Arbalester on Intelligent item?

[Alokue]

I've got this magic crossbow that my artificer has made, and she put an arbalester on it. She now wants to enchant the crossbow to be intelligent. Are there rules on that? I'm having trouble finding any, or any discussion about that on the GITP forums. Do the crossbow and the arbalester remain separate entities, keeping their own thoughts and whatnaught? If they do, could they have disagreements? What I'd really like to do is make the arbalester homunculus, but give complete control over it to the crossbow. Thanks for any help.

[Kol Korran]

isn't an arbalest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbalest) just a stronger type of crossbow? how can you put one over a crossbow? :smallconfused:

anyway, intelligent items are covered in this page (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/intelligentItems.htm), but their creations is covered here. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/creatingMagicItems.htm#intelligentItemCreation) 15th level... yikes!

isn't the arbalester already a homonuculi? i think the cross bow might control it, but what is really the difference? you want to save you directing it to new targets? might be possible i think.

hope this helps.
Kol.

[Coidzor]

Item Familiars can become intelligent.

But IIRC, Arbalesters have some form of rudimentary intelligence due to being homunculi.

Just takethe Improved Homunculus feat and go from there with it.

[Alokue]

I think I was kinda unclear. My question isn't whether I can do this: it's clear I can. My question is what happens when I do.

My question is, when I use the DMG rules for making an intelligent magic item out of the crossbow that my arbalester(Magic of Ebberon) homunculus is attached to, are they the same 'person', per se, or are they two different 'people'? Ie, is it a crossbow who can tell what's happening, is all sophisticated and stuff, and can cast spells on me, but who is being loaded by some less than genius construct, or is it now a crossbow who can load himself, fly around, and have intellectual conversation with me?

I really like the improved homunculous idea, and I think I'm going to use it, but homunculi only have rudimentary intelligence, and my character needs a companion as well as a battle partner.

[Kol Korran]

my arbalester(Magic of Ebberon) homunculus is attached to, are they the same 'person', per se, or are they two different 'people'? Ie, is it a crossbow who can tell what's happening, is all sophisticated and stuff, and can cast spells on me, but who is being loaded by some less than genius construct, or is it now a crossbow who can load himself, fly around, and have intellectual conversation with me?


they aren't the same person. a warforged who's attached to an intelligent weapon or their intelligent item afamiliar doesn't "join with them".

it can hold a conversation as a character with their mental stats, and depending on it's communication abilities.

the crossbow can't move by itself (load or fly)- in that respect it it still just a crossbow, intelligent items don't get those abilities, though i assume that you might find a way to enchant it with this ability.

i hope this helps.

[Alokue]

The warforged point helped. Thanks for your time. :)

If you're interested -- The arbalester is actually a semi-intelligent construct attached to the crossbow that can load it, shoot it, and be upgraded to fly around holding it, so, in essence, the crossbow is loading itself, but it's actually the construct attached to it doing all that.

[marcielle]

Arbelester probably has an abyssmal saving throw. The intelligent item will probably end up taking control of it most of the time. Watch out for this.

[phlidwsn]

I like the idea of the crossbow that smarter than the construct wielding it. Good potential for fun by-play between the two. ("No you idiot, up and to the left, watch what you're grabbing, don't you dare scratch me, etc")

[Alokue]

Arbelester probably has an abyssmal saving throw. The intelligent item will probably end up taking control of it most of the time. Watch out for this.

Would be awesome if I could lower the Arbelester's saving throw below normal, so that it always fails -- I'd LIKE the item to control it. Any ideas on how to do this?

Although...
I like the idea of the crossbow that smarter than the construct wielding it. Good potential for fun by-play between the two. ("No you idiot, up and to the left, watch what you're grabbing, don't you dare scratch me, etc") sounds like it could be a lot of fun...but my character would be trying to avoid this, so I guess I should as well.

[supermonkeyjoe]

As far as I'm aware, creating the arbalester permanently bonds it to the crossbow, the crossbow is part of the arbalester and no longer exists as a separate item so it can't be turned into an intelligent item, the only reason the crossbow can be enhance is because of the arbalester's receive enhancement ability:


Receive Enhancement (Ex): The crossbow built
into an arbalester can be magically enhanced as if it were
a normal masterwork weapon. The costs for enhancing the
weapon with enhancement bonuses and other special qualities
are independent of those associated with constructing
or advancing the homunculus

The language is a bit vague but I don't believe that this would include making it into an intelligent item, DMs are free tu rule otherwise thouigh.

[Alokue]

IMO,
The crossbow built into an arbalester can be magically enhanced as if it were a normal masterwork weapon.


Intelligent Item Creation...Time and creation cost are based on the normal item creation rules...

I'd argue that, since it's not explicitly stated that you can't, it's implied that all creation rules for Intelligent Items are created according to normal rules, meaning that the first quote says proceed as normal.

However...I'd be interested to know what you think about creating the intelligent item first, and then putting the arbalester onto it. Does the intelligent item get a save? Is it a will save? Against what? If it fails, is the intelligence destroyed and replaced by the arbalester? Are you just not allowed to put an arbalester on an intelligent item? Usually when you "Can't" do something in D&D, there's something negative that happens when you try, and it seems like it's usually explicitly stated. Let me know what you think. :D

[Morphic tide]

IMO,



I'd argue that, since it's not explicitly stated that you can't, it's implied that all creation rules for Intelligent Items are created according to normal rules, meaning that the first quote says proceed as normal.

However...I'd be interested to know what you think about creating the intelligent item first, and then putting the arbalester onto it. Does the intelligent item get a save? Is it a will save? Against what? If it fails, is the intelligence destroyed and replaced by the arbalester? Are you just not allowed to put an arbalester on an intelligent item? Usually when you "Can't" do something in D&D, there's something negative that happens when you try, and it seems like it's usually explicitly stated. Let me know what you think. :D

I, personally, would rule that the crafter chooses. And if they make the crossbow intelligent after putting it into the Arbalester, it applies the new mental stats and personality to the Arbalester.