Make me a master crafter!

[Campbellk8105]

Hello fellow playgrounders. The obvious point of this thread is how and what would you use to make the best crafter?

I had an idea for a character who's a master crafter but not sure how to build him. I had thought of something along the lines of Factotum and possibly Exemplar. All skills as class skills is very handy and is the major push behind me for choosing those. Exemplar is always nice especially with the Persuasive Performance. Just thinking that I can get fanatics by crafting stuff intrigues me.

So anyways, I ask this. What's a good build to go if I wanted a crafter/skill monkey?

All 3.5 books are allowed. Dragon magazine can be used but I'd have to run it by my DM to OK the stuff. Also, a big perk is you can use a free +2 LA. This campaign is also expected to go into Epic. So have fun with it! Be sure to use fluff and please don't overload my cracker with too much cheese. Cheese is good, but I don't want an overload.

Any other ramifications not explained well enough, feel free to ask.

Thanks to all the input in advance.

[missmvicious]

I'm not very good at this, but here's what I do know:

Experts make excellent Crafters
Artificers make excellent Crafters
Wizards make good Crafters (extensive spell list lets them make Magic Items)
Clerics make good Crafters (extensive spell list lets them make Magic Items)

Dwarves make excellent Crafters due to their +2 to Craft with stone or metal
Gnomes make excellent Crafters due to their +2 to Craft: Alchemy
Any race with an INT bonus make good Crafters, since Craft is INT based.

A good Race/Class combo for crafting is:
Dwarven Expert
Gnome Wizard

A skill monkey isn't nearly as important for crafters as far as I can tell. All you'll be doing is putting skill points in Craft, but a superior INT score would help.

With an L1 Gnome, if you put an 18 in INT, and 4 points in the appropriate Craft slot, you get +10 to Craft Alchemy

That gives you a 50% chance of crafting half the Alchemical items list in PHB1 in one week's time, and the possibility of crafting an Acid Flask in 1/2 a week with a Nat 20. That's not terrible for a level 1 crafter.

With an L1 Dwarf, build the same way (but with Craft: Weaponsmithing) and get +10 to Craft: Weaponsmithing and get a 75% chance (or better) of crafting Martial and Simple Weapons (as long as they are made of stone or metal) within a week.

After a few levels you'll be building MW items at a fraction of the price of purchase!

[The-Mage-King]

(+Int Race) (+Int template) Artificer 20.

Done.

(Ab)Use this too (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=6la499hb28mrlc13nnnl6ug894&topic=7274.0).

[Lonely Tylenol]

Magecraft (Eberron Campaign Setting) is good for Sorcerer/Wizard crafters, and anybody who can pull spells directly from the Sorcerer/Wizard book. It's a level 1 spell, and the +5 competence bonus to Craft skills that it provides goes well with the +2 circumstance bonus you get from MW tools. Between this, 18 INT, and 4 ranks in an appropriate craft, you have a net total of +15 to craft as a level 1 Wizard. That increases to +18 if you get Skill Focus (Craft (whatever)). Even without Skill Focus, you're succeeding on Craft Acid checks on a natural 1, and are almost to the point of making Alchemist's Fire, assuming Alchemy (which is the coolest Craft skill on its own); or, you're almost to the point of making Masterwork components on armor. Add racial bonuses, or ranks in future levels, or Skill Focus, or whatever, for added greatness.

[Flickerdart]

Warlock 12/Chameleon 2 lets you make almost any item in the game, since you can pretend to have any spells and swap your floating feat for any crafting feat you want. The actual Craft skill is utterly pointless in most cases and you can ignore it forever.

[JaronK]

Craft is... only slightly useful. There's a nice feat in one of the Dragon Magazines that lets you add mundane options to weapons and armor, and requires a very high craft check... but other than that, spells like Magecraft and Divine Insight are usually enough to pump your craft skill with minimal ranks to the levels you need to make nice items.

For magic item crafting, Artificer is the obvious choice, but as mentioned Warlock 12/Chameleon 2 can make anything. Anima Mages can also make almost anything by binding the vestige that lets them pick a new item creation feat each day.

And don't forget the various item creation cost reduction feats (Legendary Craftsman and such).

JaronK

[Campbellk8105]

Well, the reasoning behind looking into factotum and exemplar is for a few things. Factotum will give me a lot of skill points and all class skills. Exemplar, I'd really like to use the persuasive performance. Also, I had originally thought that the Factotums SLA's could be used for creating magical items, but it'd appear that there are better choices.

