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View Full Version : Should eating dragon meat be good or bad?: And other puzzling questions



Maximus:Ranger
2011-10-24, 10:10 PM
This thread is for tips or ideas on how to handle the odder things that the rules may not elaborate on. Mainly for me is this question; what are the effects of eating dragon meat? My players recently slew their first red dragon, and now the wild card of the party wants to make a dragon steak. Any interesting ideas?

legomaster00156
2011-10-24, 10:15 PM
I would simply rule that it's hard to cook (on account of a red dragon's immunity to fire) and very tough to chew, but filling. One Medium-sized dragon should give enough food for about a week of feeding 5 people. I wouldn't put any adverse effects on the party for eating it.

Mikeavelli
2011-10-24, 10:17 PM
They're sentient beings!

Tasty, tasty sentient beings.

Hiro Protagonest
2011-10-24, 10:24 PM
They're sentient beings!

Tasty, tasty sentient beings.

Dragons eat humans. :smalltongue:

Eating sapient beings isnt the part that has to do with morals, it's how you obtain the meat that does.

stainboy
2011-10-24, 10:28 PM
I don't see why not. Paladins are allowed to wear dragonhide armor without anyone making Silence of the Lambs references.

bloodtide
2011-10-24, 10:32 PM
You could go with 'it just tastes like chicken.'

Or have dragon meat be poisonous, or maybe give some type a magical side effect.


But i kinda like the 'being haunted by the dragon spirit or such.

Mastikator
2011-10-24, 10:37 PM
The main effect is that it keeps you from starving to death.
Other than that I don't know if there's any effect for eating beings of magic. What happens if you eat an angel? Or a basilisk? Or a nymph? Or a pixie? Or a tarrasque?

Seerow
2011-10-24, 10:44 PM
Dragon Steaks are nearly as iconic as dragonscale armor. Okay maybe not, but it's a dragon slaying tradition with my group that we each have at least some.

Though honestly if you butchered it, and preserved the meat, you'd probably have enough food to feed a village for months, depending on how big the dragon was. This doesn't really affect much except to realize if your players stick their dragon steaks in a bag of holding, they basically never have to worry about rations again. And given by the level you're slaying dragons, you can break economies anyway, that's really okay.

Sidmen
2011-10-24, 10:46 PM
In my games, dragon's blood carries the power of their element - so coating a weapon with it gives the weapon an appropriate enchantment for a few turns (1 turn per dose, can apply multiple doses simultaneously). Note, it must be properly distilled so you only get a limited amount.

Dragon hide/scales protect from the elements (giving resistances if worn). So it makes perfect sense that the meat do something else.... Perhaps, in addition to being food, it could give you immunity to an appropriate environmental hardship: Red Dragons prevent heatstroke and other heat-associated troubles, White Dragons prevent frostbite, etc...

Kaun
2011-10-24, 10:50 PM
You could have it being very tasty and give a slight stat bonus to say con or something, but make it addictive like a crack.

Next thing you know your low wis pc's are hunting dragons all over the place to get their next fix. :smallamused:

Maximus:Ranger
2011-10-24, 10:53 PM
Almost all of a dragon can be used for something in my campaign world. The bones for commune spells and special weapons. The brain for dragon control potions the scales for element resistant potions and armor. The blood has a burning effect on skin and can be distilled and combined with treant sap to make a potion of longevity. You get the idea, I figured the meat should either be poisonous be really spicy or mms the consumer fire resistant for a bit.

El Dorado
2011-10-24, 10:53 PM
Depends on what you pair it with. A nice red wine is preferable though dwarven ale will do in a pinch. Anything else is criminal.

Demon of Death
2011-10-24, 11:09 PM
In the 3.0 Book from AEG titled 'Dragons' has rules on how to use about every part from the Dragon, and most of it still works fine in 3.5/PF, but with an old enough dragon you can have like a permanent +11 (I think IIRC) to Intelligence which is nice, and I think it wasn't an enhancement bonus, but not sure.

Sorry for going off topic there folks.

Medic!
2011-10-25, 12:22 AM
Could always treat it like the Heroes' Feast spell *shrug*

ORione
2011-10-25, 12:25 AM
If you like practical jokes, when the players eat it roll a few d20s and ask them what their Fortitude save bonuses are.

After they tell you, say, "it tastes like chicken" and never mention it again.

Medic!
2011-10-25, 12:27 AM
3% chance of having your race changed to kobold (or better yet, a were-kobold template)? I once had the distinct pleasure of traveling with an afflicted were-chicken, there IS a precedent...

deuxhero
2011-10-25, 01:01 AM
The main effect is that it keeps you from starving to death.

And energy resistance.


Other than that I don't know if there's any effect for eating beings of magic. What happens if you eat an angel?

Doesn't leave a corpse


Or a basilisk?

Turns you stone


Or a nymph?

Gives you teleportitis


Or a pixie?

Nothing, but too little meat to be filling.


Or a tarrasque?

No clue.


But seriously though, if you are really intreested in the subject, check out Nethack.

NikitaDarkstar
2011-10-25, 01:12 AM
Well I suppose if a Good aligned cleric or paladin ends up munching on a good dragon their deities might get a little bit annoyed.

But you kill a red dragon that's been turning the local village into a snack-bar? I think they call that karma really. But I'd watch out for green or black dragon meat, it might be poisonous if you cut into the wrong parts (like that fish that can supposedly kill you if not prepared right.) and it might take quite some time to cook if it's an adult or older dragon, and be a bit chewy.

But really I'd say that's it. As for magical side effects for eating a magical creature... Do dragons get bonuses for eating wizards, druids and sorcerers? And other magical critters? No? Then players don't get magical bonuses from eating dragons. Except possibly a pretty decent morale bonus for a day or two.

Edog
2011-10-25, 01:30 AM
Seriously though, if you are really intreested in the subject, check out Nethack.

Yes, Nethack should give you some good ideas. Eating a red dragon in that, though, gave you permanent fire immunity, so you'll probably want to tone it down a bit.

Of course, you could go in the opposite direction and make it poisonous, or burning hot no matter what you do to it. A lump of searing hot dragon meat i your stomach would never, ever be a good thing.

The Succubus
2011-10-25, 04:41 AM
I don't see why not. Paladins are allowed to wear dragonhide armor without anyone making Silence of the Lambs references.

I just had this vision of a baby dragon looking in a pit looking up at a paladin with tear filled eyes....

"It rubs the lotion on it's skin or else it gets the Smite again..."

Kurald Galain
2011-10-25, 04:46 AM
what are the effects of eating dragon meat?
The main effect is that you get marked for death by any other dragon you encounter.

Eldan
2011-10-25, 04:59 AM
Just make sure you don't eat the reproductive organs of a female black dragon. It's a little known fact that some black dragon eggs are fertilized by parthenogenesis. These eggs can attach themselves onto the lining of your stomach, since it's acidic, and hatch there.

Spiryt
2011-10-25, 05:08 AM
Just make sure you don't eat the reproductive organs of a female black dragon. It's a little known fact that some black dragon eggs are fertilized by parthenogenesis. These eggs can attach themselves onto the lining of your stomach, since it's acidic, and hatch there.

