Does Knowledge Devotion Work on Your Own Species?

[Palanan]

Say I have a human rogue 2 who's maxed out Knowledge(local). Say he dips ranger at level 3 and picks up Favored Enemy(human).

For his third-level feat, can he take Knowledge Devotion, and then key off his Knowledge(local) to get the Knowledge Devotion benefit against humans? Would (local) be the appropriate field of Knowledge, or would it be (geography), or something else?

[motoko's ghost]

I say local, because its is roughly similar to the ones you get from that, and you cant take know(anatomy)(The human's weakest point is located directly between the legs:smalltongue:)

[gkathellar]

You can use Knowledge Devotion against anything. And, since the SRD says (local) is the Knowledge pertaining to humanoids, yes, you would use Knowledge (local). Favored Enemy doesn't play into it.

In general, feats do exactly what their text says they do, and will spell out any arbitrary limitations in said text.

[motoko's ghost]

Thank you, thats probably a better explanation than what I had

[Palanan]

Well, the comments from Motoko's Ghost had me wincing in sudden sympathy. :smallbiggrin:

I mentioned the ranger dip because my next question would be whether the damage bonus from Knowledge Devotion would stack with Favored Enemy. I would think they would (insight bonus + untyped), and probably KD would beat FE by a mile, but figured I should ask.

[motoko's ghost]

Well, the comments from Motoko's Ghost had me wincing in sudden sympathy. :smallbiggrin:


Whelp my work here is done:smallbiggrin:
Also how did you think stunning fist attacks worked?

[erikun]

If one is untyped and neither say they don't stack with each other, then both will apply.

[gkathellar]

IIRC they don't apply to the same things anyway. FE is damage and KD is attack.

[Palanan]

The feat description says the insight bonus applies to both attack and damage rolls.



...and, another question on KD. Does Collector of Stories work in conjunction with Knowledge Devotion?

[FMArthur]

The feat description says the insight bonus applies to both attack and damage rolls.



...and, another question on KD. Does Collector of Stories work in conjunction with Knowledge Devotion?

It might. Ask your DM. It makes sense for it to. So much sense that people just put it in KD builds as standard. But the by-the-rules answer is actually no because it's just for identifying the creature and KD isn't technically identifying the creature, just for knowing their weaknesses. It's sort of a ridiculous distinction, isn't it?

edit: Anyway KD and FE stack perfectly fine. You can also combine them with the Bane and Hunting weapon properties to build a profoundly racist character who is mediocre at fighting normal foes but suddenly goes into super murder mode against certain critters. :smallbiggrin:

[Palanan]

I agree. I'm the DM, and I approve this message.

:smallbiggrin:



Edit: Also, looking at Collector of Stories, it does mention Knowledge checks meant to learn a creature's vulnerabilities, which seems like a sensible correspondence with KD.

And where is the Hunting property from? Might be above this character (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226096)'s WBL for the moment, but something to think about.

[Coidzor]

Hmm, I don' think I've ever come across this Hunting Property either. I am now curious myself...

[FMArthur]

It's in the MIC. Just adds 4 to your Favored Enemy damage for a +1 enhancement. Not amazing but better returns than others against those particular foes. Obviously Bane is better when you only pick one Favored Enemy.

[Palanan]

That could be quite, quite useful for what I have in mind. Very much appreciated.

[FMArthur]

You mean useful for an NPC and useless as loot? :smallbiggrin:

[Elric VIII]

It might. Ask your DM. It makes sense for it to. So much sense that people just put it in KD builds as standard. But the by-the-rules answer is actually no because it's just for identifying the creature and KD isn't technically identifying the creature, just for knowing their weaknesses. It's sort of a ridiculous distinction, isn't it?

Actually, Collector of Stories says: "When you attempt a trained Knowledge check to identify a creature or to learn its special powers or vulnerabilities..."

Those that I see saying it doesn't works usually just say it doesn't work becausde it's "too powerful" or not "how it's supposed to work."

I could be wrong, but the two seem to use synonymous language, if not exactly the same language.

[Palanan]

Heh. Something like that. :smalltongue:

[FMArthur]

Actually, Collector of Stories says: "When you attempt a trained Knowledge check to identify a creature or to learn its special powers or vulnerabilities..."

Those that I see saying it doesn't works usually just say it doesn't work becausde it's "too powerful" or not "how it's supposed to work."

I could be wrong, but the two seem to use synonymous language, if not exactly the same language.

All right, I got it already. Palanan pointed out this earlier. My memory of the skill trick just turned out to be faulty. My scanner's broken so my written and signed apology letter will have to wait for a couple of days to get up in this thread, just give it some time.

[Elric VIII]

All right, I got it already. Palanan pointed out this earlier. My memory of the skill trick just turned out to be faulty. My scanner's broken so my written and signed apology letter will have to wait for a couple of days to get up in this thread, just give it some time.

Huh, completely missed that edit.

Although I eaerly await the letter. I hope it lives up to the hype.:smallbiggrin:

[Palanan]

Also, just to clarify, my last post ("something like that") was a response to FMArthur's comment about NPCs and loot, rather than part of the discussion of skill tricks. I was ninja'ed by Elric and didn't even realize it, which put my comment out of phase. Hope the displaced comment wasn't taken amiss. :smalleek: