Scary Thought: High RHD Lycanthrope Needed for 3.P Gestalt in Epic

[Tokuhara]

Normally, it is frowned upon to have a lot of racial HD and LA, but this is a time where it would benefit me (as scary as that sounds :smalltongue:)

As crazy as the thought sounded above, below should make it make sense (I hope)

Race: Feral Mineral Were-Something Half-Ogre Half-Orc X//Gladiator (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-classes/4-winds-fantasy-gaming/gladiator) 20

What I want is a high HD animal that can make a truly scary gladiator, focused on astronomical strength (I would definately prefer an animal with some serious strength so it befits a Gladiator). He will most likely weild a Gold Minotaur Greathammer (with possible Sizing so it can become appropriately sized) and running around in some sort of gladiator-esq armor.

Any help is great. Thanks y'all

-Copy Poster Toku-

[Flickerdart]

The main limiter here is the size issue, since you can only go up to Huge from a half-ogre. Legendary Tiger has 26HD and 32 STR, but a T-Rex is one size category larger, despite having only 18 HD and 28 STR. Giant Squid (12 HD, 26 STR) and Elephant (11 HD, 30 STR) are also among the beefier things in your range.

[Tokuhara]

The main limiter here is the size issue, since you can only go up to Huge from a half-ogre. Legendary Tiger has 26HD and 32 STR, but a T-Rex is one size category larger, despite having only 18 HD and 28 STR. Giant Squid (12 HD, 26 STR) and Elephant (11 HD, 30 STR) are also among the beefier things in your range.

Elephant ya say... Interesting...

[Lateral]

What's the maximum HD you can go, though? With Feral, Mineral, Half-Ogre (the template version, not the base race, I presume) and your LA from Lycanthrope, your max is 14 hit dice, or 15 if you're doing Afflicted.

[Flickerdart]

The topic says "in epic", so presumably HD is not a problem. Still, as you can see, it's tough to get animals that are merely Huge with very many HD.

[Tokuhara]

What's the maximum HD you can go, though? With Feral, Mineral, Half-Ogre (the template version, not the base race, I presume) and your LA from Lycanthrope, your max is 14 hit dice, or 15 if you're doing Afflicted.

14 RHD. Once again, it sounds crazy, but it could work

[Lateral]

He only has 20 levels of Gladiator, though. Unless the LA is on both sides (and it's indicated that it's on one side of the gestalt), the campaign doesn't start at epic, although it certainly looks slated to go into epic.

That said, if I'm wrong and HD doesn't pose a restriction, there's always the MMIII Battletitan. It has 36 hit dice, though, so I doubt you'll be able to make that one.

Never mind, I'm correct. Hmm...

[Tokuhara]

He only has 20 levels of Gladiator, though. Unless the LA is on both sides (and it's indicated that it's on one side of the gestalt), the campaign doesn't start at epic, although it certainly looks slated to go into epic.

That said, if I'm wrong and HD doesn't pose a restriction, there's always the MMIII Battletitan. It has 36 hit dice, though, so I doubt you'll be able to make that one.

Never mind, I'm correct. Hmm...

It's going to start at "20" and go into epic

[Lateral]

Well, the highest CR creature I could find with 14 or less hit dice is the Forest Sloth from the MMII. It's CR 11, but only large, only 25 STR, 20 DEX, and 21 CON, and the CRs in that book are kind of wonky. It does get Improved Grab, Swallow Whole, and Scent, though.

Alternatively, the Grizzly Mastodon from the same book is CR 13, and it's Huge, it has 35 STR and 25 CON (only 10 DEX, though), and more powerful natural attacks. You'd need to either give up Mineral or Feral or go Afflicted Lycanthrope and pony up the Control Shape ranks to make it.

[Tokuhara]

Well, the highest CR creature I could find with 14 or less hit dice is the Forest Sloth from the MMII. It's CR 11, but only large, only 25 STR, 20 DEX, and 21 CON, and the CRs in that book are kind of wonky. It does get Improved Grab, Swallow Whole, and Scent, though.

Alternatively, the Grizzly Mastodon from the same book is CR 13, and it's Huge, it has 35 STR and 25 CON (only 10 DEX, though), and more powerful natural attacks. You'd need to either give up Mineral or Feral or go Afflicted Lycanthrope and pony up the Control Shape ranks to make it.

So "By the Books," What would a Were-Grizzly Mastadon get?

[Dragonsoul]

Looking Exerco, I wonder..


"When using exerceo, failed Perform checks require an immediate Dexterity check (the DC equals the opponents AC); if that check is failed, the gladiator has accidentally struck his opponent and must roll for damage as usual. If the result of the Dexterity check is a natural 1, the gladiator scores an automatic critical against his opponent."

I can choose to fail these checks right? Meaning I always hit?

[hex0]

So "By the Books," What would a Were-Grizzly Mastadon get?

Srd says: "This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore"

So a Mastodon wouldn't be a proper candidate...

[Lateral]

Srd says: "This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore"

So a Mastodon wouldn't be a proper candidate...

This is true. Okay, then. If you can't do that, certainly don't go Forest Sloth- I don't think they're worth the CR 11, and they aren't really that powerful.

