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Tyndmyr
2011-10-20, 09:27 AM
Sure, summoners have been done before...but let's be honest, they're generally pretty clunky to use. The summons by RAW are pretty weak without splatbook diving, and are mostly only good for SLAs and the like. They need something new. Something better. Something that doesn't require lots of optimization to make work.




{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+0|
+2|
+0|
+2|Call Monster 1

2nd|
+1|
+3|
+0|
+3|Sacrifice Monster

3rd|
+1|
+3|
+1|
+3|Call Monster 2

4th|
+2|
+4|
+1|
+4|Empower Monster

5th|
+2|
+4|
+1|
+4|Call Monster 3

6th|
+3|
+5|
+2|
+5|

7th|
+3|
+5|
+2|
+5|Call Monster 4

8th|
+4|
+6|
+2|
+6|

9th|
+4|
+6|
+3|
+6|Call Monster 5

10th|
+5|
+7|
+3|
+7|

11th|
+5|
+7|
+3|
+7|Call Monster 6

12th|
+6/1|
+8|
+4|
+8|

13th|
+6/1|
+8|
+4|
+8|Call Monster 7

14th|
+7/2|
+9|
+4|
+9|

15th|
+7/2|
+9|
+5|
+9|Call Monster 8

16th|
+8/3|
+10|
+5|
+10|

17th|
+8/3|
+10|
+5|
+10|Call Monster 9

18th|
+9/4|
+11|
+6|
+11|

19th|
+9/4|
+11|
+6|
+11|Call Monster 10

20th|
+10/5|
+12|
+6|
+12|[/table]

Monster Calling: A Summoner may have one monster called at a time. He may direct it as a free mental action on his turn, and can perceive anything his monster can perceive. If he calls another monster when he already has a monster controlled, the first monster vanishes at the end of his turn. Calling a monster inflicts damage on the Summoner equal to the level of Call Monster used. Called Monsters always act on the Summoners initiative count. If a Called Monster ever travels more than 500 feet from the Summoner, the effect ends, and the Monster vanishes.

Call Monster 1: As a standard action, a Summoner may summon a Homind with stats as shown below.

Sacrifice Monster: As a swift action, a Summoner may sacrifice a monster for the listed sacrifice effect in it's stat block.

Call Monster 2: As a standard action, a Summoner may summon an Improved Homind or a Slither with stats as shown below.

Empower Monster: When calling a Monster, a Summoner may opt to infuse it with some of his life essence. By sacrificing 5 hp, the called monster receives a +4 bonus to attack and damage.

Call Monster 3: As a standard action, a Summoner may summon a Nightstalker, a Large Homind or an Advanced Slither with stats as shown below.

Hominid(Medium Humanoid):
Str 14 Dex 13 Con 12 Int 3 Wis 3 Cha 3
HP: 11(1 HD)
BaB/Grapple: +1/+3
Attack: Slam +3 Melee(1d8+3/x2)
Space/Reach: 5ft/5ft
Abilities: Can not speak.
Sacrifice: 1d4 Untyped damage to all within 5 feet/fort DC 15 negates.

Advanced Hominid

Slither(Small Magical Beast):
Str 10 Dex 10 Con 10 Int 3 Wis 2 Cha 2
HP: 9(2 HD)
BaB/Grapple: +1/-3
Attack: Slam +2 Melee(1d4/x2)
Space/Reach: 5ft/5ft
Abilities: Darkvision 30 feet, Spider Climb at/will, can speak any language the Summoner knows.

Advanced Slither

Large Hominid

Nightstalker


Arrright, lots, lots more to do, but feedback on what's done so far is quite welcome.

Tyndmyr
2011-10-20, 09:28 AM
*Reserved cause there's probably gonna be a helluva creature list*

Zeta Kai
2011-10-20, 09:58 AM
It's fairly sparse, so far, but I wanted to point out that this class, as it stands now, needs a capstone ability. Badly.

Also, I'm not sure that Empower Monster is such a hot idea. Sacrificing a static amount of HP for a static bonus for the summon won't scale well at all. By level 10, that will be a tiny bonus, while the damage is still significant. By level 20, both effects will be almost completely irrelevant. A scaling effect would be preferable.

Speaking of sacrifices, I can't tall what Sacrifice Monster is supposed to actually do, or how it's supposed to work. I presume that this will be expanded upon later?

bobthe6th
2011-10-20, 10:16 AM
This seems to have the same problems as a druid... class featyure greater than or equal to another player...

Tyndmyr
2011-10-20, 11:07 AM
Sacrifice allows you to dispose of your currently active monster for an effect. In short, it allows you to do more in a round, at the expense of being shy a monster later, which is a notable cost for nova ability.

I plan to add improved versions of Empower Monster later in the progression...this class should play with monsters being generally fairly squishy and disposable. Summon Monster X generally had only two viable forms of melee summons, the "pile o' hp" which could be mostly ignored, and grapplers. Grappling is awesome, but the fact remains that playing a summoner in 3.5 basically involved a lot of splatbook diving for the best summons, being very specialized in it(and most summoning prcs are traps), and constantly dealing with limited spell slots/short duration summons. Also, templated creatures and a stat nightmare. That all needs to die.

Bob, this differs rather notably from the druid. This IS the class feature. It's all summoning, whereas the druid has summoning tacked on to other very potent things. The summoning rather has to be as potent as other classes, or the entire class is impotent.

bobthe6th
2011-10-20, 12:24 PM
hmmm... I would think this could use an astral construct like approach. then it can just give levels of construct, and you can add abilities.

also perhaps the sacrifise could be a list, you select what effect happens when you sacrifice a summon. this list would grow as you levels.

Grod_The_Giant
2011-10-20, 12:40 PM
I like the idea, which seems to go a long way towards making summoning easier and less broken. My biggest concern at the moment is that your actual character has nothing to do in combat- he just runs around trying to stay out of range, occasionally detonating his minion. Perhaps a few buffing abilities or spells might not go amiss?