Wizard: Playing a God" whole point is, that damage is something left to the mere mortals of this world, while you certainly can do better things.

[Esgath]

Ok, here are some feats that have nearly no drawback for you and why:


Vulnerable

You are not good at defending yourself.
Effect

You take a -1 penalty to Armor Class.
Either your armor is pathetically low and enemies will hit you all the time regardless, or your armor is pushed by spells (alter self into a Tren for +8 natural armor + 4 from mage armor + dexmod = something in the twenties, and this by lvl 4) or you fly/stay invisible/Abrupt Jaunt/Mirror Image whatever. You have multiple defenses not to get hit.


Inattentive

You are particularly unaware of your surroundings.
Effect

You take a -4 penalty on Listen checks and Spot checks.
Both skills are not class skills, and based off of wisdom. Doesn't matter if you can't spot something because you have a +0 or -4 modifier.


Feeble

You are unathletic and uncoordinated.
Effect

You take a -2 penalty on Strength-, Dexterity-, and Constitution-based ability checks and skill checks.
The only relevant skill you will throw in that group will be concentration, which you can avoid by playing smart. I play a lvl 6 wizard, haven't rolled concentration once.


Poor Reflexes

You often zig when you should have zagged.
Effect

You take a -3 penalty on Reflex saves.
First of all, reflex is the most unimportant save, and even then you have greater/superior resistance from Spell Compendium.

Have you read this (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=394.0) guide completely? Look at the spell suggestions, if you stick to them you almost can't do anything wrong ^^

[faceroll]

Ask the DM about flaws. They're pretty lame, and give you an unfair advantage.

I would pick up Rope Trick (2nd level), Haste & Slow (3rd level), Enlarge Person (1st level), and Grease (1st level). Ask your DM if you can spend gold to acquire those spells. There are rules in the PHB for paying wizards to copy spells from their spellbooks. Enlarge Person will give the big stupid fighter reach. Reach is very good.

Enlarge Person and Haste are really party friendly. If you have access to Races of the Dragon, Greater Mighty Wallop is an awesome spell to put on an allies bludgeoning weapon (especially a monk's fists).

At low levels, your party will get much more mileage out of you if you use spells like Glitterdust, Grease and Web to lock things down. The wizard in my 13th level campaign's most used spell is Grease. It is phenomenal. Make sure you really read the rules on balance checks. :) Haste and Slow are incredible for evening up a fight. You may also want to pick up some good utility spells, like See Invisibility or Wind Wall (haha, stupid archers). When preparing spells, only prepare one of each spell, then in combat, cast a spell, followed by not doing anything. Most of your spells are enormously powerful and a little goes a long way. This will allow you to also address things like invisible enemies or enemies using arrows. Web is better than Wind Wall, imo, but YMMV.

Since you want to blast, check out Complete Mage. It has reserve feats which let you set a aside a prepared spell for the option of always being able to use an ability. One lets you reserve a fire spell to be able to cast a small burst of fire 1/round. It's better than a crossbow, and you also have unlimited access to burninating.

[Conchobear]

Sanctum is one of the better metamagic reducers. Free extend is one of the more reasonable uses of it, use it right, and you can get infinite spells per day.


Is this the same thing as your talking about? http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-2508-sanctum-spell.html If so it seems rather bad as I travel often. And you can choose whether you prepare a Sanctum spell or not right?


Basically, you can take 1 flaw and get 1 feat in return.

That would be the part I didn't read ^^;

[faceroll]

Sanctum is one of the better metamagic reducers. Free extend is one of the more reasonable uses of it, use it right, and you can get infinite spells per day.

Yes that's right.

Sanctum Spell doesn't work like that. To prepare an extended 3rd level spell takes a 4th level slot, full stop. An extended sanctum 3rd level spell, after casting, would be treated as a 4th level spell in your sanctum and a 2nd level out of your sanctum. It still takes up a 4th level slot, regardless of where you cast it.

Sanctum Spell's mitigation technique comes into play with Arcane Thesis and turning a +0 adjustment into a -1 adjustment.

[Aharon]

The only relevant skill you will throw in that group will be concentration, which you can avoid by playing smart. I play a lvl 6 wizard, haven't rolled concentration once.


Minor correction: Initiative is a dex-based ability check, and a -2 hurts a bit at low levels. Later on you can use nerveskitter every encounter, but at level 5, you still have to conserve your spell slots a bit.

