3.5 New Domain! For Science! (PEACH)

[NeoSeraphi]

The Alchemy Domain

Deities: The Alchemy Domain is offered by all deities who also offer the Knowledge Domain.

Granted Power: You gain the Brew Potion feat as a bonus feat. You need not meet the prerequisites, however, you may not actually use the feat until you have a CL of at least 3rd.

You may brew potions of any level spell that you are able to cast, with the prices for 4th and higher level spells remaining the same. You must have at least a number of ranks in the Craft (Alchemy) skill equal to twice the spell level+3 (11 for 4th, 13 for 5th, etc) to attempt to brew a potion of a 4th level or higher spell.

In order to brew a potion of a higher spell level than 3rd, you must expend a Turn Undead attempt at the time of creation, plus an additional Turn Undead attempt for each level the spell is higher than 4th. (So 1 Turn Attempt for a 4th level spell, 2 for a 5th, up to 6 for a 9th level spell)

The benefits of this granted power extend only to divine spells. You may still not brew potions of arcane spells that are higher than 3rd level.

Spells:

1st: Resize Person*
2nd: Alter Self
3rd: Shrink Item
4th: Polymorph
5th: Fabricate
6th: Medusa Mastery*
7th: Major Creation
8th: Polymorph Any Object
9th: Shapechange


*New Spell, described below

Resize Person
Transmutation
Alchemy 1

This spell functions as either reduce person or enlarge person, chosen when you cast the spell.

If this spell is used to create a magic item, such as a wand, scroll, or potion, the caster chooses which one to use when he creates the item.


Medusa Mastery
Transmutation
Alchemy 6

This spell functions as either flesh to stone or stone to flesh, chosen when you cast the spell.

If this spell is used to create a magic item, such as a scroll, the caster chooses which one to use when he creates the item.

[KutuluKultist]

It seems a bit strong. The spells are all quite useful and so is the granted power. It might be good to demand a tax on the potion brewing. Require a number of Craft(Alchemy) skill ranks equal to twice the level of the spell to be made into a potion (PF) or equal to twice the level +3 (3.5). This way, potions of higher level spells become available one level after you get access to the spells.

As for Spells, I would look for flavourful stuff, that works on material by changing it in some way, which is what alchemists do.

[NeoSeraphi]

It seems a bit strong. The spells are all quite useful and so is the granted power. It might be good to demand a tax on the potion brewing. Require a number of Craft(Alchemy) skill ranks equal to twice the level of the spell to be made into a potion (PF) or equal to twice the level +3 (3.5). This way, potions of higher level spells become available one level after you get access to the spells.

Twice the level of the spell +3, huh? Okay, that works.


As for Spells, I would look for flavourful stuff, that works on material by changing it in some way, which is what alchemists do.

I did. You'd be surprised how few of those spells are actually in the Player's Handbook (and not already on the cleric spell list)

[jiriku]

fantastic machine, greater fantastic machine, polymorph any object. possibly mirror image, arcane eye, and mending (the spells needed to make a homunculus).

[TravelLog]

1st: Enlarge Person
2nd: Invisibility
3rd: Fly
4th: Greater Invisibility
5th: Permanency
6th: Greater Heroism
7th: Statue
8th: Mind Blank
9th: Foresight


The spells here do seem a bit random, I'll be the first to admit. It was pretty hard for me to find a "science-y" spell list, so instead I decided to just pick the spells I thought would be the best to brew into potions. If anyone has any suggestions for spells they think would be better fit into the flavor, I'd be happy to hear them.

You had me until level 3. At that point I became very confused. Spells that fit thematically: Analyze Dweomer (6th), Fabricate (5th), perhaps Imprisonment (9th), Forcecage (7th), Forbiddance (6th), Explosive Runes! (3rd), Mage's Private Sanctum (7th), Major/Minor Creation (5th/4th), all of the Trasmute X to X spells (5th).

