Characterization over Optimization: Making a mildly decent melee sorcerer

[desmond1323]

OK, so in a game I'm in my characters consist of the Aseph twins, Cinder and Rain. Rain's a studious NG water-based Wizard (well, cold-based for now) and Cinder's a brash CG fire-based Sorcerer (Brass dragon bloodline using Pathfinder Sorc rules). Both have just hit level 4, of which I've altered nothing about them yet.

Nice and cliche, but I like the play off of each other, it's been fun.

Anyways...Rain's easy enough, being a Wizard, but Cinder's a bit more difficult--and I really wanna play his character and not so much his class, but I still want to have at least SOME effect on combat (besides blasty spells, 'cause that's easy).

So Cinder's the type that in a typical combat he will start off with a blasty spell (currently Lesser Orb of Fire typically) before rushing to the front lines, striking a time or two with his short spear, then retreat, rinse, repeat.

So, here's my question.....any suggestions to make him at least a noticeable presence in the melee regards? I'm not asking for anything crazy, I don't ever expect him to tank or slaughter everything with melee--that's not the point. The point is simply this is what the character would do--he's more physically minded than his brother, and naturally hotheaded to boot.

A few points though....preferably, I'd rather not move away from Sorcerer class, but spell selection is open (Cinder really just needs one blasty spell per spell level, the rest are more or less open), as are magic items and such.

Thanks much.

[Keld Denar]

I'm not terribly familiar with Pathfinder, but I can tell you that Gishing is pretty intense. You either do it right and you are an untouchable god amongst men, or you do it halfass and end up as a greasy stain on the side of a dungeon wall. It takes planning, various PrCs (which I'm not sure are even legal or ported over to Pathfinder), and a rather precise spell list for a Sorcerer to pull off successfully. Good luck!

[desmond1323]

I'm not terribly familiar with Pathfinder, but I can tell you that Gishing is pretty intense. You either do it right and you are an untouchable god amongst men, or you do it halfass and end up as a greasy stain on the side of a dungeon wall. It takes planning, various PrCs (which I'm not sure are even legal or ported over to Pathfinder), and a rather precise spell list for a Sorcerer to pull off successfully. Good luck!

We wouldn't have to port anything over...it's the other way round. Our group, at my insistence, has adopted PF Sorcerers and Paladins over the 3.5 Core.

But that's the thing...I don't want a true gish. I don't want someone who can melee and cast at a noticeably good level....he's mostly a blaster, but who's kind of thick enough to also risk himself running into combat sometimes. All I want is, for when he does get into combat, he's still doing SOMEthing. It doesn't have to be crazy good or what have you, just noticeable progress towards the battle at hand.

[Prime32]

Battle Sorcerer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererVariantBattleS orcerer)? If you're using PF sorcerer, can you also use PF dragon disciple (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/dragon-disciple)?

EDIT: You can deliver touch spells through natural attacks, so use the claws you get from your bloodline.

[desmond1323]

Battle Sorcerer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererVariantBattleS orcerer)?

Heh, well blast, here I was hoping this wouldn't get suggested...it simply means I have to ask if I can retroactively take the variant and make sure my DM has no problems stacking this with my bloodline (I see no problems for the second, but some with the first).


If you're using PF sorcerer, can you also use PF dragon disciple (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/dragon-disciple)?


Well, that might work...I'll have to check and see. Though the PrC I was hoping to get into (at least was considering) was the Sandshaper....but who knows.

[Eldariel]

If you can take the 3.5 Arcane Strike, just taking that feat alone would allow you to contribute meaningfully in melee, perhaps in combination with some buff spells. These wouldn't necessite moving away from Sorcerer at all and if you get ~+5-+6 from Arcane Strike you can easily negate much of the Base Attack Bonus penalty. Combine with some spells that grant you armor class and miss chance and HP (False Life is a good one) and you should be reasonably able to fight in melee.

Alternatively, you could take Arcane Disciple: War or similar and learn "Divine Power" which would allow you to be rather efficient martially for a few rounds every day.

[desmond1323]

If you can take the 3.5 Arcane Strike, just taking that feat alone would allow you to contribute meaningfully in melee, perhaps in combination with some buff spells. These wouldn't necessite moving away from Sorcerer at all and if you get ~+5-+6 from Arcane Strike you can easily negate much of the Base Attack Bonus penalty. Combine with some spells that grant you armor class and miss chance and HP (False Life is a good one) and you should be reasonably able to fight in melee.

That's seems like a good choice...it'll be a bit before I can take it, but even still, I like it. The buff spells are more or less a given, but thanks for all the suggestions.


Alternatively, you could take Arcane Disciple: War or similar and learn "Divine Power" which would allow you to be rather efficient martially for a few rounds every day.

It'd be a nice option, but his Wisdom is 10, so ultimately useless, heh.

[Curious]

If you are allowed to back-port things from PF, you may want to look at the Magus on the SRD. Basically a gish-in-a-can, but done very well.

[desmond1323]

If you are allowed to back-port things from PF, you may want to look at the Magus on the SRD. Basically a gish-in-a-can, but done very well.

Well yes, it is a fantastic class, and I'd love to play it sometime...but I can't here, as this isn't me making a character. He's already made. I'm just trying to get some ideas of where to take him in the future.

[Optimator]

Maybe you could ask your DM to let you learn Flame Blade. Or learn FLame Whips.