D&D and Game of thrones

[lorddrake]

I was thinking and I thought ser Jorah (except, of course, for not being a dwarf) is a great exemple of dwarven defender...

Going from there, what would the other caracters from the first book of A song of Ice and Fire be in D&D 3.X and PF?

Go wild!

I guess Jon would be a Ranger too.

[nyarlathotep]

Tyrion Lannister would obviously be a dilpomancer. Like everyone else though would be lowish level say 6-8 max.

[Seerow]

Tyrion Lannister would obviously be a dilpomancer. Like everyone else though would be lowish level say 6-8 max.

I can't imagine most of the world being even that high. I'd say level 4, tops.

[Neoseanster]

Yeah, that series isn't really big on the sort of high fantasy that 3.x was designed for.

Odds are, no one is past level 6 or so... see this essay (http://www.thealexandrian.net/creations/misc/d&d-calibrating.html) for a good explanation.

[Urpriest]

Given E6, I'd go with the following for Mellisandre: Cleric 3/Church Inquisitor 1/Master of Shrouds 2. Gives her a relatively unique and disparately powerful (since you're using earlier than expected entry) ability to throw deadly shadows at people, and Detect Evil at-will is great for that sanctimonious sense of always being right. Her church is LG, and she's LN, which is at least decently reasonable given the series.

[lorddrake]

I'll second those saying lower level... I guess 4th is tops too... Even lower, maybe.

Daenerys Targaryen would be a dragon blooded something, I guess... Dragon disciple?

Is Arya a swashbuckler?

Let me ask you something, though. Will, the guy from the prologue is something like a rogue of the wilderness... I think I remember seeing something like this (don't remember where)... Is there something like that?

[Elfinor]

If you have a copy, Dragon Magazine did a write up on it in issue 307, based on the end of Book III. I didn't read too much into it, because I haven't read the books (and I want to) but here were the class stats given for two of the names you guys mentioned earlier. They're higher than what you were throwing around (great essay link, by the way) but it is just from Dragon, so it should probably be taken with a grain of salt.

Tyrion Lannister LN Aristocrat 6/Fighter 5. His two relevant skill modifiers: Diplomacy +6, Ride is his highest skill at +13.

Melisandre LE Cleric 9 with Fire and Law domains

I will quickly bow out before more spoilers come in.

EDIT: Grammar fix
EDIT 2: Clarified Novel number

[kardar233]

The Game of Thrones d20 RPG by (I think) Guardians of Order statted out a lot of major NPCs. .

Not to go into too much detail, but the highest-level characters in the game are Maester Aemon, Tywin Lannister, Barristan Selmy, and Syrio Forel with the Hound, Robert and Jaime close behind. Characters without a whole lot of combat prowess such as Tyrion tend to stay at low levels.

[Knightofvictory]

My take on the main characters:

Eddard Stark is clearly straight Fighter, since he is famed for having mad combat skills and Sense Motive is definitely not a class skill for him. :smallamused:
Coincidentally, Ed Stark is one of my favorite examples of a Lawful good character in fantasy, and the kinds of shortcomings the alignment can have.

Arya is a Rouge with weapon finesse, she seems to get most of her kills with sneak attacks, especially later on in the books, and sneaking around has always been her thing from book 1. Chaotic Good all the way!

I agree Jon is probably a Ranger, he has the closest bond with his direwolf out of all the Starks (except maybe Bran), is a decent fighter, and he has experience with the surviving out in the wilds since he spends books 2-3 beyond the wall. Seems to be LG, just like Eddard.

Tryrion does hold in own in combat once or twice, but I always figured that was from lucky breaks and opportunity strikes. I'd peg him as a aristocrat with a splash of rogue. Incredibly maxed out CHA for diplomacy. Pretty complex character too, I'd have trouble picking an alignment for him, could be anywhere on the Neutral axis depending on the book. I'd say Lawful at first... but he seems to go pretty chaotic after a point.

Daenerys.... is tough. She seems to have some fire and disease resistance. But otherwise just seems to be an incredibly strong willed individual. I don't think D&D can stat out her dragonbond too accurately. High CHA aristocrat? Chaotic Good. One of my favorite examples of CG and the shortcomings it has for reasons listed below. Don't open the spoiler below unless you've read book 5.

Terrible alignment to run a city with by the way, as her concern for individuals creates chaos when she tries to overthrow longstanding traditions like slavery. Not to mention locking her dragons up because she is concerned that they will eat more of her subjects, and that is unacceptable to her, even when she needs the dragons to maintain order.

[Seerow]

Tryrion does hold in own in combat once or twice, but I always figured that was from lucky breaks and opportunity strikes. I'd peg him as a aristocrat with a splash of rogue. Incredibly maxed out CHA for diplomacy. Pretty complex character too, I'd have trouble picking an alignment for him, could be anywhere on the Neutral axis depending on the book. I'd say Lawful at first... but he seems to go pretty chaotic after a point.


While Tyrion is entertaining to us, his Charisma isn't astounding. He finds himself incapable of holding his tongue and offends people by accident constantly.

I'd peg him as having a high int (somewhere between 13 and 16), a moderate charisma (11 or 12), and a piss poor wisdom (8). Probably Aristocrat, around level 3, with maybe a 1 level dip into Warrior for weapon and armor proficiencies. No PC class levels there at all. He's an interesting character, but he never does anything heroic or awesome on the level that demands PC classes.


Not to go into too much detail, but the highest-level characters in the game are Maester Aemon, Tywin Lannister, Barristan Selmy, and Syrio Forel with the Hound, Robert and Jaime close behind. Characters without a whole lot of combat prowess such as Tyrion tend to stay at low levels.


Since when does Maester Aemon have combat prowess (which you just said is needed to be a high level character)? Honestly just being ancient, having a high starting int, and maxed ranks in all knowledge skills, as well as sense motive, should model aemon pretty well without going past 3 or 4. (At 4 he could potentially have 22 int/wis, which is a pretty big ****in deal)


Melisandre LE Cleric 9 with Fire and Law domains


Huh, I could understand saying Thoros is level 9, because he revives somebody (but given that's the only major trick we've seen him do, I'd guess it's actually a special domain or class ability that grants that earlier. He could easily still be 4-6 aside from that. And the resurrection does have more drawbacks than normal res so...), but what has Mel done that indicates she's level 9? Some really bad divination, and lighting a bird on fire? Again, easily 4-6.


Eddard Stark is clearly straight Fighter, since he is famed for having mad combat skills and Sense Motive is definitely not a class skill for him.


In the books he was never particularly renowned as a great swordsman. That was emphasized more in the TV series, but in the books he was more renowned as a general. He was a competent swordsman, but not anywhere near the likes of the Hound, the Kingslayer, or even Robert. If he is a pure fighter, it's low level, but I'd guess it's more likely that he's a Warrior, or a Fighter1/AristocratX (while he hated Kings Landing, he did have a firm control over the north which requires some diplomatic skill. He had a low wisdom and likely little sense motive, and no bluff. But I'd imagine his actual diplomacy skill was pretty good, along with Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) and Knowledge (History).)

