How to steal a door.

[GnomeGninjas]

In a campaign that I'm in the party has come across a adamantine door. Our rogue can't pick the lock and that wouldn't help much because we couldn't take the door. The wizard is 3rd level and has banned, enchantment and necromancy. The fighter is able to overcome it's hardness but breaking it would take forever and the dm might rule that the adamantine wouldn't sell for so much with it in small shavings. The campaign is pretty much core only. Are their any spells/items/ideas that would help us steal the door. Also how much do you think it would sell for.

[Tar Palantir]

The old standby is just have the fighter break the wall around the door.

[Arrghus]

Obvious question: What are the walls made of?

[Lateral]

If the hinges are on your side, break them and take the door- breaking the hinges alone, even if they're also adamantine, shouldn't take as long and won't damage the bulk of the door- the value isn't because it's a door, it's because it's a huge chunk of adamantine.

If they aren't, have the wizard cast knock, go through, and break the hinges.

There is always breaking the wall around it, but that takes forever.

[Madara]

Break the hinges? Have your wizard cast Shatter? Besides, as long as you collect the whole door, it doesn't matter if it's in pieces. You can pay someone to melt it down and forge adamant armor for the fighter.

[Venger]

if there are bad guys on the other side, invest in a silent portal disk so the door makes no noise when you're filing/melting/etc the hinges off.

unscrew the screws in the hinges and the door will fall off. since you appear to be 3rd level, an acid splash/lesser orb of acid on the wall surrounding the door (as when bypassing a super door IRL) will be just fine with enough time.

[GnomeGninjas]

Thanks for the replies, knock sounds like a good spell to get. Also if they spent so much money on a door then the treasure it is guarding must be even more ridiculous:smallamused:.

[LansXero]

Thanks for the replies, knock sounds like a good spell to get. Also if they spent so much money on a door then the treasure it is guarding must be even more ridiculous:smallamused:.

Once a DM friend of mine put the treasure inside the door. Which got melted. People werent happy.

There is a very useful item in the Arms & Equipment guide, Stonebreaker Acid, but no idea whats there available in core-only :(

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Shrink Item (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shrinkItem.htm), you can put it in your pocket and carry it away completely intact to sell later.

[dextercorvia]

With Psionics, you can Time Hop the door and then break the hinges/frame while you wait to catch up with it.

[Lateral]

Shrink Item (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shrinkItem.htm), you can put it in your pocket and carry it away completely intact to sell later.
Good luck preparing that at 3rd level, though.

[dextercorvia]

Good luck preparing that at 3rd level, though.

A scroll would not be out of reach, and a decent utility spell to have on one.

[Ksheep]

Remove the pins from the hinges.
Break the wall where the hinges are attached.
Use a crowbar to pry it off it's frame.
Melt the hinge off.
If the wall is stone, cast Transmute Rock to Mud.
If the wall is wood, break it or cast Warp Wood.
If the wall is metal, cast Transmute Metal to Wood, then see what to do with wood above.

The thing to remember is that the hinge is typically the weakest part of the door. Even if there's an epic adamantine lock on a warded adamantine door, it's still typically attached to the wall with a couple thin pieces of metal. The wall will oftentimes be second easiest to get through.

[Anxe]

Why did your DM place an Adamantine door at 3rd level?

[Ksheep]

Why did your DM place an Adamantine door at 3rd level?

That brings up a good question. Are you sure it's Adamantine, or did someone botch an appraise check to see what it is, and it's actually a normal iron door?

[GnomeGninjas]

I think he placed it because he didn't think we could get past it or sell it. We had to much wealth by level and I think his idea to fix it was to make it so we can't get to the treasure room. I don't remember how we know it is adamantine. Maybe someone did just botch an appraise check though.

[Demonic_Spoon]

If he didn't want you to get to the treasure room he should just have used a living vault or what have you. A adamantine door is treasure.

