Need Help Optimizing Cleric

[Hawkings]

I’m going to play a new game on Friday where I was going to play a malconvoker but after reading about how great an optimized cleric can be on the resent thread “Punish the DM (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=221091)” I thought it’d be much better to try one, the only problem is I’ve never played a cleric and I’m not good at optimizing; Does anyone know a particularly good build?

About the game, both my friend and I want to try clerics of Olidammara because we think it’ll be funny to have clerics acting sneaky to the point of being con artists in order to appease our god, he had thought of a paladin of freedom but I said a cleric’s probably got more moral wiggle room if we’re going to be sneaky, no pesky codes beyond the deity’s and all that.
We’ll be level 5, there’s going to be a rogue, a ninja, a druid and two clerics.
The world will involve a lot of forests and jungles, but we’ll probably end up staying near cities. The DM also loves to throw around a lot of undead so the cleric idea seems great.

If possible we’d need a build for the tank cleric my friend will play, and one for me that’d be a more support type, maybe an archer.
I’m also wondering if having one positive and one negative energy cleric would be beneficial since we’d have more variety in spontaneous casting and turn/rebukes.
In the last game I had with this DM the group wasn’t optimized and mostly used a single class, he had no problem walking over us and pulling us by the ear, I really want to be able to do whatever I want to and be strong enough for once instead of having to run from a handful of bandits, or cower before a couple shades.

Many thanks in advance!

[Gavinfoxx]

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=420.0

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=10961.0

Get back to us after you have read those and asked the DM for book / feat / spell / option availability...

[Malachei]

Cleric Handbook (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19866830/The_Cleric_Handbook)

Cleric Handbook on BG (http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=cleric%20handbook&source=web&cd=6&ved=0CE8QFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fbrilliantgameologists.com%2Fboard s%2Findex.php%3Ftopic%3D420.0%3Bwap2&ei=gbm5TsLiO8-z8QOc0K2tBw&usg=AFQjCNEhPDKhW0A9TprzEcKpOEHjmJRfvg&cad=rja)

Your favourite search engine will help you find a lot more, including the archer handbook and various cleric archer builds.

That said, I'd consider Crusader 1, Cleric 4, Ruby Knight Vindicator X as a sweet build.

[Aegis013]

Metamagic and Divine Metamagic (From Complete Divine) are the main fuel for the fire of cleric OPness. Divine Metamagic Persist and Divine Metamagic Quicken are commonly chosen options. Using Nightsticks from Libris Mortis can help get turn undead attempts higher to use these several times.

However as a tank, you build it as a melee, buff up, wade into combat and wreck faces.

As an archer, you simply take Zen Archery (Complete Warrior), it allows you to use Wisdom instead of Dexterity for bows. Bracers of Archery help a lot as well.

As far as races, Lesser Aasimars and Dragonwrought Kobolds make for excellent +0 LA choices.

There are plenty of handbooks on Clerics that can give you much more detailed info than I can. Reference them, you'll get a ton of info! Hope this helps.

[Hawkings]

Talked to my DM he said everything from an official source is allowed, so I could play the Lesser Aasimars, all spells, items and feats in any book are open too, but homebrews has to be passed through him; So solid builds are available now that everything’s open, the only limitation is that I’d really like to stick to following Olidammara if at all possible.

He also suggested a Cleric 10/Divine Judge 5/Weapon master 5 for melee, he said it was a pretty fun build for him.

I'm reading these handbooks now, thanks for the links.

I knew a handbook for clerics would be easy to find, it's just that they aren't going to have the experience and understanding everyone on the forum would, and given generalized concepts I'm certain my inexperience in optimization would have me pass up solid builds, for instance I initially would have over looked Divine metamagic and that would have been awful.


Your favourite search engine will help you find a lot more, including the archer handbook and various cleric archer builds.

That said, I'd consider Crusader 1, Cleric 4, Ruby Knight Vindicator X as a sweet build.
Awesome, I’ll look that up when I’m done with the handbooks, I was hoping for some builds you guys have played and knew worked well.

