I'm going to build a computer!

[Pie Guy]

Hello, over Christmas my parents gave me a $1500 budget to build a computer. The first two words out of my mouth were "Holy ****."

So anyway, does anyone have any recommended sites and parts to use? My dad found this site (http://www.build-gaming-computers.com/index.html), but are there better sites to use?

Thank you,
Qwazes (Pie Guy)

[Gnoman]

That site's a bit of a ripoff. Use newegg.com or tigerdirect.com.

[Pie Guy]

Yeah, but the site directs you to tigerdirect.com for the actual purchase.

[Gnoman]

It generally steers you toward the higher-priced components, more than you really need. It's better to get general reccomendations, come up with a parts list, then go direct to the purchase site.

[tyckspoon]

There's a few sites that do semi-regular build guides at a few different price points; those are a good starting point. Tom's Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/Special,6/Buyers-Guides,24/) (link to index of buy guide articles, they just finished a set for December and if you scroll down you can see November's as well as the most recent video card + CPU articles) and Anandtech (http://www.anandtech.com/tag/guides) have pretty clearly written and approachable articles.

Edit: As shopping goes, I use Newegg for pretty much everything. Check around- you can catch better deals sometimes- but they're speedy and reliable shippers and usually near the best pricing.

[OracleofWuffing]

I can't make any personal recommendations, but here's what I hear works fairly nice for high-end stuff (Shamelessly stolen from SomethingAwful's quick picks list):
i5 somethingorother (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072) processor
MSI Coupla other letters (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130582) motherboard
Eight gigs of RAM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&N=100007611&IsNodeId=1&Manufactory=8476%2C1471%2C2135%2C1687%2C11776%2C11 83%2C1459%2C1504%2C1455&PropertyCodeValue=521%3A29233%2C523%3A23986%2C524% 3A29248%2C524%3A35212%2C524%3A30325%2C2599%3A50618 %2C2599%3A29232&bop=And&Order=PRICE&PageSize=20), pick your poison they're all the same.
Then I'm really shoddy when it comes to video cards, so I don't know the difference between this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=48&Description=&Type=&N=100007709&IsNodeId=1&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&Manufactory=1314&Manufactory=1561&Manufactory=1315&Manufactory=1312&Manufactory=1402&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A100638) and that (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=48&Description=&Type=&N=100007709&IsNodeId=1&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&Manufactory=1314&Manufactory=1561&Manufactory=1315&Manufactory=1312&Manufactory=1402&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A90543).

That'll run you some $650 right there. Windows 7 64-bit will run you an extra hundred (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116986) (possibly cheaper if you're a student). Probably looking around another hundred (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112154) or so (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=100006644&isNodeId=1&Description=fractal+r3&x=0&y=0) for a really nice case, but maybe this is where you might want to go lower if that comes out to be an issue. Grab a good power supply (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207013) since you got some really nice components, probably around $70. Hard drive prices are still kind of screwy from natural disasters, so pick your poison between Samsung 1TB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152185) or Western Digital 500GB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073) at $150.

Now, you're at the $1125 ish point, with a functioning computer. This next stuff's optional, I guess. If you wanna throw everyone for a loop, grab a Solid State Drive (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167050) for your primary drive, using your regular hard drive for documents, about $200. Maybe you want an optic drive still, but that probably won't run you over $50. I like the idea of having a TV Tuner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116037) on my computers, but that might not be your thing. Maybe get a new monitor or two (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236079) while you're at it. Maybe keep the leftover on hand to buy spare cooling parts if you decide your system's running too hot, though I kinda doubt it. Maybe spot yourself an Uninterruptible Power Supply (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842101343) to protect your electronics from power surges/outages (that's one I guess that I can make a personal recommendation for, though I guess I'm sort of superstitious about those things).