So Black Dragons starred in Alien?

The Succubus
2011-10-25, 05:16 AM
Just make sure you don't eat the reproductive organs of a female black dragon. It's a little known fact that some black dragon eggs are fertilized by parthenogenesis. These eggs can attach themselves onto the lining of your stomach, since it's acidic, and hatch there.

The next time I'm running a campaign, my BBEG is going to invite all the players around for dinner! :smallbiggrin:

Eldan
2011-10-25, 05:17 AM
Those were actually Half-Black Dragon humans, yes.

hewhosaysfish
2011-10-25, 06:38 AM
I would simply rule that it's hard to cook (on account of a red dragon's immunity to fire) and very tough to chew, but filling. One Medium-sized dragon should give enough food for about a week of feeding 5 people. I wouldn't put any adverse effects on the party for eating it.

I like the idea of making it uncookable. Do you want to eat it raw? It's not every day you get a chance to eat dragon...

Maryring
2011-10-25, 06:46 AM
Meat is meat. Everything is edible as long as you cook it right. Except for good aligned outsiders who for some reason never seem to leave bodies when they die.

Morph Bark
2011-10-25, 07:04 AM
In my last campaign the players killed a dragon (by accidental luck), stripped it of its meat and preserved it (and animated its skeleton) and later cooked it. It granted DR 1/magic to anyone who ate of it for about 8 hours. They sure needed that meat since it was a 3-week trip through the desert to the next city.


In the 3.0 Book from AEG titled 'Dragons' has rules on how to use about every part from the Dragon, and most of it still works fine in 3.5/PF, but with an old enough dragon you can have like a permanent +11 (I think IIRC) to Intelligence which is nice, and I think it wasn't an enhancement bonus, but not sure.

Sorry for going off topic there folks.

What does AEG stand for? Not Arms and Equipment Guide, right? o.O

TheCountAlucard
2011-10-25, 07:04 AM
Meat is meat. Everything is edible as long as you cook it right. Except for good aligned outsiders who for some reason never seem to leave bodies when they die.The answer to that one's easy - eat it while it's still alive. :smalltongue:

hamishspence
2011-10-25, 07:05 AM
Sometimes they do:

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/spellcomp_gallery/92268.jpg

pic from Spell Compendium- Revive Outsider.

BoVD has a pic showing a sacrificed angel's body.

Demon of Death
2011-10-25, 08:44 AM
What does AEG stand for? Not Arms and Equipment Guide, right? o.O

AEG is the Company's name, the book is this (http://www.trollandtoad.com/p144995.html).

Xuc Xac
2011-10-25, 09:52 AM
Meat is meat. Everything is edible as long as you cook it right.

Actually, the higher up the food chain something is, the worse its flesh is for you. That's why almost all our food animals are herbivores. There are toxins (mostly heavy metals) that get more and more concentrated as you go up the food chain. Dragons would be worse because they live a really long time and eat quite a bit. The flesh of really old dragons would probably have so much mercury, arsenic, and lead in it that you would get sick from handling it.

Or, you can just say "It's magic! Eating it gives you superpowers!"

Serpentine
2011-10-25, 09:58 AM
This thread's for random questions too, right? Cuz I have one/some.
How long does it take the eggs of
1. that 2-headed plains dragon
2. lodestone marauder
3. thunderbirds
to hatch? Cuz my party has all of them... We kinda collect them, apparently. Rolling randomly, the thunderbird eggs are very close to hatching, but the marauder eggs have just started. Can't remember what I said about the dragon eggs...

Jay R
2011-10-25, 11:10 AM
This thread's for random questions too, right? Cuz I have one/some.
How long does it take the eggs of
1. that 2-headed plains dragon
2. lodestone marauder
3. thunderbirds
to hatch? Cuz my party has all of them... We kinda collect them, apparently. Rolling randomly, the thunderbird eggs are very close to hatching, but the marauder eggs have just started. Can't remember what I said about the dragon eggs...

They follow the Wile E. Coyote rule - they only hatch at the moment of maximum carnage. I'd have one hatch when the party is already in a melee - or sneaking past some dangerous threat. (If they aren't with you on adventure, you will return to egg shards, and possible shredded parts of your friends or servants.)


Depends on what you pair it with. A nice red wine is preferable though dwarven ale will do in a pinch. Anything else is criminal.

Well, sort of. Red wine with color dragons; white wine with metallic. And the dwarven ale that goes with best with dragon meat is made by fermenting three dwarves.

Toofey
2011-10-25, 11:23 AM
When I dm most of a dragons meat is inedible. Their liver kidneys and stuff like that can be eaten but their meat is roughly then consistency of steel wool.

The Reverend
2011-10-25, 11:32 AM
I know from personal experience big cat msat all taste like piss. Literally, they have a high uric acid content. Likewise I think red dragon meat would be sulfurous, black a combo of rot /acidic chemicals, blue like ozone or burnt hair, green like chemicals/pixie tears, and white like freezer burn.



Tarrasque meat eats you.

I read, either here or on wizards an interesting/evil alternate solution to the tarrasque problem. The guys world was attacked by the tarrasque, but they did not have the wish spell necessary to move it from their plane. So the evil empire proposed a solution. Working with the two good empires they lured the tarrasque using undead cannon fodder to a narrow high walled gorge and the dwarves collapsed the gorge in front and behind. They then began shooting giant keen harpoons that were also immovable rods into the creature and tied its limbs with adamantine chains peppered with immovable rods. They eventually after great losses chained the tarrasque down and kept reinforcing the bonds.

Eventually someone got the bright idea to start harvesting flesh from the bound abomination and converting it to weapons, armor, tools, potions, elixers, and spell ingredients. After a couple centuries an incredibly powerful city state grew up around their infinite wealth machine. So there you go.

Treblain
2011-10-25, 11:37 AM
Goblin Dan (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0326.html) would be proud.

The Reverend
2011-10-25, 11:49 AM
He would be very proud.

some of the cities aristocracy was messing around with longevity potions that were slowly, and not so slowly, turning them into abominations...hearing the yarraasques call etc. However tarrasque skin armor was the best thing that ever happened to the fighter, spells bounce off unless the caster makes a Very high DC spell check.

Viktyr Gehrig
2011-10-25, 12:39 PM
I think eating dragon meat should give you some kind of magical bonus. If you're concerned about balance, deduct the value of the dragon's corpse from its treasure.

Draconomicon has a good section on dragon anatomy. Divvy up various magical effects to the different organs, and then require that the character consume the entire organ to gain the bonus. Let the players fight over who gets to eat what.

Saitox
2011-10-25, 01:05 PM
When I dm most of a dragons meat is inedible. Their liver kidneys and stuff like that can be eaten but their meat is roughly then consistency of steel wool.

Livers, kidneys, and stuff? Making my mouth water. Love those parts of animals. As a person who likes to play characters that cook thats all I'd need to fill my fellow adventurers tummies. And since it is a red dragon I won't need to spice it :smallwink: Actually thinking about it....what texture would a red dragon tongue have?

