Pathfinder Gestalt Combinations

[Fidelacchius]

I'm running a Pathfinder Gestalt game (level 4 now), no 3.5, and only Core, APG, UM, UC, and Bestiary's (anything with a character stat block, except for Drow Nobel) are allowed, but anything from those books is fair game. I've got a large group, 7 players (though in general only 3-5 show up to play on a given week, so it's manageable).

My players and I are having a lot of fun coming up with Class combinations that are super effective, but it is a bit exhausting, so I thought I'd throw the problem to the genius level hive mind the is the Giant ITP forums.

Awesome combos that we've come up with so far: Zen Archer Monk/Ninja (this is my personal favorite), Kesai Magus/ Wizard, Cleric/Fighter (this does have some action economy problems getting buffed up quickly enough), Life Oracle/Hospitaler-Warrior of Holy Light Pally (as a healer), and Guide Ranger/Inquisitor.

So what combos do you guys think are great?

[SamBurke]

I'm running a Pathfinder Gestalt game (level 4 now), no 3.5, and only Core, APG, UM, UC, and Bestiary's (anything with a character stat block, except for Drow Nobel) are allowed, but anything from those books is fair game. I've got a large group, 7 players (though in general only 3-5 show up to play on a given week, so it's manageable).

My players and I are having a lot of fun coming up with Class combinations that are super effective, but it is a bit exhausting, so I thought I'd throw the problem to the genius level hive mind the is the Giant ITP forums.

Awesome combos that we've come up with so far: Zen Archer Monk/Ninja (this is my personal favorite), Kesai Magus/ Wizard, Cleric/Fighter (this does have some action economy problems getting buffed up quickly enough), Life Oracle/Hospitaler-Warrior of Holy Light Pally (as a healer), and Guide Ranger/Inquisitor.

So what combos do you guys think are great?

Rogue/Magus works well.

Pally/Sorc is fairly decent, has to work through ASF, though.

Druid/Cleric would probably slaughter a whole nation on its own... XD. (Though, Wild Shape is pretty nerfed....)

[Infernalbargain]

Human Sorcerer / Oracle especially if you allow double favored class bonus for a massive 135 spells known under one single casting stat.

[Ravens_cry]

Rogue//Sage Sorcerer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/archetypes/paizo---sorcerer-archetypes/wildblooded/sage) sounds fun. Monk//Ninja would be a damage dealing machine, with a lot of other fun effects as well.

[Curious]

Magus//Sage Sorceror is all kinds of fun. First, you grab Experimental Spellcaster for Accelerate as soon as possible, so you can move and full attack + cast a standard action spell + cast a quickened spell. Good tricks involve grabbing Magical Heritage for Shocking Grasp, and then Spell Perfection later. This means you can have a Quickened Shocking Grasp, and an Intensified Shocking Grasp, both prepared as level 0 spells. And 9th level spontaneous spells from an Int based sorceror, along with your Int based prepared casting from Magus.

[Rentaromon]

serene barbarian/martial monk=silly strong and hard to hit and you can run around naked at full power!! add in defensive stance with crane stance for more fun.

[BobVosh]

I really want to play a PF gestalt to do
Gunslinger 20//Gun wizard 1/Sorc 19

[Fidelacchius]

Human Sorcerer / Oracle especially if you allow double favored class bonus for a massive 135 spells known under one single casting stat.

I allow ANYTHING from the books. And you could take the deaf curse for the Oracle and Arcane bloodline. Use Still Spell and Metamagic Adept/Arcane Apotheosis. Walk down the street and casting fireballs with your hands in your pockets talking to your friend. :xykon:


Monk//Ninja would be a damage dealing machine, with a lot of other fun effects as well.

It is, it is. What's especially fun though is the Zen Archer specifically. Since Flurry runs off of the TWF feats and not the ranged multiple attack feats, you don't lose sneak attack from Manyshot, and you end up with more ranged attacks than any other class. Add in the extra attack on top of that from using KI points. And add the fact that your AC, your attacks, and your class features (baring a few ninja tricks) run off of Wisdom. :smallbiggrin:

And to the rest of you folks, the suggestions so far are good for at least a couple levels of bad guys, so thanks a bunch! Keep em coming!