[Raendyn]

Sanctum Spell doesn't work like that. To prepare an extended 3rd level spell takes a 4th level slot, full stop. An extended sanctum 3rd level spell, after casting, would be treated as a 4th level spell in your sanctum and a 2nd level out of your sanctum. It still takes up a 4th level slot, regardless of where you cast it.

Sanctum Spell's mitigation technique comes into play with Arcane Thesis and turning a +0 adjustment into a -1 adjustment.

a: Arcane Thesis can not drop a modified spell's lvl lower than +1, so says errata
b: Arcane thesis has been further nerfed by the WotC in the "ask the wizards" FAQ, it now reduces the whole metamagic spell lvl modification by -1, not -1 per metamagic feat applied.
c: Except from the mental excercise of abusing the rules & finding something that could happen the way it is written (we all have thought of some), have you ever really droped a spell's lvl bellow it's original lvl & you haven't been kicked out? ( out of the room, the session, out of the group)

[faceroll]

a: Arcane Thesis can not drop a modified spell's lvl lower than +1, so says errata

What the errata actually says:
"Page 74 – Arcane Thesis [Omission]
Add the following text to the end of the “Benefit”
section: “A spell cannot be reduced to below its
original level with the use of this feat.”"

Energy Substitution Sanctum Invisible Quickened Orb of Fire still takes up a 4th level spell slot.


b: Arcane thesis has been further nerfed by the WotC in the "ask the wizards" FAQ, it now reduces the whole metamagic spell lvl modification by -1, not -1 per metamagic feat applied.

When discussin RAW, FAQ is no more legitimate a rules source than your DM's houserules.


c: Except from the mental excercise of abusing the rules & finding something that could happen the way it is written (we all have thought of some), have you ever really droped a spell's lvl bellow it's original lvl & you haven't been kicked out? ( out of the room, the session, out of the group)

What does this have to do with anything? I was never advocating Arcane Thesis abuse, I was merely explaining that Sanctum Spell doesn't work the way EvilJoe15 suggested it did. But he did get the idea of using sanctum spell to reduce metamagic adjustments from somewhere, so I showed him the rest of the trick.

I find the rhetorical question you pose at the end needlessly hostile. Can't you come out and tell me that I'm playing D&D wrong as opposed to passively aggressively informing me that you don't like the my playstyle (even though you have no idea what that is besides seeing me correct a rules confusion on this forum).

[Raendyn]

Well, my mistake I was bored to double check & comfused the FAQ & the erratas minimums. BTW save for the sace, WotC in their official campaigns ( mark of heroes, Living grayhawk, Xendrik expeditions) they use the sages rulling considering the AT feat.

WotC official FAQ is by far closer to RAW than any house rule. Considering that the "sage" gives 2 different kind of answers, some of them really seem as errata.
example:
a: "i would suggest that (something) should be used like... (his opinion)
b: This is a typo mistake, it Should e written as follows (gives an answer which btw makes sense.
b: This was not intended, we had a limit in what could be published (in letters/pages) and (corection) was left out of the book.

As these examples show he sometimes gives advices on how it should be played & thats not official by any means as it is just is opinionj (ex.a)
In other cases when he states that misunderstandings came out of typographical errors and/or material spaxe limitations... that's an other story for me. But i agree that it is not RAW. In any case his words weight more that most ours and the FAQ generally leads to improvements



As for the last comment, it was not by any means intended to offend you. It was more like a joke. I just avoid using smilies & sometimes i forget to put one to show that i am joking, also not being native english speaker sometimes turn on me. So I apologize for the misunderstanding.

[Conchobear]

Ok so I'm gonna try and get my Bluff and such up so I can multiclass into a Mindbender and eventually a Ur-Priest. I've changed my Alignment to Neutral and am now looking at feats.

Also, I'm a Sun Elf (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Elves,_Sun_%283.5e_Race%29) so I get a bonus to Intelligence anyway. If you can give me a reason to change to a Grey Elf then I will change but currently I don't see a point. I've also changed my Familiar to Hummingbird and am working on being a God type of Wizard and worrying about offense later.

I really want to focus on Feats now and am having a bit of trouble finding good ones or ones that would be worth it.