[FMArthur]

This is actually quite hilarious and a pretty understandable DM mistake. I love that adventurers steal doors if they think they're valuable.

[Tvtyrant]

The cool part about all of this is you could simply tell the DM that you are marking the location on a map and come back in a few levels with a scroll of Stone to Mud. Now the door simply slides out of the wall and you can skip merrily away.

[GnomeGninjas]

The cool part about all of this is you could simply tell the DM that you are marking the location on a map and come back in a few levels with a scroll of Stone to Mud. Now the door simply slides out of the wall and you can skip merrily away.

If knock/breaking the hinges doesn't work I think we'll try that. If it turns out its just a steel door then we will have wasted a scroll.:smallannoyed:

[Lycar]

If he didn't want you to get to the treasure room he should just have used a living vault or what have you. A adamantine door is treasure.

I think I read about that happening in a tournament game once. Victory would be awarded to the group that managed to liberate the most loot from a dungeon in the least amount of time.

Cue in the adamantine door to the dungeon... which the winning party simply purloined and went (back) to town with. Instant win.

[ericgrau]

Thanks for the replies, knock sounds like a good spell to get. Also if they spent so much money on a door then the treasure it is guarding must be even more ridiculous:smallamused:.

Why did your DM place an Adamantine door at 3rd level?
Yes, having tough walls around the door and a treasure more valuable than the door inside the room would be logical. But mistaken DMs do stuff like this when they want to railroad the PCs away from some room even though it contains things suitable for someone near your level. Steal the door then say "Bad, bad DM, no more railroading!" Then agree that the door never really existed instead of selling it for millions.

[Medic!]

Real treasure hoardes are guarded by nanomachines that generate prismatic walls at will

[Gavinfoxx]

Remember, Mithral is 500 gp/pound, and Adamantine is more valuable than Mithral... and it is as heavy as iron. You should be able to figure out the weight of a pure adamantine door by figuring out it's dimensions.

D&D reinforced doors are 2 inches thick. Standard doors are 36" by 80" on the other dimensions; this might be larger if it is particularly large one (get size). For Cast Iron, that's ~1488 lbs, for Steel, that's 1633 lbs. Let's say that one pound of adamantine is worth 600 gold, about the most conservative amount you will find. The SRD places adamantine light armor at 5x mithral, medium at 2.5x mithral, heavy at 1.66x mithral, shield at 2x mithral... so it could maybe be 750 gp / lb, perhaps, logically. Still, worst case scenario, is 1488 * 600 = 892,000 gp. A better scenario is a bigger, more impressive vault door, oh 2 inches by 40 by 90, at the steel weight, so 2042 lbs, at the 2x mithral price, so 1000 gp per pound... which got you a door worth two million gold... which is a LOT of sets of adamantine full plate (the metal in full plate is thin!)

Also, remember the following spells:

Metal Melt, from Spell Compendium (works on small amounts of metal like hinges or a lock), and Shape Metal, from Races of Faerun.

Good luck!

[Crasical]

No druid in the party?

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/softenEarthAndStone.htm

EDIT: Before you say 'That spell doesn't effect worked stone!', the original post didn't specify where the door was. Alternatively, take 10 minutes clearing the tiles or whatnot off the floor and then use the spell to dig a trench under it.

[hex0]

This is actually quite hilarious and a pretty understandable DM mistake. I love that adventurers steal doors if they think they're valuable.

I had a rather goofy character (a 3.0 Egoist) who wanted to take the massive tapestries from the BBEG castle-thingy. The Wizard was like, "Who the hell is going to buy these in town!? They are covered in people being sacrificed to demons!?".

My character replied, "What!? They can just flip them over and use them as a floor rug! No one will notice!"

[Yahzi]

This was a test in the original "Tomb of Horrors." The PCs encountered a 10x10x10 adamantine door, which was worth roughly 1 billion gold. The stupid PCs, the ones who failed the test, figured out you had to put a sword through each of the 3 slots on the door to open it.