Necroticplague
2011-10-25, 03:50 PM
Livers, kidneys, and stuff? Making my mouth water. Love those parts of animals. As a person who likes to play characters that cook thats all I'd need to fill my fellow adventurers tummies. And since it is a red dragon I won't need to spice it :smallwink: Actually thinking about it....what texture would a red dragon tongue have?

Since their predatory, I would think their tongue would be like a cats, but exagerated. If you run your hand along its surface, it feels like coarse-grain sandpaper, but when you bend it, it feels like a giant strand of sinew, and its chewey and rubery as it gets (at least, biting my own tongue gives me that impression of a tongues texture).

Personal note, I would do one of two things:

1. what Viktyr said, watch them fight it ot over the organs for their benefits (dibs on the 9-chambered heart).

2.Make a shout-out to SLASH'EM and say "You feel a momentary chill" then as an aside to the monk "You feel guilty" and write down on my notes 'party doppleganger alternate form red dragon.' My party would probably know what I mean, since I've done stuff like this before.

Beleriphon
2011-10-25, 04:56 PM
Since their predatory, I would think their tongue would be like a cats, but exagerated. If you run your hand along its surface, it feels like coarse-grain sandpaper, but when you bend it, it feels like a giant strand of sinew, and its chewey and rubery as it gets (at least, biting my own tongue gives me that impression of a tongues texture).

I'd personally suggest razor wire for the feel of dragon tongue.

Tongues, at least cow, tend to be fairly tender as far as meats go, but that can depend on preparation. Pickled dragon tongue anybody?

QuidEst
2011-10-25, 07:54 PM
Well, I would opt for the mythology precedent! When Sigurd tasted the blood of the dragon Fafnir, he gained the ability to understand birds. The subversion to this is to actually have birds say the stuff birds are actually saying- trying to get a mate, finding food, warning other birds to stay away. I imagine it would get annoying rather fast. "You hear a voice calling 'Hey bay-bee!' repeatedly. Another joins it. An argument breaks out, and mothers are insulted on both sides."

Maximus:Ranger
2011-10-25, 09:24 PM
Well, I would opt for the mythology precedent! When Sigurd tasted the blood of the dragon Fafnir, he gained the ability to understand birds. The subversion to this is to actually have birds say the stuff birds are actually saying- trying to get a mate, finding food, warning other birds to stay away. I imagine it would get annoying rather fast. "You hear a voice calling 'Hey bay-bee!' repeatedly. Another joins it. An argument breaks out, and mothers are insulted on both sides."

Yes, yes, and more yes!

Noedig
2011-10-26, 11:30 AM
I was waiting for someone to mention old Fafnir. I agree with QuidEst, but go beyond birds. Drinking dragons blood gives the character tongues, as the spell. The duration depends on how much blood the character drinks.

PetterTomBos
2011-10-26, 01:07 PM
Do not make the effects helpful or harmful. Simply make them weird!

Whybird
2011-10-26, 01:55 PM
I think the answer has to depend on the flavour of your campaign. If dragons are rare and exciting and fantastical beings, and your campaign is a world where the supernatural happens to heroes a lot, then there should be major metaphysical ramifications, like the players gain mythical draconic knowledge from drinking the dragon's blood. If your campaign is a gritty, down-to-earth place where heroes struggle to fight their way out of the gutter, then dragon's meat should have fairly down-to-earth, prosaic properties: it's tough, and tastes foul, and maybe gives you heavy metal poisoning. The important thing is to be consistent with the themes and flavour of the setting that the dragon lives in.

Gensh
2011-10-26, 02:57 PM
I think the answer has to depend on the flavour of your campaign. If dragons are rare and exciting and fantastical beings, and your campaign is a world where the supernatural happens to heroes a lot, then there should be major metaphysical ramifications, like the players gain mythical draconic knowledge from drinking the dragon's blood. If your campaign is a gritty, down-to-earth place where heroes struggle to fight their way out of the gutter, then dragon's meat should have fairly down-to-earth, prosaic properties: it's tough, and tastes foul, and maybe gives you heavy metal poisoning. The important thing is to be consistent with the themes and flavour of the setting that the dragon lives in.

I'd definitely go with this solution. In my campaigns, eating the meat of any sapient creature is CE, which is why you see, say, white dragons eating people but not blue - or maybe white dragons are CE because they eat people. At the same time, I also rule that alignments are only concrete things because the gods want them to be, and they only really matter if you believe in them. Atheists instead keep a karma tally and reincarnate appropriately, as dictated by the god of atheism. So generally, speaking, what eating a dragon would do as far as nutrition/magic goes would depend on the game's genre, and the morality of it depends on the character's own religion or lack thereof.

RufusCorvus
2011-10-26, 04:38 PM
Well, I would opt for the mythology precedent! When Sigurd tasted the blood of the dragon Fafnir, he gained the ability to understand birds. The subversion to this is to actually have birds say the stuff birds are actually saying- trying to get a mate, finding food, warning other birds to stay away. I imagine it would get annoying rather fast. "You hear a voice calling 'Hey bay-bee!' repeatedly. Another joins it. An argument breaks out, and mothers are insulted on both sides."

"Down for some grubbin! Tweet me some spots!"

Winter_Wolf
2011-10-26, 06:56 PM
as dictated by the god of atheism

:biggrin:

Maybe make the good dragons' flesh give a mild positive mechanical game effect and evil dragons' flesh just has a flavor quality unique to that species. The weird dragons would just all be poisonous/inedible (gem dragons, for example).

Having never really thought much on it before:
Red = really freaking spicy, with a smokey aftertaste.
Blue = tangy, with a very mellow umami aftertaste.
Black = yuck: vile rotting acidic meat
Green = cloying and bitter, and the aftertaste just won't go away.
White = tastes like chicken salmon! Actually, mildly sweet and just a hint fishy aftertaste.

Jay R
2011-10-27, 09:57 AM
... the god of atheism...

Ummmm... I'm having trouble processing this phrase.

Requiem_Jeer
2011-10-27, 10:45 AM
Eh, whenever someone wants an atheist character, I just tell them they follow the tenets of Atheos, which includes utterly ignoring all gods, even him, in return for fair assessment of your deeds and how it impacted people around you. It's pretty much the karma tally noted above. He has devout followers (ones who ignored the even him part) to help him keep track of everyone, like a giant accounting firm. Ur-Priests must follow these tenets, and have their managers introduce themselves to them, as future co-workers. Given the power of the class, Atheos doesn't even need to do any tracking himself now, as Ur-Priests automatically qualify as devout followers despite losing class features when they worship him too. Attaching that baggage to the class has actually prevented a player or two from doing one of the more broken things you can do with the Ur-priest class.

Gensh
2011-10-27, 12:36 PM
Ummmm... I'm having trouble processing this phrase.

He's technically the ascended god of deicide if that helps. Most gods have a number of divine ranks based on how many people believe in them (a positive emotion), whereas he has a number of divine ranks based on how many people hate the pantheon as a whole (a negative emotion).


