Aging as Undead?

[Snowbluff]

I am Undead, do I still take the physical penalties as I get older? Do I still get more handsome, obtain better eyesight, and less senile?

[Lord Vukodlak]

I am Undead, do I still take the physical penalties as I get older? Do I still get more handsome, obtain better eyesight, and less senile?


Nope you cease to age, no bonuses or pentalties you have not already accrued.

[Calanon]

Nope you cease to age, no bonuses or pentalties you have not already accrued.

I thought as an undead you still gained bonuses but were immune to the penalties of aging :smallconfused:

[Snowbluff]

Nope you cease to age, no bonuses or pentalties you have not already accrued.

Okay, ty ^^

[Snowbluff]

I thought as an undead you still gained bonuses but were immune to the penalties of aging :smallconfused:

This actually makes a little more sense. Do you know where I can investigate further.

[Madcrafter]

Makes intuitive sense, and most any DM will rule that way. As for actual rules, I have the feeling that such a thing is not stated specifically anywhere. Though there maight be something about it in Libris Mortis.

[Coidzor]

The closest thing by RAW that I can think of is the Evolved Undead Template which undead that have existed for X number of years have a Y percent chance of gaining every time Z years pass.

I blieve this is from Libris Mortis.

[KillianHawkeye]

Can't age if yer dead, can ye? Sure, ye're still all walkin' about, but ye ain't got no pulse, have ye?

[marcielle]

Thing is, Dragons practically don't age(only grow) but still acrue the benefits of aging because it theoretically comes from experience, not the actual aging process. It's not stated, but judging from Dragons, I'd say if you were sentient at the begining of undeadhood(lich or necropolitan) then you'd get all the benefits but no penalties.

[Snowbluff]

Thing is, Dragons practically don't age(only grow) but still acrue the benefits of aging because it theoretically comes from experience, not the actual aging process. It's not stated, but judging from Dragons, I'd say if you were sentient at the begining of undeadhood(lich or necropolitan) then you'd get all the benefits but no penalties.

Cool, nice precedent. Mental stats age due to experience! Thanks.

[boomwolf]

Actually dragons work a bit differently, their crunch does not fit in with the fluff as their "age" and "experience" are entwined unnaturally...

I would say no. actually I often play with no age effects at all as they work dumb.

Undead in specific should not "age" mentally (as I see it), as their brain cease to exist/work, and their intelligence is an "afterimage" of what they were alive.

[Flickerdart]

The section of the article on Wedded to History (the eternal life feat) says that a being that lives forever doesn't have the motivation to improve themselves due to a lack of mortality or something to that effect, and so immortal characters gain neither penalties nor bonuses. There's another precedent for "no".

[marcielle]

Boomer has a point. Though, a lich wizard can still learn new spells so I'm pretty sure they can learn. And while imortals might not have any drive, undeads like necropolitans are far from immortal. In fact, they are in nearly as much danger as pre undaedening since most religious orders and heroes would have them killed as abominations. They just don't age physically. I think this is another up to DM thing. Aging in general is pretty darn wierd though. According to it, a wrinkly old man is more fearsome/handsome than a middle aged one despite being frail and decrepid.

[Mastikator]

Undead don't have age categories AFAIK. Nor do they receive their physical or mental "power" from they physical body, they don't use muscles to move or a brain to think. I think.

Edit.
Though, they would probably rot and wither in time, and in a long time their bones would probably even fossilize.

[Psyren]

You're dead, why would you age? :smallconfused:

[marcielle]

I think the aging bonuses will, in the end, not be worth the headaches from arguing with your DM lol.:smallbiggrin:
Funny thing. Warforged can also age.:smallconfused:

[Malimar]

Funny thing. Warforged can also age.:smallconfused:

They only experience the effects of two age categories, though. I actually kind of like the way warforged interact with the aging system, and one might consider applying it to any sentient undead characters one might have.

[Nagukuk]

Lib Mort is correct, the evolved undead template is +1 la

Its time interval is 100years, minimum. You have no worries about aging.

[Dr.Epic]

You don't really age. Maybe rot if your one of them lower undeads like zombie.

[Necroticplague]

Evolved Undead, Libris mortis. When you get older living, you get weaker. On you deathday as undead, you have a chance of suddenly growing stronger. "Happy deathday!" *muscles bulge*

[Psyren]

I think the aging bonuses will, in the end, not be worth the headaches from arguing with your DM lol.:smallbiggrin:
Funny thing. Warforged can also age.:smallconfused:

Warforged explicitly have living components. Undead don't.