[deuxhero]

Magnus//Alchemist

http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2007/003/915112_20070104_screen001.jpg

>_>


If there is a way to get a gun as a monk weapon (sadly, the enchantment and PRCs I know of that would allow it are 3.5), and Gunslinger//Monk has nice wis use and can flurry with a gun under full BAB, plus threaten.

[Infernalbargain]

I allow ANYTHING from the books. And you could take the deaf curse for the Oracle and Arcane bloodline. Use Still Spell and Metamagic Adept/Arcane Apotheosis. Walk down the street and casting fireballs with your hands in your pockets talking to your friend. :xykon:

Well favored class and gestalt interaction is not clear cut. By RAW, you pick 1 favored class at chargen and you only get the bonus whenever you take a level in that class. Strictly speaking, in gestalt you'd get at least 1 bonus if you took the class on one side. Question is whether in gestalt you get to pick two classes and double dip whenever you take both classes for a level. Since there are no official rules for gestalt in PF, there's no answer on how it'd work.

[deuxhero]

Isn't the bonus merely hitpoints and skillpoints? The way Gestalt works it wouldn't matter.

[CTrees]

Isn't the bonus merely hitpoints and skillpoints? The way Gestalt works it wouldn't matter.

there are alternate bonuses based on race/class combination in the apg, which range from bonuses to combat maneuvers (likely boring) to bonus evolution points or spells known for spontaneous casters (awesome).

[Corlindale]

Mindchemist/Wizard or Witch would be an nice combo. You're completely SAD, and you can end up with a +8 bonus to your Int which stacks with everything else, giving you a very nice boost to all save dcs. You also get Int to Knowledge skills twice, great if you want to be a loremaster.

Alchemist/Barbarian could be pretty scary, with physical stats through the roof thanks to raging and mutagens, and a lot of useful extracts for self-buffing - and unlike spells extracts can be used while raging.

[gkathellar]

Can't believe no one's mentioned Paladin//Bard or Monk//Cleric, yet.

[qcbtnsrm]

Human Sorcerer / Oracle especially if you allow double favored class bonus for a massive 135 spells known under one single casting stat.

I'm playing that right now. Although my DM ruled that I had to take the Eclectic feat to achieve it. Interestingly what it has mainly done is allow me to pick up several "thematic" spells every spell level, without having to sacrifice actual utility. I have an Elemental (Air) bloodline, and the Winds mystery. So between the those bonus spells and the favored class bonus spells I've been able to pick up just about all the air/electricity themed spell out there. And I still have standards like Grease and Glitterdust.

Actually one of the coolest things is that I have 24 available cantrips/orisons available at all times. I absolutely love the infinite cantrip bit. It really drives home the magic of the character to be spamming things like Mage Hand all day long. I'm not sure my character has actually picked something up herself in months.

[CTrees]

It really drives home the magic of the character to be spamming things like Mage Hand all day long. I'm not sure my character has actually picked something up herself in months.

As well you shouldn't! Things could be trapped, or poisoned, or secretly monsters! First rule of D&D survival: Never touch anything, ever. Not even yourself.

Wait, that came out wrong...

[stack]

Paladin/synthesist summoner. Low physical stats, pump CHA. Saves are through the roof (synth give a bonus on top of high CHA paladin saves). Can buff, melee, and has back-up summons if the eidolon gets poofed.

[gkathellar]

As well you shouldn't! Things could be trapped, or poisoned, or secretly monsters! First rule of D&D survival: Never touch anything, ever. Not even yourself.

Wait, that came out wrong...

Did it? :smallwink:

[grarrrg]

Hmmm, you guys seem to be thinking a little on the small/simple side.

This is a Cha focused build. And when I say Cha focused, I mean Cha focused.

The character must be Chaotic Evil.
(edit: note: levels are NOT listed in the order they would be taken)
Side A is Antipaladin 2, Sorc 18 (choice of bloodline).
This gives you Cha to Saves, 1/day Cha to to-hit (vs. Good only), and Cha-based level 9 arcane casting.