Eh, whenever someone wants an atheist character, I just tell them they follow the tenets of Atheos, which includes utterly ignoring all gods, even him, in return for fair assessment of your deeds and how it impacted people around you. It's pretty much the karma tally noted above. He has devout followers (ones who ignored the even him part) to help him keep track of everyone, like a giant accounting firm. Ur-Priests must follow these tenets, and have their managers introduce themselves to them, as future co-workers. Given the power of the class, Atheos doesn't even need to do any tracking himself now, as Ur-Priests automatically qualify as devout followers despite losing class features when they worship him too. Attaching that baggage to the class has actually prevented a player or two from doing one of the more broken things you can do with the Ur-priest class.

I generally leave ur-priest as it is. While my god of atheism ascended via deicide, he generally considers ur-priests to be more like divine mosquitoes and gives the advice that it's a road best left untaken, lest they get swatted. He instead allows a number of "philosophy students" to "emulate" him, which basically counts as being a cleric of a concept since his actual alignment is CE (remember that alignment is assigned by the pantheon), but he tends to draw in a lot of Good followers as a result of remaining on the Prime Material and being an incredibly wealthy philanthropist. He also tends to lose a lot of Good followers due to the rest of the pantheon hating him and knocking over his towers.

In general, he supports personal power over anything else, and as a result favors psionic classes (being a psion himself). On the rare occasion he gives a test of faith, it's always a philosophical question like the trolley problem and only punishes those who refuse to make any choice at all. His personal opinion on cannibalism is that it's creepy but not inherently wrong and on one occasion bit off and ate someone's finger when they were mocking him and pointing.

Hiro Protagonest
2011-10-27, 12:41 PM
I'd definitely go with this solution. In my campaigns, eating the meat of any sapient creature is CE, which is why you see, say, white dragons eating people but not blue - or maybe white dragons are CE because they eat people. At the same time, I also rule that alignments are only concrete things because the gods want them to be, and they only really matter if you believe in them. Atheists instead keep a karma tally and reincarnate appropriately, as dictated by the god of atheism. So generally, speaking, what eating a dragon would do as far as nutrition/magic goes would depend on the game's genre, and the morality of it depends on the character's own religion or lack thereof.

Uh... why? Because our culture believes that bodies should be buried in the ground and left to rot, or burned to ashes and placed in an urn? Killing sapients just to eat meat is evil, but eating the meat itself isn't.

Ravens_cry
2011-10-27, 12:43 PM
When I dm most of a dragons meat is inedible. Their liver kidneys and stuff like that can be eaten but their meat is roughly then consistency of steel wool.
Much of cooking has been an effort to turn the inedible, or even toxic, edible.
You just need the right marinade.

Jayabalard
2011-10-27, 02:11 PM
They're sentient beings!so are cows. And Deer. And Rabbits. They just aren't sapient.


Actually thinking about it....what texture would a red dragon tongue have?Approximately the same as asbestos.

Necroticplague
2011-10-27, 04:01 PM
Much of cooking has been an effort to turn the inedible, or even toxic, edible.
You just need the right marinade.

And if all else fails, remember the golden rule: Water is a universal solvent, salt is a universal preservative, and suffecient amount of fire removes a good amount amount of danger from food.

Gensh
2011-10-27, 04:19 PM
Uh... why? Because our culture believes that bodies should be buried in the ground and left to rot, or burned to ashes and placed in an urn? Killing sapients just to eat meat is evil, but eating the meat itself isn't.

Because as I said, alignment only matters as far as each setting's gods are concerned, and in most settings, the gods are designed according to the tenets of our society.

Serpentine
2011-10-28, 04:05 AM
Wait, so... Doesn't that make certain real-world cultures that consider the consumption of dead loved ones a great sign of respect, Chaotic Evil? :smallconfused:
I mean, unwise, sure, what with prion diseases, but Evil? Harsh, dude :smalltongue:

Eldan
2011-10-28, 04:17 AM
Ummmm... I'm having trouble processing this phrase.

Here, this may help:
http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=798#comic

Coidzor
2011-10-28, 05:06 AM
Because as I said, alignment only matters as far as each setting's gods are concerned, and in most settings, the gods are designed according to the tenets of our society.

Except when the gods and their whims are secondary to actual universal principles and constants rather than the universe being their fiat, of course. :smalltongue:

And even taking those out of the equation, one runs into the problem of why the evil gods are the ones who are evil and why the good gods are the ones who are good, since they all disagree about the rightness and wrongness of their actions and beliefs. And the bit where it doesn't actually satisfy the dilemma of whether something is good because the good gods like it or if the good gods are good because they like it.

I'd contend that more settings go with the bit where there is some form of ultimate Good that is independent of the settings deities as well as, generally, an Ultimate Evil than that Good and Evil are meaningless and were decided by caprice of the deities.

It's the law and chaos angle that most settings have difficulty settling upon as universal principles. Especially that are grokkable to players and DMs, which, for all the failings of D&D on the good-evil axis, it generally sets a tone even with the inconsistencies and contention about accepting it as correct by players and DMs.

OP: As for dragon meat being edible, I'm in favor of Aye, and now miss Dragonprime and his avatar. :smallfrown:

edit: Blargh. Now I'm having flashbacks to reading the socratic dialogues. x,x

Socratov
2011-10-28, 06:11 AM
ehm... good question...

I think eating dragon meat is inherently the inverse of said dragon's alignment. Who knows you could let it be a delicacy for the rich, which would be why you will get in trouble with some dragon hunters because you just took their prey. On the other hand I really support the 'weird effects' rule. Ofcourse you could dish out permanent bonuses of minor value. I'd think about a slight bonus to fort saves for the liver, will saves for the brain, ref saves for the nerves (now, how would those tase?). Or even skillbonuses. In ancient cultures indigenous people believed that by eating someoone's heart you gained his courage, his brain would make you cleverer and his muscle would make you stronger, and the balls... you get the idea... You could stretch this to eardrums for listen checks, eyes for spot, leg muscle for jump, arm musle for climb, and so on. the tongue would either grant you speak language as an in class skill, or it should permanency tongues on you, for flavor purposes, make it tough, stringy and not that great to eat... Another option for the tongue is if eaten by a truenamer, he gets a bonus on truespeak, the consequence will however be: he won't be able to taste icecream in game again. ever.

paddyfool
2011-10-28, 06:50 AM
On the moral side:

1) Do your PCs believe that "sentient beings" are "people", and thus deserving of treatment appropriate to "people"?

2) Do they have specific religious injunctions on either diet, or the appropriate disposal of the dead bodies of sentient beings?

Many settings use a moral code roughly along the lines of "if it talks, it isn't food" (this specific version may be from the webcomic Schlock Mercenary, but I'm not sure). However, things not being food may stop in extremis. The real-world law, for instance, and most real-world philosophical opinion, is OK with you eating people if you genuinely have no other option through no fault of your own, e.g. in the famous plane crash in the Andes, when the survivors were forced to eat the bodies of those who'd died.