[lorddrake]

If you have a copy, Dragon Magazine did a write up on it in issue 307, based on the end of Book III.

I'm sorry Elfinor. I'm from Brazil and in here we have other magazine convering RPG, but not your Dragon Maagazine... :smallfrown:

[The Gilded Duke]

Hmmm...



Dany Silverbrow Human Aristocrat 5 / Binder 1 (For Fire Resistance)

Arya Stark Human (Intermediate Worg Bloodline)
Swashbuckler 2 / Rogue 3 / Assassin 1 / Worg Bloodline 1

Rob Stark Human (Intermediate Worg Bloodline)
Aristocrat 3 / Fighter 2/ Worg Bloodline 1

Bran Stark Human (Major Worg Bloodline)
Rogue 2/ Worg 1/Druid 2/ Worg 2/ Fiend of Possession 5/
Feat: Otherworldly

Rickon Stark Human (Major Worg Bloodline)
Barbarian 2/ Worg 1/?

Jon Snow
Silver Brow Human (Intermediate Worg Bloodline)
Ranger 5/Worg 1/Ghost

[Dienekes]

My list, spoilers for recent book:
Arya Stark: Swashbuckler 1, Rogue 2 decent charisma, intelligence, and dexterity

Brandon Stark: Whatever you're using for the magicers 1. No outstanding or dumped attributes as far as I'm aware.

Robb Stark: Fighter 2, Aristocrat 2. Decent to high intelligence and charisma, poor wisdom, he's his father's son after all.

Jon Snow: Fighter 3, Aristocrat 1. Was considered a better fighter than Robb, and improved on the Wall. But ultimately he fails as a leader. Not as intelligent as Ned or Robb, but I don't think his wisdom was as low to balance it out a bit.

Sansa Stark: Aristocrat 2. Decent intelligence, great charisma, piss poor wisdom. She actually has a lot of details and bits of history and etiquette memorized demonstrating she has a brain, but she has no idea how to use the bloody thing, though she shows signs of learning under Littlefinger.

Eddard Stark: Aristocrat 3, Fighter 2. Decent to high intelligence and charisma, poor wisdom, no ranks in Bluff, only one or two in Sense Motive.

Catelyn Stark: Aristocrat 3. Decent intelligence, wisdom, and charisma, but nothing outstanding enough to be noticeable.

Robert Baratheon: Barbarian 1, Fighter 5. High strength, constitution, and charisma, dumped the rest. A terrible king, but a likeable enough bloke. Though currently his age and the flaws he's taken over the years have made him quite a bit less impressive a warrior than he was in his youth.

Littlefinger: Rogue 5. High Intelligence and charisma, decent wisdom, dumped everything else. Maxed Bluff.

Varys: Rogue 2, Aristocrat 4. High intelligence, and wisdom, average charisma and dexterity despite his weight.

Sandor Clegane: Fighter 2, Warblade 3. High strength, decent wisdom, dumped charisma like there was no tomorrow.

Gregor Clegane: Barbarian 4, Fighter 1. High strength and constitution. Surprisingly didn't completely dump intelligence, just say a 10.

Jaime Lannister: Fighter 2, Warblade 3, Aristocrat 1. High strength, decent dex, dumped wisdom, the rest are all pretty good.

Tywin Lannister: Aristocrat 6. High intelligence, high wisdom, high charisma, the dude was OP.

Cersei Baratheon: Aristocrat 3. High charisma, decent intelligence, dumped wisdom as far as could possibly be dumped and then dumped it some more.

Tyrion Lannister: Fighter 1, Rogue 1, Aristocrat 3. Surprisingly not completely useless in a fight, but his skills are definitely more for out of combat. Good Intelligence, decent wisdom, average charisma.

Joffrey Baratheon: Fighter 1, Aristocrat 1. Dumped intelligence and wisdom, decent charisma. Has had some training in fighting but nothing outstanding, and is an inept courtier.

Syrio Forel: Swashbuckler 3, Warblade 3. Smart enough, but his abilities really lied in the fact that he was untouchable, great dexterity.

Brienne of Tarth: Fighter 4. She's good, but not great. Dumped charisma something nasty.

Greatjon Umber: Barbarian 2, Fighter 3, Aristocrat 1. He ran his house successfully, but let's be clear here, he's a fighter and a rather brutal one at that. Strength and constitution his best stats, intelligence not dumped but not focused, generally good stats, except maybe wisdom.

Hodor: Commoner 4, Warrior 1. Hodor! Hodor, hodor, hodor, hoddddooooor, hodor Hodor!

Strong Belwas: Swashbuckler 1, Warblade 3, Fighter 2. Sweet lord did he pump up his constitution score. Weapons? Hah! He takes your swords. Poison? He is freaking immune to that crap. He is Strong Belwas, fear him.

Bronn: Fighter 2, Warblade 2. Very talented fighter, but I doubt he's in the top tiers.

Rhaegar Targaryen: Bard 1, Aristocrat 2, Warblade 2. Decent intelligence, average wisdom, high charisma. Diplomacy and Knowledge (history and religion) were focued.

Ser Arthur Dayne: Warblade 7. The theoretical perfect warrior deserves a little breach of the level 6 rule.


Ehh that's all I feel like typing out.

[myancey]

While Tyrion is entertaining to us, his Charisma isn't astounding. He finds himself incapable of holding his tongue and offends people by accident constantly.

I'd peg him as having a high int (somewhere between 13 and 16), a moderate charisma (11 or 12), and a piss poor wisdom (8). Probably Aristocrat, around level 3, with maybe a 1 level dip into Warrior for weapon and armor proficiencies.


Just because he doesn't hold his tongue doesn't mean he's incapable. The author regularly describes Tyrion as acting this way on purpose. And a wisdom lower than your average commoner..I doubt it. He uses both intelligence and wisdom regularly in his life.

And his charisma is above average despite appearances. That is why he is so persuasive and is able to change the allegiances of so many people--Bronn, all of the mountain men, etc.


No PC class levels there at all. He's an interesting character, but he never does anything heroic or awesome on the level that demands PC classes.

Except for when he leads the charge against a war party battering down a gate into King's Landing, right? Or when instead of retreating after defeating said party he rode out with two Kingsguard to take more on? Or in the battle in Game of Thrones when he and his ragged band of mountain men held the left flank of Tywin Lannisters' army against Bolton and Tyrion actually managed to defeat a mounted knight?

This guy easily deserves at least one PC class, if not more.

[Seerow]

Just because he doesn't hold his tongue doesn't mean he's incapable. The author regularly describes Tyrion as acting this way on purpose. And a wisdom lower than your average commoner..I doubt it. He uses both intelligence and wisdom regularly in his life.

And his charisma is above average despite appearances. That is why he is so persuasive and is able to change the allegiances of so many people--Bronn, all of the mountain men, etc.

