My rant on fixes.

[Hazzardevil]

In 3.5 there are many classes that are terrible.
Like Monk, so terrible that they are unplayable when compared to tome of battle.
So it's understandable when people write "fixes".
However, these "Fixes", do not fix the class.
They are still [mostly] Excellent pieces of homebrew.
But they seem to take away every single class feature from the original class and then write new ones.
So they aren't fixing the class at all, they are making a new class using another classes name.
So please, when you write your "fixes", call them retoolings, because you are not fixing the class at all.

[Mystic Muse]

In 3.5 there are many classes that are terrible.
Like Monk, so terrible that they are unplayable when compared to tome of battle.
So it's understandable when people write "fixes".
However, these "Fixes", do not fix the class.
They are still [mostly] Excellent pieces of homebrew.
But they seem to take away every single class feature from the original class and then write new ones.
So they aren't fixing the class at all, they are making a new class using another classes name.
So please, when you write your "fixes", call them retoolings, because you are not fixing the class at all.

They are fixing the classes by giving them stuff that's actually relevant. Also, in some cases, features have to be removed to fix the class. For example, the Monk's capstone and Spell resistance screw him over.

They are using "Fix" to mean they are turning something that is broken into something that works. That is what it means, and saying that it's not the way you want it to be isn't going to change anything.

[Hazzardevil]

They are fixing the classes by giving them stuff that's actually relevant. Also, in some cases, features have to be removed to fix the class. For example, the Monk's capstone and Spell resistance screw him over.

They are using "Fix" to mean they are turning something that is broken into something that works. That is what it means, and saying that it's not the way you want it to be isn't going to change anything.

But the class "Fixes" aren't taking the origanal classes and improving it, they are taking a class, stripping away everything and making a new class with new features.

[Zaq]

If that's not a fix, then what, in your mind, would be?

[Mystic Muse]

But the class "Fixes" aren't taking the original classes and improving it, they are taking a class, stripping away everything and making a new class with new features.

Which still counts as a fix.

Fixing something is simply taking something broken and making it work.

Also, I've seen several fixes that don't take anything away from the originals, and in fact only add stuff.

[Seerow]

But the class "Fixes" aren't taking the origanal classes and improving it, they are taking a class, stripping away everything and making a new class with new features.

If the class keeps the same central feel and flavor of the class, while using different mechanics, how is that not a fix?

I mean, sure you can try to fix the Soulknife by tweaking its existing abilities. The problem is, the vast majority of the abilities are so limited, that no matter what you do to them, the Soulknife itself is going to suck. In some cases, there are abilities that just have no real reason to exist, or might be included as a part of some other new ability. Or in the case of a fix that is being made to weaken a class, an ability might need to be removed completely due to being overpowered in concept.


Basically your complaint here is that someone fixing a class is actually y'know, fixing the class, rather than reposting a near exact copy of what already exists. There's a reason that those classes are being fixed-because there's something wrong with them that needed to be changed.

Even in the cases where the changes are dramatic enough it's completely unrecognizable, the 'fix' could be listed as the class in question due to flavor, and the intent to replace that class in game, even if most of its features aren't the same. Like if someone had posted 5 years ago the Warblade but as a Fighter Fix.

[Mulletmanalive]

This reminds me amusingly of a discussion we have a work every other week.

We hold a collection of historic vessels and a lot of the volunteers believe that those that aren't able to float on their own power can still be "restored." The thing being that there is no way that the vessel could be rebuilt, rather a few parts could be scavenged from the original, it would be a completely different vessel.

It would have little to nothing of the original vessel's composition and, by rights, aught to have a new registry because of its different hull. It makes "my grandfather's axe" seem reasonable by comparison.

What's being described here is basically the above. Hazzardevil doesn't see it as a repair job and, by definition, is right. If nothing of the original carcass remains, it's not a repair or "fix."

I don't see why he's bothering complaining but V 2.0 would be far more accurate than Fix in the title if the class isn't really recognisable as the original.

[Stycotl]

what i see is that it comes down to personal definitions, and everyone has their own definitions, and in a case such as this, you're not going to be able to make an intelligent case that you personally have the correct definition while others don't.

on top of that, not everyone is going to want to change their habits and workflow based off of your personal definitions. if you manage to convince some people, more power to you. but everyone else has their own definitions and methods which are as viable as your own, even if they don't mesh well with your own.

so, to make it easier on yourself and everyone else, don't worry about it.