In the Fiend Folio, there are a couple. The Megatherium (13 HD, 8 CR) is Huge, with 27 STR, 13 DEX, and 24 CON, and has Scent, Improved Grab, Trample, and an attack in which it makes a grapple check against an already grappled enemy and 'pins them down' (different from a normal pin), dealing trample damage every round in which it's maintained (including the current one). It's quite obviously an omnivorous giant land sloth, so it qualifies for the template.

The Fhorge (also FF, 12 HD, 9 CR) is only Large, with 29 STR, 10 DEX, and 21 CON, but gets Scent, Ferocity, Improved Grab, an ability which makes it do bite damage every round against a grabbed enemy, and double damage on a charge(!). It's basically an extraplanar dire boar from the Outlands, but it's an Animal (Extraplanar) instead of an Outsider (Extraplanar). Luckily you don't gain the subtype, so you shouldn't need to worry about Dismissal and the like. Those could both potentially be very strong.

[Tokuhara]

Isn't there a Dinosaur that could be dire'd to fit?

[Tokuhara]

The Fhorge (also FF, 12 HD, 9 CR) is only Large, with 29 STR, 10 DEX, and 21 CON, but gets Scent, Ferocity, Improved Grab, an ability which makes it do bite damage every round against a grabbed enemy, and double damage on a charge(!). It's basically an extraplanar dire boar from the Outlands, but it's an Animal (Extraplanar) instead of an Outsider (Extraplanar). Luckily you don't gain the subtype, so you shouldn't need to worry about Dismissal and the like. Those could both potentially be very strong.

Could you Dire it? I realize it is a pseudo-outsider that is the lovechild of a Boar and Balor, but since it's an animal, could it be advanced 2 HD?

[Lateral]

Could you Dire it? I realize it is a pseudo-outsider that is the lovechild of a Boar and Balor, but since it's an animal, could it be advanced 2 HD?

Dire isn't a template, you can't 'dire' something.

[Tokuhara]

Dire isn't a template, you can't 'dire' something.

So I would need 2 more RHD with no more LA. Crap.

I may also swap Gladiator for Armored Hulk Barbarian (Maybe with some Whirling Frenzy? I can't go Spirit Lion I don't think. AFB). If I do that, I may screw the weapon and just find a way to convince the DM to trade my Bite for a Gore.

[Lateral]

You could just advance it two hit dice; actually, although it's large, it becomes Huge if you advance it at all. I'm not sure that your were-animal can be an advanced creature, though, although I don't see anything that says it can't.

[Tokuhara]

You could just advance it two hit dice; actually, although it's large, it becomes Huge if you advance it at all. I'm not sure that your were-animal can be an advanced creature, though, although I don't see anything that says it can't.

So I would be a

Feral Mineral Werefhorge (Advanced) Half-Ogre Half-Orc 20//Gladiator or Spirit Lion (?) Whirling Frenzy Armored Hulk 20?

[Lateral]

So I would be a

Feral Mineral Werefhorge (Advanced) Half-Ogre Half-Orc 20//Gladiator or Spirit Lion (?) Whirling Frenzy Armored Hulk 20?

Yeah, pretty much. You'll be Large in human form, but Huge in the other two, and +18 STR and +10 CON when in nonhuman form. Have fun charging people to death.

Don't take Spirit Lion Totem, you don't need it- you get Pounce from Feral.

[Tokuhara]

Yeah, pretty much. You'll be Large in human form, but Huge in the other two, and +18 STR and +10 CON when in nonhuman form. Have fun charging people to death.

Don't take Spirit Lion Totem, you don't need it- you get Pounce from Feral.

So Whirling Frenzy Armored Hulk > Gladiator?

and don't I ge moar Str & Con from the size increase?

And how would a "Pouncing Bite" precisely work, especially with Shock Trooper and Improved Bull Rush?

[kardar233]

You want to see an rhinophant of pain? Here's an rhinophant of pain.

http://privateerpress.com/files/products/ExtremeTitan.png

Kill people with your spikes of death. I'm sure you'd get huge ticket sales. "Come see the rhino... elephant.... thing of DOOM! Extra spikes!"

[Flickerdart]

I see at least three places where you could add spikes.

[Rubik]

I see at least three places where you could add spikes.I see another.

On the other spikes.

[Tokuhara]

I smell a Homebrew monster...

and can you please spoiler the pic? it's making everything wonky

[Tokuhara]

So, we have determined the beasty himself (Werefhorge [Advanced 2HD to make it Huge-sized]), so I need help with Feats, Possible PrCing, and Possible equipment choices. He'll be Neutral, have a gladiator theme (Won his freedom and began adventuring, but geared himself up with Gladiatorial-style gear) and is probably going to be more/less a Shock Trooper/Dragoon (?)

[Heliomance]

Storm Giant Were-Roc.

You know you want to.

[Flickerdart]

No LA on Storm Giant, unfortunately. Is a Dungeonbred Roc still valid for lycanthropy?

[Urpriest]

Werefhorge...you need to make one of your party members a Warforged. It will be so confusing!

[Lateral]

Werefhorge...you need to make one of your party members a Warforged. It will be so confusing!

Warforged aren't in his game, remember?

That said, yes, you have to make Warforged jokes. (It's too bad you aren't a warforged Werefhorge.)