"Mixed Voice" Writing

[mootoall]

I'm doing a bit of writing for NaNoWriMo, and I was encountering a bit of a stylistic issue. As of right now, I'm having trouble deciding between writing the novel from a first person or third person point of view. I'm definitely more comfortable with third person, but at the same time I really want to include sections that are very stream of consciousness, italicized, first-person looks into the protagonist's mind.

Are there any books that execute this style of writing well? Any advice the Playground has for pulling it off?

[Thanqol]

I'm doing a bit of writing for NaNoWriMo, and I was encountering a bit of a stylistic issue. As of right now, I'm having trouble deciding between writing the novel from a first person or third person point of view. I'm definitely more comfortable with third person, but at the same time I really want to include sections that are very stream of consciousness, italicized, first-person looks into the protagonist's mind.

Are there any books that execute this style of writing well? Any advice the Playground has for pulling it off?

Eisenhorn and Fate: Stay Night are both first person novels, and two of my favourite works ever, and it's a real struggle not to write in first person after reading them.

[mootoall]

I've heard of Fate: Stay Night. I'll have to check it out now. But I was wondering about the mixed voice problem specifically, how I could mix third and first person.

[llamamushroom]

My first bit of advice (as handed down to me by English teachers frustrated at my inability to choose a person and stick with it) is don't.

My second is that there should either be a distinct demarcation between the two that you use every time (such as italics or parentheses) or it should be assimilated as part of the text. The former is clearer, and will give the reader insight into your character, but is comparatively traditional - using that form in an experimental-style work would be a little incongruous; the latter is the devil.

To be more precise, it can either do an enormous amount of harm to your story, or it can be seen as representing the rebellious and chaotic aspects of man in a dichotomous morality system. Or, clearer yet, it will trade the traditional style in a Faustian pact for great power and credibility as a modern author. Trying to then use your new demonic powers in a traditional style (I keep saying it, and I'm not sure I know what it means) will result in banishment to a special circle of writer hell, along with those who cannot decide on the tense of their verbs and people who use apostrophes after the number in decade descriptors.
It is a very large circle.
If that was helpful, it was purely by accident - my mind is apparently too tired to give actual advice.

[Tyndmyr]

My understanding is...you don't.

You just decide which one you want to use and stick to it. I am currently using first person, because I don't need multiple POV's and I prefer it. If you DO need multiple POV's, there's no choice...just go with third person.

[flumphy]

There's always the option of an epistolary novel. Obviously, that only works in certain contexts, but within those contexts it's probably the easiest method to get away with a mix of voices.

[leakingpen]

I'm doing a bit of writing for NaNoWriMo, and I was encountering a bit of a stylistic issue. As of right now, I'm having trouble deciding between writing the novel from a first person or third person point of view. I'm definitely more comfortable with third person, but at the same time I really want to include sections that are very stream of consciousness, italicized, first-person looks into the protagonist's mind.

Are there any books that execute this style of writing well? Any advice the Playground has for pulling it off?

Aspirin's Myth Adventures series, once you get to the M.Y.T.H inc books, tend to have some sections in third, and some sections in various first person.

Other than that, the best way is to use a journal or similar. By the same author, the Phule series, the mc's butler has a journal that opens ever chapter. sometimes with a paragraph, sometimes with 3-4 pages.

[mootoall]

All great advice, but
*Snip* is just great, especially since it confirms that it *can* be done. I guess I'll use italics, in the same fashion as dialogue, since it's an a) more traditional style novel, and b) rather fantasy-esque, resulting in the possibility of some interesting subversions, which is nice.

[Asthix]

Yes! Journal format! Lots of Drizzt books use this to present a page or three in first person, usually at the start of each major section.

I've never taken a writing class beyond 12th grade, so I don't believe you should 'never' do something when it comes to writing. Not everything has to be the next great American novel.

Good luck!

[Malfunctioned]

The Amulet of Samarkand, most likely the others in the series though I haven't read them, changes from First to Third person depending on who is the focus of the chapter. For Nathaniel, a human, it is third person but for Bartimaeus it is in first person, including footnotes and deviations galore.

[Dogmantra]

My understanding is...you don't.

You just decide which one you want to use and stick to it. I am currently using first person, because I don't need multiple POV's and I prefer it. If you DO need multiple POV's, there's no choice...just go with third person.
One book which I think handled multiple first person POVs well was Will Grayson, Will Grayson, though that was written by two different people in two very different styles and the different POVs strictly alternated between chapters.


The Amulet of Samarkand, most likely the others in the series though I haven't read them, changes from First to Third person depending on who is the focus of the chapter. For Nathaniel, a human, it is third person but for Bartimaeus it is in first person, including footnotes and deviations galore.
I was just going to suggest this trilogy. In the other two books, it actually also follows a third point of view, Kitty, who's also written in the third person, though one of them has a fantastic scene where you see the same conversation twice, once at the end of Nathaniel's chapter and once the beginning of a Bartimaeus one.
It's not only worth reading for learning about the technique either, it's a wonderful series.

[mootoall]

Oooh, I completely forgot about the Bartimaeus trilogy! I loved it, thanks for reminding me that it did that! Maybe a combination of that and the Song of Ice and Fire series, where each chapter is named for a character, and then whenever first person is included, italics mean it's their thoughts? That way it's possible to have multiple points of view, there doesn't necessarily have to be a "main" character (although I'll admit that I cared much more about some characters in SoIaF than others), and I can maintain an avenue into any given character's thought process at any given moment!

Maybe it'll come out with a Pratchett-esque spin, where characters meeting each other for the first time get an impression of each other that's significantly different from that of the reader!

[Savannah]

There are, as mentioned, books written with alternating points of view, but you don't necessarily need first person to know what's going on in a character's head. Take a look at...Harry Potter springs to mind. It's written in third person, but we get Harry's thoughts (and no one else's) at the same time.

[Omeganaut]

One alternative that sprung to mind that seems to have been touched on but not elaborated is the narration idea. The narrator is the main character, but he is telling the story of his past, and has additional information about other events and characters. It would include some first person perspective along with the freedom to follow other events, characters, and perspectives that even a journal couldn't accomplish.

Or you could have multiple 1st person perspectives. Depending on the content of your story, that could allow you to have a near omniscient narrator for some sections. Most of all, make sure you need both. Sometimes you think you want both a 1st person and a 3rd person perspective, but actually you only need one or the other, with hints as to what is going on in the other. Anyways, I hope this helps!

[mootoall]

Hmm, interesting idea. That's the thing, I do want an omniscient narrator, which is why I prefer third person for this story.

[Omeganaut]

Well, the story-telling method would be fairly omniscient if every character survives or at least is able to tell him about their feelings. However, if you need the villian's perspective, then you might just want to go third person, having thoughts in italics and describing new situations from that person's thoughts.

[mootoall]

Well, the story-telling method would be fairly omniscient if every character survives or at least is able to tell him about their feelings. However, if you need the villian's perspective, then you might just want to go third person, having thoughts in italics and describing new situations from that person's thoughts.

Yeah, this looks like the way I'll be going.

[Tyndmyr]

One book which I think handled multiple first person POVs well was Will Grayson, Will Grayson, though that was written by two different people in two very different styles and the different POVs strictly alternated between chapters.

Just about every rule in English writing has situations in which it can be broken. But...most of them have pretty good reasons for existing. In general, I advise people learn to follow the rules fairly strictly first. First novels are rarely best novels anyway, and adding more complexity and challenge to them is not ideal.

That said, yes, ideas like "I found a note written in this other form" are sound. It gives you the logical separation you need.