Warlock 12/ Chameleon 2 would be a good choice but, I'm playing a Warlock in a campaign now and don't really look forward to playing another one back to back.

Also, just for curiosities sake, in a campaign I'm in currently. One of my friends is playing and a human fighter using a bow and is crafting poison for his arrows. Now, he hasn't said a specific name of poison that he's using, and I'm not sure how he's doing all the crafting he says he is. He said that by raising the Craft DC he is able to create them faster (which I know is possible) and also that by raising them more, he can increase the save DC for the poisons. Now, I've never really used the craft skill or delved into poisons and what not, but it seems kinda sketchy on him doing this. I've pointed this out to the DM in private and that he should ask specifically how he's doing it but he has yet to ask him and I don't feel like pestering him into doing it. That said, the books I believe he is using to do this is the Quintessential Fighter Books and Arms & Equipment Guide.

[Flickerdart]

The Quintessential books are 3rd party, so anything goes there. In WotC's publications, increasing the save DC of poison is remarkably difficult, and you certainly can't do it with skill checks. You also need a source of materials to make poisons (the raw components required for any crafting), which in the case of poison is not always readily available. One can't, after all, make black lotus extract without any black lotus around.

[The Gilded Duke]

One interesting way to go would be to play a Midgard Dwarf from Frostburn page 124

They are basically classic Nordic Dwarves, and exceptional crafters. 8 HD of Outsider, with +4 LA. The outsider bit can be nice, but besides that they are generally underwhelming... except when it comes to crafting.

Midgard Dwarves gain the Master Smith ability. They gain Craft Magic Arms and Armor, Craft Wondrous Item, and Forge Ring as bonus feats. They are considered to have the prerequisites for any items covered by those feats, even if they cannot cast any spells at all.

After the Outsider levels and level adjustment, I'd just go ahead and set them as Warblade or Crusader the rest of the way. Then you can be a full crafter, and a decent initiator.

[Campbellk8105]

I suppose I can look into the quintessential books and see how he might be doing this but it'll have to be tomorrow.

Also, I've been letting it just go but it makes no sense to me on how he is able to craft stuff like he is. When we travel on horseback for 4 days, and the only downtime we have is at night when we sleep, how he manages to fletch arrows and craft bows... On the move... On horseback. Just makes no sense to me. He does not go around gathering supplies to make poisons, simply just, "It'll take me two days to make another dose." Again while on horseback, I'm curious how he makes ale and wine as well. Why the DM let's it go is beyond me. Personally, I wouldn't let that sort of thing fly.

As for the Midgard Dwarves, those sound interesting. I like the crafting ability they get. Making items without the spells and what not, just sounds awesome. Albeit, you can do that with the Warlock/Chameleon, it's still pretty cool.

[Lonely Tylenol]

I suppose I can look into the quintessential books and see how he might be doing this but it'll have to be tomorrow.

Also, I've been letting it just go but it makes no sense to me on how he is able to craft stuff like he is. When we travel on horseback for 4 days, and the only downtime we have is at night when we sleep, how he manages to fletch arrows and craft bows... On the move... On horseback. Just makes no sense to me. He does not go around gathering supplies to make poisons, simply just, "It'll take me two days to make another dose." Again while on horseback, I'm curious how he makes ale and wine as well. Why the DM let's it go is beyond me. Personally, I wouldn't let that sort of thing fly.

As for the Midgard Dwarves, those sound interesting. I like the crafting ability they get. Making items without the spells and what not, just sounds awesome. Albeit, you can do that with the Warlock/Chameleon, it's still pretty cool.

I had a brutally inefficient DM once who made us role play all that mundane "ingredient buying" stuff out. Only, he didn't actually really have us role play it, but he did have us go through the motions. It was all the fun of grocery shopping, and took almost as much time, or longer--one time, between the inefficient DM and my indecisive team, shopping took more than two hours of the session, during which I could do little more than twiddle my thumbs because, even though I'm a Wizard and have to buy spells regularly, I make sure to do it during downtime, or even over text or e-mail.

I'd elaborate (I still might), but my flight is taking off.

[Campbellk8105]

I was talking to one of the other players in my group and he said that there might have been some expanded poisonmaking chart in a dragon magazine he is going off of but, if there is, I can't find it.

[Gavinfoxx]

Here are several relevant links for crafting and such...

http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=4854
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=4400
http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1002
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=12795
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148101
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149464
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187851
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5929
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=11474
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=12661
http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1000