[Calanon]

You're dead, why would you age? :smallconfused:

I can understand why you would believe this and now I understand it (See lower comments)



The section of the article on Wedded to History (the eternal life feat) says that a being that lives forever doesn't have the motivation to improve themselves due to a lack of mortality or something to that effect, and so immortal characters gain neither penalties nor bonuses. There's another precedent for "no".

I can understand this due to the fact that Yes, if you live forever you usually tend to stay the same mentally, physically and psychologically (However you do run the risk of insanity) This can either be arrogance, pride, or just the way you are. Take in example my great grandmother (107 and still kicking) She still believes that as a women she has no right to vote, should stay in the kitchen and cook (which is awesome because its Thanksgiving she makes awesome pie! :smallbiggrin:) Her ideas are archaic to say the least, but still decides to follow her old ways...I use her as a comparison to immortality (She's 107 and not dying anytime soon)


Actually dragons work a bit differently, their crunch does not fit in with the fluff as their "age" and "experience" are entwined unnaturally...

I would say no. actually I often play with no age effects at all as they work dumb.

Undead in specific should not "age" mentally (as I see it), as their brain cease to exist/work, and their intelligence is an "afterimage" of what they were alive.

Dragons are a terrible example of "immortality" or "longevity" because Dragons, unlike humans are built to last for almost ever (I don't think I've ever heard of a Dragon dying of old age...) For Undead they keep there style of working "living" because they believe it is the right and flawless way however certain undead must be able to decide at one point in there unlives that they want something more for themselves and they change there outlook on death. This is how I believe an Undead would age, however Undead are DEAD they should not age for the most part so then we apply the evolved undead Template to show that the Undead has had a revelation of sorts


Undead don't have age categories AFAIK. Nor do they receive their physical or mental "power" from they physical body, they don't use muscles to move or a brain to think. I think.

Edit.
Though, they would probably rot and wither in time, and in a long time their bones would probably even fossilize.

Libra Mortis states that most Undead receive power from the Negative Energy plane I can see nothing short of the Negative Energy Plane hitting Venerable as an excuse for Undead to gain the benefits of Aging and that isn't happening any time soon :smallwink: and that fossilization doesn't apply to all the "good" undead so only Skeletons, living fossils, Zombies, and other lesser undead can become fossils at all meaning Lichs, Vampires, Mummys, Death Knights, and obviously Ghost can never be fossilized :smallsmile:

[Arbitrarious]

I could've swore the Dragon article said that you don't get mental bonuses because you don't get penalties. The logic being that you don't have to adapt to doing things a different way since your body isn't weakening. If you could open a stuck jar yourself by sheer strength and that never changes you don't have to learn other ways of doing it such as clever tricks (int), common sense (wis), or asking others to help you (cha).

I'm not saying it's perfect but that was their reasoning. I've always though the age categories in D&D were a mess.

[Ravens_cry]

I guess it was to give credence to the Wise Old Sage archetype and the long bearded, ancient wizard stereotype. If the charisma bonus is anything to go by, all old men turn into Sir Patrick Stewart.

[Psyren]

I guess it was to give credence to the Wise Old Sage archetype and the long bearded, ancient wizard stereotype. If the charisma bonus is anything to go by, all old men turn into Sir Patrick Stewart.

Christopher Lee, Ian McKellen, Stephen Fry... actually, there might be something to it :smallsmile:

[Ravens_cry]

Sir Christopher Lee, Sir Ian McKellen, Stephen Fry... actually, there might be something to it :smallsmile:
Ah, such men. They do not grow old so much as mature, ripen, like wine.:smallamused:

[Snowbluff]

Christopher Lee, Ian McKellen, Stephen Fry... actually, there might be something to it :smallsmile:

You forgot George Clooney and Sean Connery :smalltongue:

[Calanon]

You forgot George Clooney and Sean Connery :smalltongue:

My Mom used to clean George Clooney's Connecticut house... he yelled at me when I went to work with her once for sitting on his couch :smallfrown:

[KillianHawkeye]

Thing is, Dragons practically don't age(only grow) but still acrue the benefits of aging because it theoretically comes from experience, not the actual aging process. It's not stated, but judging from Dragons, I'd say if you were sentient at the begining of undeadhood(lich or necropolitan) then you'd get all the benefits but no penalties.

