Warlock/DFA Recovery Mechanic.

[Tvtyrant]

Would giving Warlocks and Dragon Fire Adepts a recovery mechanic similar to that of the Warblade improve their versatility? For instance the Warlock knows all of the invocations in both classes sets, but it can only ready 14 a day (like a Crusader) and has to recover them after each use. They can change readied ones after a 10 minute break. The DFA might not know as many because its a stronger class, but the same basic concept.

[Godskook]

I don't think giving them full access to their entire list without any restrictions would push them any farther up than tier 3, honestly. There's not really any dangerous combos to be had that weren't had already.

Where are you trying to get them?

[Tvtyrant]

I don't think giving them full access to their entire list without any restrictions would push them any farther up than tier 3, honestly. There's not really any dangerous combos to be had that weren't had already.

Where are you trying to get them?

It was really just about the Warlock, because it needs a lot of work just to get up to decent. Its abilities seem like they would be more interesting if you weren't left with a couple of them your entire career. Not necessarily strong, but more interesting/variable.

[Wings of Peace]

I don't see it changing much. One of the biggest weaknesses of Invocations is that they're almost all standard actions where as spells have plenty of ways to break the action economy.

[Tvtyrant]

Okay, slight tangent. How useful would a recovery mechanic be for a Warmage?

[Godskook]

Okay, slight tangent. How useful would a recovery mechanic be for a Warmage?

In what way would you give them such a system that wouldn't be a nerf?

[Tvtyrant]

In what way would you give them such a system that wouldn't be a nerf?

Have them simply recover a slot every 3 rounds? Then they can nova every encounter, since they are a wee bit underpowered if they cannot.

[Godskook]

Have them simply recover a slot every 3 rounds? Then they can nova every encounter, since they are a wee bit underpowered if they cannot.

1.Its not how much spellcasting they have, its the quality of what they've got that's the problem.

2.They've already got enough spell slots that they have useful things to do all combat past the early levels. Worst case? Lesser orbs are a decent method of picking off enemies, especially if you put a little metamagic on them.

3.This is another "Use a baseball bat to change your oil" moment. Giving the Warmage slots that 'come back' over time breaks so many things that you're really better off not attempting something like that, unless you're doing it across the board.

4.Warmages aren't that underpowered compared to anything you should be comparing them to. They hit tier 4, and tier 3/4 are the fun-but-balanced tiers. And if you're trying to compare them to anything in tier 1/2 region, that's completely silly, since the point of Warmage is to get out of those tiers of power.

[Greymane]

I don't think giving them full access to their entire list without any restrictions would push them any farther up than tier 3, honestly. There's not really any dangerous combos to be had that weren't had already.

Where are you trying to get them?

I find this notion to be very interesting, actually. I've never had the pleasure of playing a Warlock (but someday, when I'm actually a player, I will), but they always seemed sort of underwhelming. If giving them all of their Invocations ever knocks them up to Tier 3, what is the problem with doing that? Knee-jerking aside.