[factotum]

There's a few sites that do semi-regular build guides at a few different price points; those are a good starting point. Tom's Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/Special,6/Buyers-Guides,24/) (link to index of buy guide articles, they just finished a set for December and if you scroll down you can see November's as well as the most recent video card + CPU articles)

Note that they messed up on their $1200 build this time around, though--it was fine for virtually everything except games, where they ended up with massive CPU bottlenecks due to using an AMD Bulldozer CPU rather than an Intel i5.

[Starwulf]

/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842101343"]Uninterruptible Power Supply[/URL] to protect your electronics from power surges/outages (that's one I guess that I can make a personal recommendation for, though I guess I'm sort of superstitious about those things).

I will 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, and 10th this particular piece. I myself live on top of a mountain, and as such, for whatever reason, Lightning tends to strike close to us more often then it does other people and cause massive power surgers/outages, and before I bought an Uninterruptible Power supply, I literally fried 4 modems, 3 hard-drives, 2 Power supplies, and a Partridge in a pear tree(that last one isn't true, but it sounded good!). Since I got one, I've had exactly one thing fry, and that was a power supply unit, and that was because my wife thought it was ok to flip the main power breaker on and off a few times without unplugging, or hell, even turning off the computer beforehand.

[Pie Guy]

Ok, how do you tell if various parts are compatible with each other?

[tyckspoon]

Ok, how do you tell if various parts are compatible with each other?

It's honestly not that big a problem. Mostly, you decide on the motherboard and CPU you want to use. Then pretty much everything else will work out as long as you buy reputable parts; basic compatibility isn't much of an issue unless you really don't do your research and end up trying to plug an Intel CPU into an AMD-socketed board.

It's a little trickier if you intend to overclock, but even there it's not 'will all of these work together' so much as 'will all of these support being pushed to the performance level I want to make the computer achieve;' it's pretty easy to get a working computer by just getting a decent deal on parts, slotting them together, and letting them run at stock settings.

(If you're really paranoid about it, Newegg and probably most of the other sites often offer system-build bundles of some mix of motherboard/cpu/RAM/videocard, which can both save you a bit of money if they have one that meets the specs you want and gives you a set of components that somebody else has already looked at and said 'yeah, ok, that'll work.')

[DabblerWizard]

I recommend you buy a "modular" power supply. This allows you to install only the plugs you need to run your components. With a regular PS, you're going to end up with extra wiring that just takes up space for no good reason.

I suppose, if you have a large case, this might not be much of an issue. I just dislike having to tuck away a bunch of cords I'll never use.

[ryzouken]

Modular PSU, I'd shy away from less than 750W for future scaling.
Quad Core or better CPU. i series is a good bet. i5 or thereabouts.
I only recommend around 6 gigs of RAM, but that's based on my personal usage, I find I don't scrape much higher than 4 gigs in use at any time, but then I don't do much video editing or what have you. 6 is a solid amount for gaming purposes.
GPU I run a single card set up to keep heat down and keep points of failure to a minimum. Unless you're running Crysis 2 or other GPU killers, a GTX 460 or better NVidia card will work. Radeon wise you'll want a 5k series I think. 5770? Or better.
Cases: I recommend Antec series cases because I love them. If you don't end up getting an Antec 900 V2, go with a Cooler Master CM690 or thereabouts. You shouldn't need a Lian-Li thousand dollar case, and either of the models of cases I recommended will keep your system nice and frosty with the stock cooling.
Get a solid state drive for your OS and programs to run on and toss your data on a second SSD so that when the first one explodes (due to repeated write cycles) you don't lose your crap. Should make your system good and quick.
A UPS is a luxury, not a necessity. It might be in your budget though.
Remember to budget for an optical drive and a copy of Win 7.

I'd go with newegg as their customer support and reliability are second to none. I've heard mixed reviews about Tigerdirect, but many swear by them.

[Gnoman]

I recommend you buy a "modular" power supply. This allows you to install only the plugs you need to run your components. With a regular PS, you're going to end up with extra wiring that just takes up space for no good reason.

I suppose, if you have a large case, this might not be much of an issue. I just dislike having to tuck away a bunch of cords I'll never use.