On the health outcomes/bonuses: these have been well-discussed, but do whatever's fun for you. Obviously, in the real-world, there tends to be trouble with the flesh of high-end predators (even if, it's said, the flesh of "long pig" is really tasty, as is that of monkeys, dogs, crocodiles and shark - although personally, I've only tried the last two and am not a big fan of croc). And in fiction, there are examples of all sorts of strange and mystical effects, beneficial and maleficient, to such diets. I'd be tempted by ambiguous effects, myself (maybe give them a chance of growing scales, sharp teeth, vestigial wings, altered eyes etc., with very small mechanical benefits and some social issues; maybe also give them some kind of weird penalty in the presence of dragons in the future, both visavis social skills and combat, as something inside them might not be on their side).

Gensh
2011-10-28, 08:34 AM
Wait, so... Doesn't that make certain real-world cultures that consider the consumption of dead loved ones a great sign of respect, Chaotic Evil? :smallconfused:
I mean, unwise, sure, what with prion diseases, but Evil? Harsh, dude :smalltongue:

Those cultures are usually represented as some form of orc or goblin. Sad but true. :smallsigh:


Except when the gods and their whims are secondary to actual universal principles and constants rather than the universe being their fiat, of course. :smalltongue:

And even taking those out of the equation, one runs into the problem of why the evil gods are the ones who are evil and why the good gods are the ones who are good, since they all disagree about the rightness and wrongness of their actions and beliefs. And the bit where it doesn't actually satisfy the dilemma of whether something is good because the good gods like it or if the good gods are good because they like it.

I'd contend that more settings go with the bit where there is some form of ultimate Good that is independent of the settings deities as well as, generally, an Ultimate Evil than that Good and Evil are meaningless and were decided by caprice of the deities.

It's the law and chaos angle that most settings have difficulty settling upon as universal principles. Especially that are grokkable to players and DMs, which, for all the failings of D&D on the good-evil axis, it generally sets a tone even with the inconsistencies and contention about accepting it as correct by players and DMs.

Since the moral and ethical axes are given as being equal, yet the ethical axis remains largely undefined due to differing opinions by the various authors, I tend to make the moral axis equally nebulous. Since alignment has to be given in a concrete for the sake of paladins for example, I instead give the alignment reading as per the most similar god, regardless of personal faith.

Generally speaking, the alignment components are cosmic forces so much as political blocs that have associated by choice with more vague forces. As a result, characters are left with such conundrums as why using negative energy in one situation is evil whereas in others it is not: negative energy is nothing more than an abstract force, but it is a favored tool of the "Evil" bloc, hence it is labeled as "Evil" when used in ways not sanctioned by at least one of the gods in the "Good" bloc.

Naturally, this leaves the question as to why my god of deicide is CE when even the CE gods don't like him. Simply put, enough of them were crazy enough or twirled their mustaches while tying women to railroad tracks enough that he was best received in that particular corner. Plus, killing politicians in cold blood without even intending to replace them is CE no matter what justification one has.

You're right in your assumption that a large number of settings, likely the plurality, involve some form of Ultimate Good and Evil, but that's an artifact of a morality no longer so easily sustained narratively due to an increasing diversification of beliefs in our society. While such ideals can potentially be sustained indefinitely due to their general attractiveness, they require a delicate touch on the part of the DM and the willingness of the players in order to represent appropriately. A system of "morality is what you make of it" caters to more players immediately since if the DM finds the players wanting that sort of "traditional" morality, the systems can be swapped almost seamlessly, and in the event that the players want to set aforementioned system on fire, there's no issue removing it because it wasn't there to begin with.


Many settings use a moral code roughly along the lines of "if it talks, it isn't food" (this specific version may be from the webcomic Schlock Mercenary, but I'm not sure). However, things not being food may stop in extremis. The real-world law, for instance, and most real-world philosophical opinion, is OK with you eating people if you genuinely have no other option through no fault of your own, e.g. in the famous plane crash in the Andes, when the survivors were forced to eat the bodies of those who'd died.

I originally heard the line from Digger (http://www.diggercomic.com/?p=292), which gives a decent basic framework for morality that's not at all categorical in nature, instead being a series of generalizations that allow for situations as you mentioned. Incidentally, the comic is also a good way of showing players new to Exalted exactly how the Ebon Dragon works.

paddyfool
2011-10-28, 09:29 AM
Ah, yes, of course it was Digger. My bad.

Further on morality: I'd put the scale as this:

Fully acceptable: eating the body of a dead sentient creature because you really have no other choice to survive.
Also acceptable: eating the body of a dead sentient creature if you believe this to be beneficial for said creature (e.g. preventing them being raised as a zombie, if this is likely to occur otherwise)
Iffy: eating the body of a dead sentient creature for some benefit which you don't absolutely need, assuming you didn't kill them to get said benefit. I wouldn't make a Paladin fall over partaking in snack time after slaying a dragon, orc or what have you, but it's definitely not good.
Generally wrong: buying or selling the flesh of a dead sentient creature. Because by doing so, you're helping to establish a profit motive to hunt down and kill them.
Just plain wrong: hunting down, killing and eating a sentient creature for pleasure and profit.

That said, aside from the eating, the last item indicates the standard behaviour for most RPG groups anyway. Therefore, for many players, eating people would really just add a ghoulish little bit of spice to their average gaming experience.

Serpentine
2011-10-28, 09:32 AM
Would religious cannibalism as a mark of respect to the dead count as "beneficial for said creature"? What about a tradition of, say, eating the heart of your enemy to gain their courage (given that they're not your enemy because you want to eat their heart)?

paddyfool
2011-10-28, 09:39 AM
Would religious cannibalism as a mark of respect to the dead count as "beneficial for said creature"?

Acceptable (if not exactly healthy).


What about a tradition of, say, eating the heart of your enemy to gain their courage (given that they're not your enemy because you want to eat their heart)?

Iffy.

Coidzor
2011-10-28, 12:43 PM
You're right in your assumption that a large number of settings, likely the plurality, involve some form of Ultimate Good and Evil, but that's an artifact of a morality no longer so easily sustained narratively due to an increasing diversification of beliefs in our society. While such ideals can potentially be sustained indefinitely due to their general attractiveness, they require a delicate touch on the part of the DM and the willingness of the players in order to represent appropriately. A system of "morality is what you make of it" caters to more players immediately since if the DM finds the players wanting that sort of "traditional" morality, the systems can be swapped almost seamlessly, and in the event that the players want to set aforementioned system on fire, there's no issue removing it because it wasn't there to begin with.

You've failed to really show that the idea of changing whether an act is good or evil in one's game is, of necessity, linked to there being no ultimate good in the setting, as you've more argued that they disagree with the RAW values of what in particular is good and evil, not the concepts or the ultimate whys.

If Good = worshipping Pelor, killing monsters, and helping the less fortunate, and the players object that worshipping Pelor in particular and alone cannot be good because what about good deity X, they're necessarily disagreeing with the ultimate source of what makes killing monsters and helping the less fortunate good, they're just finding problems with the assignment of the label good to a specific action.

