[3.P] Good Synthesist build? Pure? Monk? Magus?

[Dakaar]

Hi all. I am playing a game that has 3 roguetypes, so I can't bring out my usual favorite builds.

I'm looking at one of the following:

Synthesist 1-2/Monk X: Lots and lots of wis, large size or ac bonuses for evos?

Synthesist straight: good casting I guess? Pounce and tons of attacks -- what is the best melee synthe?

Synthesist 1/Magus Kensai X: high int for canny defense, extra armor bonuses -- good??

[Dakaar]

Also, saw this:

"Feral Mutagen
Whenever the alchemist imbibes a mutagen, he gains two claw attacks and a bite attack. These are primary attacks and are made using the alchemist’s full base attack bonus. The claw attacks deal 1d6 points of damage (1d4 if the alchemist is Small) and the bite attack deals 1d8 points of damage (1d6 if the alchemist is Small). While the mutagen is in effect, the alchemist gains a +2 competence bonus on Intimidate skill checks."

Note: "gains two claw attacks and a bite attack"

So lets theoretically say I am a serpent synthesist with no arms.... Do I still gain claws? o_O

[Curious]

-Snip-

Well, if you want a pure gishy build, Magus 20 is pretty much the best you can get without being a Wizard/Eldritch Knight. Most Magus do better with high dex than Str (Dervish Dance), so Synthesist doesn't offer a whole lot, besides pounce.

[kestrel404]

I've got a really nice Charisma-centric build:

Synthesist 2/Paladin 3/Dragon Disciple X
Start with a Bipedal eidolon, and take the Arms evolution twice.
Race: 1/2 elf (Skill focus perception)
3rd level feat: Eldritch Heritage (Draconic)
11th level feat: Improved Eldritch Heritage for the Breath Weapon

Here's why:
The Bipedal eidolon has 1 set of arms + claws. Eldritch Heritage (Draconic) gets you the ability to grow claws - you've already got claws on your first set of arms, but you've still got 2 more sets of arms, so just put them on one of them. Dragon disciple says that if you are not a sorceror, you gain the powers from the Draconic Bloodline - it doesn't check to see if you've already got those powers. And the limit on Eidolon natural attacks? Only applies to natural attacks gained through evolutions! Which means that for the most part, once you hit level 6 (Dragon disciple 1), you'll have 6 natural attacks. Dragon Disciple 3 gets you a bite attack as well.
And the reason you take Improved Eldritch Heritage is because you'll get extra uses of your breath weapon (at a higher sorceror level) - and since the Improved Eldritch Heritage feat doesn't check for you having that power already, there's no problem in getting it again.

The only downside to this build is that the Str bonuses won't apply to the Eidolon - but it means you'll still be halfway reasonable when you don't have it up.

[stack]

Honestly, synthesist 20 should be very solid. I believe there are a few general build methods.

Reach-Bipedal, reach arms, reach weapon, second set of arms (for claws to threaten adjacent or to hold a regular weapon). Use enlarge person, eventually take the large evolution for crazy reach, add in lunge for an extra 5'. Can be combined with a high-STR slugger build.

Pounce-quadruped, max number of natural attacks (maybe add arms for a weapon or two), get there fast and hit hard

Kali -as many arms as you can afford to abuse the fact that weapon attacks are NOT capped. Gets expensive for all those magic weapons and special materials.

Regardless, you have nice buffs on your spell list and little use for physical stats. I don't see any need to multiclass, though I'm sure there are plenty of builds that would benefit.

(Before I get corrected, the FAQ has changed, and this advice works as of the last time I read it. The details of this archetype are fuzzy as published and the initial FAQ was utterly incompetent, so things seem to be fluid as to the "official" interpretation.)

[Dakaar]

Thanks for the tips. I looked at my party composition and am definately going with a summoner -- the insane mental stats avail with synthesist and the party-friendly spell list have me pretty sold. (Haste as 2nd level, etc). The game will be pretty low level.

Im still pondering maybe dipping monk 1(or pally 2) for the extra bunch of ac from wis, and maneuver master lets you add an additional combat maneuver to the end of a full attack. Not sure if that is worth losing eidolon progression though!


I guess my only other wonder is that while this seems pretty good -- is it really better than a regular summoner? Aside from the fact that the summoner himself is rather squishy, doesnt he then get to cast and attack each round effectively? Or is it that with access to your feats, vs the eidolon's feats, you can build a better eidolon?




Honestly, synthesist 20 should be very solid. I believe there are a few general build methods.

Reach-Bipedal, reach arms, reach weapon, second set of arms (for claws to threaten adjacent or to hold a regular weapon). Use enlarge person, eventually take the large evolution for crazy reach, add in lunge for an extra 5'. Can be combined with a high-STR slugger build.

Pounce-quadruped, max number of natural attacks (maybe add arms for a weapon or two), get there fast and hit hard

Kali -as many arms as you can afford to abuse the fact that weapon attacks are NOT capped. Gets expensive for all those magic weapons and special materials.

Regardless, you have nice buffs on your spell list and little use for physical stats. I don't see any need to multiclass, though I'm sure there are plenty of builds that would benefit.

(Before I get corrected, the FAQ has changed, and this advice works as of the last time I read it. The details of this archetype are fuzzy as published and the initial FAQ was utterly incompetent, so things seem to be fluid as to the "official" interpretation.)

[Dakaar]

Alright. I think I found something cheesy.

"http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/feral-combat-training-combat"

"..blahblah blah....

Special: If you are a monk, you can use the selected natural weapon with your flurry of blows class feature."

So, what happens when one has a synthesist head with bite/trip.

You could go synth 2(be large)/monkX, extra evolution for trip, and attack many times with free trips. You can take improved trip for free as well as a monk. You would get huge size from enlarge and then large evo with your 2 levels of synthesist. Seems decent to me. Get greater trip and you are doing pretty well :)

You would never need any other natural attacks but the one with flurry, so you could really pump your damage or defense

[Stone Heart]

You could go synth 2(be large)/monkX, extra evolution for trip, and attack many times with free trips. You can take improved trip for free as well as a monk. You would get huge size from enlarge and then large evo with your 2 levels of synthesist. Seems decent to me. Get greater trip and you are doing pretty well :)

You would never need any other natural attacks but the one with flurry, so you could really pump your damage or defense

I looked this up after reading this. I was totally unaware of this feat, and I think I love you, since I am building a synthesist right now.

[stack]

Large requires summoner level 8 (or character elvel 8, depending on how you read "The summoner must be at least 8th level before selecting this evolution."

[9mm]

Paladin 2 is the only real dip that's worth losing ediolion abilities for; especially since the interactions between feral monks and natural attacks are iffy at best (does it add the natural weapons to the manufactured weapon routine or vice versa.)