Top 10 bigest offenders

[Devronq]

In your vast knowledge of broken combos, whats the the top ten worse offenders as far as arcane and divine spells from any book. By offenders i mean spells that cause infinite combos or some hugely powerful tier 1 ability that it was probably never ended by the game designers.

[TroubleBrewing]

Doc Roc has a list of optimization tricks that probably cover what you're looking for.

[Acanous]

Gate, Wish, Miracle, Polymorph Any Object, Alter Self.

as far as single spells that can start infinate combos, anyhow

[Killer Angel]

Gate, Wish, Miracle, Polymorph Any Object, Alter Self.

as far as single spells that can start infinate combos, anyhow

Tough, as single spell, wish or miracle aren't broken. Wish it's broken only when you combine it with gate (the starter of the combo?) and SLA.

[Runestar]

To me, the most broken spells are those the DM actually lets you get away with, such as gating in pyroclastic dragons, PAO'ing into more powerful forms or using disjunction to automatically dispel all of an opponent's buffs. That they are the more basic uses of said spells speaks volumes of just how game breaking these spells are.

It's really spell applications like this which warp high level combat, turn the game's underlying assumptions on its head and let you say "screw you" to the rules.

[tiercel]

In and of themselves, the entire polymorph line of spells qualifies as "broken" on several levels: sheer potential power, open-endedness (with the number of supplement books in play), and poorly-phrased rules (how many errata, clarifications, Rules of the Game articles, etc have there been, and how much potential DM headache is there even still)?

Anything that lets you Call in and compel a creature to your will which can grant you "free" wishes and/or gates is a pretty obvious game-breaker.

While polymorph is broken enough on its own, comboing it with awaken (change your type to Animal to be a valid target for awaken , receive Instantaneous benefits, lather, rinse, repeat) is pretty abusive if not strictly infinite.

Fabricate breaks what passes for the game's economy all by itself.

Holy word (or the other-aligned variants) + 1001 ways to raise your effective caster level (hello, cheesetastic necklace of prayer beads -> bead of karma) = Instant I Win.

9th level spells, pretty much.

And this is just Core....

[Golden Ladybug]

Hmmm, let me find it...Ah yes, Arcane Spellsurge for a Sorcerer. I claim that this creeps in at number 10, whereas Gate is number 1. I'll leave it to you guys to figure out the other 8

Hell, the example I'm giving is a boring one. Its just damage

In this hypothetical scenario, we're a Sorcerer-based Incantatrix 10 with Arcane Thesis (Greater Arcane Fusion and Orb of Force), Practical Metamagic (Twin Spell and Repeat Spell) and Easy Metamagic (Twin Spell) and Invisible Spell. Now we can cast twinned repeating greater arcane fusion as an 8th-level spell. Let's say that inside our Greater Arcane Fusion we put a twinned repeating arcane fusion (containing a twinned repeating Orb of Force and some random first-level spell) and a twinned repeating Orb of Force. We cast two of these Greater Arcane Fusions in the first round. Anyone care to wager just how much firepower we're about to discharge?

Round 1:
Step 1) Two Twinned Repeating Greater Arcane Fusions = Four Repeating Greater Arcane Fusions, each containing one twinned repeating Arcane Fusion and one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force.
Step 2) Four Twinned Repeating Arcane Fusions = Eight Repeating arcane fusions, each containing one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force and one 1st-level spell.
Step 3) Twelve Twinned Repeating Orbs of Force = Twenty-four repeating Orbs of Force.

That's 240d6 force damage in the first round of combat, plus whatever our eight random 1st-level spells were. But wait, we're not done. Because next round, we've got a whole new rotation of spells that are going off!

Round 2:
Step 1) Four Greater Arcane Fusions, each containing one Twinned Repeating Arcane Fusion and one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force.
Step 2) Eight Arcane Fusions, each containing one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force and one 1st-level spell.
Step 3) Twenty-four Orbs of Force.

There. We've resolved all of our Repeating spells from Round 1. However, we have some new spells this round, thanks to our Greater Arcane Fusions. So, let's resolve those now.

Step 1) Four Twinned Repeating Arcane Fusions = eight Repeating Arcane Fusions, each containing one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force and one 1st-level spell.
Step 2) Eight twinned repeating Orbs of Force = Sixteen Repeating Orbs of Force.

