SW Saga Questions

[Alejandro]

Here's hoping a playgrounder can help (or correct) me.

So, talents. The handbook says nothing about talents in the introduction to level dependent benefits. In fact, it never point blank (that I found) explains when you get them. I looked at all five class tables, and saw they all get talents at the same rate (every odd level) and that each talent must be of the class level you take at said odd level.

Then, I looked at Chewbacca's stats in the back of the book, and saw that he is 10th level (2 classes) and has 5 talents, which I assume he took at levels 1, 3, 5, 7, and 9. This is the mechanism I have been using for my now 3rd-level PCs, who have 2 talents each (1st and 3rd level.) Am I doing this right?

Second part: Prestige classes. So, let's say someone has a 7th level character. They've got 4 talents (1, 3, 5, and 7th levels.) For their 8th level, they take a prestige class. The prestige class says that they get to take a prestige class talent at the 1st level of their prestige class. So, does that mean that the PC is getting a talent at both 7th and 8th level, with the 8th level talent being a prestige class talent?

What if the PC then advances to 9th level, and takes another level of their old, regular class, instead of a second level of their new prestige class. Does that mean they now get to take another talent, because they made 9th level, meaning they managed to take 3 new talents in 3 character levels?

[Mando Knight]

You gain talents when the class progression tables tell you to, generally every odd level in the given class.

If you're multiclassing at an even level, say Soldier 7/Elite Trooper 1 or Soldier 1/Scout 1, you still gain a talent, since that's what you get at level 1 for that class. If you then return to Soldier levels, then your Soldier level will be even (8 for the former, 2 for the latter) and you take a bonus feat.

[Alejandro]

Wait, so someone could make a Jedi 1/Soldier 1/Scout 1/Noble 1/Scoundrel 1 and, for all five of those levels, get a talent every time?

[TheCountAlucard]

Wait, so someone could make a Jedi 1/Soldier 1/Scout 1/Noble 1/Scoundrel 1 and, for all five of those levels, get a talent every time?Possibly, but it wouldn't be the wisest idea - it's hard to make so diverse talents synergize.

[Alejandro]

Well, I guess I haven't screwed my players much. For example, one PC is a Scoundrel 2/Scout 1. He took a Scoundrel talent at level 1, and then multiclassed into Scout at level 3 to take a Scout talent (because we thought you got talents at every odd character level, period.) Technically he could have had both of those talents at level 2, by being a Scoundrel 1/Scout 1?

[Philistine]

Yes, and then he wouldn't get one at level 3 - unless he multiclassed again, to something else.

[Alejandro]

My PC was given a gift of a box of glitterstim spice, by a Hutt. I'd really like to sell it (saving up for a ship) but I can't find a value for spice anywhere, not even in Scum and Villainy. It's got to be worth a good amount, seeing as it's so rare and highly illegal to smuggle. Any help?

[Daisuke1133]

This is a situation where you will need to depend on the GM's (or perhaps your own as well) best guess, I'm fairly certain that there are no rules whatsoever regarding the various types of spice. Just keep in mind the rare and highly illegal nature of Glitterstim and you should do relatively alright.

[TheCountAlucard]

My memory's fuzzy (it's been too long since I played this game), but wasn't the price of spice given in the core book, under some examples of expenses? :smallconfused:

[The_Snark]

There are a couple of entries for spice on the Trade Goods table in the core book (p. 118). I have no idea if those prices are supposed to represent glitterstim and other illegal spices—listing it under trade goods makes me think of real-world spices like saffron and cinnamon, whereas "spice" in Star Wars generally means drugs—but it's something.

[Mando Knight]

Spice as a trade good in Star Wars generally means some kind of illicit drug. Given the price for just a kilo of common spice is a thousand credits, they're not talking about cinnamon or paprika, here. Unless you think a kilo of cinnamon is worth about the same as six or seven luxurious meals.

[Daisuke1133]

@Mando: At the same time though, 1 credit for a gram of common or 20 for a gram of the exotic stuff seems a tad low for something that can only be bought and sold on the black market. When I think of trade goods I think of things that can be bought and sold legally with little fuss or muss. And considering none of the other trade goods are anything illegal to buy and sell in mass quantities, I'm not sure your argument bears out.

[The_Snark]

Mando: when I hear the words "spice trade", it generally makes me think of spice trading in colonial-era Europe. Spices were a luxury good and some of them (like saffron) could be pretty exorbitant.

Plus, a kilogram of spice is a lot.