Yes, most of these are sorcerer/wizard spells. That's what you get when they are more Alchemical/Science! than a cleric.

That was just SRD too, there are a ton more out there.

[NeoSeraphi]

fantastic machine, greater fantastic machine, polymorph any object. possibly mirror image, arcane eye, and mending (the spells needed to make a homunculus).

Fantastic machine and greater fantastic machine? Are those Eberron spells or something? :smallconfused:

[jiriku]

Spell Compendium. They conjure a clockwork servitor. Kind of weak for the level, but no reason you couldn't grant them one level earlier than advertised.

[NeoSeraphi]

Spell Compendium. They conjure a clockwork servitor. Kind of weak for the level, but no reason you couldn't grant them one level earlier than advertised.

Alright then, thank you. And thanks for your suggestions as well, TravelLog. Guess I'll update the spell list.

[NeoSeraphi]

There we go! A nice and balanced list with a bunch of spells that alter objects or creatures around you, as an alchemist should have!

[Domriso]

I like it. The new list fits better.

[jiriku]

I like the new spells. Reminds me of the reversible spells common in 2e.

[Wavelab]

Not the be a party pooper, but you just made a 10 level prc void.

Magic of Faerun Page 34 Master Alchemist.

He gains the ability to make 9th level potions at the last level in the prc. So you have a Domain accesible at level 1 and a prc at level 17.

I know you won't be able to cast 9th level spells yet, but yeah it does that. I'm not suggesting I don't like this domain, as usual I like your homebrew, just that ability is kinda overpowered(just a little).

[NeoSeraphi]

Not the be a party pooper, but you just made a 10 level prc void.

Magic of Faerun Page 34 Master Alchemist.

He gains the ability to make 9th level potions at the last level in the prc. So you have a Domain accesible at level 1 and a prc at level 17.

I know you won't be able to cast 9th level spells yet, but yeah it does that. I'm not suggesting I don't like this domain, as usual I like your homebrew, just that ability is kinda overpowered(just a little).

Magic of Faerun is 3.0 material. It's not 3.5. (I know this because Magic of Faerun has the old version of wieldskill, the broken one that gives you a +10 bonus, instead of the updated one in PGtF that gives you +5)

Though I suppose you're right. I'll change it so that you have to spend a Turn Undead attempt to brew a potion higher than 4th, per level it is higher than 4th. So you would need at least 22 Charisma or the Extra Turning feat to make a 9th level potion. Sound fair?

[Noctis Vigil]

It's...interesting. I think the domain power is a bit much, though. I'd limit it to 4th level spells. Just as an example, you could make an ointment of True Resurrection with this once you hit level 18. That's a little much to get for free.

[NeoSeraphi]

It's...interesting. I think the domain power is a bit much, though. I'd limit it to 4th level spells. Just as an example, you could make an ointment of True Resurrection with this once you hit level 18. That's a little much to get for free.

The thing is, potions/oils/ointments cost more to make than scrolls (because they don't require a UMD check to use), so that costs more XP and money on the cleric's part. It balances itself out.

[Acidic_Cakes]

I have to admit, I rather wish there was an actual "Science" Domain, though frankly I don't really have much of an idea of how that would go together.

Ah well.

[NeoSeraphi]

I have to admit, I rather wish there was an actual "Science" Domain, though frankly I don't really have much of an idea of how that would go together.

Ah well.

Well, in the typical Medieval European setting, alchemy was a well-respected and researched science, so for some campaigns, this is a science domain.

Science itself is defined as the pursuit of knowledge and use of your talents and equipment to define what is true and what is not. The Knowledge Domain can easily be reflavored into that.

[Wavelab]

I like it, it's powerful yet playable.

PS. I see I'm in your sig. You might want to use my above statement instead.

[NeoSeraphi]

I like it, it's powerful yet playable.

PS. I see I'm in your sig. You might want to use my above statement instead.

