Multi Class past Dry Lich

[shuikage]

Alright so once i get done with the 10 levels of dry lich im just wondering what would be good to go into after that.Just staying in the cleric or should i go into something else? My class will look like: Cleric 1/Dry Lich 10/ ?????.

[Psyren]

Dry Lich class? I'm confused, do you mean Walker in the Waste? How are you getting in at level one?

[shuikage]

well being an asherati to get the heat endurance feat, and getting versatile spellcaster as my normal feat slot. have all the pre-reqs with that.

[Big Fau]

well being an asherati to get the heat endurance feat, and getting versatile spellcaster as my normal feat slot. have all the pre-reqs with that.

Hate to burst your bubble, but it isn't that easy. None of the 1st level spells on the Thirst or Sand domains are Cleric spells. You only have a maximum of 1 spell from either domain, and must wait until at least 3rd level to enter the PrC.


You may be able to cast the same spell 3/day, but you cannot cast 3 spells from the Sand or Thirst domain.

[Chess435]

Could you do it from Archivist 1?

[Greenish]

Could you do it from Archivist 1?If you managed to get a 2nd level spell as a spell known, yeah.

[Psyren]

You don't need Asherati either, as you can get both feats just being human. But yeah, Fau beat me to it. Using VS, you would be able to cast 2 spells from Sand at level 1, or 2 spells from Thirst (namley, the 1st and the 2nd one), but not 3 spells from either of them.

This also runs into the fuzzy RAW issue of whether you need the higher-level slots available to be able to convert lower level slots in this way, but that's another can of worms altogether that I won't open here.

[Greenish]

You don't need Asherati either, as you can get both feats just being human. But yeah, Fau beat me to it. Using VS, you would be able to cast 2 spells from Sand at level 1, or 2 spells from Thirst (namley, the 1st and the 2nd one), but not 3 spells from either of them.

This also runs into the fuzzy RAW issue of whether you need the higher-level slots available to be able to convert lower level slots in this way, but that's another can of worms altogether that I won't open here.I don't see how Versatile Spellcaster would get you higher level spells known, unless you've got something like beguiler's "know every spell you can cast".

But if that worked, you could take both Sand and Thirst domains, and use VS to get 2nd level spell from either.

[Psyren]

I don't see how Versatile Spellcaster would get you higher level spells known, unless you've got something like beguiler's "know every spell you can cast".

Now I'm confused - don't clerics know their entire list by default?
I'm objecting to this use of VS on different grounds than that one.

[Greenish]

Now I'm confused - don't clerics know their entire list by default?Oh, yeah. I was confused.

So that works then. Funny that.

[Urpriest]

Anyway, it depends what you're doing with the class, which you haven't told us yet.

[Cog]

I'd argue that Clerics, without a spells known mechanic, don't know any spells - they merely have access to all of them, instead. It fits with the fluff, too; a Sorcerer must have an innate understanding of the spell to focus his magic into it, while a Cleric is merely channeling the power provided by another.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Contemplative is extremely useful for any divine caster, and it probably won't take any extra effort to qualify.

Divine Oracle is great for a two or four level dip, but it's still worth getting all ten. You can use the Frog God's Fane in Complete Scoundrel to get its feat prerequisite without spending a feat.

Divine Disciple (PGtF) is a decent 5-level class that shouldn't take anything extra to qualify for.

I'd probably go Contemplative 1/ Divine Oracle 4/ Divine Disciple 4.

[Metahuman1]

As far as going into stuff afterward.

2 Paladin of Freedom levels to get Cha to AC (Using the AFC described in the X stat to Y bonus thread.)

1 lvl Monk. (If you can use Jiriku's Monk fix, make it three levels and Take Decisive Strike AFC.)

1 lvl Sorcerer. (Make sure to take Astetic Mage so that you get Cha to AC form a seperate stacking sorce. If it's Jiriku's monk fix, you also get Cha to hit and damage form this. Now just find a way too get at least a D10 damage die on a slam attack or something akin to it.)

