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Insider
2011-12-30, 01:56 AM
Lurker mode: off :smallredface:
I am currently running a dark heresy campaign which took unexpected turn. To make long story short: My players decided to go against Inquisition and allied themselves with Heretek magos biologos, which were lesser evil in my campaign. And they have their own destroyer (yes it is badly damaged and horribly understaffed, capable of only short jumps, but it is their own).
Now I'm going to give them one or two BSG'que sessions before they can reach the secret rebel base. The question is since Imperium does not know about the ship (it was a derelict), but know about the treason - what opposition they should expect?
Is there a FTL communication system, other then courier ships? Does photos of PC' are now in every world in the system with MOST WANTED caption?
Should they want to restock their food supplies in some backwater system - what are possible defences?
How should those defence forces react to an unexpected guests?
Where they could find a navigator?
I imagine that if PC's succeed they would tour Calixis sector to deliver weapons to dissented factions (maybe to slaves in infamous Sepheris Secundus - homeworld of one of my PC'), acquire weapons/ship plans from forge worlds, and face opposition from their former employer and the campaign big bad. Again if they do a good job and remain secretive, their faction would successfully run subsector spanning rebellion and the campaign end should be the epic three sided battle with Chaos and Sector Fleet over Scintilla.

Any tips, ideas or criticism are welcome

One more thing. In Rogue Trader the ship crews are tens thousands strong. As a GM I have cut those numbers by five because I simply doesn't have any idea what those people should do on a starship. Except inhaling precious oxygen. Are there any reasonable explanation for such high numbers except "Black Industries made this up"??

Ashtagon
2011-12-30, 05:17 AM
If the Imperium doesn't know about the ship, they will assume the PCs are in whatever star system they were last seen in.

It is quite likely that information about the PCs and their loyalty records will be transmitted as fast as standard data couriers allow (which could be slowed by disturbances in the warp). However, unless the PCs somehow announce their location and identity, or that they have obtained a derelict ship, it is unlikley that the Imperium willbe after them specifically for their loyalty issues.

However...

How did they acquire teh destroyer? It is reasonable to supppose that records may exist about the ship's manufacture, and if it is a recovered derelict, then someone used to own it. The imperial harbour masters will likely want to put a freeze on the ship's movements while they establoish who actually owns the ship, assuming the PCs don't have verifiable ownership documents.

Starshade
2011-12-30, 06:12 AM
I'd guess the tens of thousands number might be soldiers and crews for weaponry, guns, possibly 2 or 2.5 crews as on a modern boat, for rotating crews underway (to let gunners get rest in battle, and replacement gunners if ppl die), etc.
Imagine an Startrek ish Galaxy class ship, who I think is same size as a destroyer, imagine it with something reminding of WW2 era gunnery stations, without a centralized computer system working that well, and a engineering staff who believe in tech fairies, praying to the engine's spirits before doing anything. You'd need a HUGE staff. It's what I think anyway.

I assume they can hire people from non Imperial worlds with sufficient advanced tech level, training people of, say, our current era level of education into spaceship crew should be doable, for navigators I'd think it would be hard. It's so few of them they would probably not want to join an rebel crew, they could try look for some outcast navigator. Or look for some Alien psycher to do same job, perhaps an Eldar?


The Imperium do use psykers to send "FTL" messages between systems, but, it's not really reliable, it too can use LOTS of tome to get trough, get lost, etc. But the empire is able to send FTL messages trough daisychains of psykers called Astropaths.

Shadowleaf
2011-12-30, 06:25 AM
I'd guess the tens of thousands number might be soldiers and crews for weaponry, guns, possibly 2 or 2.5 crews as on a modern boat, for rotating crews underway (to let gunners get rest in battle, and replacement gunners if ppl die), etc.
Imagine an Startrek ish Galaxy class ship, who I think is same size as a destroyer, imagine it with something reminding of WW2 era gunnery stations, without a centralized computer system working that well, and a engineering staff who believe in tech fairies, praying to the engine's spirits before doing anything. You'd need a HUGE staff. It's what I think anyway.

I assume they can hire people from non Imperial worlds with sufficient advanced tech level, training people of, say, our current era level of education into spaceship crew should be doable, for navigators I'd think it would be hard. It's so few of them they would probably not want to join an rebel crew, they could try look for some outcast navigator. Or look for some Alien psycher to do same job, perhaps an Eldar?