That's a great example for disproving your point, since an undead dragon WON'T gain additional age categories. How's it going to keep growing after it's dead?

[Calanon]

That's a great example for disproving your point, since an undead dragon WON'T gain additional age categories. How's it going to keep growing after it's dead?

1. Become an Advanced Dragon Great Wyrm
2. Become a Dracolich
3. ???
4. Profit!

When a Dragon becomes an Advanced Dragon it stops growing in Age categories every 4 levels and begins taking "Virtual age categories" at every 3 levels since these Virtual age categories do not technically count as the Dragon aging past Great Wyrm (man that would be cool couldn't it?)

The Dragon is not so much Aging as it is improving its own skills :smallwink:

[AtlanteanTroll]

I am Undead, do I still take the physical penalties as I get older? Do I still get more handsome, obtain better eyesight, and less senile?

Are you implying that the undead are even a little bit handsome in the first place? :smalleek:

[Madcrafter]

What's wrong with handsome undead? They were people too.

But I agree it is probably more likely their expanding ego and dominating personalities that would represent an increase in CHA.

[Ravens_cry]

Are you implying that the undead are even a little bit handsome in the first place? :smalleek:
Different stokes for different folks, the Lich Loved feat exists for a reason.
Beyond making us want to gouge out our brain and beat it against a rock I mean.

[Psyren]

Cha is not attractiveness. It's closer to self-confidence. Granted, being attractive and being confident go hand-in-hand for many people, but they aren't joined at the hip by any means.

[Ravens_cry]

Cha is not attractiveness. It's closer to self-confidence. Granted, being attractive and being confident go hand-in-hand for many people, but they aren't joined at the hip by any means.
Of course not, we know this,but a lot of people find powerful personalities sexy. Sir Patrick Stewart as Captain Picard was a sexy, sexy man, but he also exuded an aura of command and personality.

[Calanon]

Are you implying that the undead are even a little bit handsome in the first place? :smalleek:

I don't know... Xykon is looking sexier and sexier to me every day :smallwink:

CHA is more of how people react to you in a social situation, if people pay great attention to you and follow your every word, then you must have a pretty high Charisma otherwise your a loner of sorts. Lichs I can understand as an increase to there CHA because becoming a Lich is a sign of serious arcane power and power is sexy as all hell :smallsmile:

[Flickerdart]

Or losing your flesh just has a really slimming effect on a person. :smallwink:

[Ravens_cry]

True that. Look at Harry Kissnger. Apparently woman were all over him, even though he looks like an Uncle Louis who sells car insurance.

[KillianHawkeye]

1. Become an Advanced Dragon Great Wyrm
2. Become a Dracolich
3. ???
4. Profit!

When a Dragon becomes an Advanced Dragon it stops growing in Age categories every 4 levels and begins taking "Virtual age categories" at every 3 levels since these Virtual age categories do not technically count as the Dragon aging past Great Wyrm (man that would be cool couldn't it?)

The Dragon is not so much Aging as it is improving its own skills :smallwink:

I'm calling BS on this one. But considering it's got to be an epic level monster by then, and everything is BS in epic levels, I guess I'll let it slide. :smallamused:

[Calanon]

I'm calling BS on this one. But considering it's got to be an epic level monster by then, and everything is BS in epic levels, I guess I'll let it slide. :smallamused:

NO! Epic level is not BS! the ability to make a spell so powerful that it rips a creatures soul out and allows you to hi-jack there body with a 5th level spell is totally and completely fair!

[Taelas]

Boomer has a point. Though, a lich wizard can still learn new spells so I'm pretty sure they can learn. And while imortals might not have any drive, undeads like necropolitans are far from immortal. In fact, they are in nearly as much danger as pre undaedening since most religious orders and heroes would have them killed as abominations. They just don't age physically. I think this is another up to DM thing. Aging in general is pretty darn wierd though. According to it, a wrinkly old man is more fearsome/handsome than a middle aged one despite being frail and decrepid.

Yeah, no.

There's this thing called a "circumstance penalty" which is applied whenever the DM feels they are appropriate.

I don't think you'll get any arguments whatsoever that it isn't appropriate to, say, apply a circumstance penalty to Listen because you're old.