In the same way, nudging creating mindless undead servitors from being in and of itself evil does not negate the accepted ultimate evil of the Abyss spewing forth entities that are literally made of the metaphysical substance of evil.

The Succubus
2011-10-28, 02:24 PM
Would religious cannibalism as a mark of respect to the dead count as "beneficial for said creature"? What about a tradition of, say, eating the heart of your enemy to gain their courage (given that they're not your enemy because you want to eat their heart)?

Relevant. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0738.html)

Gensh
2011-10-28, 02:57 PM
You've failed to really show that the idea of changing whether an act is good or evil in one's game is, of necessity, linked to there being no ultimate good in the setting, as you've more argued that they disagree with the RAW values of what in particular is good and evil, not the concepts or the ultimate whys.

If Good = worshipping Pelor, killing monsters, and helping the less fortunate, and the players object that worshipping Pelor in particular and alone cannot be good because what about good deity X, they're necessarily disagreeing with the ultimate source of what makes killing monsters and helping the less fortunate good, they're just finding problems with the assignment of the label good to a specific action.

In the same way, nudging creating mindless undead servitors from being in and of itself evil does not negate the accepted ultimate evil of the Abyss spewing forth entities that are literally made of the metaphysical substance of evil.

Generally speaking, none of the planes really pose an issue as far as my explanation is given; one can simply say something along the lines of "Bahamut created the Seven Mounting Heavens of Celestia" because there's no information that directly contradicts that. In fact, that's one of the given explanations for the existence of the Nine Hells of Baator. In such a case, the explanation is simple as the Good gods inventing the trait of "Good," which apparently has no effect but inflicting (relatively) mild penalties on Evil characters, which then diverged into the various "Holy" effects. The Abyss, however, is a tricky subject due to its limitless dimensions. I would venture to call it a cosmic fountain of sorts, from which the rest of the Great Wheel would later form - or else the primordial soup of a universe not yet formed or even stillborn. Generally, I specify that since limitless mass means limitless energy, the Abyss is actually the source of all magical power, hearkening back to the first (detailed) construction of Law and Chaos given in the Eternal Champion series. In any case, it keeps physics intact. :smallwink:

Lord Vukodlak
2011-10-29, 12:40 AM
I have a lizardman fighter who has a cookbook where he writes recipes for cooking various monsters. Among them Umberhulk, Krenshaw, Naga, Frost Giant, Black Pudding(requires lava), Chimera, Raksasha, Beholder, Slaad and Three varieties of chromatic dragon.(black, red and white). Oh and Mind Flayer Calimari

Adventures already follow a "keep what you kill philosophy". You slay the mighty dragon, loot his horde, turn his hide into armor and his claws into weapons but eating him is somehow crossing the line? From the dragons perspective taking his horde is probably worse then eating him.

paddyfool
2011-10-29, 01:59 AM
I have a lizardman fighter who has a cookbook where he writes recipes for cooking various monsters. Among them Umberhulk, Krenshaw, Naga, Frost Giant, Black Pudding(requires lava), Chimera, Raksasha, Beholder, Slaad and Three varieties of chromatic dragon.(black, red and white). Oh and Mind Flayer Calimari

No recipes for humans, however? Surely he must have come across some pretty monstrous ones :smallwink:


Adventures already follow a "keep what you kill philosophy". You slay the mighty dragon, loot his horde, turn his hide into armor and his claws into weapons but eating him is somehow crossing the line? From the dragons perspective taking his horde is probably worse then eating him.

To be fair, the use of the hide and claws goes into the same "iffy" category. Mutilating the corpse of a dead foe is probably about as disrespectful and (unnecessarily) hurtful to their loved ones, presuming they have them, as eating it. But if you're doing it for the RP and having fun, go right ahead.

Lord Vukodlak
2011-10-29, 12:00 PM
No recipes for humans, however? Surely he must have come across some pretty monstrous ones :smallwink:

He has some recipes for preparing goblin but not human. He has to many human friends to associate them with food. And he wants to improve
Lizardfolk human relations.

And he never would have found a publisher for his cookbook "To Serve God" if it contained recipes for human. The title comes Zepth'thar'alax the black dragon his tribe worshipped has a god... until they ate him. The bones of Zepth'thar'alax were then laid to rest among his predecessors in office.



To be fair, the use of the hide and claws goes into the same "iffy" category. Mutilating the corpse of a dead foe is probably about as disrespectful and (unnecessarily) hurtful to their loved ones, presuming they have them, as eating it. But if you're doing it for the RP and having fun, go right ahead.
My point was that making dragonhide armor was already considered acceptable by most. And that for a dragon taking his horde is about the worst thing you can do..

Maximus:Ranger
2011-10-29, 01:33 PM
Thanks for the tips everyone. I went with the meat being extremely fire resistant and the blood giving weird effects if drank. Two party members can talk to animals and are starting to get annoyed with it as they found out most animals are idiots.:smallbiggrin: and one has scaly skin and serpintine eyes with low-light vision. I'll post questions if I have them, and in the meantime feel free to post your own!

Toofey
2011-10-29, 01:35 PM
Livers, kidneys, and stuff? Making my mouth water. Love those parts of animals. As a person who likes to play characters that cook thats all I'd need to fill my fellow adventurers tummies. And since it is a red dragon I won't need to spice it :smallwink: Actually thinking about it....what texture would a red dragon tongue have?

I actually made a point of everyone who was bidding on parts wanting the eyes. The party ended up eating one of them poached.

Ravens_cry
2011-10-29, 01:47 PM
I remember an intriguing, if violent, anime where eating unicorn meat could make you immortal, or, much, much more likely, it would kill you, horribly, or, if you were really unlucky, make you a monster.
Something similar for dragon meat could be appropriate.
Bathing in a slaying dragons blood made Siegfried invulnerable, except a patch where a leaf fell on his back. Some serious DR or Natural Armour could be fitting.

Hiro Protagonest
2011-10-29, 02:43 PM
Bathing in a slaying dragons blood made Siegfried invulnerable, except a patch where a leaf fell on his back. Some serious DR or Natural Armour could be fitting.

That won't work. You have to travel to The River Styx in the Nine Hells for that.

TheCountAlucard
2011-10-29, 03:51 PM
That won't work. You have to travel to The River Styx in the Nine Hells for that.Umm, no, the River Styx in the Nine Hells causes total memory loss.

Ravens_cry
2011-10-29, 03:55 PM
Umm, no, the River Styx in the Nine Hells causes total memory loss.
Doesn't matter so much if happens when you are a baby (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles)*. But Jade Dragon, who says Greek mythology has to be the only source for inspiration?
*Warning: Link contains penis.

Hiro Protagonest
2011-10-29, 03:57 PM
Umm, no, the River Styx in the Nine Hells causes total memory loss.

No, that's the River Lethe. Don't any of you study Greek mythology? :smalltongue:

Winter_Wolf
2011-10-29, 04:06 PM
I remember an intriguing, if violent, anime where eating unicorn meat could make you immortal, or, much, much more likely, it would kill you, horribly, or, if you were really unlucky, make you a monster.
Something similar for dragon meat could be appropriate.
Bathing in a slaying dragons blood made Siegfried invulnerable, except a patch where a leaf fell on his back. Some serious DR or Natural Armour could be fitting.