Generally, this is an extremely bad idea. In my experience, you wind up losing 1% of your capacity per connection, because a socket can never be as efficient as a hardwired connection. This means that you have to buy a more potent power supply than you need for you components, wasting cash.

That said, do not, under any circumstances, skimp on the PSU. Lower-grade units can only deliver between 65-85 percent of rated capacity.

[factotum]

That said, do not, under any circumstances, skimp on the PSU. Lower-grade units can only deliver between 65-85 percent of rated capacity.

I think it's more important to get a decent PSU because every single other device in the machine is attached to it, and if your cheap PSU decides to blow up and dump mains voltage into the internal connectors, you have only yourself to blame when looking at the charred wreckage of your machine! (OK, this is a vanishingly unlikely scenario even with a cheap PSU, but it's certainly possible for power surges and over-voltages to occur).

[Brother Oni]

Snip list of components

Further to this list, don't forget keyboard, mouse and speakers.

Depending on your router, you may also need to get yourself a wireless network card or some network cable. If the latter, don't forget to check your motherboard has onboard networking (most should these days).

[ryzouken]

Generally, this is an extremely bad idea. In my experience, you wind up losing 1% of your capacity per connection, because a socket can never be as efficient as a hardwired connection. This means that you have to buy a more potent power supply than you need for you components, wasting cash.
The streamlined cabling can be worth the minor efficiency dump when discussing cooling and easier cable management. The 1% reduction in throughput is unlikely to be noticed, honestly. If you're running 500W of hardware on a 500W PSU, you're going to run into issues, modular or not. If, on the other hand, you're running 500W of hardware on a 750W PSU, the 1% loss of throughput is going to be subsumed in the 250W extra output you're not using, so you won't notice it.

[FoeHammer]

This (http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af150/The_FalconO6/CurrentLogicalPCBuyingGuide/Guide.png) is a great guide for buying components. If nothing else, it gives you an idea of what's out there.

[OracleofWuffing]

My understanding on Power Supplies is that Wattage is a horrible measuring stick for them, that's basically just used to distinguish between two similar power supplies. I believe you're supposed to go by the amperage ratings, but I studied software, not electricity. :smalltongue: Like I said, I just go on hearsay. It's the circle of hearsay.

For what it's worth, here's the suggested modular PSUs from the place I got the other stuff:
Antec TruePower blah blah blah (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371020)
SeaSonic omgwtfbbqafaik (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151088)
XFS Pro it has three Xs so it must be good somehow (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207016)
Corsair I think there's a foreign swear word in there (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139031)


Further to this list, don't forget keyboard, mouse and speakers.
Rats (http://www.artlebedev.com/everything/optimus/maximus/), he doesn't have the budget for a standard keyboard. :smallbiggrin: He'll have to go with a budget number.

For the record I still miss my split-ergo wired keyboard. Why couldn't you support PS/2, hackintosh!?

[Triaxx]

With that kind of budget, you can kind of go overboard if you feel like it. Try this set up

Six core AMD processor, and a matching motherboard: 299.99
http://3btech.net/msi88andamdp.html

Four, 4GB Crucial Memory sticks 4x29.99= 119.96
http://3btech.net/crteba16p4gb.html

This case, with USB 3.0 built into it. 179.99
http://3btech.net/andafldffuto.html

Plug in a pair of these 2x249.99= 499.98
http://3btech.net/ev01nvgegtx51.html

That clocks in at 1099.92 dollars.

If you like modular PSU's this one is nice: 89.99
http://3btech.net/thtr2rx75mop.html

But I've found Chiefmax PSU's to be extremely reliable and cheaper by far. 22.99
http://3btech.net/newv2ch6524p.html

For HDD's, I'd slot in an SSD for a Windows Drive. 119.99
http://3btech.net/crm464sostdr.html

And stick a nice big Seagate in for storage 129.99
http://3btech.net/sest1tb72rpm.html

1,429.89 with the Thermaltake PSU
1,372.89 with the Chiefmax PSU

Frankly that brings you right up against your goal, and the latter leaves you with cash to pick up windows 7, or a new monitor.

