Joystealers Don't have a Charisma Drain?

[TheRinni]

In Monster Manual IV, page 78, we have a fey I am very much interested throwing at my party tonight: the Joystealer.

It's special abilities include:


Sense Emotion (Su) This ability functions like blindsense, except that a joystealer can detect only the presence and positions of living creatures.

Drain Emotions (Su) Once a joystealer has reduced a living creature to 0 Charisma, it can drain emotion completely from that opponent as a standard action. A creature so drained can't be affected by morale bonuses or penalties, can't race, and can't receive the benefits of any other ability derived through inspiration or emotion. The affected creature is also immune to fear effects.

And that's it. It gives you an ability you can use after an enemy's Cha has been reduced to 0, but no way to actually reduce it. I guess I'm just confused on how this monster is supposed to function. Is it really worth the CR:5?

I guess you could fix this with wands or weapons, except it explicitly states:

During their enslavement, joystealers possessed nothing of their own, and being incorpreal, they have no material treasure.

What exactly am I missing?


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Edit:
Some food for thought: I'm thinking about coupling a couple of these with a Grey Jester. What CR would you put that encounter at?

[Gorgondantess]

Look at their attack line.:smallamused:

[TheRinni]

Look at their attack line.:smallamused:
GAHBlarglargin! This is so frustrating; I know it's here. I still can't seem to find it. Can I trouble you for a quote?

[Douglas]

Right under "Speed" and above "Space":

Melee incorporeal touch +6 (1d4 Cha)

It's an incorporeal touch attack that deals 1d4 charisma damage.

[Qwertystop]

Isn't that kind of pointless? When they get to 0 CHA, they're basically in a coma. Does the emotionlessness persist after the CHA goes back up?

[TheRinni]

Isn't that kind of pointless? When they get to 0 CHA, they're basically in a coma. Does the emotionlessness persist after the CHA goes back up?

Yes. The emotion drain can only be countered by finding and destroying the Joystealer who caused it - or a remove curse spell within the area of a hallow spell.


And thank you for the answer!

[Fax Celestis]

Joystealer psions (with at least three class levels) are terrifying things to behold (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/egoWhip.htm).

[Nikker]

I'm sorry for answering this after 7 years but I think it's still better than opening a new thread.
That "Melee incorporeal touch+6 (1d4 cha)" confuses me.
The joystealer has a base attack bonus of +3. But the fey could still take class levels. So, let's say they reaches a +6/+1 bab. Would they become able to make more than one touch attack, since the charisma damage is not stated to be a supernatural ability nor the like?

[Kobold Esq]

I'm sorry for answering this after 7 years but I think it's still better than opening a new thread.
That "Melee incorporeal touch+6 (1d4 cha)" confuses me.
The joystealer has a base attack bonus of +3. But the fey could still take class levels. So, let's say they reaches a +6/+1 bab. Would they become able to make more than one touch attack, since the charisma damage is not stated to be a supernatural ability nor the like?

Natural attacks don't give additional attacks with high BAB. See any dragon or huge elemental's stat block for obvious examples.

[KillianHawkeye]

I'm sorry for answering this after 7 years but I think it's still better than opening a new thread.

You're wrong. On top of that, you knew you were wrong and you did it anyway.

0/10, two thumbs down

[AlanBruce]

Natural attacks don't give additional attacks with high BAB. See any dragon or huge elemental's stat block for obvious examples.

That is true, but don't Joystealers advance via class levels? I believe MMIV says that rogue is their favored class and if they have enough levels in rogue to grant them multiple attacks through BAB, couldn't they use their incorporeal touch to say, sneak attack someone repeatedly in a round if given a chance?

I read the rogue entry and nothing says they can't use their natural weapons for SA damage, unless the Joystealer, being incorporeal, had to use some ghost touch weapon to hit several times in a round and her touch as a secondary attack with the usual penalties.

[Remuko]

That is true, but don't Joystealers advance via class levels? I believe MMIV says that rogue is their favored class and if they have enough levels in rogue to grant them multiple attacks through BAB, couldn't they use their incorporeal touch to say, sneak attack someone repeatedly in a round if given a chance?

I read the rogue entry and nothing says they can't use their natural weapons for SA damage, unless the Joystealer, being incorporeal, had to use some ghost touch weapon to hit several times in a round and her touch as a secondary attack with the usual penalties.

it doesnt matter how they advance or what their BAB is. their touch attack is a natural weapon and if theyre using it, they dont get iteratives. they could sneak attack with it but they wouldnt get multiple hits. if they used a weapon they would get iteratives on their sneak attack but they wouldnt get the drain from their touch.

[Kelb_Panthera]

it doesnt matter how they advance or what their BAB is. their touch attack is a natural weapon and if theyre using it, they dont get iteratives. they could sneak attack with it but they wouldnt get multiple hits. if they used a weapon they would get iteratives on their sneak attack but they wouldnt get the drain from their touch.

Fun little hidden gem in the rules; you can deliver touch attacks with unarmed strikes if you can hit the higher AC. Unarmed strikes -do- get iteratives.

Just need a kung-fu joystealer. :smallbiggrin:

Edit: oh, and a set of ghost touch gauntlets, I suppose.

[Remuko]

Fun little hidden gem in the rules; you can deliver touch attacks with unarmed strikes if you can hit the higher AC. Unarmed strikes -do- get iteratives.

Just need a kung-fu joystealer. :smallbiggrin:

Edit: oh, and a set of ghost touch gauntlets, I suppose.

ooo nice loophole!

[Nikker]

I read the rogue entry and nothing says they can't use their natural weapons for SA damage, unless the Joystealer, being incorporeal, had to use some ghost touch weapon to hit several times in a round and her touch as a secondary attack with the usual penalties.

I believed the natural attack of a Joystealer was an "incorporeal touch attack".
If you're using a Ghost Touch weapon, it hits like it's corporeal.

Same for the unarmed strike, I don't think that the Cha damage would work unless it goes incorporeal.