Arcane Monk? [Pathfinder]

[Lord.Sorasen]

So, I'm about to engage in a new campaign, and a friend of mine is asking for some help making her character.

In the beginning she told me she wasn't sure whether she wanted to run a monk or a wizard (she is entirely aware of the fact that these classes are on the opposite ends of the power system, but our group has never cared and it hasn't made a big difference yet). Well, I in my foolishness suggested both, and now we're looking for a way to get both the feel of a monk and the feel of an arcane caster within a build. We're not looking for too much power but we are looking for elegance, which essentially means she wants the build to have some level of synergy.

Here's what we were considering so far:

- Magus20 or Magus 20/Monk 1. Looking to use the whole staff magus variant and take a couple feats in unarmed strikes. The idea would be to use the magus arcana which turns ranged touch to melee touch.
- Wizard20 or Wizard 19/monk 1. Take unarmed feats, and otherwise just sort of use spells that increase physical abilities. It'd be a wizard played very suboptimally. I'm not fond of this one.
- Qinggong Monk. This one would be played pretty much as intended.

That's actually all I have right now. So since this is pretty bare, I'm hoping you all might know of ideas?

[Curious]

Hungry Ghost (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk/archetypes/paizo---monk-archetypes/hungry-ghost-monk), Qinggong (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk/archetypes/paizo---monk-archetypes/qinggong-monk) monk. Trade Tongue of the Sun and Moon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk#TOC-Tongue-of-the-Sun-and-Moon-Ex-) for Cold Ice Strike (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/cold-ice-strike), trade High Jump (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk#TOC-High-Jump-Ex-) for Gaseous Form (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/g/gaseous-form), trade Wholeness of Body (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk#TOC-Wholeness-of-Body-Su-) for Restoration (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/restoration), take the Dimensional feats on the PFSRD up to Dimensional Dervish (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/dimensional-dervish), grab the Spider Step (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/spider-step) and Cloud Step (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/cloud-step) feats, get a keen guided (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-weapons/magic-weapons-non-core/weapon-property---guided) weapon. Pick up a few style feats, such as Dragon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/dragon-style-combat) or Crane (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/crane-wing-combat) style.

Guided adds Wis to damage and to hit in place of Str, Dimensional Dervish allows you to move + full attack, Spider Step allows you to run across water or up walls, cloud Step allows you to run across the air, Gaseous Form lets you go through walls, Restoration is always useful, Cold Ice Strike is a swift action 15d6 attack, Hungry Ghost allows you to regain ki on a crit or kill. Be human.

Here's how you optimize Qinggong Monk.

[Drelua]

Another cool idea would be to take Blood Crow Strike (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/blood-crow-strike) and Quicken Spell-Like Ability (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/monster-feats/quicken-spell-like-ability) to make 2 full attacks in a round, one at medium range. You might ask your DM to refluff Blood Crow Strike, although it fits pretty well thematically with Hungry Ghost Monk's fluff if you decide to go that route. I don't know how optimal this is, it just sounds really cool to me, just like I know Dhampir is, mechanically, a terrible fit for Hungry Ghost Monk, but the fluff just matches up seamlessly.

[McToomin]

You could also allow her to port over Enlightened Fist from Complete Arcane. Just allow her to trade the required 8 ranks in Concentration to something else (since Concentration is no longer a skill in PF). Enlightened Fist is about as perfect a mix of arcane and monk abilities as you can get. I'm playing one right now that is tons of fun, and especially if your group isn't too concerned with optimization, she'll have plenty of options and tons of fun. Turning all your spells into touch attacks is great. :P

*EDIT* Maybe just 8 ranks in Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft instead? This would create a build of something like Monk 2/Wizard 6/Enlightened Fist 10/whatever 2. It's possible to enter Enlightened Fist earlier than that if there's a feat equivalent to Practiced Spellcaster (which raises your caster level by 4).

Alternately, if she's not too worried about spell resistance, only take Enlightened Fist to 7 for Hold Ray.

Alternately alternately, maybe Magus is better for the build than Wizard? I'm not very familiar with Magus.

[Lord.Sorasen]

You could also allow her to port over Enlightened Fist from Complete Arcane. Just allow her to trade the required 8 ranks in Concentration to something else (since Concentration is no longer a skill in PF). Enlightened Fist is about as perfect a mix of arcane and monk abilities as you can get. I'm playing one right now that is tons of fun, and especially if your group isn't too concerned with optimization, she'll have plenty of options and tons of fun. Turning all your spells into touch attacks is great. :P

*EDIT* Maybe just 8 ranks in Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft instead? This would create a build of something like Monk 2/Wizard 6/Enlightened Fist 10/whatever 2. It's possible to enter Enlightened Fist earlier than that if there's a feat equivalent to Practiced Spellcaster (which raises your caster level by 4).