The rest of my party is Paladin, Cleric, Rogue, Fighter and Druid so some stealth may be required like with the Rogue but I don't think enough to justify Silent Spell and Automatic Silent Spell although it does intrigue me.
I kinda want to focus on how long my buffs/debuffs last and at what range I can cast them but these might not be as important as I think now because I've never really used spells like this.

I was thinking of going into the Conjuration Domain but Transmutations Haste, Polymorph and Disintegrate is very attractive as well... I think I like Transmutation for the later levels but Conjuration for the earlier levels. I will still get Web and such if I choose Transmutation but pointers would be helpful on which might be a better choice.

I think my DM is allowing Flaws so saying when I should get the feats and what feats I should get in exchange for the flaws would be really helpful!

For Offense, I have really only looked at spells that also have secondary abilities like deals damage and debuffs. Is getting a decent number of offensive spells good if I get the feat Entangling Spell (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-901-entangling-spell.html) or is that a small bonus that is overshadowed by spells that straight up focus on incapacitating.

Also, I have a Ring of Wizardry I so I'm not too starved for Spell Slots.

I would like to say Thanks again for all the help I've revived, This forum is great!

[Optimator]

If you have access to Exemplars of Evil, Uncanny Forethought is a wicked good feat.

[Esgath]

The only relevant skill you will throw in that group will be concentration, which you can avoid by playing smart. I play a lvl 6 wizard, haven't rolled concentration once.

Minor correction: Initiative is a dex-based ability check, and a -2 hurts a bit at low levels. Later on you can use nerveskitter every encounter, but at level 5, you still have to conserve your spell slots a bit.
Oh right, didn't see that. In that case, this flaw is bad and should not be taken. Anything that lowers initiative should be avoided.

@Conchobear Mindbender is commonly used as a 1-level dip to get telepathy so you qualify for the feat Mindsight (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1960-mindsight.html). Taking more than 1 level is not good, you dont want to lose casterlevels.

Why Ur-Priest? You are playing an arcane caster, what would be the point to take this prestige class? You would have to be evil, and you would get to cast divine spells, which are based off of wisdom.



For Offense, I have really only looked at spells that also have secondary abilities like deals damage and debuffs. Is getting a decent number of offensive spells good if I get the feat Entangling Spell (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-901-entangling-spell.html) or is that a small bonus that is overshadowed by spells that straight up focus on incapacitating.

Entangling would be a nice debuff, but a +2 level modifier is too much.

Feats that would help for battlefield control:Cloudy Conjuration (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-368-cloudy-conjuration.html), Sculpt Spell (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-2536-sculpt-spell.html), Metamagic School Focus (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1931-metamagic-school-focus.html). You would have to take Spell Focus: Conjuration (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-2699-spell-focus.html) first, and then some other metamagic feat before taking sculpt spell.

[Calanon]

Instead of trying to publicly humiliate the fighter, has your wizard considered not being a jerk?

Its tier envy man, no matter what happens there gonna be jelly on the Wiz...

In regards to the BSF

Be a Grey Elf with atleast base 16 int (18 total)

Round1: Web his sorry ass (Make him regret not being god!)

Round2: (He wasted a round getting out of the web... or he still stuck). Ray of Enfeeblement

Round2: (He wasted YET ANOTHER ROUND!). Ray of Enfeeblement.

If he has a strength score of 18 (I'm assuming he's a human) you just lowered his str score down to at minimum 12... I'm PRETTY confident that would just be enough to put the fear of god in him (The DM will probably kill you for killing another PC so a show of force is usually all you need) and if he back talks or wants to go again you can pretty much smack him with another Ray (He has a Str score of at minimum 9 he's still stupid... but he's not a fighter anymore xD)

[Conchobear]

@Conchobear Mindbender is commonly used as a 1-level dip to get telepathy so you qualify for the feat Mindsight (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1960-mindsight.html). Taking more than 1 level is not good, you dont want to lose casterlevels.

Yea I'm only gonna get Mindsight. Seems rather Godly to have Omnipotence.


Why Ur-Priest? You are playing an arcane caster, what would be the point to take this prestige class? You would have to be evil, and you would get to cast divine spells, which are based off of wisdom.


A few people have said that if I want to slay Gods a Ur-Priest would be the way to go. I haven't looked much into it so if theirs something better then can you let me know? Thanks for all the help! Will be looking at those feats.