1 lvl Witch Hunter for Cha to saves.

If Dm is letting you go Epic, get 2 levels of Iaijutsu master, 4 of Holy Liberator, and a few Hexblade levels to get Metal.

You now have Cha to

Hit
Damage
AC(x2)
Saves(x2 with Metal and Evasion)
HP
Initiative.

Now, just jack the crap out of your Cha.

[faceroll]

I don't see a level 2 entry as possible with cleric. In fact, I don't think you can enter until level 3, as you won't have feat access to the requisite spells even if you're using Beguiler-esque early entry shenanigans.


Now I'm confused - don't clerics know their entire list by default?

No. The language used for knowing spells is reserved for spontaneous spellcasters. Nowhere is the language "clerics know all the spells on their spell list" used. Instead, the language is more similar to "clerics may prepare any spell on their list."

While mechanically the outcome is the same, the interaction with feats that require actual knowledge of a spell, as opposed to access to it, is different.

Recently had a thread on this:
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=213547


I'd argue that Clerics, without a spells known mechanic, don't know any spells - they merely have access to all of them, instead. It fits with the fluff, too; a Sorcerer must have an innate understanding of the spell to focus his magic into it, while a Cleric is merely channeling the power provided by another.

I think you are correct.

[shuikage]

Alright sooo what im getting is that i actually need to be at the very least 3rd level befor i can go into Walker in the Waste. just trying to figure out these fine details within the next week or so due to stating out next week sometime. The group is going to be a hap-hazard of classes due to like 7 or 8 people playing. Not sure what everyone is going to be playing off hand. From what i can remember there is going to be a decent mix of range, caster, and melee.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

He wasn't asking whether his early entry would work, only what prestige classes to take afterward. Besides, Cleric 1 qualifies for Walker in the Waste just fine:

Pick both Sand and Thirst as your domains, get the PH2 spontaneous domain casting ACF for one of them. You may now convert prepared spells into spells of that domain. Knowledge of your spell list is irrelevant.

Take Heat Endurance and Versatile Spellcaster at 1st level. You may now convert two 1st level prepared spells into your 2nd level domain spell. That's an ability to cast two 1st and one 2nd level spell from those two domains' spell lists, thus you meet all of the prerequisites for Walker in the Waste.

Regardless of who wants to nitpick it, the only thing that matters is if your DM will agree with it and allow it to work. A Cleric has access to his entire spell list, which is equivalent to knowledge of the spell list. Versatile Spellcaster's interaction with characters who can only cast certain spells spontaneously requires some DM interpretation anyway, otherwise you end up with a character able to spontaneously convert two prepared spells into any spell on their list of one level higher. It's entirely between him and his DM if his early qualification will work, as it's entirely unclear whether or not it will work by RAW. Maybe try offering some useful advice, rather than nitpicking what he may as well have already had set in stone.

[Alleran]

I wonder if it would be plausible to advance wizard casting with a Dry Lich rather than cleric casting. Does the PrC itself say anything about it being specifically divine? I'm AFB right now, so I can't check myself. Getting the Sand and Thirst domains would be a pain with a Wizard (unless you dipped for a cleric level), but possible.

[Terazul]

You can qualify at level 1.

Human Cleric 1 (Go Cloistered).

Magical Training feat to give yourself arcane caster level of 1.
This qualifies you for...

Precocious Apprentice, which gives you a single 2nd level spell of any spellcasting class to which you belong (not necessarily arcane).

Then just take Sand and Thirst domains, giving you the ability to cast the first level spells from both, and a 2nd from one of them. Bam, 3.

Then just drop a Flaw on Heat Endurance.

As for what to take after your shenanigans, that's actually a good question. Preferably something that doesn't lose any more caster levels. Divine Oracle? Sovereign Speaker for more domains?