Sneak attack and Grease

[Cicciograna]

I'm probabily too tired to think or read right now, but for the sake of my sanity could someone point me out in the rules why the spell Grease would allow a Rogue to sneak attack an enemy standing in an area subject to this spell?
Moreover, would it work in Pathfinder too?

[Starbuck_II]

I'm probabily too tired to think or read right now, but for the sake of my sanity could someone point me out in the rules why the spell Grease would allow a Rogue to sneak attack an enemy standing in an area subject to this spell?
Moreover, would it work in Pathfinder too?
1. In 3.5 D&D, you lose dex to AC when balancing without 5 ranks in Balance skill.
While standing on grease you are considered balancing.
2. No, rule changed in PF (Pathfinder). PF Grease now only considers you balancing while moving. So, technically, the only way you can sneak attack with grease is AoO (since they would be moving by your space then).
It was one of the major nerfs to Rogues (besides PF Blink changes).

[Cicciograna]

1. In 3.5 D&D, you lose dex to AC when balancing without 5 ranks in Balance skill.
While standing on grease you are considered balancing.

Ah, this is what I couldn't remember! Thanks for your input!


2. No, rule changed in PF (Pathfinder). PF Grease now only considers you balancing while moving. So, technically, the only way you can sneak attack with grease is AoO (since they would be moving by your space then).
It was one of the major nerfs to Rogues (besides PF Blink changes).

Wow, that's a pretty hard nerf.

[JohnDaBarr]

And I'm guessing if your standing in stuff similar to grease, like oil, same thing applies?

btw if the character standing in grease had Uncanny Dodge or Improved UD would he lose dex to AC

[Darrin]

And I'm guessing if your standing in stuff similar to grease, like oil, same thing applies?


Per the Balance rules, any time you're attacked while standing on a slippery, sloped, or precarious surface.



btw if the character standing in grease had Uncanny Dodge or Improved UD would he lose dex to AC

By RAW, I don't believe so. Uncanny Dodge lets you keep your Dex bonus even if flat-footed, and it doesn't quibble about or specify how you got flat-footed.

[BlackestOfMages]

By RAW, I don't believe so. Uncanny Dodge lets you keep your Dex bonus even if flat-footed, and it doesn't quibble about or specify how you got flat-footed.

but your not flat footed, you just don't have your dex bonus :smallsmile:

[MesiDoomstalker]

Question: if a Rogue is flat-footed but with Uncanny Dodge (and not the improved version), would an opposing Rogue still get Sneak Attack? I know whenever they are denied dex they get it, and flat-footed does that, but does the flat-footed condition allow sneak attack even with Uncanny Dodge?

[Darrin]

but your not flat footed, you just don't have your dex bonus :smallsmile:

From the SRD:

"Being Attacked while Balancing: You are considered flat-footed while balancing, since you can’t move to avoid a blow, and thus you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC (if any)."

(emphasis added)

[Provengreil]

Question: if a Rogue is flat-footed but with Uncanny Dodge (and not the improved version), would an opposing Rogue still get Sneak Attack? I know whenever they are denied dex they get it, and flat-footed does that, but does the flat-footed condition allow sneak attack even with Uncanny Dodge?

aside from flanking, doesn't look like it. the only thing is whether the target would be denied a dex bonus(though whether the target actually has good dex doesn't matter), and uncanny dodge says you always retain it.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

aside from flanking, doesn't look like it. the only thing is whether the target would be denied a dex bonus(though whether the target actually has good dex doesn't matter), and uncanny dodge says you always retain it.

Point of pedantry: No it doesn't. It only says you retain dex bonus while flat-footed. There's other ways to be denied dex bonus to AC, and those are still fully effective against the target in question, even if he does have uncanny dodge.

In the matter of a Balance check, it simply makes an opponent flat-footed. If you have uncanny dodge, you retain dex bonus to AC while flat-footed, which does negate the sneak attacks.