[Morty]

The fixes might strip down the mechanics of a class, but as long as the spirit of it remains the same, it's still a fix and not a new class.
If someone makes a Monk fix with entirely different, actually useful abilities but it's still an Eastern-themet martial artist focusing on perfection of self, it's a monk fix, not an entirely different class. If someone makes a Fighter with actual class features that still revolves around mastery of weapons it's still a Fighter fix, not a new class. If someone makes a Wizard fix that doesn't break the game in half on high levels (I haven't seen any that succeeds, but never mind) but the class is still about gaining arcane power via study, it's a Wizard fix.
The "spirit" also encompasses the role a class plays in actual game - a Monk fix is still an unarmed combat specialist, a Fighter fix still attacks with weapons and a Wizard fix still stays in the back and casts spells.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

From thefreedictonary.com


fix (fks)
v. fixed, fix·ing, fix·es
v.tr.
1.
a. To place securely; make stable or firm: fixed the tent poles in the ground. See Synonyms at fasten.
b. To secure to another; attach: fixing the notice to the board with tacks.
2.
a. To put into a stable or unalterable form: tried to fix the conversation in her memory.
b. To make (a chemical substance) nonvolatile or solid.
c. Biology To convert (nitrogen) into stable, biologically assimilable compounds.
d. To kill and preserve (a specimen) intact for microscopic study.
e. To prevent discoloration of (a photographic image) by washing or coating with a chemical preservative.
3. To direct steadily: fixed her eyes on the road ahead.
4. To capture or hold: The man with the long beard fixed our attention.
5.
a. To set or place definitely; establish: fixed her residence in a coastal village.
b. To determine with accuracy; ascertain: fixed the date of the ancient artifacts.
c. To agree on; arrange: fix a time to meet.
6. To assign; attribute: fixing the blame.
7.
a. To correct or set right; adjust: fix a misspelling; fix the out-of-date accounts.
b. To restore to proper condition or working order; repair: fix a broken machine.
c. Computer Science To convert (data) from floating-point notation to fixed-point notation.
8. To make ready; prepare: fixed the room for the guests; fix lunch for the kids; fixed himself a milkshake.
9. To spay or castrate (an animal).
10. Informal To take revenge upon; get even with.
11. To influence the outcome or actions of by improper or unlawful means: fix a prizefight; fix a jury.
v.intr.
1. To direct one's efforts or attention; concentrate: We fixed on the immediate goal.
2. To become stable or firm; harden: Fresh plaster will fix in a few hours.
3. Chiefly Southern U.S. To be on the verge of; to be making preparations for. Used in progressive tenses with the infinitive: We were fixing to leave without you.
n.
1.
a. The act of adjusting, correcting, or repairing.
b. Informal Something that repairs or restores; a solution: no easy fix for an intractable problem.
2. The position, as of a ship or aircraft, determined by visual observations with the aid of equipment.
3. A clear determination or understanding: a briefing that gave us a fix on the current situation.
4. An instance of arranging a special consideration, such as an exemption from a requirement, or an improper or illegal outcome, especially by means of bribery.
5. A difficult or embarrassing situation; a predicament. See Synonyms at predicament.
6. Slang An amount or dose of something craved, especially an intravenous injection of a narcotic.
Phrasal Verb:
fix up
1. To improve the appearance or condition of; refurbish.
2. To provide; equip.
3. Informal To provide a companion on a date for: fixed me up with an escort at the last minute.
Idiom:
fix (someone's) wagon
To get revenge on another.

The bolded statements apply to homebrew. Outside of that, we're arguing semantics, which isn't a productive use of time. If it makes you happy, consider them refurbishments, re-imaginings, revisions, alterations, or anything your heart desires.

Standard 3.5 homebrew parlance, however, has dubbed them "fixes," and, as such, that is unlikely to change.

[Stycotl]

They are fixing the classes by giving them stuff that's actually relevant. Also, in some cases, features have to be removed to fix the class. For example, the Monk's capstone and Spell resistance screw him over.

They are using "Fix" to mean they are turning something that is broken into something that works. That is what it means, and saying that it's not the way you want it to be isn't going to change anything.