Side B is Gunslinger 1 (Mysterious Stranger), Oracle 14 (Lore Mystery), Agent of the Grave 5
This side gives Cha to damage (w/ firearm attacks). For revelations you want Sidestep Secret so Cha replaces Dex for AC and Ref saves, and Mental Acuity (+3 Int), and level 9 divine casting.
Agent of the Grave allows you to use Cha instead of Con for your HP bonus, and at the 5th level you can gain additional spells known equal to your Int mod (why we took Mental Acuity).

End result, we have Cha to AC, Ref Saves, All Saves, Arcane and Divine 9th level casting, and up to 14 levels of Cha to HP (AotG lets us add it to any later levels, and we can start taking AotG at level 7). We also have 1/day of Cha to to-hit, and Cha to damage with firearm attacks.

Notes: The level of Gunslinger is thrown in only so I can say you get Cha to damage, feel free to replace with something more useful.
Agent of the Grave/Antipaladin can be taken on either side of the build, but they should NOT be taken on the SAME side, or else you'd lose 9th level spells on that side.

[Andreaz]

Paladin//Oracle is a very simple, absurdly effective build.

I have a Cleric//Psychic Warrior going right now (Yes, Psionics have been officially updated to PF and they are awesome (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed)), Going with Tactics + Travel domains and the paths Weaponmaster and Mindknight.

It's a little gish powerhouse, using cleric spells like Deadly Juggernaught, Shield of Faith and Greater Magic Weapon along potent short buffs and swift powers like Vigor, Hustle and later Dispelling Buffer and Form of Doom to ensure things can't touch me and I touch them very hard. The maneuvers allowing me to attack multiple enemies at once or do some mad flynning (particularly funny when done with a scythe) are gravy.

With psychic warrior powers, maneuvers and quickened spells it expends about half its feats on the action enhancers, like psionic meditation and extend spell, or it'll be easily trapped in not having swift actions.

[kestrel404]

Synthesist summoner/Sorceror. It's a really nasty gish combo.

Normal summoner/Sorceror - This one is the one-man-army. You take the Sylvan bloodline and the Eldritch Heritage feat chain for Arcane bloodline to get an Eidolon, an Animal companion and a Familiar - then use spells to buff your mini-army.

Either way, all you need is charisma.

[Psyren]

I have a Cleric//Psychic Warrior going right now (Yes, Psionics have been officially updated to PF and they are awesome (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed)), Going with Tactics + Travel domains and the paths Weaponmaster and Mindknight.


Indeed they have, and indeed they are.

- Paladin//Wilder (Full caster in full plate; Warrior Surge, Leader Surge or Healing Surge are very fitting here.)
- Monk//Psychic Warrior (Brawler, Assassin, Feral Paths)
- Rogue/Assassin//Soulknife - search all you want, you won't find my weapon until I slit your throat with it. Walk up to king, study while you converse with him, free action draw -> full death attack

[Curious]

-Snip-

One nitpick; con bonuses are retroactive in PF (so if your con bonus was +2 and then increased to +3, it would be like it was always +3), so you would actually have Cha to all your levels in hit points.

[Fidelacchius]

Hmmm, you guys seem to be thinking a little on the small/simple side.

This is a Cha focused build. And when I say Cha focused, I mean Cha focused.

The character must be Chaotic Evil.

Side A is Antipaladin 2, Sorc 18 (choice of bloodline).
This gives you Cha to Saves, 1/day Cha to to-hit (vs. Good only), and Cha-based level 9 arcane casting.

Side B is Gunslinger 1 (Mysterious Stranger), Oracle 14 (Lore Mystery), Agent of the Grave 5
This side gives Cha to damage (w/ firearm attacks). For revelations you want Sidestep Secret so Cha replaces Dex for AC and Ref saves, and Mental Acuity (+3 Int), and level 9 divine casting.
Agent of the Grave allows you to use Cha instead of Con for your HP bonus, and at 5th level you can gain additional spells known equal to your Int mod (why we took Mental Acuity).

End result, we have Cha to AC, Ref Saves, All Saves, Arcane and Divine 9th level casting, and 5 levels of Cha to HP. We also have 1/day of Cha to to-hit, and Cha to damage with firearm attacks.

