(PF) Arcane Duelist bard help

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

I'm moving to Australia in 4 weeks, and so I'm leaving behind my gaming buddies. I'm led to believe that the Pathfinder Society has chapters there, so I'm designing a character with that in mind, but not necessarily for that purpose.

I chose a bard (arcane duelist archetype) due to a versatility of abilities, and to be a contributing member of any group I may join. However, so help with the finer points would be nice. I understand I will be no Magus/Duskblade, but that my spells are for buffing myself and my party, and for utility, both in and out of combat.

Im not sure whether to go human for an extra feat, skill point, and favored class Hp, or half elf for low light vision, skill focus, and favored class extra round of bardic performance /level.

20 point buy

STR 10
DEX 14 (16)
CON 14
INT 13
WIS 10
CHA 15

plan to put 1 point into CHA, the rest into DEX.

Arcane Duelist Feats:
1 Arcane Strike
2 Combat Casting
6 Disruptive
10 Spellbreaker
14 Penetrating Strike
18 Greater Penetrating Strike

feats:
1 Finesse
3 Combat Reflexes
5 Step Up
7 Shield Focus
9 Missile Shield
11 Ray Shield
13 Following Step
15 Lingering Performance
17 Step Up and Strike
19 ??

I was planning on using a short sword and light shield. The short sword for finesse, when grappled, its fairly concealable, and is a common weapon. I felt this things were more important than usual, what with the Arcane Bond the Arcane Duelist has at level 5. Has to be with his weapon, so...

I would use the benefits of Arcane Bond by making the short sword +1 Agile (Dex to damage) ASAP (for half price due to arcane bond). Spell storing after that.

The Light shield is so I could gain the benefits of the various Shield feats, but also so I can hold items if necessary with my off hand, something a heavy shield won't allow.

Any help or critiques would be much appreciated. Thanks!

[kulosle]

Its hard to say what would be the best for this due to the nature of the problem being presented. Since we can't know the party it would be difficult to know what to suggest. As a vague thought that is always good is IC optimization fits into every party.

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

yes, it is problematic, not knowing party composition. However, I am trying to make a character that will be versatile if a part of any party, so please try to look at the build in that light.

A question I thought of last night: would this character be more effective as an archer build? something to consider, I suppose...

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

shameless bump.

Anything guys?

[RndmNumGen]

Since your build doesn't appear to be feat-starved, I would go for an Elf for the racial bonuses(Skill points are moot, since Elves get +2 INT and humans get the extra point, so you'll be on the same level). I don't think melee versus ranged will make much of a difference to you - ideally you will want to be able to do both.

Note that the Step Up And Strike feat requires Following Step as a prerequisite, which you don't have.

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Since your build doesn't appear to be feat-starved, I would go for an Elf for the racial bonuses(Skill points are moot, since Elves get +2 INT and humans get the extra point, so you'll be on the same level). I don't think melee versus ranged will make much of a difference to you - ideally you will want to be able to do both.

Note that the Step Up And Strike feat requires Following Step as a prerequisite, which you don't have.

good catch on the step Up and strike, I will fix that.

As for melee and ranged.. yes. ideally, I would be good at both, but it is generally best to be good at one or the other. I dont have enough feats for a true switch hitter build. Right now, I am very melee oriented. I am wondering if I should swap to a ranged focus... I've heard on other boards it can be very effective with an Arcane Duelist Bard.

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Im finally getting to play this character before I go. The rest of the party consists of a Sorcerer, a Druid, a Fighter, and a Ranger.

SO is this build going to function well enough in such a party?

[Paul H]

Hi

Hyave you looked ad Dervish Dance feat? Req's: Wpn Finesse, NG follower of Sarenrae. Grants bonus damage from Dex not Str.

Need free offhand, but you can take Combat Expertise & Dodge to increase AC.

