True Mind Switch and dragons

[Alleran]

A question. If you should happen to be a Psionicist who successfully uses True Mind Switch (or somebody else who gains access to the power) to swap bodies with a true dragon, you gain the dragon's spellcasting abilities, correct? True Mind Switch is largely the same as Mind Switch, and although the latter doesn't give you access to skills or feats, it does give you the extraordinary special attacks and qualities of the new form, which would presumably include the spellcasting abilities.

Or have I just wandered into another of those grey areas?

[Curious]

I believe a true dragons spellcasting abilites are Su.

[Jack_Simth]

A question. If you should happen to be a Psionicist who successfully uses True Mind Switch (or somebody else who gains access to the power) to swap bodies with a true dragon, you gain the dragon's spellcasting abilities, correct? True Mind Switch is largely the same as Mind Switch, and although the latter doesn't give you access to skills or feats, it does give you the extraordinary special attacks and qualities of the new form, which would presumably include the spellcasting abilities.

Or have I just wandered into another of those grey areas?
As a one-minute manifesting time power that requires a DRAGON to fail a save, it's unlikely to come up very often.

However, unlike other stuff, it's not tagged "Su", "Ex", or "Sp". Spellcasting just is. It's not on the "You gain" list, however, so you probably don't get it.

Additionally, True Mind Switch inherits the HD cap (based on manifester level, so can be boosted) from Mind Switch - which generally means you're not going to get much spellcasting, even if you would get it.

[Psyren]

Spellcasting is a natural ability; you do not get these by RAW, only Ex abilities. You also don't get supernatural or SLAs, so among other things you gain no breath weapon from dragon-swapping either. No gray here.

[Calanon]

As a one-minute manifesting time power that requires a DRAGON to fail a save, it's unlikely to come up very often.

And with all his dreams on the line, the little boy shouted "Challange Accepted!"

1. Be Telepath lvl 12
2. Start researching the locations of dragons dens (that have children)
3. Knowing DM (s)he'll give you the most impossible dragon ever
4. hunt it down with an evil scheme in mind
5. Survive long enough to get to the Eggs (cause ALL DRAGONS HAVE BABEHS!)
6. Mind Switch it knowing it will fail the roll (assuming you have an 18 for your int thats an 80-90% success ratio)
7. Incarnate the crap out of it!
8. when your DM says "You can't do that" laugh while asking why the DM is mad
9. If the DM kills your old body than there is nothing for you to return to
10. Live out the rest of your probably brief life as a Dragon regaling to your offspring the tale of how you pissed the great DM in the sky off :smallbiggrin:

[Demonic_Spoon]

I understood everything up to step 6, but what do you mean by incarnate the crap out of it?

[Psyren]

I understood everything up to step 6, but what do you mean by incarnate the crap out of it?

I assume he means Incarnate (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/incarnate.htm), aka Psionic Permanency. Mind Switch is not on the list of allowed powers though, and you would therefore need the DM's permission to use it that way. You'd also be vulnerable to a dispel - particularly if it happens after the death of the dragon in your body, which would kill you as soon as the power ends.

But here's a better way - use the Soul Crystal power from Magic of Incarnum, and make several crystals of True Mind Switch containing 17 PP each. (Total cost: 30 PP per crystal.) Not only will each one only be a standard action to activate, you also circumvent the XP cost. In the same minute it would normally take to manifest TMS, you get 10 attempts vs. the dragon. Or even more fun, have your psicrystal activate them while you fend off the dragon. Note that the psicrystal will use your manifester level, so as long as you could have switched with the dragon, so can it.

Now you have a pet dragon with your psicrystal's mind. He loses the breath weapon, but has all the (Ex) abilities, as well as his own (Su) abilities, including your ability to communicate with it telepathically. Then you can find another dragon and repeat the process for yourself, using your psicrystal-dragon to grapple him and make your life a lot easier. Enjoy!