Feats that would help for battlefield control:Cloudy Conjuration (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-368-cloudy-conjuration.html), Sculpt Spell (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-2536-sculpt-spell.html), Metamagic School Focus (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1931-metamagic-school-focus.html). You would have to take Spell Focus: Conjuration (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-2699-spell-focus.html) first, and then some other metamagic feat before taking sculpt spell.
Looked at the feats and most of them require me to specialize in a school which I can't since I'm a Domain Wizard and do not wish to lose any spells.


Its tier envy man, no matter what happens there gonna be jelly on the Wiz...


Haha yes the plan that followed as well is really awesome!




Be a Grey Elf with atleast base 16 int (18 total)

Any other reason for Grey Elf than Int Bonus? Because being a Sun Elf gives me the same bonus but -2 Con.

[Esgath]

Looked at the feats and most of them require me to specialize in a school which I can't since I'm a Domain Wizard and do not wish to lose any spells.

No they don't. Every feat has the prerequisite like "Spell Focus (Conjuration) OR specialist wizard".

[Conchobear]

No they don't. Every feat has the prerequisite like "Spell Focus (Conjuration) OR specialist wizard".

Yes but directly quoting from Domain Wizard (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/UA:Wizard_Variant:_Domain_Wizard) "A domain wizard cannot also be a specialist wizard" so it wouldn't work for me.

[Esgath]

I don't understand where your problem lies?

You are a Domain Wizard, then you take the feat "Spell Focus: Conjuration".

Then you can take Cloudy Conjuration, "some random metamagic feat", Sculpt Spell, Metamagic School Focus in that order without problems.

You do NOT have to be a specialist wizard to take those feats.

[Conchobear]

I don't understand what your problem is?

You are a Domain Wizard, then you take the feat "Spell Focus: Conjuration".

Then you can take Cloudy Conjuration, "some random metamagic feat", Sculpt Spell, Metamagic School Focus in that order without problems.

Ah sorry, I'm such a moron. I assumed that the prerequisites of the feat would be needing to specialize into a school. Sorry about that, I also might have thought I read it as I have been reading SEVERAL feats and spells and it's getting a bit mixed in my head of what one spell said and what another feat said. Cool, I will look further into this then as it seems very useful!

[Vladislav]

If you want to be a wizard capable of both raining fire on your enemies and solving all sorts of generic problems, take the Fiery Burst (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1123-fiery-burst.html) feat. Now you can hurl mini-fireballs of which you never run out, and fill your spell slots with mostly utility non-combat spells.

[BlueInc]

If you want to be a wizard capable of both raining fire on your enemies and solving all sorts of generic problems, take the Fiery Burst (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-1123-fiery-burst.html) feat. Now you can hurl mini-fireballs of which you never run out, and fill your spell slots with mostly utility non-combat spells.

Wooooow I like that feat, especially for NPC spellcasters. A bunch of adepts with scorching ray prepared could rain down tiny fireballs for quite a while on an unprepared party.

[Esgath]

Acidic Splatter (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-24-acidic-splatter.html) would be better in that regard, because fire damage gets very often resisted by monsters and acid gets least resisted plus acid deals full damage to objects, so you could open doors or whatnot. Sure, it doesn't attack an area, only one target at a time.
But beware, those feats are not great later on and you should only take them if you could retrain them.

[BlueInc]

Acidic Splatter (http://dnd.savannahsoft.eu/feat-24-acidic-splatter.html) would be better in that regard, because fire damage gets very often resisted by monsters and acid gets least resisted plus acid deals full damage to objects, so you could open doors or whatnot. Sure, it doesn't attack an area, only one target at a time.
But beware, those feats are not great later on and you should only take them if you could retrain them.

Also: Acidic splatter has a range of 5 feet/level of the highest acid spell prepared. Kinda meh.

[TurkeyBlizzard]

Any other reason for Grey Elf than Int Bonus? Because being a Sun Elf gives me the same bonus but -2 Con.

Sun Elf gives you +2 Int, -2 Con? Grey Elf is better with +2 Int, -2 Str. Str is a dump stat for wizards, but Con is going to hurt you- you already have the lowest HD (d4).

[Vladislav]

To alleviate confusion, Sun Elf is +2 Int, -2 Con, and Gray elf is additionally +2 Dex, -2 Str

I'd say Gray Elf is better.

[Raendyn]

I really can't stop finding ways that wizards can humiliate fighters.