People tell me they like my "homebrew" all the time, but the only thing that gets a place in my new signature is if they refer to it as "Seraphi Homebrew". :smallcool:

Since you did that, I've just...I don't know! I like the sound of it.

[Gamer Girl]

The spells don't really fit 'alchemy' though. You'd think that spells in an Alchemy Domain would have more to do with potions, liquids and such then just 'changing things'.

How is resize person or alter self alchemy related? Sure the effects of alchemy can do the stuff, but they can also do lost of other things. So why limit an alchemy domain caster to changing people?

This domain needs more flavorful spells:

*Animate Liquids
*Animate Potion(this sounds fun, making a 'potion elemental')
*Metamorphose Liquids
*Potion Pocket(store a potion extradimensinaly)
*Enhance Potion or Alter Potion(a great one...)
*Wave of Potions(pour potions into a wave...oh, fun)
*Potion 'port(teleport a potion from a container to your mouth)
*Transmute Lead to Gold(a classic...)

[NeoSeraphi]

The spells don't really fit 'alchemy' though. You'd think that spells in an Alchemy Domain would have more to do with potions, liquids and such then just 'changing things'.

How is resize person or alter self alchemy related? Sure the effects of alchemy can do the stuff, but they can also do lost of other things. So why limit an alchemy domain caster to changing people?

This domain needs more flavorful spells:

*Animate Liquids
*Animate Potion(this sounds fun, making a 'potion elemental')
*Metamorphose Liquids
*Potion Pocket(store a potion extradimensinaly)
*Enhance Potion or Alter Potion(a great one...)
*Wave of Potions(pour potions into a wave...oh, fun)
*Potion 'port(teleport a potion from a container to your mouth)
*Transmute Lead to Gold(a classic...)

The concept of alchemy itself is not "turn metals into gold", though that is what it's best known for.

An alchemist can best be described as a transmuter, in D&D terms. The concept that you can, through alchemical reactions, transform any substance into any other substance.

Yes, in Western Europe, alchemists were known best for chemistry, for brewing potions and the like. But think about it in terms of a world where magic was actually possible, rather than one where the alchemists were pioneers into a world that had no concept of modern chemistry.

Do you really think that an alchemist who had access to transmutation magic would have wasted his time trying to change lead into gold, when he could have studied the much more amazing accomplishment of changing a person to stone, or transforming himself into a dragon?

The polymorph any object spell represents the true dream of an alchemist, though oddly it does not allow you to create gold. (For balance reasons, obviously). But the concept of changing anything into anything else, that is the core of alchemy.

[Domriso]

One thing that pops into mind is the utter lack of any life-extending spells. One of the biggest pushes of alchemy, in both eastern and western alchemical circles (pun totally intended) was searching for eternal life. I feel like leaving that out is somehow a bit sad, even though I see what angle your approaching this from.

[NeoSeraphi]

One thing that pops into mind is the utter lack of any life-extending spells. One of the biggest pushes of alchemy, in both eastern and western alchemical circles (pun totally intended) was searching for eternal life. I feel like leaving that out is somehow a bit sad, even though I see what angle your approaching this from.

Hmm...*scratches my head* What kind of spells would you suggest? Like, clone?

[Domriso]

That's where I run into some issues. Particularly for higher level spells, there isn't really any that just extend life. I mean, oddly, the only one that pops into mind is actually Gentle Ripose, sort of as a "Well, we haven't perfected eternal life, but we do have eternally un-decomposed down."

[Coidzor]

Granted Power: You gain the Brew Potion feat as a bonus feat. You need not meet the prerequisites, however, you may not actually use the feat until you have a CL of at least 3rd.

You really need to begrudge them potions that can have a CL of 1 if they can afford them? Or is this a point of clarification that one can't make them with a CL less than 3 due to the crafting rules themselves?

[NeoSeraphi]

You really need to begrudge them potions that can have a CL of 1 if they can afford them? Or is this a point of clarification that one can't make them with a CL less than 3 due to the crafting rules themselves?