Of course, that's not even the top of the top of the line. But it's still a monster of a computer.

[tyckspoon]

Should pay more attention to your bits if you're going to recommend parts, Triaxx- the motherboard part of that combo only has 1 PCI x16-size slot, which means it's only going to fit one video card. And the Chiefmax power supply only has one video card connector as well (also I severely doubt a $25 PSU is outputting anything near a reliable or good quality 650w, and will continue to do so unless I see a review of it with a full bench breakdown and test suite applied. I certainly wouldn't trust a power build with multiple video cards and a six-core CPU to it.)

[Triaxx]

Indeed, my bad. Was looking at similiar Mobo's and got them confused.

So far I've had zero problems with an identical PSU, but my system is lighter, and I only run one Video card so I didn't notice the lack of a second connector.

What I wanted to recommend instead was:

This Mobo: 154.99
http://3btech.net/assoamm5evow.html

And this CPU: 169.99
http://3btech.net/amdphiix610t2.html

1,464.88 with the Thermaltake PSU.

[Tyndmyr]

That site's a bit of a ripoff. Use newegg.com or tigerdirect.com.

This. Newegg is my preferred option, as I hate dealing with rebates and tiger direct seems to use them rather more. Both sell good stuff, though.

Start with the processor/mobo. Make sure that they match, as otherwise, you're not really going to be able to do much of anything with them. Usually, this is acheived by making sure they both have the same socket type. Some motherboards may support multiple socket types, but mixing and matching is generally not a thing on multi-proc boards. I like i5s or i7s. If you're going a bit lower/cheaper, AMD procs are quite solid for this niche. Most procs will come with a heatsink/fan that is sufficient for them, if not especially flashy or high end.

Now, once you've picked a proc, how do you decide on a mobo? Size, brand, and slots. More slots is generally better, but generally result in a larger size. Mobos are generally made in standard sizes, so you'll end up with a case based on mobo size. If it has to be tiny, you want to set that in stone now. Otherwise, grab a decent mobo with lots of extra slots. Often, proc/mobo combos are offered, so flip through there to see if anything you want saves you a few bucks.

Case is next. Find one that holds the size of mobo you got. If your proc comes with funky cooling(usually unnecessary), make sure you have space for it. A little extra space is nice, and built in power supplies are also frequent.

PSU. Power supply is not usually a great factor in terms of watts unless you're going to add a ton of non standard stuff. However, modular power cables are fantastic for reducing clutter. I highly recommend them. If you can't get them, at least use cable ties. Make sure your CPU power cable matches that on the motherboard(some match multiple configurations). Make sure the total wattage is sufficient to handle your computers needs. A little bit higher is ok, as it'll give you room for expansion, but you need not purchase the absolute biggest available.

Video card. These are annoying. Go out, read spec compares for the recent cards, and get a feel for what's out now. They change sufficiently often that memorization isn't going to be effective in the long term, and a simple comparison of on-board memory is not a good overall metric. Make sure the slot matches a slot you have free on your motherboard. High end gaming systems may have dual matching video cards. This does impact power consumption, etc somewhat, do your homework on the specific card to see if it's worthwhile and possible before ordering two.

Memory. Try to match them all in brand/speed/etc. Low latency is great, more is better. If you plan to run an x86 OS, don't exceed 4 gb, but otherwise...enjoy it.

Operating System. Be aware that you can get cheaper licenses from newegg if you order them with the rest of your system building stuff. No point going to best buy or the like. Win 7 is a x64 OS, so it's a pretty solid choice if you're a windows person. If mac...consult a hackamac guide. It may have additional restrictions on certain hardware choices. If Linux, check for linux driver availability before ordering. Many hardware setups will be capable of handling all of the above, though.