They can do it without effort & regardless of what they specialize into.

low lvl wizard casting scroll of reverse gravity & then eating pop corn while watching the fighter spining a mile high in the sky, after a while you start tossing into the AoE little stones at the size of a human palm, when they reach the fighter they have the potency to dmg him, when spell ends he eventually falls unconcious of the falling dmg, if he is still alive

Cast just 1 spell, a will save or loose, or a summon, which generally is better than fighter.

abrupt jaunt his attacks & kill him using CL1 magic missles from a wand.

overheat his armor, watch him undress while shoutng like a bi@tch...

Rly, someone stop me plz!!!

As for a descent build. no ACF is rly needed save from abrupt jaunt from PH2, combat wizard also is good for Imp Init.

BC all around build
conjurer 2/master specialist 3/ malkonvoker 5/ Initiate of the 7fold veil 7/ archmage 3

take abrupt jaunt if possible you don't rly need anything else you are BControl master, summoning master, dispell master, unable to die, can deal dg with No SR no Saveorb spells, period.

generalist build
Sun Elf
1- Elf generalist substitution lvl, combat wizard (scribe scroll->Imp init) (fire domain) "or conjure, or transmute, but i like fire"
2-4 wizard ( take the elf substitution lvls
5 ACF spontaneus divination ( or domain granted power Inquisition for +4 dispell)
6-15 Incantatrix
15+ wyrm wizard to get Wings of flurry into your spellbook & arcane thesis on it. maybe 1 lvl archmage for spelllike timestop x2 for one 5th and one 9th.

feats: searing spell, arcane thesis:wings of flurry, arcane thesis: orb of fire(or scorching ray), extend, persist, empower, maximize, split ray, twin. w/e

everything you attack, dies, period

Who needs flaws?

[Calanon]

Haha yes the plan that followed as well is really awesome!

Necromancy is my favorite school of magic (Screw all you Transmuters and Conjurers!) and I've been in the same predicament as you before so i understand (Fighters just want dominance over someone who is stronger than them... to hell with that!) except it was a drow rogue =_=;; (Replace Web with Spell Vulnerability on round 1, than round 2 web... than 2 rays of clumbsyness :smallbiggrin: ) biggest problem with being a wizard is an evil thing called Spell Resistance... THANK GOD FOR SPELL VULNERABILITY! No Save, No SR, Decreases SR by a maximum of 15 SO GOOD AT HIGH LEVELS <3



Any other reason for Grey Elf than Int Bonus? Because being a Sun Elf gives me the same bonus but -2 Con.

Off the top of my head I'd have to say the decrease to a dump stat is always a plus and besides at later levels your usually going to use some sort of telekinesis to do all your str checks (Or the BSF, OR just waste a spell to improve someone elses str and have them do it for you... OH than theres my favorite! killing your enemy, animating them and having them do it for you for FREE! <3)

Edit: DAMN NINJA'S!

[Conchobear]

To alleviate confusion, Sun Elf is +2 Int, -2 Con, and Gray elf is additionally +2 Dex, -2 Str

I'd say Gray Elf is better.

I found This (http://gamebrief.wikidot.com/obsolete:sun-elf) regarding Sun Elves but I'm not sure how legitimate it is. We play in the Forgotten Realms but my DM is pretty open I think. Arcane Aptitude seems a bit over powered though.

Anyways, I've re-written a lot of my character sheet but I'm pretty busy so I didn't get it all done but this is what I have so far:

Str: 8 Dex: 18 Con: 14 Int: 20 Wis: 10 Cha: 10
Alignment: Neutral Class: Wizard Race: Sun Elf Familiar: Hummingbird
Skills: Bluff: 4 Diplomacy: 4 Intimidate: 4 Knowledge (Arcana): 8 Knowledge (Religion): 8 Sense Motive: 4 Spellcraft: 8 (These are without the Synergy and Ability Modifiers.)
Domain Wizard - Conjuration Domain

That's all I've decided on. I'm going to go into Mindbender for 1 level for the Mindsight so I need the Spell Charm Person so that's a must and the other spells I get from my Domain are useful like Web so still deciding what to learn. Nerveskitter is one I'm thinking about taking as I see many many uses for it even with my Hummingbirds + To Initiative. I also think I'm going to get Unluck for my 3rd level spell just to make the bosses a LOT easier (Have had recent problems with bosses.) As for the Feats, I'm still looking at some and would like other suggestions just to add to the possibilities. With my Skills I think I'm just gonna put more in Knowledge when I level up.