The smart PCs got out pickaxes to destroy the walls around the door, free the door, and tunnel their way to the surface. Magic would make this easier, but even without magic, 1 billion gold is about 30x the rest of the treasure in the entire dungeon.

If you are facing an adamantine door, you don't care what is behind it. You just want the door.

[Gavinfoxx]

Ten feet THICK door?

[Curmudgeon]

Adamantine isn't particularly valuable as a material; it's mostly the cost of fabricating things out of such a hard material that makes those items expensive. Unless you can find someone who wants an adamantine door in exactly that size, I don't think stealing it will be worth the effort.

[Coidzor]

IIRC, there is a way to, between discs of silent portal and another item that specifically animates doors, make door ninjas.


This is actually quite hilarious and a pretty understandable DM mistake. I love that adventurers steal doors if they think they're valuable.

Well, yeah, if you're serious about looting, you're taking the gem-encrusted golden doors of the treasure hoard too.

[RedWarrior0]

Of course, the old standby is that it's a perfectly ordinary door that happens to have illusions over it, making it just look adamantine

[Taelas]

Adamantine isn't particularly valuable as a material; it's mostly the cost of fabricating things out of such a hard material that makes those items expensive. Unless you can find someone who wants an adamantine door in exactly that size, I don't think stealing it will be worth the effort.

Uh, what? :smallconfused:


Adamantine is so costly that weapons and armor made from it are always of masterwork quality

I don't see what you're saying at all. Adamantine is expensive in and of itself.

[Curmudgeon]

I don't see what you're saying at all. Adamantine is expensive in and of itself.
Adamantine is costly to work with more than it's valuable for itself.

[Taelas]

Adamantine is costly to work with more than it's valuable for itself.

It seems to me you're pulling this out of thin air. Adamantine is an expensive material, and there is nothing at all about it being expensive to work with.

[Curmudgeon]

It seems to me you're pulling this out of thin air. Adamantine is an expensive material, and there is nothing at all about it being expensive to work with.
The cost for making an weapon from adamantine is +3,000 gp regardless of the size (i.e., the amount of adamantine used) in the weapon. (That's from the rules, not from thin air.) Adamantine ice pick or adamantine greatsword ─ it doesn't matter.

[Taelas]

The cost for making an weapon from adamantine is +3,000 gp regardless of the size (i.e., the amount of adamantine used) in the weapon. (That's from the rules, not from thin air.) Adamantine ice pick or adamantine greatsword ─ it doesn't matter.

This does not mean the material is more expensive to work with than it is worth, as you imply. It is a simplification for game mechanic purposes.

[twas_Brillig]

This does not mean the material is more expensive to work with than it is worth, as you imply. It is a simplification for game mechanic purposes.

On the other hand, provided you can be consistent with this, it would be a more-or-less reasonable house rule to avoid handing players a billion dollar door. Depending on the players, this is could well end in revolt.

[GnomeGninjas]

The cost for making an weapon from adamantine is +3,000 gp regardless of the size (i.e., the amount of adamantine used) in the weapon. (That's from the rules, not from thin air.) Adamantine ice pick or adamantine greatsword ─ it doesn't matter.

That makes sense. But I still think it would sell for a decent amount and we might be able to turn it into armor for fighter.

[Crasical]

The cost for making an weapon from adamantine is +3,000 gp regardless of the size (i.e., the amount of adamantine used) in the weapon. (That's from the rules, not from thin air.) Adamantine ice pick or adamantine greatsword ─ it doesn't matter.

That could be just as easily handwaved as saying that adamantine is so rare that even a greataxe just has a sliver of Adamantine running along the blade, no more than would be used making a dagger.

Also, even if the cost is in the craftsmanship instead of the material, the Players can still drag the block back to town and then use Fabricate to mass-produce Adamantine items to be sold.

[Curmudgeon]

Also, even if the cost is in the craftsmanship instead of the material, the Players can still drag the block back to town and then use Fabricate to mass-produce Adamantine items to be sold.