Other cards. TV tuner card is kind of nice, but not necessary for most. I highly recommend wifi(N, of course). Onboard wifi, where it exists, is often inferior to separate cards. Most mobos have enough usb/etc slots that additional expansion boards are unnecessary, but if you have special needs in this area, make sure you cover the bases. Make sure your chosen mobo has slots necessary to install all these cards and be aware that some cards take up multiple slots in physical size.

Airflow should be logical. Make sure that your fans on one side are blowing in, and fans on another side are blowing out. I've seen a lot of boxes where this is not the case, and if everything is blowing in, you have much worse cooling performance. Liquid cooling systems are best not done on your first build, and most computers do not need them anyway.

Accessories. Lights, panels, etc are unnecessary, but sometimes aesthetically nice. Make sure you have standoff screws for your mobo. Often they come with either case or mobo, but you'll need them. Required cabling will usually come with the accessories, but if you're doing anything unusual, you may need cables, and they'll be much cheaper at newegg than bestbuy.

Make sure you have a nice, clean area to put things together, avoid static, and handle the parts with care. Also, do not power the system while assembling it. I know, I shouldn't HAVE to include this, but I've actually seen it messed up, and it's terrible. It's not that hard of a job if you're careful with things, but rushing it can result in mismatching stuff and multiple orders.

[Gnoman]

One thing. Ensure that your video card has the monitor connectors directly on the card itself. Some have a proprietary connector that requires an adaptor, which adds much unneeded complexity and failpoints.

[Triaxx]

Incidentally, remember there are two area's not to skimp on. RAM and cooling. When it comes to gaming, Crucial is the Ram to cram in.

And the cooler the computer the better. PERIOD.

[factotum]

Win 7 is a x64 OS, so it's a pretty solid choice if you're a windows person.

Windows 7 is available in both 32-bit and 64-bit flavours, just so's you know. The only Microsoft OS at the moment which is x64 only is Windows Server 2008 R2.

[Ryuho Tsugu]

One thing. Ensure that your video card has the monitor connectors directly on the card itself. Some have a proprietary connector that requires an adaptor, which adds much unneeded complexity and failpoints.

What modern video card has had a connection that isn't a standard, though?

[factotum]

What modern video card has had a connection that isn't a standard, though?

However, if you have a DVI output on the card and only a VGA input on the monitor, you still have to use an adapter--it's just not proprietary!

[Ryuho Tsugu]

However, if you have a DVI output on the card and only a VGA input on the monitor, you still have to use an adapter--it's just not proprietary!

Well, that's true. If that's the case, though, it's probably time for a new monitor.

[Tyndmyr]

Windows 7 is available in both 32-bit and 64-bit flavours, just so's you know. The only Microsoft OS at the moment which is x64 only is Windows Server 2008 R2.

There's...really no notable reason to use 32 bit for a new computer, though. 64 bit is a thing now, and compatible hardware is not really a worry. It might be if you have an older model, but for a brand new build? Vista/XP 64...those are poorer choices for a variety of reasons. Windows Server anything is probably not really necessary for a gaming box. Just go with win 7-64 bit.

[factotum]

There's...really no notable reason to use 32 bit for a new computer, though.

I know that, but your comment implied that you could ONLY get 64-bit versions of Windows 7, and that might have caused confusion when he purchased one and it turned out to be 32-bit!

[Gnoman]

What modern video card has had a connection that isn't a standard, though?

The Nvidia 8800 card I bought last year. Instead of the standard 2 DVI (or 1xdvi 1xvga) or HDMI port, it has one port that looks like an old LPT connector. YOu have to connect this massive cable to the back of it that sprouts into two DVI ports.

[tyckspoon]

The Nvidia 8800 card I bought last year. Instead of the standard 2 DVI (or 1xdvi 1xvga) or HDMI port, it has one port that looks like an old LPT connector. YOu have to connect this massive cable to the back of it that sprouts into two DVI ports.

Those are pretty rare; usually show up when they're taking something that really ought to be a double-slot card and trying to find a way to jam it into a single space. Also sometimes Dell systems, because Dell. :smallsigh:

[Gnoman]

Know it's not common. Just wanted to point out that they exist.