Do you by chance mean mermaid flesh? Mermaid Forest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mermaid_Saga) and Mermaid Scar by Rumiko Takahashi both deal with the life of a young (looking) man who ate it and didn't turn into a horrible monster, as well as how he tries to cope with immortality (in this case meaning both unkillable and unageing). The wiki link is to the Mermaid Series, of which I know only two of the stories.

It would be interesting if consuming dragon flesh turned you into a monster. What if that was how they actually perpetuate the species, or if there was a primordial dragon whose flesh was consumed by natural animals and that spawned abominations?

Tangentially, I once played a half dragon cleric that ate the hearts of all his enemies, except goblinkind, because "those things are filthy."

Ravens_cry
2011-10-29, 06:18 PM
Do you by chance mean mermaid flesh? Mermaid Forest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mermaid_Saga) and Mermaid Scar by Rumiko Takahashi both deal with the life of a young (looking) man who ate it and didn't turn into a horrible monster, as well as how he tries to cope with immortality (in this case meaning both unkillable and unageing). The wiki link is to the Mermaid Series, of which I know only two of the stories.

D'oh! Yes, yes, it was mermaid. I don't know why I wrote unicorn, maybe my head went all Harry Potter there.


It would be interesting if consuming dragon flesh turned you into a monster. What if that was how they actually perpetuate the species, or if there was a primordial dragon whose flesh was consumed by natural animals and that spawned abominations?

Or maybe both. After all, there had to be an original dragon for the former to work. Maybe what people think of as dragons are the transformed animals and people, while the True Dragon is something suitably awesome and epic.


Tangentially, I once played a half dragon cleric that ate the hearts of all his enemies, except goblinkind, because "those things are filthy."
But of course, it's goblin eyes you eat, especially gently sautéed with leeks and a nice crisp pinot blanc.

paddyfool
2011-10-30, 01:08 AM
I find it funny how this works better in fantasy than other genres.

A human character in the world of Star Trek, Babylon 5, Star Gate or Star Wars (mm, tepanyaki Wookie) who went around consuming the flesh of biologically compatible aliens would be properly macabre. But the flesh of goblins, orcs, dragons etc. is fair game (badump) in quite a lot of fantasy. Do we perhaps have a greater tolerance for different moralities if they come from a fantasised conception of the past, rather than the future, demanding that the latter be more "advanced"?

deuxhero
2011-10-30, 01:15 AM
Eating humans is immoral ONLY because it's a great way to get diseases that effect humans and as omnivours, a good potential for heavy metal poisoning (and the whole killing humans thing).

paddyfool
2011-10-30, 01:39 AM
Eating humans is immoral ONLY because it's a great way to get diseases that effect humans and as omnivours, a good potential for heavy metal poisoning (and the whole killing humans thing).

I disagree. I think we feel it's immoral more because of a strong cultural taboo, rooted partly, perhaps, in compassion and respect for other people. Putting yourself at risk because of eating dodgy food isn't immoral, just stupid. But even disregarding the law, the social consequences of being discovered as a cannibal in almost any society would be huge. However tasty someone's liver might be with fava beans and a nice chianti. :belkar:

Knaight
2011-10-30, 01:48 AM
I disagree. I think we feel it's immoral more because of a strong cultural taboo, rooted partly, perhaps, in compassion and respect for other people.

Most cannibalism is rooted in compassion and respect for other people. It tends to be part of elaborate funeral services, and the entire point of most funerals is to show respect to the dead and provide comfort to the living who were close to the dead.

paddyfool
2011-10-30, 03:57 AM
Most cannibalism is rooted in compassion and respect for other people. It tends to be part of elaborate funeral services, and the entire point of most funerals is to show respect to the dead and provide comfort to the living who were close to the dead.

Well, some cannibalism is, anyway. Other cannibalism carries ritual significance of some other nature (see Aztec sacrifices, tribal warfare in Papua New Guinea etc.). Such things are still pretty fringe, and with reference to what we're talking about, even where the flesh of people is regarded as food, it really isn't just food.

Serpentine
2011-10-30, 04:08 AM
I've never heard of the Aztec sacrifices being accompanied by cannibalism. As the cannibal said as he dined on the academic, sauce plox?

paddyfool
2011-10-30, 06:57 AM
Well, my original source was my old history teacher from when I was 13, but luckily Wikipedia also has the answers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism_in_pre-Columbian_America#Aztec_cannibalism).

Another famous example with regards to tribal warfare etc. is traditional Maori culture. A nice illustration of this is how the bared tongue in the Haka is a threat to eat your opponent.

Serpentine
2011-10-30, 08:37 PM
Well there you go.
I knew about the Maoris, though. In fact (note: don't have a source for this, so grains of salt and all that), supposedly there was another people there when the Maoris turned up, but they et them. There's been some debate over performances of the Haka, too - it's an incredibly violent, threatening and insulting demonstration, so showing it to tourists and opposing football teams and the like is probably pretty inappropriate. But dammit, it's so damn cool!

Tenno Seremel
2011-10-30, 10:34 PM
Meat is meat. Everything is edible as long as you cook it right. Except for good aligned outsiders who for some reason never seem to leave bodies when they die.

They are simulation of greater conscience. They don't really exist.

Sith_Happens
2011-11-02, 09:10 PM
He's technically the ascended god of deicide if that helps. Most gods have a number of divine ranks based on how many people believe in them (a positive emotion), whereas he has a number of divine ranks based on how many people hate the pantheon as a whole (a negative emotion).



I generally leave ur-priest as it is. While my god of atheism ascended via deicide, he generally considers ur-priests to be more like divine mosquitoes and gives the advice that it's a road best left untaken, lest they get swatted. He instead allows a number of "philosophy students" to "emulate" him, which basically counts as being a cleric of a concept since his actual alignment is CE (remember that alignment is assigned by the pantheon), but he tends to draw in a lot of Good followers as a result of remaining on the Prime Material and being an incredibly wealthy philanthropist. He also tends to lose a lot of Good followers due to the rest of the pantheon hating him and knocking over his towers.

In general, he supports personal power over anything else, and as a result favors psionic classes (being a psion himself). On the rare occasion he gives a test of faith, it's always a philosophical question like the trolley problem and only punishes those who refuse to make any choice at all. His personal opinion on cannibalism is that it's creepy but not inherently wrong and on one occasion bit off and ate someone's finger when they were mocking him and pointing.

By any chance is your campaign setting based on Discworld?

Gensh
2011-11-03, 10:10 AM
By any chance is your campaign setting based on Discworld?

Nah. I usually just attach the same god of atheism to whatever world I decide to run because a lot of the people I game with are atheists, and they enjoy the parody. He's sort of become a universal constant, like Unicron.

Dr.Epic
2011-11-03, 10:39 AM
I see it more as how it's prepared. I guess poisonous dragons maybe, other than that I don't see a problem with eating it so long as it's cooked.

