Enchantment VS NPCs (3.P)

[MukkTB]

A PC tells an important NPC that they want a word alone.

When alone the PC tries to cast hypnotism on the NPC.

The NPC had made a sense motive check VS the PC's bluff check thus knowing something was up.

The NPC and the PC rolled initiative against each other. The NPC won and the PC said that it was bogus that the NPC would get a chance to anticipate and respond to the spell before it went off.


How legit is this course of events?

As far as I know:
Vancian Magic takes some ammount of time to trigger the spell before any effects take place.

If the PC had come in with a dagger the NPC could have rolled spot against the PC's sneak check to see that the PC was concealing a dagger and about to stab him, and rolled for initiative if he made the spot check.

NPC and PC alone
Enchantment / Dagger
Sense Motive VS Bluff / Spot VS Sneak
If failed
NPC rolls save vs spell DC / PC rolls attack VS NPC AC
If succeeded
Roll for initiative / <---

The spell has verbal and somatic effects. The caster has to wave his arms around and say weird words for a casting time of one round for this particular spell before the spell takes effect.


If this play isn't totally bogus, what feats and tactics can a player use to cast an enchantment spell in a social situation without giving away their spellcasting? Stacking still spell and silent spell metamagic? Is there any way to pull this kind of play off at a low level?

I get the feeling that PC should've just stuck some skillpoints into bluff or sneak so they weren't making an unmodified roll against the NPCs perception.

If this play is bogus please explain to me what went wrong.

[sabelo2000]

Nope, I totally support this play. That's part of what a Readied Action is for; "I'll ready an action to disrupt any spell he attempts to cast on me, bein's as how I won initiative."

[Coidzor]

Nope, I totally support this play. That's part of what a Readied Action is for; "I'll ready an action to disrupt any spell he attempts to cast on me, bein's as how I won initiative."

You can only do that if you ready for it, not retroactively or as an immediate action. By the time this situation came up it should've been resolved by initiative count and combat rounds, which would've lead to either the NPC getting a surprise round on him/to run away before he started casting or the PC having to cast defensively to avoid getting disrupted by the NPC.

Then again, he chose hypnotism which has a 1 round casting time, so even casting defensively the NPC could still attack him to try to disrupt it.

Should've just used Charm Person and then said he was going to cast another spell and had the NPC not even able to roll sense motive since charm person makes them perceive it in the most favorable way.

[bloodtide]

A PC tells an important NPC that they want a word alone.

When alone the PC tries to cast hypnotism on the NPC.

The NPC had made a sense motive check VS the PC's bluff check thus knowing something was up.

The NPC and the PC rolled initiative against each other. The NPC won and the PC said that it was bogus that the NPC would get a chance to anticipate and respond to the spell before it went off.

As described the NPC was on guard and expecting something. So they would not be surprised and would get a chance to act.

It's generally a bad idea to 'ask to talk to someone alone'. Just think in real life has that ever been good news to you?

[jaybird]

It's generally a bad idea to 'ask to talk to someone alone'. Just think in real life has that ever been good news to you?

A couple times, actually :smallbiggrin: admittedly, in rather different circumstances then the average D&D encounter...

[Coidzor]

If you make a comment about being scried upon and needing to have a private conversation, that's at least a pretext, but, well, then you're getting back into needing a bluff check in the first place.

Which is probably where the plan really fell apart to begin with, the unspoken pre-event bluff vs. sense motive.