And yet the people who actually matter continue to look down on him despite everything he manages to do for them. He manages to befriend some barbarians and a sellsword, neither of whom have anything resembling social skills. He's above average at the whole diplomacy thing, but he's legitimately worse than Littlefinger, or even Cercei, at the diplomacy game. His advantage was always being more clever than his opposition, not being better able to win people to his side with words.




Except for when he leads the charge against a war party battering down a gate into King's Landing, right? Or when instead of retreating after defeating said party he rode out with two Kingsguard to take more on? Or in the battle in Game of Thrones when he and his ragged band of mountain men held the left flank of Tywin Lannisters' army against Bolton and Tyrion actually managed to defeat a mounted knight?

This guy easily deserves at least one PC class, if not more.

All of his victories in combat were more through luck than skill. Like I said, he may have a dip for proficiencies, but he's no Fighter. (that said the difference between a fighter and a warrior is 1 feat... what feat is it that Tyrion would have from his fighter level if he absolutely must be a PC?)

[WitchSlayer]

Thoros should be among the higher leveled ones, probably. Not only does he have the reviving stuff and the flaming sword and the like, but he has been established as one of the better fighters in the series.

[Zarake]

If you want they're stats then look at the GoTRPG book by Guardians of the order, goes right to level 20.
I'd post them but I'm not sure if I'm aloud due to OGL but Tyrion have an int of 17 or 18 and cha of like 12

[Cog]

(that said the difference between a fighter and a warrior is 1 feat... what feat is it that Tyrion would have from his fighter level if he absolutely must be a PC?)
Combat Expertise? It's not such a great trade in terms of real-game party dynamics, but for somebody just trying to survive while landing a few lucky hits here and there and holding out for assistance, it's pretty reasonable.

[Seharvepernfan]

My interpretation based off what I've seen from the first ten episodes of Game of Thrones:


I'd say this is an E6 world, but exactly what levels each character has is beyond me, I'd say the young/poor/stark characters lean towards lower levels and old/noble/lannister characters lean towards higher levels, but that is also true for ability scores, so maybe I'm seeing the ability score difference instead.

Ned Stark: LG leaning LN, first level is aristocrat, rest is warrior. I didn't see anything from him that warrior couldn't do, so I won't say fighter (no tower shield, not especially tough, no weapon specialization). If he's a leader, its more marshall than white raven. I'd guess 14 str, and within 2 or 3 of average in the rest of his scores - con being higher than dex, cha higher than wis, and averagish int. I am biased against him, though, I may be underestimating.

Robert Baratheon: N or CN, but good right before his death. It's a bit tough to place his class, I don't think he was a legitimate barbarian, maybe he had a level of boar or bear totem, but I still doubt it, he's temperamental/strong/tough, but that doesn't mean barbarian. He's intelligent and I get the impression that he could lead troops, so maybe some white raven warblade, but I would say that the majority of his levels are fighter and/or warrior.
Had high strength and probably good con in his youth, above average Int, Cha is his highest. I'd bet on 12 or less dex and wis.

Tyrion Lannister: He leans in so many directions that I'm just going to say Neutral (undecided, not balance). For his class, I'd say straight aristocrat. I didnt see anything not covered by that class, and he uses wealth that he didn't earn as a tool, and he does it often and well. It gives him weapon and armor proficiencies, decent bab and hp, social/knowledge/perception skills, and good will saves. I didn't see anything more from him.
Above average mental scores, only int being especially high (but its probably at least 16, I wouldn't be surprised if higher). If he has good dex, its from being small.

Catelyn Stark: The only martial ability I saw was in not being immediately stabbed by the assassin, so I'd say expert. The only mentionable score I could see is charisma, which is probably at least 13. Her skills are social with some know(local/nob & roy). I'd say she's probably neutral, I didn't see any extremes.

Jaime Lannister: CE Warblade. If he has any aristocrat, it's first level only. High scores all around, with probably con and wis being lowest (still probably at 12-14). He isn't a total monster, but he is chaotic and he is evil. He does what he can to get what he wants, and innocent people suffer for it. I might be overestimating him, the actor that played him is very winning.

Cersai lannister: NE expert. Basically the same as catelyn, except higher mental scores and higher ranks in the same skills.

Daenarys: NG Expert with average scores, cha being highest, wis being lowest, otherwise nothing noteworthy. Magic/dragon related resistances. I'd bet she has a weak build with poorly placed ranks/feats/etc. I'd say her only real strength is her station, and even then she's not very good with it. I am biased though, I don't like her.

Jorah Mormont: LN, though leaning towards good. He is loyal and kind, but he doesn't try to be good beyond his serivce to Daenarys, and I get the feeling he's more self-interested than he lets on. I'd say he's an aristocrat with good ability scores all around, dex being lowest (but still not bad, probably 10-12). He's a knight, so his build should reflect that, but I didn't see anything an aristocrat couldn't do. Possibly a marshall, possibly some white raven, haven't seen the evidence yet. He has some knowledge about the world, probably local or geography.

Petyr (littlefinger): An expert with high int and cha, and at least decent wis. High know (local, nob & roy), high bluff/diplomacy/gather info. He hasn't done anything an expert couldn't. His alignment is tough, I don't think I can really say based off what I've seen, but I'd guess N leaning NE or vice versa.

Viserys Targaryen: NE expert (I never saw him in armor or anything) with unnoteworthy physical abilities, probably above average int (12-13 tops), low wisdom, and high charisma (somewhere 13-17). I'm biased against this guy.

Jon Snow: There are so many things with this guy that go in both directions that I can't really say. He's a skilled swordsman, and though I haven't seen him in armor, I bet he can wear it. He's probably got at least one level in aristocrat, he seems to lean towards law and good, ...I just don't know. I would be surprised if he doesn't have ranger levels, at least later on.

Robb Stark: LG aristocrat with at least average scores all over, higher than average charisma. He seems to lead well and isn't incompetent in battle, maybe he has some marshall or white raven in him.

Sansa Stark: ...probably Neutral expert with her mothers skillset, just lower and less experienced. I doubt she has bluff, definitely no sense motive, low wisdom, probably low-average int (9-11), higher charisma (maybe 12-13). Naive, foolish, selfish, but not a bad person.

Arya Stark: My favorite character by far. CG for sure, probably something like aristocrat 1/swordsage 1 or swashbuckler. Haven't seen any actual rogue so far. Dexterous, intelligent, raw force of personality (but not looks or social skills, besides some intimidate maybe), strong willed. Whatever she is though, she's still a child and has the weaknesses of a child. Definitely biased in favor towards her, though.
EDIT: ari 1/swd 1 is a bit much for an 11 year old who's only ever stabbed a fat kid. I would say she's a swordsage or swashbuckler in training, so she is, say, 1/2 level. She is proficient with shortbows, so its looking like swashbuckler.

Theon Greyjoy: He seems similar to Robb, though LN, not LG. He's a skilled archer, and at least a bit stealthy. I'd say he's an aristocrat/expert. If he's more, I haven't seen it yet.

