Sacred Fist build without Ur-Priest

[Master Thrower]

Hello playground, i'm starting a basic 10th level campaign, playing as as the divine caster, and I'd like to go with sacred fist for the flavor, and decent abilities it gets. My DM rules text over table, so it is full casting.

Also on a 32 point buy how should I get my stats to be?


Build-
Human
Monk 1 Cleric 5 Sacred Fist X
1- Combat Casting, IUS,Stunning Fist, Combat Reflexes

Past this I have no clue what feats to take.

Books- PHB,MM,DMG, CadV,CD,CA,CW,DrC,PlH,LM

Any advice would be great, including feats, spells to use, and other ideas

[DonutBoy12321]

I suggest Cloistered Cleric if possible.

[Waker]

Well, first off you'll have to take another level of either Cleric or Monk to meet the BAB requirements for Sacred Fist. Five levels of Cleric net you +3 BAB while the one in Monk give you +0, unless you are using the stacking fractional BAB.
Anyways, for feats you have a few choices. Many people will go with Divine Metamagic, Improved Turning and Persist Spell.
I'm drawing a blank on other feats aside from basic stuff like Improved Initiative.

[Master Thrower]

Well, first off you'll have to take another level of either Cleric or Monk to meet the BAB requirements for Sacred Fist. Five levels of Cleric net you +3 BAB while the one in Monk give you +0, unless you are using the stacking fractional BAB.
Anyways, for feats you have a few choices. Many people will go with Divine Metamagic, Improved Turning and Persist Spell.
I'm drawing a blank on other feats aside from basic stuff like Improved Initiative.

Sorry totally forgot we do use Fractional BAB, I forgot it wasn't in the rules we've used it for so long.

[Master Thrower]

I suggest Cloistered Cleric if possible.

Also why cloistered cleric? What does it add, as i'd like to be in melee atleast a bit...

[Waker]

I wouldn't recommend Cloistered Cleric for this build. You gain an extra domain, Lore, skill points and a few extra spells, but it hurts your HD and BAB, which would delay gaining the PrC.

[Psyren]

I wouldn't recommend Cloistered Cleric for this build. You gain an extra domain, Lore, skill points and a few extra spells, but it hurts your HD and BAB, which would delay gaining the PrC.

Agreed; let someone else be the skillmonkey, a Sacred Fist's job is to smash face (in the name of the gods.)

[Master Thrower]

Also forgot to ask, what domains helps me with this character

[Snowbluff]

Also forgot to ask, what domains helps me with this character

If you want DMM Persist, the Planning domain gives Extend Spell.

[Darrin]

1- Combat Casting, IUS,Stunning Fist, Combat Reflexes

Past this I have no clue what feats to take.

Books- PHB,MM,DMG, CadV,CD,CA,CW,DrC,PlH,LM


No ToB, eh? That rules out Superior Unarmed Strike and Snap Kick. Improved Natural Attack and Ability Focus (MM) are still available.

Hmm. Planar Touchstone -> Oxyrhynchus might work. This gives you an extra attack whenever your opponent is denied his Dex bonus. Do you have access to Frostburn (for the ice slick spell) or Exemplars of Evil (for the Invisible Fist ACF)? Otherwise... Slime domain gets you grease, but that's not in your sources, either. Trickery domain has invisiblity and mislead.

Does LM = Libris Mortis or Lords of Madness? If it's Libris Mortis, you could try doing something with Stunning Fist:

Freezing the Lifeblood (Complete Warrior) turns your Stunning Fist attack into a paralysis attack.

Ability Focus (Monster Manual) increases the save DC by 2.

Contagious Paralysis (Libris Mortis) causes anyone else touching your paralyzed opponent to save vs. paralysis.

...which could be a good combo for bull rushing, but you don't have access to Knock-Back. A dip into Hulking Hurler might work (stun opponent, grapple, lift them over your head, then throw them at another opponent), but you'd have to be large-sized or ask your DM if Powerful Build counts.


Also forgot to ask, what domains helps me with this character

Strength domain gives you access to enlarge person, and increasing your size is one of the best ways to improve an unarmed/grapple-based build.

If you're going to focus on grappling, Competition domain gives you a +1 bonus on all opposed checks.

[gkathellar]

I recommend Monk 1/Cloistered Cleric 9/Sacred Fist 10.

If you want more SAD, have some feats to spare, and Serenity is allowed: Monk 1/Cloistered Cleric 6/Prestige Paladin 2/Shiba Disciple 1/Sacred Fist 10 can be very nice.

In either case, sub Cleric levels out with full-casting PrCs as desired.


I wouldn't recommend Cloistered Cleric for this build. You gain an extra domain, Lore, skill points and a few extra spells, but it hurts your HD and BAB, which would delay gaining the PrC.