Notes: The level of Gunslinger is thrown in only so I can say you get Cha to damage, feel free to replace with something more useful.
Agent of the Grave/Antipaladin can be taken on either side of the build, but they should NOT be taken on the SAME side, or else you'd lose 9th level spells on that side.

This IS awesome at 20, but there are some problems. A) your BAB is in the toilet with 13 at level 20. You're not a physical combatant and a lot of combat feats are closed to you. Of course, this is not a physical combat build (baring 1/day with guns), so not a huge problem, right?

B) You don't have access to spells quick enough. On side B you're a spontaneous caster 1 level behind the curve, and on side A its 2 levels behind. Meaning prepared casters are getting the next level of spells 2/3 levels ahead of you and you don't catch up to them until level 19 on side B. This is actually a pretty huge problem, since it looks like with this build casting is your main offense. Remember, you have to survive level 4-19 to be awesome at level 20.

C) Agent of the Grave is from an adventure path, not from one of the main books.


Well favored class and gestalt interaction is not clear cut. By RAW, you pick 1 favored class at chargen and you only get the bonus whenever you take a level in that class. Strictly speaking, in gestalt you'd get at least 1 bonus if you took the class on one side. Question is whether in gestalt you get to pick two classes and double dip whenever you take both classes for a level. Since there are no official rules for gestalt in PF, there's no answer on how it'd work.

Well, how it works in my game is as you said in the former case (I try to go by RAW). You get one favored class, unless you are a Half-Elf, in which case you get 2. And yes you can take the same bonus twice on a level.

[kestrel404]

This IS awesome at 20, but there are some problems. A) your BAB is in the toilet with 13 at level 20. You're not a physical combatant and a lot of combat feats are closed to you. Of course, this is not a physical combat build (baring 1/day with guns), so not a huge problem, right?

Actually, you get CHA MOD grit points, so you can add Cha to damage at least Cha mod times per day (min 1), and you add 1 to this every time you: Crit, Kill something, or do something cool enough that the GM says you get a grit point back.

That said, this build would be infinitely better as a combatant with Gunslinger 11 to allow you to pick up the Signature Deed feat. Yes, you give up lots of casting to do that - but if you're planning on making a gish build, you only need casting on one side.
As it's built, I think this is more of a supercaster, and as such should dropt the gunslinger level entirely - you don't need Cha to damage during attacks if you're going to be throwing spells around all day.


B) You don't have access to spells quick enough. On side B you're a spontaneous caster 1 level behind the curve, and on side A its 2 levels behind. Meaning prepared casters are getting the next level of spells 2/3 levels ahead of you and you don't catch up to them until level 19 on side B. This is actually a pretty huge problem, since it looks like with this build casting is your main offense. Remember, you have to survive level 4-19 to be awesome at level 20.

Strongly agree. As a caster, you don't want to delay getting spells just for a couple of dips to gain minor boosts. Paladin might be worth it for Divine Grace, but that's about it.

[grarrrg]

*snip snip*

One nitpick; con bonuses are retroactive in PF (so if your con bonus was +2 and then increased to +3, it would be like it was always +3), so you would actually have Cha to all your levels in hit points.

Agent of the Grave's Unholy Fortitude reads as

Starting with the hit points he rolls for gaining his first agent of the grave level and every time he gains a level in any class thereafter, the character may choose to add either his Constitution bonus or his Charisma bonus to the number of new hit points he gains for that level.
It says you can choose either/or for each level. So you would not get Cha retroactive to ALL hp, just the ones selected as Cha (as your Cha increases your Cha-HP-Levels would give you an HP bonus, but not your Con-HP-Levels).
Agent of the Grave can be entered as early as level 7 with an Oracle entry (need Oracle 6 for Animate Dead and Skills), so as many as 14 of your levels would have Cha to HP, but 6 levels MUST have Con to HP.


A) your BAB is in the toilet with 13 at level 20. You're not a physical combatant and a lot of combat feats are closed to you. Of course, this is not a physical combat build so not a huge problem, right?

B) You don't have access to spells quick enough....Remember, you have to survive level 4-19 to be awesome at level 20.


...drop the gunslinger level entirely - you don't need Cha to damage during attacks if you're going to be throwing spells around all day.
Strongly agree. As a caster, you don't want to delay getting spells just for a couple of dips to gain minor boosts. Paladin might be worth it for Divine Grace, but that's about it.