Ok, our tally now sits at 240d6 + 400d6 = 640d6 force damage. Let's keep going, shall we?

Round 3:
Step 1) Eight arcane fusions, each containing one Twinned Repeating Orb of Force and one 1st-level spell.
Step 2) Sixteen Orbs of Force

Alright, we've resolved the repeating spells from last round. Let's resolve the new spells from this round.

Step 1) Eight Twinned Repeating Orbs of Force = sixteen repeating orbs of force

We're now up to 240d6 + 400d6 + 320d6 = 960d6 force damage. On to the last round!

Round 4:
Step 1) Sixteen Orbs of Force.

Whew, all done. Our final count: 240d6 + 400d6 + 320d6 + 160d6 = 1120d6, or 3920 avgerage, force damage.

Action Economy!

[Eldariel]

Hmmm, let me find it...Ah yes, Arcane Spellsurge for a Sorcerer.

Wizards have Arcane Spellsurge too. Only Arcane Fusion is Sorc-specific.


How come nobody has mentioned Simulacrum, Magic Jar & Planar Bindings yet?

[Golden Ladybug]

Wizards have Arcane Spellsurge too. Only Arcane Fusion is Sorc-specific.


How come nobody has mentioned Simulacrum, Magic Jar & Planar Bindings yet?

True, but they can't abuse it as much. It really shines when you can change how long it takes to cast a spell at will (like, for instance, a Sorcerer selectively applying metamagic). Arcane Fusion was just part of that example, but Spellsurge is only really limited by your ability to apply crazy effects to spells huge amounts of times in combat.

I mean, I suppose a Wizard could use it to cast Summon Monster as a Standard Action as well as whatever spell they would have used, but its not nearly as fun.

[Telonius]

1. Any method of Pun-Pun entry.
2. "Tainted Scholar" casting.
3. Gate/Binding - infinite wish cheese.
4. Celerity line.
5. Craft Contingent Spell. (Not bad in itself, but bad in what it enables)
6. Polymorph line.
7. Shivering Touch.
8. Anything with metamagic reducers (DMM, I'm looking at you).
9. Morality Undone/Mindrape/Sanctify the Wicked/any other similar "Your character does not act like that anymore" spells.
10. Time Stop. (Again, not bad in itself, but bad in what it enables)

[Eldariel]

1. Any method of Pun-Pun entry.
2. "Tainted Scholar" casting.
3. Gate/Binding - infinite wish cheese.
4. Celerity line.
5. Craft Contingent Spell. (Not bad in itself, but bad in what it enables)
6. Polymorph line.
7. Shivering Touch.
8. Anything with metamagic reducers (DMM, I'm looking at you).
9. Morality Undone/Mindrape/Sanctify the Wicked/any other similar "Your character does not act like that anymore" spells.
10. Time Stop. (Again, not bad in itself, but bad in what it enables)

Simulacrum, for crying out loud! It's at least 10 times more ridiculous than Shivering Touch. Ice Assassin even more so but just getting an anything of anything to do anything is pretty ridic. and Simulacrum does that.

[dextercorvia]

Sanctum Repeating Mage's Lucubration can give you N copies of itself, where N is based on your willingness to say, I cast Sanctum Repeating Mage's Lucubration again. That is a decent combo, especially if you use the prepared spells to fuel some Spellpool abuse.

[Telonius]

Simulacrum, for crying out loud! It's at least 10 times more ridiculous than Shivering Touch. Ice Assassin even more so but just getting an anything of anything to do anything is pretty ridic. and Simulacrum does that.

I'm unconvinced that Simulacrum is game-breaking. It has a fairly big XP cost, takes 12 hours to cast, requires a piece of whatever it is you're trying to duplicate (so you most likely have to be strong enough to beat whatever it is you're duplicating, and can't duplicate a hypothetical mage), and has only half the hitdice and levels of whatever it is you're making the simulacrum of. Also, only half the special abilities of a creature with that many levels or hitdice. (Apparently it's up to the DM to determine what abilities are appropriate). Half the regular hitpoints. It basically can't be healed unless you have a spare day and a bunch of money. Depending on how stubbornly you read the spell description, it might not be able to benefit from any spell cast on it.

The only way I could see this being a problem is if a Killer Gnome shadowcasts it, but that's a problem with Killer Gnome, not the regular spell.

[Piggy Knowles]

For me, the most ridiculous and game-breaking spells are...

