Wand of Thunder Lance/Kelpstrand/Spiritual Weapon?

[shadow_archmagi]

Kelpstrand, Spiritual Weapon, and Thunder Lance let you use your attributes as modifiers in the effects of the spells. (IE: Spiritual Weapon has BAB equal to yours, and gets your WIS as a bonus to attacks)

Wands don't normally let you use your attributes. However, that's a general rule; attributes don't apply to save DCs.

So, if I have a Wand of Kelpstrand, what happens? Do I get to take advantage of my WIS?

[teslas]

Using a wand to create a Thunderlance would only determine how long it would last based off of the wand's CL. It's quite clear that once you begin wielding it you're simply substituting your character's INT or CHA in place of STR for the purposes of melee.


Kelpstrand would use the wand's Wisdom modifier for the purposes of casting the spell, which is always the lowest possible for a spell, so +1.

[shadow_archmagi]

Using a wand to create a Thunderlance would only determine how long it would last based off of the wand's CL. It's quite clear that once you begin wielding it you're simply substituting your character's INT or CHA in place of STR for the purposes of melee.


Kelpstrand would use the wand's Wisdom modifier for the purposes of casting the spell, which is always the lowest possible for a spell, so +1.


Wait, what? But Kelpstrand does the same sort of thing; you summon strands of kelp that use your WIS and Caster Level in place of STR and BAB for grapple.

[arguskos]

Wait, what? But Kelpstrand does the same sort of thing; you summon strands of kelp that use your WIS and Caster Level in place of STR and BAB for grapple.
The CL of the wand would be it's lowest possible, but when the spell is checking your Wisdom, it checks yours, not the wand's. At least, that's how I read it.

Basically, if it's in the text of the spell, it's you. If it's not (ie. if it's a save or caster level based range/duration/etc), it's the wand.

[teslas]

For starters, wands can be created with higher caster level by paying more gold. There is no specified way to make them start with a higher casting stat (and therefore save DC).

Kelpstrand is a somewhat oddly worded spell. You could possibly interpret it both ways, but that would be a mistake.

RAI, it's pretty clear that the caster level of the wand and the wisdom score of the wand should matter, not the caster's. If this were not the case then a level 20 Druid could spend 4,500gp (90gp per cast) and have a spell the exact same strength as if they cast it themselves--the only difference being duration, though 3 rounds is still enough.

Conversely, if an 8 WIS Rogue with UMD picked up the wand it would be awful to use.

Wands take the place of the caster for the creation of spells, and as such any statistics that affect the spell are contained in the wand, NOT the caster.


Thunderlance's situation with INT/CHA instead of STR is different. If you're somehow confused by this, I'll tell you why.