First off, I didn't list the classes in the order they should be taken, I merely listed them (and I pointed out the Gunslinger didn't add much, other then letting me say "it gets Cha to damage").
So as far as delayed casting is concerned, you only have to worry about it on one side (to start with)

As far as Bab goes, fractional-Bab is a MUST when doing gestalt. Otherwise you'll have someone take Wizard 20//Fighter 1/Sorc 19 and claim they have full Bab (cause Wizards get it opposite levels from Sorc).
Granted, fractional Bab will not help this build much, but as has been stated, it is more Caster than anything.

The level progression should go as such (replacing Gunslinger with another level of Oracle)
Side A
Antipaladin 2
Sorcerer 18
Side B
Oracle 6
Agent of the Grave 5
Oracle +9

You'd have Cha to AC/Ref by level 1, Cha to saves at level 2, and could start adding Cha to HP at level 7.
Sorcerer casting is delayed by 2 levels. Oracle casting is not delayed until level 7, and it is only delayed by 1 level afterwards.

Using Fractional-Bab you have 14 Bab.
If you switch sides for Antipaladin and Agent of the Grave (adjusting Sorc-down/Oracle-up) then your bab would become 15.

If you take Agent of the Grave on the Sorc side, you could then take levels of Eldritch Knight, which would improve your Bab/HP, while still getting you to dual 9th casting.


C) Agent of the Grave is from an adventure path, not from one of the main books.

Well blarg.

Well, you won't get Cha to HP (darn, now we need 2 stats...), but it does open your options up to (reg) Paladin, and you can waste a non-caster level on something else.

[CTrees]

Since Agent of the Grave was created by Paizo, and is on the SRD as a first-party PrC, in apparently the exact same level of validity as the APG PrCs, I don't see a problem with using it. Similar to the Orc bloodline for Sorcerors, which you see brought up a lot, it seems like a lot of groups are okay with it.

[Ravens_cry]

Can't believe no one's mentioned Paladin//Bard or Monk//Cleric, yet.
Monk//Cleric is something I have wanted to try in 3.5, it works even better in Pathfinder.
Paladin//Bard would be interesting from both a fluff and crunch perspective.

[Gnaeus]

Ranger//wizard is strong in 3.5 and stronger in PF. Gives all good saves, Full bab, evasion, good skill points (from high int) on a good skill list, 9th level arcane casting and a little divine casting in case you need to use a wand of lesser restoration or CLW. Works just as well with Ranger//witch.

[CTrees]

Cavalier4/Psion6/Thrallherd10//Summoner20 with Horse Master is an amusing start - you have an animal companion as a lvl20 druid, a fully developed eidolon, and two thralls. Also, Twin Eidolon. Played right, you can be your own cavalry division (paladins get pretty spiffy mounts...) I'm sure it can be better optimized *shrug*

[Chess435]

Pretty much Synthesist Summoner// Anything Cha-Based = Win!

[Fidelacchius]

Since Agent of the Grave was created by Paizo, and is on the SRD as a first-party PrC, in apparently the exact same level of validity as the APG PrCs, I don't see a problem with using it. Similar to the Orc bloodline for Sorcerors, which you see brought up a lot, it seems like a lot of groups are okay with it.

I restricted it to the main books mostly because those are what are available on the PRD on Paizo's website. Also, I'd rather not spend time trying to incorporate all the adventure path stuff from all the books into my custom world. Granted, Agent of the Grave itself might not be difficult to incorporate, but other adventure path stuff would, so its easier just to ban it all.

[Zagaroth]

Pretty much Synthesist Summoner// Anything Cha-Based = Win!

This is true

I was specifically thinking Synthesist // Oracle of Battle. CoDzilla with the power of the summon...

[ragedeluge]

I've never been able to play a Gunslinger before, so the Gunslinger (Gun Tank) / Wizard (Spellslinger) combination looks very synchronized! Anyone tried it?

[grarrrg]

I've never been able to play a Gunslinger before, so the Gunslinger (Gun Tank) / Wizard (Spellslinger) combination looks very synchronized! Anyone tried it?

