ILM
2011-10-26, 04:34 AM
I’m trying to build a medium-ish level archer, that can shoot people and deal respectable damage from crazy distances, but can also hold his own at more traditional ranges. I don’t have a target level (he’s an NPC, I’m the DM) but I was gunning for BAB 11 for that third iterative/ Manyshot arrow.
I’m operating under a number of restrictions that are particularly harmful to the archer concept:
1) He needs to be a primarily martial archer. I don’t mind Ranger levels with their partial spellcasting, or dips, or wands with UMD but I won’t go Cleric 15.
2) Anything 3.0 is out, updated or not (bye bye Peerless Archer and Deepwood Sniper)
3) Dragon Mag stuff is out too (bye bye Targetteer and Scout variant)
4) Kaorti Resin is 3.0, so it’s out
5) Telling Blow doesn’t let you apply SA or Skirmish damage beyond their normal range
6) Craven doesn’t get multiplied on crits
7) I can further enhance Energy Bows with other magical properties (the way costs are calculated is irrelevant here)
I know, it’s like I’m intentionally gimping myself. I’m happy to explain the above rules choices but please, let’s not turn this thread in a mini-rules FAQ either.
I’ve read the handbooks and stuff so I’ve got a couple skeleton builds. One is a simple Rogue 10/ Cragtop Archer 4. Important feats are Craven, Greater Manyshot, Knowledge Devotion and, possibly, Telling Blow.
At extreme ranges (thank you Cragtop Archer), with an Energy Bow of Collision, and with a wand of Hunter’s Mercy, I can deal up to [2d6 +4 (Strength assumption) +2 (weapon) +5 (collision) +11 (power shot) +3 (reasonable Knowledge Devotion assumption)] x3 +14 (Craven) +5d6. Average 127 damage. Nothing that’s likely to impress CO veterans here, but not negligible either.
At closer ranges, where you can use Greater Manyshot, the above damage is basically multiplied by 3. Hunter’s Mercy as a swift action, move action for whatever, then 3 Manyshot arrows with full precision damage in your face (this is where Telling Blow helps). Belt of Battle to do that twice. That’s pretty much my basic build (and I fully realize I'm assuming the attacks hit, which isn't a given with all the penalties stacked here).
Now it occurs to me that Rogue doesn’t bring much to the table here in terms of damage. This brought me to a second build: Rogue 1/ Ranger 6/ Scout 3/ CA 4 with Swift Hunter on top. The 6th level of Ranger is just to get that third d6 of Skirmish damage, and possibly Manyshot if I arrange the levels just right. I do lose about 4d6 of long-range damage, but close-range is practically unaffected and the side benefits change:
Lose:
- evasion
- trap sense
- skill points
- improved uncanny dodge
- one special Rogue ability (possibly HiPS with the right ACF)
Gain:
- very limited spellcasting
- animal companion (useless, but I can grab the Distracting Attack ACF)
- Fast movement
- Trackless step
- Track
- Favoured enemy
- Combat style – free feats, essentially
I’m not sure if it’s worth it, and basically I’m wondering if there’s any superior options out there for the levels that aren’t Rogue 1/ Cragtop Archer 4. edit: here's another option: Rogue 4/ Fighter 4 (for Ranged Weapon Mastery)/ CA 4.
I'd also like to know if anyone can think of ways to increase the damage on long-range single shots.
Also, bonus question: is there a (cheap) item that'll let me see at the kind of ranges CA lets me shoot at? Even a 1/encounter or 1/day thing, it's not like he's going to snipe from 5000 ft all day long...
I’m operating under a number of restrictions that are particularly harmful to the archer concept:
1) He needs to be a primarily martial archer. I don’t mind Ranger levels with their partial spellcasting, or dips, or wands with UMD but I won’t go Cleric 15.
2) Anything 3.0 is out, updated or not (bye bye Peerless Archer and Deepwood Sniper)
3) Dragon Mag stuff is out too (bye bye Targetteer and Scout variant)
4) Kaorti Resin is 3.0, so it’s out
5) Telling Blow doesn’t let you apply SA or Skirmish damage beyond their normal range
6) Craven doesn’t get multiplied on crits
7) I can further enhance Energy Bows with other magical properties (the way costs are calculated is irrelevant here)
I know, it’s like I’m intentionally gimping myself. I’m happy to explain the above rules choices but please, let’s not turn this thread in a mini-rules FAQ either.
I’ve read the handbooks and stuff so I’ve got a couple skeleton builds. One is a simple Rogue 10/ Cragtop Archer 4. Important feats are Craven, Greater Manyshot, Knowledge Devotion and, possibly, Telling Blow.
At extreme ranges (thank you Cragtop Archer), with an Energy Bow of Collision, and with a wand of Hunter’s Mercy, I can deal up to [2d6 +4 (Strength assumption) +2 (weapon) +5 (collision) +11 (power shot) +3 (reasonable Knowledge Devotion assumption)] x3 +14 (Craven) +5d6. Average 127 damage. Nothing that’s likely to impress CO veterans here, but not negligible either.
At closer ranges, where you can use Greater Manyshot, the above damage is basically multiplied by 3. Hunter’s Mercy as a swift action, move action for whatever, then 3 Manyshot arrows with full precision damage in your face (this is where Telling Blow helps). Belt of Battle to do that twice. That’s pretty much my basic build (and I fully realize I'm assuming the attacks hit, which isn't a given with all the penalties stacked here).
Now it occurs to me that Rogue doesn’t bring much to the table here in terms of damage. This brought me to a second build: Rogue 1/ Ranger 6/ Scout 3/ CA 4 with Swift Hunter on top. The 6th level of Ranger is just to get that third d6 of Skirmish damage, and possibly Manyshot if I arrange the levels just right. I do lose about 4d6 of long-range damage, but close-range is practically unaffected and the side benefits change:
Lose:
- evasion
- trap sense
- skill points
- improved uncanny dodge
- one special Rogue ability (possibly HiPS with the right ACF)
Gain:
- very limited spellcasting
- animal companion (useless, but I can grab the Distracting Attack ACF)
- Fast movement
- Trackless step
- Track
- Favoured enemy
- Combat style – free feats, essentially
I’m not sure if it’s worth it, and basically I’m wondering if there’s any superior options out there for the levels that aren’t Rogue 1/ Cragtop Archer 4. edit: here's another option: Rogue 4/ Fighter 4 (for Ranged Weapon Mastery)/ CA 4.
I'd also like to know if anyone can think of ways to increase the damage on long-range single shots.
Also, bonus question: is there a (cheap) item that'll let me see at the kind of ranges CA lets me shoot at? Even a 1/encounter or 1/day thing, it's not like he's going to snipe from 5000 ft all day long...