Bran Stark: Too hard to say. He's naive, and he seems good, I'd guess NG. He had a high climb skill and poor archery early on. He's probably going to be some sort of druid. Above average Int and Wis, but still a child.

Joffrey: Obviously evil, otherwise similar to Sansa, except he probably has a rank of bluff in there somewhere.

Sandor "The Hound": I'd say Neutral or Lawful Neutral, he does what he's told even if it's bad, but I can't call him evil. He is loyal and I've seen him go out of his way to protect others at least twice when he wasn't ordered to (at least not expressly). I'd say he's a proper fighter, but maybe a warblade, it's hard to tell. One of the best combatants in the story so far, definitely skilled and able. Obviously high physical stats, dex isn't great but it isn't bad either (probably 12-13), and his intelligence is probably above average.

Khal Drogo: Tough to say. The only thing about his alignment that I can say I'm sure about is that he isn't good. His ability scores are high, except maybe intelligence, and his constitution isn't especially high. I'm having trouble deciding between warblade and swordsage, he has traits of both. I haven't seen enough to say for sure, and he's dead now.

Tywin Lannister: Classic Aristocrat, probably has the highest all around mental ability scores that I've seen so far. He might have some marshall and/or white raven, but I haven't actually seen it yet. As for his alignment, again I haven't seen enough, but I would bet money it's LE or close to.

Gregor Clegane: CE Barbarian, maybe with some fighter. Can anybody argue with that? He probably has Powerful Build.

Bronn: I haven't seen much, but I strongly suspect he's neutral with a blend of rogue and warrior, I just can't say exactly what, why, or how much.
EDIT: by rogue and warrior I mean skillmonkey and beatstick, not actual rogue and warrior. Also, I just realized that I never considered Crusader, some of these knightly types might be crusaders.

[Seerow]

Jaime Lannister: CE Warblade.


I look forward to your reaction of the next couple seasons :rofl:

[herrhauptmann]

One of the odder things about the RPG (or one of them), is that your social status is almost an inherited template, granting certain bonuses. (Supposed to cover their better education, diet, and training)
So Joffrey as a level 3 person, and royalty, would be equal in combat to the following
Robb Stark: level 4 great noble
Lord Littlefinger: Level 5 and a lesser noble
Gregor Clegane: Minor nobility, and a level 6
Sandor Clegane: Landed knight and level 7
Duncan the Tall who is level 8 and A hedge knight (from: The Hedge Knight, The Sworn Sword)
Bronn: level 9. Sellsword and general scum
Some peasant: Level 10

Or something along those lines.
Mind you, that's all an approximation of what I remember when I looked at the books years ago. All that's assuming they're the same class with the same stats. Obviously, Joffrey, despite being royalty, is fairly low level. His father was a former god on the battlefield, so he'd be very high level (higher than Rhaegar who was the crown prince).

[Dienekes]

I look forward to your reaction of the next couple seasons :rofl:

I agree with him even then.
He's a charming enough bugger, but he's still a whiny, evil, selfish arse. Just funny.

[Seerow]

I agree with him even then.
He's a charming enough bugger, but he's still a whiny, evil, selfish arse. Just funny.

I have to disagree. By books 3-4 he's at least firmly into neutral on the good-evil scale, and I find it hard to peg him as purely chaotic either. If anything by current point in the books, I'd peg him as Lawful Neutral, he's become much more interested in promoting justice, has turned away from his sister (which was the source of most of his rasher impulses), and while his methods may not be wholly good, he has been going about the business of restoring peace and order to the Riverlands in a very orderly fashion. Hell even his methods I can't complain about, for all the flak he gets for the baby-catapult line, it was that or storm the wall and kill thousands of people on both sides.

I just find it hard to see Chaotic Evil. I could see Neutral Evil even, with a particularly harsh interpretation of his actions, but I'd be more inclined to call that his alignment at the start of book 1, and a shift into Lawful Neutral throughout the following books.

[Dienekes]

For all his vaunted desire to change, he still doesn't care about the throne or who rules it. Honestly his opinion about following orders and accepting your place is unchanged, except that he wouldn't kill Cersei like he would have killed Robert. No instead he just ignores the royal summons. No change from chaotic to lawful I think. Mind you, chaotic doesn't mean he can't be organized and intelligent. And I will give that he has had an organized method of gaining the Riverlands. Of course it was already pretty much done when he arrived. As Roose said, this is just picking over the remains.

As for turning away from evil. He has not once accepted that what hehas done is in any way wrong. He still through a child out of a window, and nothing he's done or acted has even atoned for that. Mind you he has acted friendly to people. Sure, he acted friendly to Tyrion and i'm assuming to whatever friends he had even during his Cersei-banging stage of his life.

He came up with a clever ploy to lift two sieges, and for that I respect his intelligence. He's a likeable enough fellow and for that I admit he's charming. But we haven't seen him have to face any situation that really tested him, and I remain the only truly good act he's done was save Brienne. It takes more than that to dig yourself out of the whole he's made.

Of course, this should probably be discussed elsewhere. And so I don't feel like I've completely hijacked the thread, here's some other alignments, again spoilered for last book.

Eddard, Robb, and so forth are Lawful Good, I don't think this needs explaining

Arya: Neutral Evil. Watching her plunge to becoming a full blown murderous sociopath has been interesting indeed.

Jon Snow: Neutral/Lawful Good. Obviously last book he suffered a fall from being pure lawful, but I'm not sure if it would change his alignment, cause frankly anyone else who was up to that situation would do the same. I waver on this one. On one hand he dispenses with tradition, on the other he still tries to cling to the bits that he feels are worth clinging to until he can't anymore.

Brandon Stark: True Neutral. Honestly, kind doesn't mean good. Yeah, he's a sweet kid but he hasn't actually done anything good or bad or exceedingly chaotic or lawful. Just a pleasant child.

Rickon Stark: Chaotic Neutral.

Sansa Stark: True Neutral. Like Bran, except she went through a brat phase. She admittedly has a few more pet the dog moments but I would severely hesitate to call her good. I might give her a lawful, if I thought more on her actions.

Robert Baratheon: Chaotic Neutral.

Stannis Baratheon: Lawful Evil. I keep wanting to put him at Lawful Neutral because that seems like what he is built up as. But then you remember the burning folks in their church, the murder of some guy trying to guard a friends bastard, and yeah I feel he deserves the evil alignment.

Renly Baratheon: Chaotic Neutral. No respect for the traditions, seemed to act out on his desires alone, and never actually seems to do anything good or bad. Also an idiot, but that's neither here nor there.

Tywin Lannister: Lawful Evil.

Jaime Lannister: Chaotic/Neutral Evil.

Cersei Lannister: Stupid Evil.

Tyrion Lannister: True Neutral, maybe Neutral Evil. You have to look at his actions again. He's committed some murders at this point and I'm not sure if all of them are justified.

Roose Bolton: Lawful Evil

Ramsay Bolton: Chaotic Evil, and how

Dany: I have no idea.

[lorddrake]

Going back a little to the first book...