I appreciate the help.

[Gavinfoxx]

That build he suggested is terrible compared to some of the other options out there. You either want to go cleric and classes that advance spellcasting without losing a single level (okay MAYBE a single level) of spellcasting, or you sometimes want to go for something that is so awesome in other ways that you MIGHT be okay losing some caster levels. Maybe. The RKV build qualifies, but its one of a few...

[Karoht]

If you want to be a melee cleric, find whatever feat/ure gets you Wis -> X. X being any relevant melee stat you want/need. Wis->AC, Wis->Attack/Damage, etc. Wis->Reflex is very handy to have as well.
Stack Wis and Con. Smash things in the face with your choice of weapon. Add on your buff spells and it gets crazy. This is before you do gamebreaking stuff that Clerics are fully capable of.

Not optimized, but can be very fun. Enjoy.

[hex0]

If you can get The Giant's Divine Trickster (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9623145#post9623145)approved, I'd suggest it. It is "high grade homebrew", since Rich has written for official content.

Also, Cloistered Cleric will help put your skills to use.

[Randomguy]

For the tank cleric, DMM persist Divine Power is a must have, since it gives full BAB. It might be nice for archer clerics as well. Also, don't get +5 weapons or armour. Get +1 weapons of several adjectives and cast magic weapon on them. If you want magic armour, cast magic vestment and either get armour enhancements if you see any you really like or save your money on other things.

Remember to activate your prayer beads of karma before you cast your persistent buffs, to make them extra hard to dispel.

Persist a mass lesser vigor or, at higher levels, vigorous circle,to provide all day healing for your party.

Righteous might is a decent spell to persist.

Have the melee cleric cast a persistent ice axe: it creates a magical weapon that makes touch attacks and that has 2d12+1per caster level cold damage each hit. The downside is that strength doesn't apply, but you can still power attack with it. If you apply the sanctify spell feat to it, it still deals half damage to enemies that are immune to cold.

If your friends get jealous that they're missing out on the persistent fun, persist Girallon's blessing on one of them for two extra arms. They can either dual wield bows, quad wield weapons, dual wield two handed weapons or attack with a single weapon and deal 2.5 times their strength bonus, rather than 1.5.

If you pick up the celerity domain, from complete divine (yes, it is available to clerics of Olidamara) you can DMM persist haste, as well.

Reserve feats from complete mage are also useful: If your melee friend finds a polymorphing spell of at least 4th level and picks up Minor Shapeshift, they can get a bunch of temporary HP that they can refresh at will. (Polymorphing spells are hard to get for clerics, the drow domain gets some though.) You can also get reserve feats that let you blast all day without wasting spell slots.

[Malachei]

I appreciate the help.

You're welcome.

As an add-on: Crusader 3, Cleric 2, RKV X gets a Stance at 6th level (RKV 1), which allows you to take Thicket of Blades, among the best stances in the game and two levels earlier than a single-classed Crusader. Now get Combat Reflexes and Enlarge Person (possibly as a Domain Spell?), plus perhaps Stand Still (in the SRD).

EDIT:
Normally, I'd agree with "thou shalt not lose caster levels", but RKV is generally considered an excellent Prestige Class for a melee focused divine caster. You could even pick up Thicket of Blades by later entering and having less Crusader levels, although I find the Zealous Surge ability (reroll) nice.

One of the main benefits of RKV comes later, though: Gaining additional swift actions for spending a Turn / Rebuke Undead attempt. This is wonderful, and, especially at very high levels, when the action economy matters even more, it can be life-saving.

I've played a Crusader, Cleric --> RKV and must say it was a tremendous experience. In combat, I was healing more damage than the cleric, and often without spending actions. With the Stone Power feat, the Steely Resolve class ability and the Stone Bones maneuver, a Crusader is very hard to kill, and I'd say this was the character I've played with the highest survivability at low levels.