The feat itself has a prerequisite of CL 3rd. The cost is so high that you'd probably not want to spend that much XP already anyway.

WotC chose to not allow Potion Brewing until 3rd level, and potions are pretty strong, as far as magic items go. So yes, I decided to prevent 1st and 2nd level potion brewing (and dipping)

I mean, if you only wanted to be a cleric to get potion brewing so you could get some extra 1st level spells as a barbarian while you were raging (and couldn't use spells or wands) then you should at least invest the full 3 levels into the class for it.

[motionmatrix]

one way to grant more to this character without having to add much more is to write up some actual alchemy recipes.

An elixir of life? takes a certain percentage of years off. Or slows down future growth. Maybe acts as a resurrection effect if given to the recently deceased.

I like the spells. Shrink item should be shrink/grow item, keeping with the theme.

[NeoSeraphi]

one way to grant more to this character without having to add much more is to write up some actual alchemy recipes.

An elixir of life? takes a certain percentage of years off. Or slows down future growth. Maybe acts as a resurrection effect if given to the recently deceased.

I like the spells. Shrink item should be shrink/grow item, keeping with the theme.

I don't think grow item is a spell. I'm not homebrewing any actual new spells here, just making reversible options.

[Wavelab]

One thing that pops into mind is the utter lack of any life-extending spells. One of the biggest pushes of alchemy, in both eastern and western alchemical circles (pun totally intended) was searching for eternal life. I feel like leaving that out is somehow a bit sad, even though I see what angle your approaching this from.

Most life extending spells(Besides animate dead, create undead, etc.) are epic spells(Ioulam's Longevity) and even then it takes massive costs to develop and cast.

There is Steal Life(BoVD) that allows you to drain 1 point from a target each round with a duration of concentration. If cast while it's full moon you get a week younger for every point you drain. But that is an [evil] spell and is probably not what alchemists do.

[motionmatrix]

I don't think grow item is a spell. I'm not homebrewing any actual new spells here, just making reversible options.

I know, I didn't recall the proper name, but grow item (or whatever the hell it is called, I am sure I have read it somewhere) is (or would be) to shrink item as enlarge person is to reduce person.

It makes sense, and I don't think it is writing new stuff. I will try to take a look for the spell (it may be splat, even 3rd party, though I am hoping not).

[Veklim]

Strangely, in a setting where gods roam, powerful epic wizards create their own demi-planes and entire civilisations can disappear in the blink of an eye, there is STILL no way of transmuting lead to gold? Keep in mind the fact that we can ACTUALLY DO THIS now, right now, with science. It's a remarkably simple, albeit horrifically costly, process but it's possible. Magic should be able to as well, regardless of any exhorbitant price tags you may (rightly) place.

Nice domain though, feels like a cross between Knowledge and Creation in some respects, which is pretty much bang on the mark for Alchemy. Thing is, if you're going to make Alchemy feel and act closer to a science, then there should be a relaxing of restrictions on the craft alchemy skill too, why do you have to be a spellcaster to understand and practice science?

[NeoSeraphi]

Nice domain though, feels like a cross between Knowledge and Creation in some respects, which is pretty much bang on the mark for Alchemy. Thing is, if you're going to make Alchemy feel and act closer to a science, then there should be a relaxing of restrictions on the craft alchemy skill too, why do you have to be a spellcaster to understand and practice science?

Oh, I personally toss that rule right out the window, along with multiclassing XP penalties.

[Veklim]

Ahh, glad I'm not the only one!

[motionmatrix]

Nice domain though, feels like a cross between Knowledge and Creation in some respects, which is pretty much bang on the mark for Alchemy. Thing is, if you're going to make Alchemy feel and act closer to a science, then there should be a relaxing of restrictions on the craft alchemy skill too, why do you have to be a spellcaster to understand and practice science?


Oh, I personally toss that rule right out the window, along with multiclassing XP penalties.

Ditto, both of them are never used on our games.