Do you guys think the Dothraki are barbarians?

I gave some thought about this one... And I don't think they are the class barbarian (the people overseas may think of them as barbarians, though). Khal Drogo showed some reasoning and capacity of leadership and strategy.

And you? What do you think?

[Mastikator]

They're fighters, some fighter/barb combo.

[herrhauptmann]

Once upon a time 'barbarian' just meant uncivilized people. Where 'civilized' meant something very specific, usually the people/country calling others uncivilized.
So by that standard, they are barbarians. As viewed by Yunkai, Qarth, Free Cities, Westeros, etc.

Are the dothraki 'barbarians' in the terms of D&D? Probably not. They don't go and start raging or frenzying. If anything, Ser Loras should have a level or two in Frenzied Berserker.

[Dienekes]

They're fighters, some fighter/barb combo.

Not enough skills they on a whole seem decent in survival, ride, perception, knowledge (nature) and so on, they're probably rangers with a fighting style for riding.

[Kommander_Keen]

So my friends and I are making a campaign which takes place in Westeros, and we're using 3.0.
I don't want to ruin anything, so I'll just put the rest of this post in the Spoiler below:
The main thing we're having difficulty with is the obvious - magic. It's apparent to me that the normal magic in DnD 3.0 is simply not applicable. So we're gutting it completely. All spellcasting classes are out, with the possible exception of Ranger. We're going to have to figure something out for the Ranger though, because we're certainly not giving him/her ANY spells at all. Hopefully allowing them to take human as a favored enemy will make up for it (seeing as we'll be fighting humans exclusively for most of the campaign) but we're just going to play it by ear and see what happens. Bonus feats may be in order.
Magic in Song of Ice and Fire is seemingly 'reborn' along with Dany's dragons at the end of the 1st book/season, so we were going to incorporate this by having all magical abilities accessed through prestige classes. We have a few ideas in the works already, like Red Priest and Warg (Shapeshifter, kind of), as well as some slight adaptations such as Kingsguard (Dwarven Defender) and Braavosi (Swashbuckler). But there's other magics at work, like the Warlocks, not to mention everything North of the Wall.
I think that none (literally none) of the spells will translate AT ALL from traditional DnD to this new world. We're going to reconsider/redesign everything from scratch. The Red Priest, for example, has some of the most powerful magics in the entire world. It's blood magic though, so you can't just let them cast things per day - it all has to cost some sort of life force, either temporary stat damage, XP, or just HP.
I'm a bit worried about how such a drastic change will affect the game balance but we'll just have to test it out and see what happens. I'd love to hear your thoughts on this! Help us out.

[rafaruggi]

If you wanna play Game of Thrones, use Burning Wheel.

D&D wasn't designed for that.

[Kommander_Keen]

I'm unfamiliar with Burning Wheel, whereas my friends and I have been steeped in V 3.0 since it came out. Also, I can't afford new books at this point.
But seriously, I don't see how DnD [I]isn't[I] designed exactly for this kind of thing. The game is, at its core, the most modifiable game ever. I've done campaigns with guns and electricity and they worked out quite well I have to say.
Anyway, thanks for the suggestion and I'll do some more research, I bet I'll get some great ideas from the Burning Wheel mechanics.

[CyberThread]

I would be totally for this , but sadly I really liked one of the D&D creators but sadly George R. R. Martin written him off.



R.I.P Gary Gygax

[Silvanoshei]

That was emphasized more in the TV series, but in the books he was more renowned as a general. He was a competent swordsman, but not anywhere near the likes of the Hound, the Kingslayer, or even Robert.

Did you forget that Ned killed Gerold Hightower? The white bull was in his prime, Ned is not a pushover.

[crazyhedgewizrd]

I just like seeing people going "It's not a high magic world like your typical dnd world (I.e. Forgotten Realms) so that people in the setting cant be high level".

Do you know the difference between a level 8 fighter and a level 12 fighter, not much the level 12 can swing his sword 20% better than the level 8 and has more Hit Points.

I'm just wondering are these people are the same people who say "you cant play dnd without magic or magic items"?

[IronFist]

If you wanna play Game of Thrones, use Burning Wheel.

D&D wasn't designed for that.

You should actually use A Song of Ice and Fire RPG, designed specifically for that.

[Manly Man]

Brienne of Tarth, I'd say, is a Lawful Good (or at least Lawful Neutral with good tendencies) Fighter 4/Knight 1. There's a reason she can kick the crap out of several bandits (who would likely be Rogues between 2-4) at once.

[Yora]

You should actually use A Song of Ice and Fire RPG, designed specifically for that.
Which happens to be a conversion of D&D 3rd Edition.

[herrhauptmann]

I just like seeing people going "It's not a high magic world like your typical dnd world (I.e. Forgotten Realms) so that people in the setting cant be high level".

Do you know the difference between a level 8 fighter and a level 12 fighter, not much the level 12 can swing his sword 20% better than the level 8 and has more Hit Points.

I'm just wondering are these people are the same people who say "you cant play dnd without magic or magic items"?

Because you can't, not if you're using all the monsters in the MM. And you gotta account for how much deadlier combat is without cleric/druid healing.

[SowZ]

How has no one mentioned Jakan Hagar?

I'd say Rogue 5/Assassin 1.

Metamagic School Focus, Illusion. Arcane Thesis, Disguise Self. Extend Spell. Persist Spell. Easy Metamagic: Persist Spell. Forceful Magic.

This allows 1 persisted Disguise Self a day. A couple flaws are necessary. High skills will include move silently, hide, survival, gather information, and craft (poison.) I'm guessing good intimidate too, or is that just me?

Syrio Forel I would maybe peg as a Swashbuckler 1/Fighter 5. Weapon Focus/Weapon Specialization (Rapier.) Einhander. Quick Draw. Combat Reflexes.

[Urpriest]

I just like seeing people going "It's not a high magic world like your typical dnd world (I.e. Forgotten Realms) so that people in the setting cant be high level".

Do you know the difference between a level 8 fighter and a level 12 fighter, not much the level 12 can swing his sword 20% better than the level 8 and has more Hit Points.

I'm just wondering are these people are the same people who say "you cant play dnd without magic or magic items"?

A level 12 Fighter has around 100 hit points, which gives very good chance of surviving a fall at terminal velocity, while a level 6 (the typical cap here) has around 50 hit points, and will usually not survive.

A level 12 Fighter has around AC 10+8 (full plate) +1 Dex +4 (enhancement) +4 (natural) +4 (deflection) = 31 AC. That means you need a +12 to hit to even have a chance, without relying on natural 20's. Even in optimal conditions (enemy prone, flanked, denied Dex bonus, higher ground), you're dealing with what's effectively AC 23. An average soldier will have +1 BAB +2 Str = +3, so he's still only hitting that on a 20. And before you object that in a low-magic game the Fighter wouldn't have those enhancement, natural, and deflection bonuses, they only exist because in normal D&D AC scales with gear while attack bonus scales with level. For a low magic game you would be introducing mundane bonuses that scale at the same rate that magic ones would in order to keep the game engine sensible.