GAH!
Threadcomancy!
TURN UNTHREAD!!!!

[StreamOfTheSky]

Someone said Mindchemist//Wizard. I'd add Vivisectionist to that. Arcane Trickster in a can! Another possibility... Half-Orc Scarred Witch Doctor // Beastmorph Vivisectionist Alchemist. Use the mutagen to boost con, as that's your casting and hex stat now.

Monk//Druid was always my personal favorite, though between PF nerfing flurry to not allow additional natural attacks and PF nerfing flurry so that it needs two weapons... I'd do Master of Many Styles for the monk.

Ranger//Wizard is indeed surprisingly synergistic. Paladin//Sorceror is simple and effective.

Thanks to paragon surge spell and Improved Eldritch Heritage (Arcane Bloodline), now a Half-Elf (or Human w/ the right feat) could do Oracle//Ranger and end up w/ full BAB, d10 HD, all good saves, 6+int skills w/ good list, and access to nearly every spell in the game aside from higher level druidy stuff. (full access to cleric and wiz/sorc lists and ranger list is basically druid starter kit). I suppose Oracle//Druid would work as well, it'd just be more MAD and worse HD, BAB, and skills.

[HeadyYeti]

Sorcerer20/Anti-Paladin20, and become a lich
cha bonus to saves and hp
full bab, full casting + anti-pally spells
pathfinder system really rewards full class progressions so i dont see why so many people try to cherry pick classes for gestalt.
seems like half the builds i see with that are people that dont understand the rules, like combining sneak attack with sudden strike etc.
i honestly think that you have plenty of options with full class progressions without allowing players to try to sort out 5 different classes and figure out what their bab saves, etc are

[Xerxus]

Turn Undead!

[Katana1515]

Would personally recommend soulknife/inquisitor. its fun but not OP (in my group we have a gentleman's agreement not to gestalt classes that are tier 2 or 1). Best part is that with a single blade skill you can run entirely on wisdom for attack and damage rolls which has a nice synergy with the inquisitors class features. Blade skills like combat slide and absorbing blade give you multiple combat options while Bane and judgements boost your offensive output plenty.

[navar100]

Human Sorcerer / Oracle especially if you allow double favored class bonus for a massive 135 spells known under one single casting stat.

Ouch!

Good one.

Soulknife/Aegis is a nice concept combo where you can create your own weapon and armor.

Vitalist/Cleric or Life Oracle offers very efficient healing for those who like to play heal-bots. You get virtual selective mass heal at low levels allowing for healing during combat to be very efficient.

Druid/Summoner to bring forth your own army wherever you go.

[AttilaTheGeek]

Human Sorcerer / Oracle especially if you allow double favored class bonus for a massive 135 spells known under one single casting stat.

Bingo. I wrote up a whole bunch of great Pathfinder gestalt combos a little while ago, and this was at the top of the list. Let me see if I can find it...

Edit: Here we go.


One of my favorite builds is about as castery as it gets: Sorcerer 20 // Oracle 20. You can spontaneously spontaneously cast over a hundred different non-cantrip spells of your choice at level 20 by counting the Human Sorcerer favored class bonus (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/core-races/human#TOC-Favored-Class-Options) and your 18 Bloodline and Mystery bonus spells. If that's not enough, there's also the Pages of Spell Knowledge (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/m-p/page-of-spell-knowledge) I'm sure you'll buy. And it has Charisma synergy. Hook yourself up with a Greater Metamagic Rod of Quicken Spell and you'll be golden. One annoying thing about this build is that your list of spells known does not fit in Mythweavers' default spells section even if you double-stack your cantrips, so keep that in mind if you use it for backing up sheets.

Another build that gets excellent casting but is better suited to melee combat is the Eldritch Cleric. The standard build is Wizard 5/Fighter 1/Eldritch Knight 10/Wizard 3/Fighter 1//Cleric 20, but I personally prefer Sorcerer 6/Paladin 2/Eldritch Knight 10/Sorcerer 2//Oracle 20. My version misses out on 9th-level spells, but can pump Charisma through the roof and gets it as a bonus to all saves. Both versions of the build get +16 BAB and full casting in heavy armor. Both versions are fairly weak until level 5-6, but I can personally attest to the fact that this is a super fun build to play.