[Mando Knight]

@Mando: At the same time though, 1 credit for a gram of common or 20 for a gram of the exotic stuff seems a tad low for something that can only be bought and sold on the black market.
That's a gram. Do you understand how little that is, and how quickly the cost adds up? There's no way I'm paying the same for one kilo of cinnamon (~$20 in the US) as for several multi-course luxury meals ($100+ in the US). Two grams is the same as a simple meal? That's like saying two grams of the stuff is worth a whole can of soup!

One kilo of exotic spices costs 20000 credits. To quote Skywalker, "Ten thousand? We could almost buy our own ship for that!"

[The_Snark]

Actually, that looks about right. Not for cinnamon, which is pretty inexpensive, but a bit of browsing informs me that a kilogram of saffron (one of the most expensive spices even today) would cost you thousands of dollars, possibly over ten thousand. And if saffron were illegal, I'm sure it would be higher.

[TheCountAlucard]

Oops, pardon my mistake - for some reason, I had saffron confused with poppies. :smallredface:

[Cirrylius]

My advice; don't let the Hutt find out you're selling it. Gangsters can get touchy when they discover you've pawned their generous gift of recreational drugs for a fistful of creds.

[Mando Knight]

Actually, that looks about right. Not for cinnamon, which is pretty inexpensive, but a bit of browsing informs me that a kilogram of saffron (one of the most expensive spices even today) would cost you thousands of dollars, possibly over ten thousand. And if saffron were illegal, I'm sure it would be higher.
Then it's not all that common, now, is it?

[DeadManSleeping]

In Star Wars, "common" spice is equivalent to something like marijuana. Glitterstim is ridiculously rare on top of being highly illegal. Just sayin'.

[The_Snark]

Then it's not all that common, now, is it?

Er, no. I was comparing it to the exotic spice. >$10,000 compared to 20,000 credits, seems approximately equivalent when you consider that one's legal and one isn't.

Of course, I have no idea what the dollars-to-credits exchange rate is, but I'm not going to think about it because I suspect that delving too deeply into Star Wars economics will lead to MADNESS

Just ask your GM if you can get a million space bucks for the glitterstim and call it a day.

[Mando Knight]

Of course, I have no idea what the dollars-to-credits exchange rate is, but I'm not going to think about it because I suspect that delving too deeply into Star Wars economics will lead to MADNESS
Their economy is based around holes. It's why Obi-Wan needed to take Utapau.

[Sith_Happens]

Their economy is based around holes. It's why Obi-Wan needed to take Utapau.

Actually it's based around Muunilinst (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Muunilinst), which is why the Intergalactic Banking Clan can get away with absolutely anything.

[Golkiwu]

First off, let's talk about Star Wars Spice.

There are different types based on where they are mined. The quality of spice is also variant on where it is mined. Ryl Spice is a low quality hallucinogen that is fairly common. Glitterstim, also known as Kessel Spice, has supra almost force like mental effects when used. It is mined on Kessel, a prison planet nestled in between 4 Super-massive black holes. The spice itself is actually an excretion from huge spiders that live in Kessel's crust. Mining it and shipping it is EXTREMELY dangerous. It has to be done in complete darkness, as Glitterstim is photo-reactive. Kessel is also the only known source of Glittertim. A single dose costs 6000-10000 credits depending on the market, but never less than 6000. Not ounces or grams, A SINGLE DOSE.
This is out of the Jedi Academy source-book (WEG D6) which is canon sourced from the Jedi Academy Trilogy books. Canon source means it is official by George Lucas, so it spans any RPG regardless of who is licensed to do so.
It also states that anyone taking Glitterstim is to be considered Force Sensitive for 10 rounds, as if having the Receptive Telepathy power (not sure of the equivalent in Saga). Now I admit that I am unsure of how that plays out in Saga, but it is a pretty heavy effect regardless of game system.
Other varieties of Spice are similar only to themselves. If you have been given some Glittertim, I would ask how many DOSES you were given, and then recommend finding a VERY rich client who can afford to buy it. I am pretty sure any Hutt that would gift this too you, is not expecting you to do anything but sell it. You having a couple of doses is not going to undermine his profits.
:smallbiggrin:

[MeeposFire]

But how much is a "dose"?

[Golkiwu]

But how much is a "dose"?

In the books it is described as a vial. something the size of a magic marker in size. Since the Glitterstim must e kept away from light, it is kept in a light proof tube. I t is something like a thick strand of yarn, 3-6 inches in length. So that is a dose, and a dose sells for 6000-10000 credits.

[Mando Knight]

So, probably something in the range of 20-50 grams, I'd guess. Given that glitterstim is one of the rarest of the spices, it kinda makes sense that it's more expensive than "normal" exotic spice.