Thank you all for your help, I didn't expect such a welcome to my first post. Great comics and a great forum! I will post updates as I get them done which I might get quite a bit done on Friday or Saturday because Saturday night is when our next meet is. Thanks again guys!

[Eldariel]

I found This (http://gamebrief.wikidot.com/obsolete:sun-elf) regarding Sun Elves but I'm not sure how legitimate it is. We play in the Forgotten Realms but my DM is pretty open I think. Arcane Aptitude seems a bit over powered though.

That's:
1) Obsolete.
2) Level Adjustment +2

So yeah, no. The current iteration of Sun Elf is simply +2 Int, -2 Con with the standard Elven traits. Yeah, Gray Elves are better (though usually not available in the same settings).

[Conchobear]

That's:
1) Obsolete.
2) Level Adjustment +2

So yeah, no. The current iteration of Sun Elf is simply +2 Int, -2 Con with the standard Elven traits. Yeah, Gray Elves are better (though usually not available in the same settings).

Is it obsolete for 3.5? Because I don't do anything above 3.5 pretty much so it's ok to do some older stuff and my DM might allow it so is the Level Adjustment a big thing? I don't really get what it means.

[Eldariel]

Is it obsolete for 3.5? Because I don't do anything above 3.5 pretty much so it's ok to do some older stuff and my DM might allow it so is the Level Adjustment a big thing? I don't really get what it means.

3.0 FRCS has the latest printing of Sun Elf which is the +2 Int -2 Con so yes, it's very obsolete if ever official.

And Level Adjustment basically is phantom levels that give you nothing. That is, Level Adjustment +2 means you're a level 1 character when others are level 3. In other words, it's pretty much a suicide far as character power goes. You do not want Level Adjustment.

[Fouredged Sword]

Thou shal not lose caster levels! Rule number one!

[Conchobear]

I'm using This (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Elves,_Sun_%283.5e_Race%29) for the Sun Elf reference. I'm picking Sun Elf because it makes sense for my type of character.

[Conchobear]

Alrighty so I kinda got some stuff figured out. My character is kinda conning everyone to think he's nice but in reality has fairly dark motives. Not overly evil but neutral evil kinda. Anyways, our Fighter was arguing with me about things and he threw a punch at me while we were deciding which part of the town to save. I dodged it and backed away and used Blinding Color Surge then proceeded to lower his Strength to 5 with Ray of Enfeeblement. I took quite a few hits and was bloodied before our Rogue and Paladin stopped us but he was on the ground helpless. He then calls me a coward and claims that he almost killed me (yes, true) and that I hadn't even wounded him (Yet he was helpless and at my mercy...) He then cussed me out and kept insulting me while I tried to reach a compromise. Our Paladin is supposedly our leader but he's very quiet and usually doesn't object to anything even though our Fighter was taking all the loot and claiming it was "His" because he killed the monsters without us doing anything. So he doesn't obey orders or suggestions, he takes all the loot, Tries to Intimidate anything that moves, and does fairly evil things whereas I do somewhat evil things but sneakily and not anywhere near the Paladin, I basically identify every magical object we find including creatures, Buff peoples stats, blind creatures thus making the fight soooooo easy and other such stuff but the DM said that I'm not that useful utility wise because I mainly just sit back and scheme/read books/learn spells. So the Paladin is trying to decide, I'm willing to compromise but the Fighter is being so unreasonable. We are both technically jerks to everyone but I'm trying to be nicer and actually share stuff and help to suit my own goals which require teamwork. One of us might be getting kicked out of the group. It seems like I'm the more compatible choice as I'm a decent team player but the fighter is somewhat needed for the damage.

Basically, I need to appear useful to my group but the more I say I'm useful the more the Fighter insults me. Any advice on how to win over a Paladin without doing anything Religious?

[Andion Isurand]

Races of Faerun updates the age progression for sun elves, making them longer lived than other elves.

Sun elves age according to the following progression:
Adult @ 110
Middle Aged @ 210
Old @ 315
Venerable @ 420
Maximum Age @ +6d% years

However, when it comes to elven adult age, I think WotC should have gone this route (http://andionisurand.blogspot.com/2011/10/elven-age-categories.html).