Alternately, if she's not too worried about spell resistance, only take Enlightened Fist to 7 for Hold Ray.

Alternately alternately, maybe Magus is better for the build than Wizard? I'm not very familiar with Magus.

I haven't looked too into it, but it definitely looks like Magus wouldn't be better. The idea of magus is that it's a gish in a can and has some neat abilities to that end. The enlightened fist seems to do a fine job of this, which would make the combination a bit redundant.

I have to ask, why 8 ranks? If you aren't familiar with skills in pathfinder, there is no "maximum ranks = Level + 3." It's just "level." Which would mean that it would take a lot longer to get into the class via pathfinder than it would via 3.5.

I'm normally opposed to using 3.5 things in Pathfinder campaigns but I am definitely thinking about making an exception. That Arcane Fist/Hold Ray thing just seems so cool.

In 3.5, would you be able to make it to this class with monk 1/Wizard 5? That's what it looks like to me but I want to make sure.

[McToomin]

Well, I said 8 ranks because Enlightened Fist normally requires 8 ranks in Concentration. But you're right, I wasn't thinking about the significantly different ways that skills are allocated in 3.5 vs. Pathfinder. And yeah, Monk 1/Wizard 5 would qualify easy. Just make sure to grab Combat Casting and the required skills. Hold ray is just a ton of fun to use, speaking from experience. Hopefully you'll allow the player to wear some kind of glove (if not a gauntlet, some people substitute leather hand wrappings or something similar) that she can enchant, but still use her unarmed strike damage through. I recommend two gloves of Spell Storing. She'll get some very useful 1-3rd level spells, and having two extra castings per day of stuff like Shocking Grasp, Ray of Enfeeblement, Shivering Touch, or Vampiric Touch which will make her pretty powerful in a non-optimized group.

[Lord.Sorasen]

Well, I said 8 ranks because Enlightened Fist normally requires 8 ranks in Concentration. But you're right, I wasn't thinking about the significantly different ways that skills are allocated in 3.5 vs. Pathfinder. And yeah, Monk 1/Wizard 5 would qualify easy. Just make sure to grab Combat Casting and the required skills. Hold ray is just a ton of fun to use, speaking from experience. Hopefully you'll allow the player to wear some kind of glove (if not a gauntlet, some people substitute leather hand wrappings or something similar) that she can enchant, but still use her unarmed strike damage through. I recommend two gloves of Spell Storing. She'll get some very useful 1-3rd level spells, and having two extra castings per day of stuff like Shocking Grasp, Ray of Enfeeblement, Shivering Touch, or Vampiric Touch which will make her pretty powerful in a non-optimized group.

If I remember correctly, pathfinder has a weapon that serves that purpose officially.

[Arutema]

It has Brass Knuckles, but the developers see to be backpedaling on whether or not you can use your unarmed damage with them. See their SRD entry (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/brass-knuckles) for the gory details.

[Stormageddon]

See if you could use the feat kung fu genius. Switching the monks abilities from wis to int.

[McToomin]

Just as an example of why you should let her port over Enlightened Fist, my group was playing recently and got attacked by a Death Slaad (out of nowhere, we were like literally 100 xp from leveling and begged the DM to give us something before the session ended so we could level before the next session). His first attack blinds me for the entire encounter (blind for several minutes? I forget the specific time). I was also deafened for about 4 rounds I think. Once I could hear again, I simply had the party members direct me to it and continued casting touch attacks, while BLIND, and I'm pretty sure I never missed once (got lucky on my 50% miss chance, but still). Granted, getting lucky on the miss chances helped me more, but only needing to touch the thing to cast my best spells was amazing.

It just outclassed us (it was too high a level encounter for our group), but the Spirit Shaman and I used a combination of Moonbolt (I think that was it, it robs Strength) and my Ray of Enfeeblement to lower his Strength down to 0, and then just smash him in the face. Thanks to Hold Ray, all I had to do was successfully touch several times. Thanks Hold Ray!

Also, right before he died he summoned some kind of green slaad (I'm not too familiar with slaads). ONE casting of Shivering Touch and a lucky roll, and I dropped its Dex completely and it went down. All while blind. :P