Gate, Simulacrum, Polymorph Any Object, Shapechange, Planar Binding (and co.), Celerity (and co.), Wish, Miracle, Astral Projection

Polymorph and Alter Self are overpowered for their level, but they won't break a campaign by themselves. They're just really outrageously flexible and powerful spells. PaO and Shapechange, on the other hand, can give you abilities that were really never intended for PCs to use. Simulacrum, Gate and Planar Binding have similar issues.

Wish and Miracle are far too open-ended, and if the rituals from Savage Species are allowed, Wish jumps to the top of the list. But the ability to emulate any other broken spell make them pretty solidly at the top.

Celerity does things to the action economy that are not pretty, and more or less ensures that a wizard can always pull off its broken tricks against any opposition; there just isn't a response to it, and that causes major problems in the game.

Astral Projection can create "save game" states, and let you duplicate items.

The only reason Ice Assassin is missing from this list is because I tend to consider Ice Assassin the same as Simulacrum, for these purposes. I know they are different spells, but really, Ice Assassin is just Greater Simulacrum.

[Kefkafreak]

What about Magic Jar?

[Piggy Knowles]

Personally, I think Magic Jar falls in with Alter Self and Polymorph. It's powerful, and it has some unintended consequences, but I don't think it's broken in the same way, say, Shapechange or Planar Binding is.

There are a few things that make Magic Jar a little bit more sane compared to the others...

1. No access to spells, SLAs, Ex or Su abilities of your host form.
2. Easily blocked.
3. Allows a saving throw.

The big one, of course, is number 1 - that's what stops it from just breaking a game to pieces on its own. Numbers 2 and 3 make it, in my opinion, less immediately abusable than Alter Self/Polymorph. However, it's still crazy powerful, and there are lots of cool tricks you can do with it.

The rules do go a bit wonky when you start dealing with multiple Magic Jars, but I'm not sure I'd classify that as game-breaking....

[JaronK]

There's a lot of spells that become broken when you ignore component costs, usually by turning them into an Sp Ability. Animate Dread Warrior, Simulacrum, and so on. Others are broken if you cast them as a standard action via the same method, such as Major Creation.

And Planar Binding is probably the single most obvious broken spell, just because of the stuff you can get.

JaronK

[Piggy Knowles]

Yeah, with a few exceptions, it seems like the most broken spells in the game are the ones that give you access to creature abilities without real limitations. Generally this is either because they are abilities that were never really meant for PCs without severe restrictions (Sarrukh being the prime example), or because you can chain that one ability for a bunch more (for example, casting one 9th-level spell, Shapechange, to change into a Black Ethergaunt and gain the casting of a 17th-level wizard).

These seem to fall under three basic categories:

1. Spells that let you gain the abilities of monsters, creatures, other classes, etc., without limitation.

Examples: Shapechange, Polymorph Any Object

2. Spells that allow you to summon and control a creature and use its abilities.

Examples: Gate, Planar Binding

3. Spells that let you create and control a creature, retaining its abilities.

Examples: Simulacrum, Ice Assassin, Animate Dread Warrior

The first two are pretty much immediately broken, without much in the way of shenanigans. It doesn't take a genius to think, "Hey, what happens if I cast Planar Binding, a 6th-level spell, and use it to summon a creature with multiple uses of a 9th-level spell?" All that takes is one casting, and everything falls apart, short of DM fiat.

The third category usually requires a bit more forethought and work, but can be just as devastating.

These aren't the only spells that I think can completely ruin a game (as I said, Astral Projection and Celerity are pretty nasty, and JaronK had a good point with Major Creation), but still, they make a big difference...

[tyckspoon]

Tough, as single spell, wish or miracle aren't broken. Wish it's broken only when you combine it with gate (the starter of the combo?) and SLA.

Miracle's pretty silly all by itself, because its default powers don't use XP. You have one 9th level slot that you can use to cast like 80% of the spells in the game, plus the general-purpose clause of "Have any effect whose power level is in line with the above effects" ...so if you can make a good argument that something should be achievable by a 7th-level spell, Miracle can do that too. When you can fill all your spell slots for a level with just one spell and not really notice any lack in your capacity for doing so.. that spell is probably broken. (The Wizard equivalent would probably be memorizing nothing but Shapechange, except the duration on that is long enough that you only really need two or three to cover your day.)

