Please Help Optimize A Gun Mage

[SleepyShadow]

The gun mage is a character concept that I've been trying to use for a while, but both the Artificer class from Eberron and the Gun Mage PrC from FFd20 were (pardon the pun) shot down by my DM :smallfrown:. I was not really interested in an archer gish, since it was a character type I had just played.

Then I discovered this (http://files.meetup.com/47309/IK%20Gun%20Mage%20(as%20per%20character%20book).pd f): the Gun Mage from the Iron Kingdoms d20. After showing it to my DM I got the green light to use it.

I'm already leaning toward TWF with my Magelock Pistols, but I would really appreciate some optimization advice. TYVM :smallbiggrin:

[Waker]

Well, the big questions to ask are, what level are you starting at and what sources do you have available?
One handy dip to grab is a level of Spellthief and then take the Master Spellthief feat (CSc) so you can steal spells to channel into your rune bullets.
I don't have the IK book, but are guns considered exotic weapons or something else? See if you can get your DM to allow you to qualify for Abjurant Champion (CM) or Swiftblade (online)

[Kaje]

Take 1 level of Spellthief with the Master Spellthief feat, then take a bunch of Gun Mage for a few levels, followed by Spellwarp Sniper 5 / Abjurant Champion 5.

That gets you more spells you can steal and then cast into your bullets or shoot from your gun. You also get the ability to shoot area spells like fireball, and they don't even get a reflex save. Finally, Abjurant Champion improves your buffs, though annoyingly it only just makes up for the bab lost through your other dips.

[Rejakor]

Kaje's suggestion is spot on if you're after damage/boom spells. If you want a touch more survivability, a unarmed swordsage dip and paladin (of slaughter, whatever) dip will also help (cha to AC in light armour assuming your GM lets Ascetic Mage work with swordsage, shadow jaunt/cloak of shadows tele/invis, and cha to saves from pally).

Alternately, look into rogue/unseen seer if you're after more stealth/stealth kills, although swordsage does double duty in this area too. You can TWF with pistols and you really probably should if you're relying on them for damage. Being able to reload as a free action is important as well.. getting that weapon quality from Tome of Battle: Bo9S that lets you treat the weapon as any other weapon.. aptitude... and taking the hand crossbow focus feat would work, or the chain of feats from IK that makes reloading a free action.

If you're interested, i'll dig up Jaronk's CrossSniper build for you.. it has basically every way to add damage to a non-str ranged weapon in the game built into it.

[SleepyShadow]

Since I'm bad at multi-quoting, I'll just do it like this. My bad :smalltongue:

@Waker: We start at level 8, and we have access to all official material. The DM did set the caveat that we need to present him with a full 'theoretical lvl 20' build so that he knows if/where our characters have power spikes and can plan for them accordingly. Apparently one of the players sprang an Uber-Charger on him a while back, and he's been doing this ever since.

@Kaji: So GM 9/SpT 1/SwS 5/AbC 5? Sounds good long run, but how's it work at level 8? Sorry if I'm being picky. Thanks ^_^

@Rejakor: It would be great if you could find the CrossSniper. It sounds like it's exactly what I need.

[SleepyShadow]

Alright, so my final build is Gun Mage 6/Spell Thief 4/Spell Warp Sniper 5/Abjurant Champion 5. I end up with 15 BAB, full Gun Mage casting, and otherwise pretty well off except for my abysmal Fort save.

My only real complaint is how feat hungry I am. Any way to fix that without loss of caster levels, or am I just going to have to deal with it?

[Kaje]

FYI, Master Spellthief makes your spellthief and spellcasting class levels stack for the purpose of caster level. They don't stack for the purpose of spellcasting. So you'd probably be better off with just one level of spellthief.

[SleepyShadow]

Thanks for catching that Kaje, I missed that on my first read-through of the feat. Well, there went my BAB :smallfrown:

[Rejakor]

BAB is less important than you might think.. spellcasting actually gives you more attacks.

The crosssniper is on brilliant gameologists, which is down at the moment, so I can't find the link.

[SleepyShadow]

Any suggestions for other PrCs? When I've acquired all of my good class abilities by level five Gun Mage, it seems a shame to stay in it for four more levels. Any thoughts?

[Kaje]

You're already lamenting your BAB. Any full-casting prc would make it worse than it already is. I forget, do you have the proficiencies to qualify for Spellsword, because a 1-level dip in that is about the best you could do.

[SleepyShadow]

You're already lamenting your BAB. Any full-casting prc would make it worse than it already is. I forget, do you have the proficiencies to qualify for Spellsword, because a 1-level dip in that is about the best you could do.

Unfortunately not. I already looked into it, but I don't have the proficiency requirements for it. I would be alright with a PrC with 3/4 BAB, since I wouldn't lose out over the last three levels of Gun Mage.

*EDIT*: Found it! Final build is Gun Mage 5/Spell Thief 1/Spell Warp Sniper 4/Abjurant Champion 5/Unseen Seer 5

Acceptable BAB, reasonable hp, and 19/20 casting. Only drawback is a terribad Fort save :smalltongue:

[Kaje]

Do you have access to Tome of Battle? Once you hit level 12 you can take the Martial Study feat to get Mind Over Body - make a concentration check instead of a fort save 1/encounter.

[SleepyShadow]

That's perfect! The only thing I was really worried about was insta-kill due to failed Fort save. Thank you, Kaje, for fixing the last problem with my gun mage.

[radionausea]

Have you had a look at the Arcane Tempest Gun Mage prestige class? It's from No Quarter Magazine #16 and can be found here:

http://www.davidrm.com/rpg/ikwiki/doku.php?id=start

I'd be thinking something along the lines of:

Gunmage4/Arcane Tempest3/Heartfire Fanner2/XX1/Sublime Chord1/HFF1/XXXXX8

Where X is something like Eldritch Knight or Abjurant Champion.

9th Level spells, Decent BAB and you can cast touch spells, cones, cylinders, lines and sphere effect spells from your rune bullet. Get Shivering Touch and you're good to go


---apologies for slight thread necro-----