By contrast, a well-equipped level 6 Fighter would have AC 10+8+1+2+2+2=25. Still hard for our average soldier to hit, but with the same situational advantages you're lowering AC to 17, at which point you're hitting 35% of the time. This underscores the reason why people prefer E6 to full 20 level D&D for settings like Westeros: Westeros is a world where you can be the best Fighter around, but an ordinary soldier who's smart and well-prepared can still be a deadly and meaningful threat.

Then there's the whole issue of skill checks, and the fact that mundane classes are balanced with the magic classes in mind (hence why they all have save progressions). It's tough to do a proper low magic high grit 3.5 D&D game, and there are lots of systems out there that are better for it.

[FlurriesRus]

Converting GoT to DnD is very simple:

At the beginning of each session each player flips a coin, if tails circumstances will conspire to ensure their character will die by the end of the session, no save.

[Blas_de_Lezo]

Nerd Stark: Fighter.
John Snow: Ranger.
Tyrion: Rogue.
The Hound: Fighter.
Drogo: Barbarian.
Daeneris: Dragon Shaman with Leadership and Dragon Cohort.
Bronn: Fighter/rogue.
Hagar: Changeling rogue/assassin.
Jaime: Fighter.
Brienne: Knight.
Melissandra: Cleric.

[crazyhedgewizrd]

Because you can't, not if you're using all the monsters in the MM. And you gotta account for how much deadlier combat is without cleric/druid healing.

How many types of monsters are game of thrones, hardly any, a few dragons, some undead, a few giants, dire wolfs, shadowcats, and mammoths. You are not looking at a lot of monsters and monsters are rare.



A level .... are better for it.

Are you factoring in that there is no magical equipment, so that the ac is 10 +8 fullplate +1 Dex maybe a +2 heavy sheild = +19 or +21 AC, that's it. The rest of it i don't know what the heck you are saying, are you telling me that deflection and natural AC is a common thing to get without magic, please so tell me where. If you are so hang-up on Hit points so much why dont you use the variant injury rules from unearth arcana.

Why are you saying that the base soldier is level 1, its like saying only PCs can get experience and NPCs can't get any no matter what they do.

[Urpriest]

Are you factoring in that there is no magical equipment, so that the ac is 10 +8 fullplate +1 Dex maybe a +2 heavy sheild = +19 or +21 AC, that's it. The rest of it i don't know what the heck you are saying, are you telling me that deflection and natural AC is a common thing to get without magic, please so tell me where.

I explicitly explained that. If you would care to read my post again, I'm sure you can find it.



Why are you saying that the base soldier is level 1, its like saying only PCs can get experience and NPCs can't get any no matter what they do.

Are you saying there aren't any level 1 Warriors in the world? That's ludicrous. Everyone has to start somewhere.

Since the point I was making was that Game of Thrones is the sort of world where even the most inexperienced and unskilled soldier can kill you if he's smart and gets you when your figurative pants are down, I can't see what other point you would be making here.

[SowZ]

How many types of monsters are game of thrones, hardly any, a few dragons, some undead, a few giants, dire wolfs, shadowcats, and mammoths. You are not looking at a lot of monsters and monsters are rare.




Are you factoring in that there is no magical equipment, so that the ac is 10 +8 fullplate +1 Dex maybe a +2 heavy sheild = +19 or +21 AC, that's it. The rest of it i don't know what the heck you are saying, are you telling me that deflection and natural AC is a common thing to get without magic, please so tell me where. If you are so hang-up on Hit points so much why dont you use the variant injury rules from unearth arcana.

Why are you saying that the base soldier is level 1, its like saying only PCs can get experience and NPCs can't get any no matter what they do.

Yeah, even if you are only level 1 for your first battle, level 1 warriors are still a valid example.

[Grim Reader]

I can't imagine most of the world being even that high. I'd say level 4, tops.

I agree that the world is low level, but I think 4 tops gives us a scale that is too...grainy.

Ned Stark seems a fair fighter, but no match for the top notch, like Jaime, Gregor Cleggane etc. He is still well above the average fighting man, I think.

The kids, like Jon, seems to be just approaching an adult fighting man for skill, but Jon is still able to handle a number of untrained recruits his own age.

I'd say that the highest level melee people are about 6, with Barristan above that. The kids, in book 1, are just starting out, the girls probably with a level of aristocrat, the boys getting figher. Jon probably takes his second level as ranger during the first book.

[SowZ]

I agree that the world is low level, but I think 4 tops gives us a scale that is too...grainy.

Ned Stark seems a fair fighter, but no match for the top notch, like Jaime, Gregor Cleggane etc. He is still well above the average fighting man, I think.

The kids, like Jon, seems to be just approaching an adult fighting man for skill, but Jon is still able to handle a number of untrained recruits his own age.

I'd say that the highest level melee people are about 6, with Barristan above that. The kids, in book 1, are just starting out, the girls probably with a level of aristocrat, the boys getting figher. Jon probably takes his second level as ranger during the first book.

Jon is at least second level when the story starts. Consider that he is the best warrior among the Stark children, and Theon/Rob were able to handle 4 Wildling raiders. Handling four untrained night watchman at once is something a level 1 couldn't do, even if they were all commoners.

[crazyhedgewizrd]

I explicitly explained that. If you would care to read my post again, I'm sure you can find it.

I find no point in this anymore, you are one of those people who say dnd doesn't work without magic and probably thinks trippyverse actually works.

[SowZ]

I find no point in this anymore, you are one of those people who say dnd doesn't work without magic and probably thinks trippyverse actually works.

D&D could work without magic, but in Game of Thrones no one is level 10+. A high level fighter is killed by a single gore of a pig. No one could singlehandedly take on CR 10 monsters in a straight up fight.

[Analytica]

There are spell-less ranger variants in some Complete book.

For magic, consider taking the system from Call of Cthulhu d20 - effectively, the Corrupt spells are all there is; those cost ability damage/drain.

[Urpriest]

I find no point in this anymore, you are one of those people who say dnd doesn't work without magic and probably thinks trippyverse actually works.

Considering that the very part of my post that you've been ignoring is a point about how to run low-magic D&D that every competent DM that runs D&D low magic takes into account and that your other posts indicate has never occurred to you, I'd say I have more practical experience with low-magic D&D than you do.

[Balthanon]

And yet the people who actually matter continue to look down on him despite everything he manages to do for them. He manages to befriend some barbarians and a sellsword, neither of whom have anything resembling social skills. He's above average at the whole diplomacy thing, but he's legitimately worse than Littlefinger, or even Cercei, at the diplomacy game. His advantage was always being more clever than his opposition, not being better able to win people to his side with words.


All of his victories in combat were more through luck than skill. Like I said, he may have a dip for proficiencies, but he's no Fighter. (that said the difference between a fighter and a warrior is 1 feat... what feat is it that Tyrion would have from his fighter level if he absolutely must be a PC?)