Anderlith
2011-11-03, 12:03 PM
Eating an animal is not a crime. Now the question is "Are dragons animals?"

Morithias
2011-11-03, 12:26 PM
Eating an animal is not a crime. Now the question is "Are dragons animals?"

No they are dragons. They are flat out stated in the rules to not be animals. You can't wild empathy them, you can't charm animal them.

all joking aside, I think it really depends as probably others have said, on what kind of creature the dragon was in life.

on a side note it probably isn't a good idea to eat those with poison breathe.

Anderlith
2011-11-03, 12:29 PM
No they are dragons. They are flat out stated in the rules to not be animals. You can't wild empathy them, you can't charm animal them.

all joking aside, I think it really depends as probably others have said, on what kind of creature the dragon was in life.

on a side note it probably isn't a good idea to eat those with poison breathe.

That is an out of game construct.


To those who think eating a poisonous dragon is hazardous; almost all animals have acidic bile, the key to not tainting the meat is to not breach any of the bile filled sacs

Morithias
2011-11-03, 01:15 PM
That is an out of game construct.


To those who think eating a poisonous dragon is hazardous; almost all animals have acidic bile, the key to not tainting the meat is to not breach any of the bile filled sacs

Ok so what we're looking for on the other hand is blood. Anyone know the rules on what element a dragon's blood is? does a red dragon have a weak form of lava for blood? Silver a liquid nitrogen knock off?

Anderlith
2011-11-03, 03:36 PM
Ok so what we're looking for on the other hand is blood. Anyone know the rules on what element a dragon's blood is? does a red dragon have a weak form of lava for blood? Silver a liquid nitrogen knock off?

Doesn't matter, just string it up to drain

paddyfool
2011-11-04, 10:12 AM
Eating an animal is not a crime. Now the question is "Are dragons animals?"

To me, the question is more. "Eating people is wrong. Are dragons people?"

Jayabalard
2011-11-04, 01:24 PM
That is an out of game construct.


To those who think eating a poisonous dragon is hazardous; almost all animals have acidic bile, the key to not tainting the meat is to not breach any of the bile filled sacsit's not as simple as that.

Example: Several animals have a high concentration of vitamin A in their liver... high enough to be toxic to humans in fact. Polar Bears, and sled dogs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xavier_Mertz#Death_during_the_Far_Eastern_Party).

hawksbill turtle meat is poisonous (they feed on cnidarians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cnidaria)).

Likewise, Many predatory fish can be poisonous, if they feed on poisonous fish, and Lots of coral dwelling fish are poisonous. So you've got a good chance that a Barracuda is going to be poisonous.

The Hooded Pitohui (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooded_Pitohui) is also poisonous due to it's diet, as are the Ifrita kowaldi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ifrita_kowaldi).


Keep in mind that a dragon would pick up toxins from stuff that it eats or is around, that may not bother it, but would be very dangerous to humans.

So a volcanic dwelling dragon, for example, might have extremely high levels of selenium, mercury, arsenic, and iridium (all of which can be quite toxic depending on how much you get).

Any sort of dragon may regularly feed on poisonous critters and therefore be toxic.

JoeYounger
2011-11-05, 12:53 PM
In my last campaign the players killed a dragon (by accidental luck), stripped it of its meat and preserved it (and animated its skeleton) and later cooked it. It granted DR 1/magic to anyone who ate of it for about 8 hours. They sure needed that meat since it was a 3-week trip through the desert to the next city.



What does AEG stand for? Not Arms and Equipment Guide, right? o.O

I dont know what it stands for, but its a 3rd party publishing company. They published several "unofficial" books for dnd, which frequently unbalance games :P


it's not as simple as that.

Example: Several animals have a high concentration of vitamin A in their liver... high enough to be toxic to humans in fact. Polar Bears, and sled dogs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xavier_Mertz#Death_during_the_Far_Eastern_Party).

hawksbill turtle meat is poisonous (they feed on cnidarians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cnidaria)).

Likewise, Many predatory fish can be poisonous, if they feed on poisonous fish, and Lots of coral dwelling fish are poisonous. So you've got a good chance that a Barracuda is going to be poisonous.

The Hooded Pitohui (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooded_Pitohui) is also poisonous due to it's diet, as are the Ifrita kowaldi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ifrita_kowaldi).


Keep in mind that a dragon would pick up toxins from stuff that it eats or is around, that may not bother it, but would be very dangerous to humans.

So a volcanic dwelling dragon, for example, might have extremely high levels of selenium, mercury, arsenic, and iridium (all of which can be quite toxic depending on how much you get).

Any sort of dragon may regularly feed on poisonous critters and therefore be toxic.

O.o Are you a scientist?!

Lord Vukodlak
2011-11-07, 07:25 AM
snip

Neutralize poison or purify food and drink.

Now its simple.

Jayabalard
2011-11-07, 11:31 AM
O.o Are you a scientist?!No, but I did stay at a holiday inn express last night.

Jayabalard
2011-11-07, 11:43 AM
Neutralize poison or purify food and drink.

Now its simple.Not really (especially since those are D&D specific spells and this forum isn't).

Neutralize poison doesn't look it'd work on dragon meat. "detoxify any sort of venom" ... poisonous metals aren't venom. The other usage looks like it would just delay the effects for the duration.

nor would it work on stuff like polar bear liver (where the issue is the toxicity of a non-water soluble vitamin in high doses, not the fact that it's poisonous).

purify food and drink... still dicey. Vitamin A isn't poisonous in and of itself; but in high doses it's toxic. Selenium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selenium#Health_effects_and_nutrition) isn't in and of itself poisonous (in fact, it's necessary for good health); but in high doses it's toxic.

So dragon is suitable for eating, by the definition of purify food and drink but still might be toxic.

Xuc Xac
2011-11-07, 11:43 AM
Well, some cannibalism is, anyway. Other cannibalism carries ritual significance of some other nature (see Aztec sacrifices, tribal warfare in Papua New Guinea etc.). Such things are still pretty fringe, and with reference to what we're talking about, even where the flesh of people is regarded as food, it really isn't just food.

{Scrubbed}

HalfDragonCube
2011-11-07, 11:54 AM
HDC disapproves of the notion of eating those of a dragony nature. :smallmad:

Anderlith
2011-11-07, 11:57 AM
HDC disapproves of the notion of eating those of a dragony nature. :smallmad:

Mmmmm, dragon jello.

HalfDragonCube
2011-11-07, 12:13 PM
Mmmmm, dragon jello.

Your soul shall taste delicious once I can find a template that will let me devour it. :smallamused:

The Reverend
2011-11-07, 12:21 PM
As I've said before I know large cats taste like piss, because of high uric acid content in their muscles. The fact dragons draconus fundamentum turns anything they eat into nutrition leads me to believe absolutely nothing. Its magic. Although European traditions hold that dragon meat is poisonous.

HalfDragonCube
2011-11-07, 12:47 PM
Although European traditions hold that dragon meat is poisonous.

Yes. Definitely this. This is true. As is anything else that says that eating those of my type is bad.