The fixes might strip down the mechanics of a class, but as long as the spirit of it remains the same, it's still a fix and not a new class.
If someone makes a Monk fix with entirely different, actually useful abilities but it's still an Eastern-themet martial artist focusing on perfection of self, it's a monk fix, not an entirely different class. If someone makes a Fighter with actual class features that still revolves around mastery of weapons it's still a Fighter fix, not a new class. If someone makes a Wizard fix that doesn't break the game in half on high levels (I haven't seen any that succeeds, but never mind) but the class is still about gaining arcane power via study, it's a Wizard fix.
The "spirit" also encompasses the role a class plays in actual game - a Monk fix is still an unarmed combat specialist, a Fighter fix still attacks with weapons and a Wizard fix still stays in the back and casts spells.

these are the definitions i side with. it is the theme of the class that makes it a class to me, not the mechanics that are supposed to represent the theme. so if the mechanics are screwed, they might need to be stripped out and entirely replaced in order to fully represent the theme.

[jiriku]

I could agree that it's a good idea to clearly label your 'brew so that people know what's inside the box. It's not a bad idea to state up-front the creation's expected role, power level, flavor, and similarity to the original. Especially for experienced homebrewers, it's easy for us to forget that a lot of our readers don't have the skill or experience to assess a piece of homebrew. Heck, I've been playing for 20 years and homebrewing almost from day 1, and I'm still surprised by what players do even with the homebrew that I wrote myself.

[erikun]

Also, realize that most people are not going to tell the difference between a fix, tweak, update, correction, repair, re-invision, recreation, revision, change, edit, or retooling. To most people, all these words mean basically the same thing, and we certainly don't have a dictionary specifying when a homebrew is one but not another. "Fix" is the simpliest and most common word used, and so it's the term most people will become attached to.

Also, just because something is a retooling doesn't necessary mean it isn't a fix. Fix is a broad, "something is wrong and I am going to correct it" kind of term, while retool has a more specific "take apart a class and replace it with working parts" meaning (in my mind).

[T.G. Oskar]

I wouldn't mind if someone uses the term "fix" when making an improvement to a class via homebrew, but I have some issues on the term "retooling" as I tend to use that term almost to the point of making it a trademark (the retooling I made of the Monk and the Ninja used the term "revamp", but afterwards I exclusively use the term "retool" unless the 'brew is original material).

However, aside from that, I find the issue being semantic in origin. Some people find that stripping all the bad meat from a class, refilling with better quality meat, and releasing that as homebrew is considered a "fix", while others consider an alternative from WotC that replaces one class a "fix" (e.g. Unarmed Swordsage as a "fix" to the Monk), or a series of changes that barely alter the class but improve some of its stuff as a "fix" (e.g. giving full BAB to a Monk, the ability to make all its attacks as a standard action). I could easily call the first example a "revamping" or "retooling" or "improved version" or "version 2.0" as much as a "fix", while I could easily call the second option an "alternative" or "blasphemy!!" and the third option a "patch". So, at most, it's a semantic question; what you call "fix" I could easily call "patch" and none would be more correct than the other.

Oddly enough, I don't see why there should be a problem with calling a piece of 'brew a "fix". Sometimes it's other people that make that assumption for you and do the mention for the 'brewer, after all.

[averagejoe]

My pet peeve when it comes to fixes is kind of like the OP's going the other way. It seems like a lot of the time I read a piece of homebrew that pertains to wizards, monks, fighters, etc. and even many mechanics, people overwhelmingly seem to respond to it as a, "Fix," and even tend to say things like, "As a fix this is underwhelming," even when the OP has in no way indicated that they're trying to fix anything.

Not that I'm trying to get down on the people who respond - it's cool that they're taking time off to do so, and the advice tends to be pretty useful either way - it's more that "fixing," and in the greater meta-discussion, overwhelmingly hardline stances that pertain to power level, seem to have pervaded everything so deeply that it's the place people seem to automatically go to.

Not a big deal, but I sometimes get the feeling that there's another discussion that's getting drowned out.

[Morty]

Yeah, I agree. It seems that game balance, or lack thereof, dominates the homebrew section sometimes, even if the purpose of a particular piece of work isn't to "fix" anything.

[Yitzi]

Doesn't apply to my fixes. Even my (latest, as yet unposted) fighter fix involves giving him no class features other than feats. (He gets more of them, and there are some very nice high-end feats and feat-combos available to those who can afford to take them, but still just feats.) I've never written a fix that both removes major features and grants major features, and probably never will. (Retoolings are another issue, of course.)