Personally, I would place Tyrion as a Bard/Urban Savant, specializing in knowledge skills (he can also tumble and has a number of other fairly eclectic skills). He doesn't need a high charisma because he uses his Intelligence bonus on Diplomacy checks. (Maybe Bard 4/Aristocrat 1/Urban Savant 2 if we're staying fairly low level, though honestly I think he needs sneak attack as well... I think he starts around here and then starts adding more combat classes into the mix when the "campaign" starts.)

I frankly think just the fact that he's managed to survive 5 books in the Game of Thrones universe is enough to argue he has a ridiculous amount of hit points. People tend to forget that hp isn't just taking a wound and toughing it out-- it can be modeled just as easily as a pool of luck that you wear through. And for that matter, luck is a trait you can purchase with feats as well-- lucky victories don't mean you're low level.

Robert, for instance, didn't die from a single boar's attack-- he died because he went on a two week bender, never got any healing, was essentially poisoned, and _then_ got gored by a boar.

The fact that Tyrion is still looked down upon by those in power is likely because the DM is apparently allowing the use of flaws and he took one or more that gave him some massive disadvantages (namely, being a dwarf and an ugly one at that). Despite that, he has a number of pretty significant victories in the political arena-- I would say he demonstrated himself as Cersei's better pretty handily until his father arrived and he was put out of commission for weeks on end. Littlefinger is clearly his better, but he has dedicated himself to the pursuit of power-- Tyrion is a scholar ultimately.

[Zonugal]

I think some builds like those below in an E6 campaign setting would work okay.

Ned Stark: Human Knight 4
Jon Snow: Human Ranger 3
Bran Stark: Human Telepath 3
Sansa Stark: Human Aristocrat 1
Arya Stark: Human Rogue 1
Theon Greyjoy: Human Ranger 3
Robb Stark: Human Knight 2/Warblade 2
Catelyn Stark: Human Aristocrat 2
Brienne of Tarth: Human Fighter 2/Knight 1
Tyrion Lannister: Halfling Marshal 2/Rogue 1
Jaime Lannister: Human Warblade 6
Cersei Lannister: Human Aristocrat 2
Tywin Lannister: Human Marshal 6
Joffrey Baratheon: Human Fighter 2
Robert Baratheon: Human Barbarian 1/Fighter 2/Warblade 1
Daenerys Targaryen: Human Bard 6
Jorah Mormont: Human Ranger 3/Knight 1
Khal Drogo: Human Ranger 2/Barbarian 2/Fighter 2
Barristan Selmy: Human Ranger 1/Knight 1/Warblade 4
Petyr Baelish: Human Rogue 3
Samwell Tarly: Human Aristocrat 1/Ranger 1
Sandor Clegane: Human Warblade 4
Varys: Human Bard 3
Bronn: Human Sneak Attack Thug Fighter 4
Jaqen H'ghar: Human Rogue 3/Ranger 1/Rogue 1/Assassin 1
Syrio Forel: Human Warblade 6
Grand Maester Pycelle: Human Expert 2/Rogue 1
Davos Seaworth: Human Rogue 2/Knight 1
Stannis Baratheon: Human Barbarian 1/Fighter 4/Crusader 1
Melisandre: Human Cleric 3/Church Inquisitor 1/Master of Shrouds 2

[SowZ]

I think some builds like those below in an E6 campaign setting would work okay.

Ned Stark: Human Knight 4
Jon Snow: Human Ranger 3
Bran Stark: Human Telepath 3
Sansa Stark: Human Aristocrat 1
Arya Stark: Human Rogue 1
Theon Greyjoy: Human Ranger 3
Robb Stark: Human Knight 2/Warblade 2
Catelyn Stark: Human Aristocrat 2
Brienne of Tarth: Human Fighter 2/Knight 1
Tyrion Lannister: Halfling Marshal 2/Rogue 1
Jaime Lannister: Human Warblade 6
Cersei Lannister: Human Aristocrat 2
Tywin Lannister: Human Marshal 6
Joffrey Baratheon: Human Fighter 2
Robert Baratheon: Human Barbarian 1/Fighter 2/Warblade 1
Daenerys Targaryen: Human Bard 6
Jorah Mormont: Human Ranger 3/Knight 1
Khal Drogo: Human Ranger 2/Barbarian 2/Fighter 2
Barristan Selmy: Human Ranger 1/Knight 1/Warblade 4
Petyr Baelish: Human Rogue 3
Samwell Tarly: Human Aristocrat 1/Ranger 1
Sandor Clegane: Human Warblade 4
Varys: Human Bard 3
Bronn: Human Sneak Attack Thug Fighter 4
Jaqen H'ghar: Human Rogue 3/Ranger 1/Rogue 1/Assassin 1
Syrio Forel: Human Warblade 6
Grand Maester Pycelle: Human Expert 2/Rogue 1
Davos Seaworth: Human Rogue 2/Knight 1
Stannis Baratheon: Human Barbarian 1/Fighter 4/Crusader 1
Melisandre: Human Cleric 3/Church Inquisitor 1/Master of Shrouds 2

Robb isn't a particularly good fighter. Certainly not better than Jon. As for major disagreements here, no way is Stannis the equal of Barristan. Stannis is a good fighter. But I wouldn't peg him higher than 3, 4 tops. And Theon would get his own foot served to him on a platter against Brienne. Anyone who bests the Kingslayer, (even if he is at a severe disadvantage,) should be worthy of level 4 or so. Also, Ned shouldn't be able to stand toe to toe with the hound IMO.

Otherwise, it is cool to see how many you statted up. Why is Joffrey second level, though? The dude's a pansy. Arya could wipe that stupid sociopathic smirk off his face 7 days out of the week.

How high would you suppose the Viper is?

[bekeleven]

If you are running GoT as 3.X with rangers, change their favored enemy to be humans by region. Favored Enemy (Dothraki), or (Dornishman), or (Wildling) would all be valid.

[Hytheter]

Daenerys Targaryen: Human Bard 6
Varys: Human Bard 3

Not really seeing these ones...

[DonEsteban]

Daenerys is clearly a sorceress, who took an ACF from some obscure third party splatbook swapping all her spell slots for the Improved Familiar feat chain. ;)

[Zonugal]

Robb isn't a particularly good fighter. Certainly not better than Jon.

I'd argue he is and that in that build Robb isn't focused on improving his own skills rather leading others in a battle (and thus would focus pretty heavily on White Raven).


As for major disagreements here, no way is Stannis the equal of Barristan. Stannis is a good fighter. But I wouldn't peg him higher than 3, 4 tops.

Just because a character has the same BaB doesn't make them equals. I put Stannis, alongside a bunch of other characters, at level six so he could get leadership.


And Theon would get his own foot served to him on a platter against Brienne. Anyone who bests the Kingslayer, (even if he is at a severe disadvantage,) should be worthy of level 4 or so. Also, Ned shouldn't be able to stand toe to toe with the hound IMO.