[Eric Tolle]

Contingency + Plane Shift. With the right wording, if any spell, effect or attack threatens you, you shift to your personal demiplane, where time moves say, 50,000 times faster. After resting and revising the spell list, the wizard casts Astral Projection and travels back to the site of the problem, where approximately one round has passed. Unload whatever spells you want, including maybe another Time Stop, go back to your demiplane, wash, rinse, repeat.

I used that trick to emphasize to one of those guys who claimed that 3.x wasn't completely broken, just how utterly useless his massively optimized fighter was. He got pissed off, threw dice, and stomped off. But I figure if someone's gonna do something as foolish as play a fighter in 3.x....

[sreservoir]

requires a piece of whatever it is you're trying to duplicate (so you most likely have to be strong enough to beat whatever it is you're duplicating, and can't duplicate a hypothetical mage),

it should be in your spell component pouch. if not, eschew materials.

[Z3ro]

it should be in your spell component pouch. if not, eschew materials.

This type of legalism always infuriates me. I can't imagine that a piece of a high level wizard would sell for less than a gold piece; just because it doesn't list the cost in the spell doesn't mean there isn't one (yes, I know, RAW, whatever).

[Z3ro]

Double post.

[Zale]

Contingency + Plane Shift. With the right wording, if any spell, effect or attack threatens you, you shift to your personal demiplane, where time moves say, 50,000 times faster. After resting and revising the spell list, the wizard casts Astral Projection and travels back to the site of the problem, where approximately one round has passed. Unload whatever spells you want, including maybe another Time Stop, go back to your demiplane, wash, rinse, repeat.

I used that trick to emphasize to one of those guys who claimed that 3.x wasn't completely broken, just how utterly useless his massively optimized fighter was. He got pissed off, threw dice, and stomped off. But I figure if someone's gonna do something as foolish as play a fighter in 3.x....

I don't think Genesis lets you play with time on your demi-plane...

I seem to recall someone stating that even deities with personal demi-planes had to be fairly strong to do that.

[JaronK]

I don't think Genesis lets you play with time on your demi-plane...

I seem to recall someone stating that even deities with personal demi-planes had to be fairly strong to do that.

It does. The spell lets you make "any environment you can visualize." Interestingly, the divine version of the spell specifically says you can't muck with time traits, despite otherwise being an identical spell in its description.

So, evidently divine magic can't, but arcane can (I assume they figured out how bad this was after the arcane one was made, so they made the divine one without this problem... but never errataed the arcane one).

JaronK

[Eldariel]

It does. The spell lets you make "any environment you can visualize." Interestingly, the divine version of the spell specifically says you can't muck with time traits, despite otherwise being an identical spell in its description.

The Psionic version, no? I'd think I'd have heard of a divine Genesis if there was one :smallconfused:

[JaronK]

There is one, though now I'm hard pressed to find it. I definitely saw it... it was identical to the arcane version, except for a line about time traits being untouchable.

The Psionic version is rather differently written.

JaronK

[BIGMamaSloth]

persisted footsteps of the divine for the whole moving faster than sound thing. :smallsigh:

[ThiefInTheNight]

Speed of sound wouldn't be so bad. Unfortunately, IIRC, it's faster than the speed of light, which is a much more serious transgression (since that would probably mean time travel).

[sreservoir]

Speed of sound wouldn't be so bad. Unfortunately, IIRC, it's faster than the speed of light, which is a much more serious transgression (since that would probably mean time travel).

shouldn't be too bad. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/pg/20030409b)

[tyckspoon]

persisted footsteps of the divine for the whole moving faster than sound thing. :smallsigh:

Broken by errata; it's specifically a discharged spell now, which makes it ineligible for Persist. Burning an Extended one still makes you really fast for that turn, just nowhere near racing-the-daylight-line fast.

[sreservoir]

Broken by errata; it's specifically a discharged spell now, which makes it ineligible for Persist. Burning an Extended one still makes you really fast for that turn, just nowhere near racing-the-daylight-line fast.

it's still not discharged; its duration does not say "or until discharged" and its effect does not end the spell, only reduce its duration.

anyway, even with that, there's a spell in races of the wild called enduring flight. it doubles the duration of a temporary ability to fly. it's hard to tell, but I think it stacks, because it doesn't seem to contradict any stacking rules.

even if footsteps is discharged, and extended footsteps should still be affected at least once, resulting in 4 x CL x 10' bonus, more or less.