[Alejandro]

Well, this Hutt gave me the gift after I saved him from death, or at the least, being heavily cheated out of his money. (I perceived someone doctoring a goblet full of something that was to be given to the Hutt to drink, and I quick drew and shot the goblet before the serving droid could hand it to him.)

Analysis of the spilled liquid revealed a neurotoxin of some kind that had a low to fair chance of eventually killing the Hutt, and a much higher chance of causing the Hutt to make extremely poor decisions leading to nasty fraud of his money. (And yes, I know Hutts are poison resistant, this was a nasty, nasty toxin.)

The gift was a closed, wrapped box. I looked inside, and the GM said "It's a box of spice." I asked if the spice was inside little sealed tubes, and the GM said yes.

I will check with the GM to be sure that is what he meant, however, since he was not aware of spice's light reactive properties until I explained such.

[Golkiwu]

Just to be thorough,the light sensitivity is only related to Glitterstim spice from Kessel.

[Sith_Happens]

Well, this Hutt gave me the gift after I saved him from death, or at the least, being heavily cheated out of his money. (I perceived someone doctoring a goblet full of something that was to be given to the Hutt to drink, and I quick drew and shot the goblet before the serving droid could hand it to him.)

Analysis of the spilled liquid revealed a neurotoxin of some kind that had a low to fair chance of eventually killing the Hutt, and a much higher chance of causing the Hutt to make extremely poor decisions leading to nasty fraud of his money. (And yes, I know Hutts are poison resistant, this was a nasty, nasty toxin.)

The gift was a closed, wrapped box. I looked inside, and the GM said "It's a box of spice." I asked if the spice was inside little sealed tubes, and the GM said yes.

I will check with the GM to be sure that is what he meant, however, since he was not aware of spice's light reactive properties until I explained such.

Well, it sounds like each of the "little sealed tubes" is probably a dose, so count them up and start planning your retirement.:smallwink:

[Golkiwu]

I would seriously consider verifying with your Hutt, what variety of spice it really is. If it is truly Glitterstim, then selling it without going to Kessel as n Imperial Prisoner is going to be a challenge. With that said, I am unsure as to the era in which your game is set. If it is the classic era, then what I stated will be true, as the only way for a Hutt to have gotten Glitterstim is to have illegally procured it from Kessel, which is controlled by the Empire. If it is New Republic era, then you have a much better chance of having other "Scum and Villainy" attempt to thwart you. Unless you have connections to those that can offload that type of contraband, you will most likely not get full value, as I am sure the 6000-10000 cr price is end user cost, not dealer.

If it is any other type, it will be worth a whole lot less. I will see if I can find going rates and types of other Spice and post it for you.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Spice

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Control the universe, obviously.

[hamishspence]

I think the A. C. Crispin's Han Solo Trilogy (Rebel Dawn) says how much the spice was worth- something like 14000-odd credits. With the 15% extra Jabba's charging Han (for giving him the extra time) that fits in with the 17 thousand he's supposed to be getting off Ben & Luke.

Even at 20 credits a gram (if the base price off Doole was that low) we're looking at less than a kilo.

[LibraryOgre]

I think the A. C. Crispin's Han Solo Trilogy (Rebel Dawn) says how much the spice was worth- something like 14000-odd credits. With the 15% extra Jabba's charging Han (for giving him the extra time) that fits in with the 17 thousand he's supposed to be getting off Ben & Luke.

Even at 20 credits a gram (if the base price off Doole was that low) we're looking at less than a kilo.

On the other hand, if you're looking at less than a kilo, the Falcon is a good way to smuggle it. It doesn't even have the hold of the Ebon Hawk (that we've seen).

[Mando Knight]

On the other hand, if you're looking at less than a kilo, the Falcon is a good way to smuggle it. It doesn't even have the hold of the Ebon Hawk (that we've seen).

We see mostly the passenger quarters, though, and the ship has fairly sizable smuggler compartments (can hold the whole party, even the Wookiee!). If you look at the deck plan for the YT-1300's (Millennium Falcon's frame) stock freight configuration, what we see in the movie besides the cockpit, corridors, and engineering are what's probably the main hold converted into passenger space. The remaining three cargo holds are each slightly smaller than the Dynamic class's (that is, the Ebon Hawk) garage (and its cargo hold is slightly smaller than that). In the end, the Dynamic class has only 60% the cargo space of the YT-1300.