Human flexibility helps with the stats, but Halflings also fit the role well

And don't forget that PFS chars retire at 12th lvl. (There are higher level scenarios, but you add the chronicle to an 'unretired' character).

Thanks
Paul H

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Hi

Hyave you looked ad Dervish Dance feat? Req's: Wpn Finesse, NG follower of Sarenrae. Grants bonus damage from Dex not Str.

Need free offhand, but you can take Combat Expertise & Dodge to increase AC.

Human flexibility helps with the stats, but Halflings also fit the role well

And don't forget that PFS chars retire at 12th lvl. (There are higher level scenarios, but you add the chronicle to an 'unretired' character).

Thanks
Paul H

I ma well aware of Dervish Dance, and it doesnt actually require the Sarenrae follower bit anymore. Why get use a feat (two, if you include i need to get scimitar proficiency) on something that a +1 enhancement gives me? which I can get for half price? Feats are far more valuable that 4000 gp.

[Paul H]

Hi

Hope you weren't getting the Dervish Dance info from the SRD - it's wrong.
(Though up to your GM if they want to deviate frome the 'official' rukes).

Dervish Dance is in the Qadira handbook.

And it doesn't give you just +1 enhancement - it's a + (dex mod) bonus to damage. (Dex 16 grants +3 damage) in addition to your other bonuses. That's worth at least 18K!

Thanks
Paul H

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Hi

Hope you weren't getting the Dervish Dance info from the SRD - it's wrong.
(Though up to your GM if they want to deviate frome the 'official' rukes).

Dervish Dance is in the Qadira handbook.

And it doesn't give you just +1 enhancement - it's a + (dex mod) bonus to damage. (Dex 16 grants +3 damage) in addition to your other bonuses. That's worth at least 18K!

Thanks
Paul H

my point was that the Agile Weapon property, which gives Dex to damage with any finesse weapon, is a +1 enhancement. Thus, Dervish Dance forces me to use a scimitar, put ranks in Perform:dance, and waste a feat.

agile Weapon Property (from Pathfinder Field Guide) allows Dex to damage if you use finesse with the weapon. With Arcane Bond, (which the arcane Duelist bard gets at level 5) you can enchant your weapon with that for half price. this, a +1 agile weapon property cost 4000 gold in raw materials.

A feat is worth much more than that, not to mention that I would also have to use one of the numerous ways to get proficiency: scimitar. So basically, a waste of two feats, two skill points, for something I can get for 4000 gp.

[Paul H]

Hi

Wasn't aware of the Agile property for weapons.

First off - increasing +1 weapon to +2 weapon costs extra 6,000GP

Second - they'll have to gain access to the abilty first (Prestige awards simplest way).

Third - saving up 6,000gp will take some time

Fourth - many classes gain bonus combat feats, in addition to the extra feats that everyone gets compared to 3.5

In non - PFS games I'd prob agree with you, but in PFS, prob more useful to take the extra feat.

Thanks
Paul H

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Hi

Wasn't aware of the Agile property for weapons.

First off - increasing +1 weapon to +2 weapon costs extra 6,000GP

Second - they'll have to gain access to the abilty first (Prestige awards simplest way).

Third - saving up 6,000gp will take some time

Fourth - many classes gain bonus combat feats, in addition to the extra feats that everyone gets compared to 3.5

In non - PFS games I'd prob agree with you, but in PFS, prob more useful to take the extra feat.

Thanks
Paul H

Once again, arcane bond... The Arcane Duelist gains this ability at level 5. it allows the character to enchant the arcane bond (in this case, a weapon) for HALF price. so, a +2 weapon (normally 8000 gp) would cost 4000 gp total.

Secondly, yes, many classes get bonus feats. If you look at my build, however, you will see my lack of free feats, and that the Bonus Feats I do get are locked into specific feats.

[Duncan_Ruadrik]

Anything peoples? still waiting for someone to tell me if this build is viable or not, if I should switch to ranged or not, or what.

thanks!