Moving a little farther down the caster/melee scale is the Gish To End All Gishes: Magus 20//Paladin 20. If you look closely at the Paladin spell list (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/spell-lists-and-domains/spell-lists---paladin), it's designed specifically to support attacking- swift action spells, fast movement, and self-buffs are all common. The Magus list (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/spell-lists-and-domains/magus-spell-list), on the other hand, provides incredible offensive power in melee range as well as long-range blasting. This build makes a very powerful and combat-oriented character for 20 straight levels, but do note that your class features will become completely useless or even detrimental in diplomatic scenarios. Still, you'll be able to dish out damage like nobody's business.

Near the end of the scale is Paladin 2/ Ranger 18 // Synthesist Summoner 20. You may be wondering why this is the penultimate melee build, but it's because the Summoner spell list (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/spell-lists-and-domains/spell-lists---summoner) consists largely of buffs, either for yourself or the rest of the party. The Synthesist archetype (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/summoner/archetypes/paizo---summoner-archetypes/synthesist) lets you merge with your eidolon for some great stat bonuses. Paladin 2 provides an excellent save bonus (between +10 and +15 at level 20) because the Ranger capstone isn't great. Also, both animal companions make you practically a walking army. Go, action economy! (The Broodmaster (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/summoner/archetypes/paizo---summoner-archetypes/broodmaster) and Master Summoner (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/summoner/archetypes/paizo---summoner-archetypes/master-summoner) archetypes let your turns take even longer, but beware of books flying at your head). Since you'll be controlling at least one and at most five creatures plus the PC, this build is recommended for advanced players only.

The end of the caster/melee scale is Barbarian OR Monk 20// Fighter 20. If you really want to play a melee-only character, I'd recommend Monk over Barbarian, but in general this is a very weak build. You're effectively trading one side of your gestalt for rage powers or some small feat bonuses when you could be getting some casting that will save your life. If you do really want to play a high-level Fighter, WBL is the stat you live by. Be sure to get a Cloak of 50% Miss Chance, a +10-equivalent Falchion (I strongly recommend the Brilliant Energy enhancement), but you know how to spend your WBL. Optional dip is Paladin 2 on the non-fighter side. It's very simple to play, which could be good for a new player or boring for an experienced player.

I hope that's a good summary of some popular gestalt builds. In general, avoid having the same thing on both sides. Builds like Wizard//Sorcerer, Wizard//Magus, Sorcerer//Summoner, and Monk//Fighter are inefficient because they spend one side of the gestalt for something that the other side already partially gives. Because of the way gestalt is set up with level 20 in two classes instead of level 40 in one, seeking great breadth of abilities is superior to great depth and mastery in a single field. If you have any questions, post them here or feel free to PM me.

[Elricaltovilla]

Orc Bloodline Sorcerer//Mutagen focused Alchemist. Nets you the highest strength bonus in the game.

[AvatarVecna]

Oracle 20/Sorcerer 20
Choose a theme and go nuts. Alternatively, if you'd like a third class, start going Mystic Theurge on one side at 5th level while the other side changes to another class that fits in with your character (if going battle caster, I'd suggest at least 2 levels of paladin/antipaladin to get Cha mod to saves, assuming you can meet the alignment requirement; if not, go fighter or barbarian).

Alchemist (Beastmorph/Vivisectionist) 20/Rogue or Ninja 20
SNEAK ATTACK! If you choose Ragebred Skinwalker for your race, by 10th level, you're rocking 6 natural attacks, pounce, and 10d6 sneak attack. Be warned: mutagens that increase Dex reduce Wis, which drives your nonexistent will saves. I recommend building more of a thug rogue with dirty trick instead of using Stealth+Invisibility to get 60d6 in a single round. Throw in some Master Chymist if your wish.