You must make an appropriate Craft check to fabricate articles requiring a high degree of craftsmanship. Since all adamantine weapons are of masterwork quality, the Craft check is required; you can only bypass that if using Fabricate to make lower-quality items. And that check doesn't speed up just because you cast a spell; progress is still measured by the week.

[OracleofWuffing]

If you are facing an adamantine door, you don't care what is behind it. You just want the door.
But if you stop there, you'll never find the legendary Hallway of Adamantine Doors.

[SirFredgar]

Since all adamantine weapons are of masterwork quality, the Craft check is required; you can only bypass that if using Fabricate to make lower-quality items. And that check doesn't speed up just because you cast a spell; progress is still measured by the week.

This runs counter to what I know of the fabricate spell. Yes it does require a check to make high-quality items, but you are still making the items in the casting time set fourth by the spells. I beleive for Full Plate it's like 2-3 rounds (as long as you hit the DC on the craft check).

If I'm mistaken I'd really like to see the RAW that goes against this.

[Crasical]

Since all adamantine weapons are of masterwork quality, the Craft check is required; you can only bypass that if using Fabricate to make lower-quality items. And that check doesn't speed up just because you cast a spell; progress is still measured by the week.

That's certainly a matter of opinion. All it says is "You must make an appropriate Craft check to fabricate articles requiring a high degree of craftsmanship.", so there's plenty of room to argue that I only have to make a Craft Check as part of casting the spell.

Also, the highest check you need to make a masterwork item is DC20. an 18 int wizard with a cleric poking him for Guidance already has a +5 to the check without any ranks in any Craft. And Craft is even on their class skills list! Making the skill check is certainly not the hard part of the equation here.

[NichG]

So the fixed +3kgp does tell us an upper bound on the material value if nothing else. This upper bound would be 3000gp multiplied by the weight of the lightest weapon that can be made out of Adamantine (barring ammo, which uses different rules). Otherwise you could buy an adamantine greatsword and turn out 10 adamantine daggers (or 16 or whatever) and make a huge profit.

That upper bound is still something like 1500gp/lb.

We can do better by looking at ammo. Adamantine ammo costs +60gp per ammo item. An arrow weighs about 0.15lbs in D&D (20 arrows is 3 lbs). If we imagine conservatively that 1/3 of that weight is in the metal part, then the maximum value of adamantine is 1200gp/lb.

Sling bullets, however, are half a pound each and are entirely metal. So based on sling bullets, we get a much more modest 120gp/lb as an upper bound.

So based on this, adamantine as a material must be less valuable than Mithril or you could just buy a bunch of adamantine sling bullets and melt them down to make money.

[SowZ]

Remember one of the most important rules of economics. Things are only worth what people are willing to pay for them, not the 'listed price.' At least, no necessarily. Remember in Morrowind? A filled Grand Soul Gem or enchanted Daedric Sword coul be worth tens of thousands of gold? Well, they weren't worth that. Because no one could buy it for that. The door will still be worth a lot. But extrapolating the value using conversions is only marginally helpful.

[Coidzor]

Adamantine is costly to work with more than it's valuable for itself.

You're extrapolating too much from that. The actual cost of adamantine is left up to the individual DM. A lack of RAW ≠ the RAW stating that something is worthless. Otherwise one could purchase a noble title for a song.


Since all adamantine weapons are of masterwork quality, the Craft check is required; you can only bypass that if using Fabricate to make lower-quality items. And that check doesn't speed up just because you cast a spell; progress is still measured by the week.

So the spell that I cast that has an instantaneous effect requires me to hang in wizard space for a week. I find that a hard pill to swallow.

[Belril Duskwalk]

Back on the subject of stealing the door: Easiest mundane option is going to be taking down the wall around the door, or breaking the hinges off, depending on what kind of tools you have.
Given access to 3rd level spells (or scrolls thereof) I don't think you'll find an answer much better than Shrink Item. It simultaneously solves the problem of the door being attached to the dungeon, AND the problem of how you carry a huge-freaking door out of a dungeon.