[IdleMuse]

This is the thing; you generally end up having to take the bonus-feat levels anyway, except when dipping. But Saga is very multiclass-friendly anyway, most characters should aim for a PrC at level 8, meaning 7 levels of base classes, which should USUALLY involve three base classes; I'm a large fan of the 3/3/1 multiclass split in base classes, just to get the extra (usually more powerful) talents. For example, I think Soldier 3/Scoundrel 1/Noble 3 is a pretty sweet progression pre-PrC.

The only times you don't really want to do this in your first 7 levels are if you want to maintain full BAB for qualifying (in which case you're probably looking at Jedi 7, or Jedi 6/Soldier 1, or rarely Jedi 4/Soldier 3, or obviously Soldier 7 for non-jedi). But generally, this isn't a problem, as Jedi builds (especially two-weapon melee based) are feat-starved as it is.

[Alejandro]

I asked the GM. He told me that he meant for the spice to be worth about 20,000 credits, and that I can sell it as long as I find the right buyer. I plan on selling it to some other criminal element.

The GM meant for me to combine this 20K value with the 10K in cash I have already, and then I will have enough money to get a ship of my own, which our group needs.

[Alejandro]

I apologize for so many threads, but there isn't a Q&A for this forum I am aware of.

So, I'm going to be getting a light freighter. It comes with one weapon, fired by a gunner. How do I go about wiring/setting up the ship so the pilot can fire the weapon from his station if he wants to? I looked in the main book, Scum and Villainy, and Starships of the Galaxy, and I can't seem to find any information on this, when I expected it to be common. Am I missing something obvious?

[LibraryOgre]

Simple answer? I'd say some difficult Starship Repair checks. If you're using d6, stuff like that is near the Technical skills; I don't know with d20 variants, but I'd give the DM a skill and a suggested difficulty, and let him argue about it.

[Mando Knight]

So, I'm going to be getting a light freighter. It comes with one weapon, fired by a gunner. How do I go about wiring/setting up the ship so the pilot can fire the weapon from his station if he wants to? I looked in the main book, Scum and Villainy, and Starships of the Galaxy, and I can't seem to find any information on this, when I expected it to be common. Am I missing something obvious?

Eh, it's a Mechanics check. Since you're not actually replacing anything, it should just be the base DC 20 check (SotG page 40) if you take a decent amount of time with the rewiring... probably a day's worth of work. There's a lot of wiring and such going on in there, so it's not like getting your oil changed, but the systems are already mostly in place, so you shouldn't need to take the entire installation time.

Now, to set it up for a master override, to switch it between pilot and gunner control relatively freely? I'd probably say that comes free if you installed any slave circuitry at most, and possibly otherwise allow you to fire one weapon (including fire-linked or quad guns, but not batteries) not marked (pilot) if the seat isn't taken (since many small ships can have one character function in multiple roles simultaneously), but in that case I wouldn't give you the free +2 to attack that trained pilots get with pilot weapons.

[Alejandro]

Okay. I remember that it was a possible and fairly common thing done in Star Wars D6, but could not find any mention of it in Saga.

I was unaware pilots get a special bonus to fire pilot weapons. Do you mean the bonus anyone gets, from the ship's Intelligence?

[Mando Knight]

I was unaware pilots get a special bonus to fire pilot weapons. Do you mean the bonus anyone gets, from the ship's Intelligence?

No. I mean the bonus mentioned at the top of page 171 in the core book.

[Alejandro]

Well, I'll be durned. Thank you, sir.

Why in the world wouldn't they include that in the description of the Pilot skill, under Skills? I love Saga but the book layouts sometimes leave much to be desired.

[The Glyphstone]

The Saga book layouts are some of the worst I've ever seen.

[IdleMuse]

The Saga book layouts are some of the worst I've ever seen.

I think the D&D3.5 DMG is more of a maze, but I'll agree with the general sentiment :D

[Vknight]

I think the D&D3.5 DMG is more of a maze, but I'll agree with the general sentiment :D

I second the DMG
And I think Saga has problems but its not the worst I've seen.

[Squark]

I apologize for so many threads, but there isn't a Q&A for this forum I am aware of.

So, I'm going to be getting a light freighter. It comes with one weapon, fired by a gunner. How do I go about wiring/setting up the ship so the pilot can fire the weapon from his station if he wants to? I looked in the main book, Scum and Villainy, and Starships of the Galaxy, and I can't seem to find any information on this, when I expected it to be common. Am I missing something obvious?

Hmm... Frankly, I'd leave it in the hands of the gunner, wait a level or two, then buy a second gun for you to fire yourself. What model are you looking at, by the way?