Fighter (Dragoon) 20/Paladin or Barbarian (Mounted Fury) 20
In a non-gestalt game, the Fighter (Dragoon) 20 can get all the mounted combat, two-weapon fighting, and weapon-specific feats (Weapon Focus/Specialization, etc.) while having a couple left over. Dual lances charging with Mounted Skirmisher allows that character to kill, in a single round, without any assistance at all, any monster whose CR is less than about 30, with only a couple epic monsters being the exception. Now add in Barbarian Rage or Paladin Smite, and you might actually be able to take on Lucifer solo if you can get the drop on him. Even if that's not possible, Orcus and the Oinodaemon just became easy pickings FOR A 20TH LEVEL CHARACTER.

Monk 20/Paladin 20
One the one hand, LOOK! THE MAD-EST CHARACTER IN EXISTENCE! On the other hand, look at all those awesome class features: Full BAB, all good saves, d10 HD, fast movement, divine grace, divine health, unarmed damage, AC bonus, smite evil, improved evasion...the list goes on.

Fighter 20/Anything 20
Ever playing a character focused on combat, but don't have enough feat to pull off the build? Gestalt with Fighter! Gunslinger? Paladin? Monk? Barbarian? Now you'll have more feats than you'll know what to do with! The mounted build above is one example, but there are plenty others.

Gunslinger 20/Monk 20
This combo is okay under most circumstances: neither build needs any Cha, and only a monk focusing on melee dpr needs to worry Str, so that can be dumped, too. The resulting Dex/Wis build combines in great ways: d10 HD, full BAB, all good saves, improved evasion. Dex adds to attack/damage for melee and ranged, Wis fuels both your Ki pool and Grit pool. The only way this build could get better is if you found a way for a firearm to count as a monk weapon for the purposes of flurrying, at which point you can begin filling people with holes faster than ever.

Druid 20/Ranger 20
d10 HD. Full BAB. All good saves. 6 SP. Full spellcasting. And not at all MAD, which many gestalt builds suffer from. It's even thematically appropriate. It's certainly not the most optimized build, but it's not bad, and it would be fun to play.

Paladin 20/Rogue 20
Who wants to play an Assassin's Creed character? Fun fact: sneak attacks aren't forbidden by the paladin oaths. This build gives you everything in the four main class abilities (HD, saves, skills, and BAB) except a d12 HD. Smite attack and sneak attack can stack (well, not against undead). On top of everything, the same Cha that fuels your social skills (Bluff/Intimidate) also fuels all your saves. This combination and the subsequent build it entails would reduce the MAD-ness.

That's what I got for you. I realize this is a really old thread, but I thought I'd put my thoughts out into the world.

[SamsDisciple]

LOL this thread has been brought back from the dead for what is it, three years now? something isn't quite right. If you want to write about this maybe you should just start a new thread...

[Jounichi]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Bloodrager 20 / Lore Warden 20

You get 5 bonus bloodline feats from the Bloodrager and another 12 (11 after Combat Expertise) from Lore Warden; plus two fixed Int skills which will likely be Knowledge (Arcana) and Spellcraft.

You might be waiting a little while to really up the damage with Arcane Strike not being available until your 4th level bonus Fighter Feat and Power Attack as a 6th Level Bloodline Feat, but level six is a doozy. You can pick up Power Attack and Vital Strike at once, and with Blooded Arcane Strike at 5th level that's 4d6+10 with a Greatsword before the Strength bonus is factored in. You only get one attack per turn this way, which is situational but useful for a mobility build. You also have enough bonus feats to pick up Cornugon Smash, Hurtful, and Intimidating Prowess by 9th level.

For high level campaigns I recommend the Abyssal bloodline. Also spend your 3rd, 11th, and 17th level feats on the Eldritch Heritage (Orc Sorcerer Bloodline) chain. If you can take the campaign all the way up to 20th level your Bloodrage grants a +14 morale bonus to Strength from the Abyssal bloodline, you get a +6 inherent bonus to Strength from the Orc bloodline's Strength of the Beast, and you can gain a +6 size bonus to Strength from the Orc Bloodline's Power of Giants. With a +6 belt and an 18 starting stat (or 16 and Abyssal's Demonic Bulk); that's a total of 50 Strength. You could get it higher, but you need 17 Charisma to finish out the chain. I recommend starting with a 13 and putting each of your level-ups into Charisma to meet the requirements incrementally.

[Haruki-kun]

The Winged Mod: *seals thread and grants it a final rest*