Also, I think it should be noted your DM made one large blunder on keeping you adventurers from getting too rich. If you want adventurers to find less treasure, don't make the treasure room harder to access, make the treasure room nonexistent. Perhaps more intriguingly, have the room be already looted when the party arrives.

[tiercel]

Some things to check:

Does the door detect as magical? Note that detect magic isn't foolproof if some jerk is maintaining (Nystul's) magic aura to add or hide a magic glow. Leaving aside that possibility, the presence of a magic aura could indicate one or more of a number of things:


There is an illusion over the door or of the door, to make it look adamantine. An illusion is almost certainly cheaper than an actual adamantine, after all.
The door is magically trapped. If somebody has the gold to spend on an ADAMANTINE DOOR, then it doesn't seem incredible that they might use some comparatively small change to make the door blow up in your face or do something incredibly nasty if you try to break/bypass/haul it away.
The door is magically enchanted. This could mean any number of things (the door could be magically hardened, or a magic item or even an intelligent magic item in its own right. Notably, magic interacts differently with magic items than it does with unattended nonmagical items... some spells (e.g. shrink item) only work on nonmagic items, and the door would be entitled to a saving throw against other spells which could affect it.


If the door really isn't magical, there's still the question of what exactly you are looking at. Naturally, you want to try and verify that it's actually adamantine. Even if it is, you may not necessarily be looking at a solid adamantine door -- it would be somewhat less insane to have an adamantine-clad door than a single solid slab of ridiculously rare metal. (The downside for you of cladding means a lot less loot; the upside is that, if you can figure out how to strip the cladding, it will be a lot easier to transport home and will probably still be enough to make a suit of armor or at least a couple good sized weapons.)

If you can verify that the door is adamantine and a huge solid slab, then (A) your DM is insane and (B) you probably really want a scroll of shrink item, because moving that sucker otherwise is going to be more trouble than you want. (Be sure to take careful measurements of the door first, since a default scroll at CL 5 will affect 10 cubic feet; depending on how ridiculously large and/or thick the door is, you may need to commission a higher-level scroll -- but if your DM is *giving you more than 10 cubic feet of solid adamantine*...... jiminy christmas....)

Transportation is probably a bigger obstacle than removal of the door (unless the thing is lousy with traps, a distinct possibility). You want shrink item because it makes your life much easier, and at a tiny fraction of the door's worth, and avoids the whole "every bandit, NPC adventuring group, and army in the vicinity is going to attack the heavily-laden toiling PCs trying to drag a Large Obvious Insanely Expensive Door back to Town" problem.

Honestly? This sounds like a talk-with-the-DM moment, given that the door sounds like a symptom of a greater problem (i.e. railroading). Address the larger problem by talking, then offer to compromise on the actual door by making it cladding, which eliminates a good deal of your trouble by making it easier to transport, doesn't break the game by making you multizillionaires, but still gives you a nice reward (thousands of gp or raw materials for a nice adamantine item).

[Tyndmyr]

Good luck preparing that at 3rd level, though.

At those levels, if I have no such option, I routinely write down the location for future use. Wild amounts of wealth in a couple of levels are still useful.


The cost for making an weapon from adamantine is +3,000 gp regardless of the size (i.e., the amount of adamantine used) in the weapon. (That's from the rules, not from thin air.) Adamantine ice pick or adamantine greatsword ─ it doesn't matter.

The same is true for making a weapon out of gold or platinum(source: Heavy enchantment). This strikes me as a game balance abstraction, not one that you should derive economic data from.

[SirFredgar]

If IRRC, Stronghold Builder's guide does have some rules for adamantine construction. The prices I remember being much more reasonable... something like 5 times the cost of an equivilent iron object. If that were the case, would stealing this door still be worth the trouble (or worth more trouble then just bypassing it and getting shinies on the other side)?