Perhaps Brienne should! But seeing as she held her own against a fatigued, bound opponent she isn't that impressive. And as I have mentioned before being equal level/BaB doesn't make characters equal on a battlefield. A 4th-level Knight isn't equal to a 4th-level Warblade.


Otherwise, it is cool to see how many you statted up. Why is Joffrey second level, though? The dude's a pansy. Arya could wipe that stupid sociopathic smirk off his face 7 days out of the week.

Joffrey I could see kicking back down to 1st-level Fighter. I primarily just wanted to give him a BaB of +1 and a feat to improve his crossbows.

[Psyren]

RE: Jaime, I agree with Seerow.

Also, I definitely agree that D&D is totally the wrong system for this game.

[SowZ]

I'd argue he is and that in that build Robb isn't focused on improving his own skills rather leading others in a battle (and thus would focus pretty heavily on White Raven).



Just because a character has the same BaB doesn't make them equals. I put Stannis, alongside a bunch of other characters, at level six so he could get leadership.



Perhaps Brienne should! But seeing as she held her own against a fatigued, bound opponent she isn't that impressive. And as I have mentioned before being equal level/BaB doesn't make characters equal on a battlefield. A 4th-level Knight isn't equal to a 4th-level Warblade.



Joffrey I could see kicking back down to 1st-level Fighter. I primarily just wanted to give him a BaB of +1 and a feat to improve his crossbows.

Even still, she has been outnumbered by well trained soldiers, (at least level two, probably,) and come out on top multiple times. She took down two of Renley's King's Guard in seconds. Those guys had to be at least level 3 Warriors.

As for Robb, sure, he's a good leader. But he mostly relies on strategy and tactics, not leading from the front. A level 1 character with high Int could be an excellent tactician. The way you have Robb statted he would be able to take on six or seven mooks at once and win. Robb is just never shown as being that strong or skilled with a sword.

Joffrey likes crossbows a lot, but he isn't that great with them. You could give him weapon focus if you'd like, but he has a MW crossbow and would never actually shoot someone with it if he didn't have every advantage, (unless running away wasn't an option.)

Also, having an army doesn't mean Leadership feat. If you have to justify his troops with leadership, Stannis would have to be 27th level and have all the Epic Leadership feats. He has the troops because of his circumstances. He isn't even all that charismatic. I wouldn't give him the Leadership feat because I could never see him drawing crowds of followers to him if he was a normal guy

Arya has probably grabbed an extra level or two by the end of book 3/4, too.

[Ossian]

Hmmmm, the levels scale too quickly to render GOT well. Still, if I should try with just the Starks....

At best.

House Stark

John Snow: Ranger 3

Ned Stark: Aristocrat 1, Fighter 5

Robb Stark: Aristocrat 2 / Fighter 1

Arya Stark: Rogue 1 / Swashbuckler 1

Sansa Stark: Aristocrat 1 / Commoner 1

Cathleen Stark: Aristocrat 2 (no armour proficiency) / Expert 4 (Diplomat)

Brandon : Aristocrat 1 (shapeshifter template, or warg)

Hodor: Commoner 3 (STR 20)

Just about everyone else follows a similar pattern. They are all really just a bunch of kids :)

Perhaps Brienne, Jorah, Jaimie, Vargo Hoath, Tywin, Barristan, Daario, Khal Drogo deserve more of a level breakdown.

They really are more "talented" people than "unkillable PC". For example:

Drogo: Fighter 5 / Scout 2 (Mobility, the steppe, etc....) or Barristan: Knight 7

Jaimie: Aristocrat 1 / Knight 2 / Fighter 4

Brienne: Knight 4

[ddude987]

Converting GoT to DnD is very simple:

At the beginning of each session each player flips a coin, if tails circumstances will conspire to ensure their character will die by the end of the session, no save.

Can I sig this? :smallbiggrin:

[Troacctid]

How about Euron "Crow's Eye" Greyjoy? He'd have high Int and Cha with ranks in bluff, intimidate, profession (sailor), knowledge (arcana), knowledge (local), and use magic device. He definitely has Leadership, so he's at least level 6, and he's not a primary spellcaster but he's dabbled enough that he'd probably have a dip. Rogue/Wizard/Dread Pirate? Maybe Unseen Seer or Legendary Captain?

[Invader]

In the books he was never particularly renowned as a great swordsman. That was emphasized more in the TV series, but in the books he was more renowned as a general. He was a competent swordsman, but not anywhere near the likes of the Hound, the Kingslayer, or even Robert. If he is a pure fighter, it's low level, but I'd guess it's more likely that he's a Warrior, or a Fighter1/AristocratX (while he hated Kings Landing, he did have a firm control over the north which requires some diplomatic skill. He had a low wisdom and likely little sense motive, and no bluff. But I'd imagine his actual diplomacy skill was pretty good, along with Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) and Knowledge (History).)

He was fighting Jaime to a stand still and he conceivably could have won until he got attacked from behind, I'd say that's worth more than a single level of fighter or Warrior.

Arya would have levels of assassin since, you know, that's exactly what she is.

[Invader]

And his charisma is above average despite appearances. That is why he is so persuasive and is able to change the allegiances of so many people--Bronn, all of the mountain men, etc.



You're confusing charisma with currency...

[Troacctid]

You're confusing charisma with currency...

Yeah, I'd say Tyrion has average charisma at best, with penalties for being ugly. Everyone hates him! He makes up for it with skill ranks as well as synergy and circumstance bonuses, not to mention some insanely lucky rolls.

[Captnq]

I'm working on a my little pony/game of thrones combo called:

My Little Throney: Winter is Magic.

I'm sticking with E6. While they may be highly skilled, everyone is rather fragile in game of thrones.

[CyberThread]

what about this badass?


http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120523132529/gameofthrones/images/5/52/Jaqen_H'ghar.png

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

It doesn't use the D&D core rules, but it is a d20 based game. (http://www.amazon.com/Game-Thrones-D20-Based-Open-Gaming/dp/1588469425/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1399567150&sr=8-2&keywords=game+of+thrones+rpg) A friend of mine has a copy of it, but we've never played it. I believe it uses a system similar to Vitality and Wounds from UA, has maiming rules for critical hits, gives you very few hp/level after 1st but not many sources of bonus damage, and a bunch of other differences. Most of all, magic does not exist beyond plot devices, PCs cannot use magic. For that reason, D&D is one of the worst systems to use to represent it.

[Gildedragon]

what about this badass?


http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120523132529/gameofthrones/images/5/52/Jaqen_H'ghar.png

Changeling most prolly

As to hodor: half-giant commoner with the pig flaw... Except the pig has been PAOed into a nobleman named Bran Stark who is taking levels in some psionic nonsense

[Arbane]

Since the point I was making was that Game of Thrones is the sort of world where even the most inexperienced and unskilled soldier can kill you if he's smart and gets you when your figurative pants are down, I can't see what other point you would be making here.

As someone on RPGnet put it, the problem is that there's several different games going on. Most of the characters are in RuneQuest, the people on the wall are in D&D, and Daenerys is in Exalted.