HD matters less and less as you level up, and BAB is irrelevant once Divine Power and the Cleric's mass-buffing comes in — not that it matters much in the first place, since you generally take as few levels of the actual cleric class as possible. Which means that by 10th level, seriously who cares. Knowledge Domain is worth it.

[nedz]

I'm curious why no Monk 2 ?
I know Thou shalt not sacrifice caster level, but you've already broken that rule. Evasion+Bonus Feat+... is quite useful.

[gkathellar]

I'm curious why no Monk 2 ?
I know Thou shalt not sacrifice caster level, but you've already broken that rule. Evasion+Bonus Feat+... is quite useful.

Because in the first build we're trying to minimize loss of caster level, and in the second one (which is arguably weaker, but more SAD) we're at least trying to preserve access to 9th-level spells.

Just for anyone who hasn't noticed: Sacred Fist's text says it doesn't lose any casting, and text trumps table, so yeah.

[Master Thrower]

Ok i've got a little more fleshed out a build,
Im taking the Dragon Domain (For greater magic fang), and then I believe the strength domain for the decent combat spells,

I will be using Dragonborn, (despite it not on the allowed books, I wanted a dragon theme, and my DM suggested it.

Still dont know how to set my stats up

[gkathellar]

Wis > Con > Str > Dex > Cha > Int should work. With Shiba Disciple and/or Intuitive attack, you can shift Strength to a lower priority.

[Randomguy]

You don't really need greater magic fang when you've got greater magic weapon.

I also recommend taking a second level in monk, for evasion and that bonus feat. You won't regret it when you're hit by a fireball or an entangling breath affect.

See if you can get the draconscale husk ACF. It basically lets you grow your own armour, and it doesn't count as armour for the purposes of your monk abilities. It does have an armour class penalty, though, and a max dex bonus, but it means you don't need as much dex. The downside is that it's in dragon magic, which isn't allowed, but ask your DM.

I would say make wisdom your highest stat, since it's more useful to you than the average cleric. (It goes to spells, AC and stunning fist DC.) This should be followed by strength, with at least 14 con and 10 or more dex. Put the remainder on dex (at most 14 if you've got the dragonscale husk) and con. This is only if you aren't taking the DMM persist rout, in which case you'd need a high charisma and much lower strength, since your strength buffs would last all day.

See if there's a way to get natural weapons, since you can make attack with those as well as unarmed strikes. Most notably, you can fight with unarmed strikes and claws while most melee characters can't.

[Master Thrower]

You don't really need greater magic fang when you've got greater magic weapon.

I also recommend taking a second level in monk, for evasion and that bonus feat. You won't regret it when you're hit by a fireball or an entangling breath affect.

See if you can get the draconscale husk ACF. It basically lets you grow your own armour, and it doesn't count as armour for the purposes of your monk abilities. It does have an armour class penalty, though, and a max dex bonus, but it means you don't need as much dex. The downside is that it's in dragon magic, which isn't allowed, but ask your DM.

I would say make wisdom your highest stat, since it's more useful to you than the average cleric. (It goes to spells, AC and stunning fist DC.) This should be followed by strength, with at least 14 con and 10 or more dex. Put the remainder on dex (at most 14 if you've got the dragonscale husk) and con. This is only if you aren't taking the DMM persist rout, in which case you'd need a high charisma and much lower strength, since your strength buffs would last all day.

See if there's a way to get natural weapons, since you can make attack with those as well as unarmed strikes. Most notably, you can fight with unarmed strikes and claws while most melee characters can't.

evasions good and all but I really like to not lose a second caster level. And for why I want greater magic fang is so I can use a rod of lesser extend on it coupled with divine spell power to get atleast a +3 to my fists all day. (also my DM lets a enchant handwraps)

[gkathellar]

You can do that with GMW. A monk's unarmed strikes count as both manufactured and natural for most purposes.

[Master Thrower]

You can do that with GMW. A monk's unarmed strikes count as both manufactured and natural for most purposes.

except its a 4th level spell for clerics, and is not legal for a rod of lesser extend

[whiplashomega]

For the record, from Dragon Magic, Dragonscale Husk ACF:
Your dragonscale husk is treated as medium armor for the purpose of determining your speed and whether you can use class features or other special abilities.

This means you would lose a few things from your monk abilities if you used it, such as speed bonus, flurry of blows, and AC bonus, which if you have a lot of wisdom(like if you are primarily a cleric) makes it much less worth it. You also lose the AC bonus from sacred fist. What it does NOT have is an arcane spell failure chance, whether from an oversight by the creators(I have not checked the errata) or by design, that makes it much more useful for theurges.

[nedz]

Wow, this is one Epic Threadnecromancer you have going on here.