The Imperium do use psykers to send "FTL" messages between systems, but, it's not really reliable, it too can use LOTS of tome to get trough, get lost, etc. But the empire is able to send FTL messages trough daisychains of psykers called Astropaths.Why wouldn't an Imperial ship have a working central computer? I'm fairly certain it's what Techpriests patch into when they talk to the Omnissiah.

I'm fairly-ish certain Farseers are the Eldar's Navigators. I am also fairly certain the number of Farseers willing to act as navigators for a human ship is close to none, especially if you compare it to the number of rogue human psykers.

Astropath communication is fairly reliable. Depending on the author they either open a link between two Astropaths who then have a conversation using emotions/images, emit a psionic beacon-like message or send messages as letters.

hamishspence
2011-12-30, 08:37 AM
Imagine an Startrek ish Galaxy class ship, who I think is same size as a destroyer, imagine it with something reminding of WW2 era gunnery stations, without a centralized computer system working that well, and a engineering staff who believe in tech fairies, praying to the engine's spirits before doing anything. You'd need a HUGE staff. It's what I think anyway.

The ship's "machine spirit" would be what they call the central computer. Or they'd call it a "cogitator".

Galaxy class ships are rather shorter than destroyers- some 700-odd metres, compared to a Cobra Destroyer's 1500 metres.

Accorting to Rogue Trader: Into the Storm, an average Cobra has a crew of 15000.

king.com
2011-12-30, 09:10 AM
Lurker mode: off :smallredface:
I am currently running a dark heresy campaign which took unexpected turn. To make long story short: My players decided to go against Inquisition and allied themselves with Heretek magos biologos, which were lesser evil in my campaign. And they have their own destroyer (yes it is badly damaged and horribly understaffed, capable of only short jumps, but it is their own).
Now I'm going to give them one or two BSG'que sessions before they can reach the secret rebel base. The question is since Imperium does not know about the ship (it was a derelict), but know about the treason - what opposition they should expect?




Is there a FTL communication system, other then courier ships? Does photos of PC' are now in every world in the system with MOST WANTED caption?


The FTL communication system is through the use of Astropaths who a somewhat similiar to regular psykers who have the capacity to transmit messages through the warp to other Astropaths, across of the sub-sector or sector itself if they are powerful enough though given the nature of the the warp it is not instantaneous and can take a wild time frame though likely a day or so.

If your running a Dark Heresy campaign, and they've managed to piss off the Imperial Inquisition there won't be any kind of WANTED posters. This will be quiet. The Inquisition, depending on the threat the playesr pose will simply drop an assassin who will make their way aboard the ship and murder them while they sleep.

This is even more reinforced by the lack of awareness of a ship. Its going to a small, elite assassination unit. If your not high level, its going to be regular assassins, if you are high level. Its going to be a bunch of death cultists or worse, a member of the Officio Assassinorum (note that if something like this is deployed your players a dead, end of story).



Should they want to restock their food supplies in some backwater system - what are possible defences?


Restocking depends on their resources and what they need.



How should those defence forces react to an unexpected guests?


So I think your trying to say that the rebel base has been destroyed by the Imperium? Given that you are working with Hereteks, I would imagine the place is overrun with not only the Imperial Guard but also Skitarii (cyberneticlly enhanced Tech-Guard) as the Adeptus Mechanicus would be personally involved with a manner such as this.

If this is a legitimate threat, they would have overrun with base with FAR more than they possibly have needed and maybe even drawn troops being deployed to the Jericho Reach Crusade going on. Battlefleet Calixis would likely have deployed a few vessels (couple of frigates, maybe even a light Cruiser) to escort the transports aswell.



Where they could find a navigator?


A legitimate navigator? As heretics? No way, no Navigator House would willing deal with them. So your best bet is to try and find rogue Navigators or banished Navigator Houses, likely to be sitting in the neighbouring region of the Koronus Expanse where they are most likely to be hired. Try Port Wander, its on the edge between the Koronus and Calixis sector.



I imagine that if PC's succeed they would tour Calixis sector to deliver weapons to dissented factions (maybe to slaves in infamous Sepheris Secundus - homeworld of one of my PC'), acquire weapons/ship plans from forge worlds, and face opposition from their former employer and the campaign big bad. Again if they do a good job and remain secretive, their faction would successfully run subsector spanning rebellion and the campaign end should be the epic three sided battle with Chaos and Sector Fleet over Scintilla.

Any tips, ideas or criticism are welcome


Dont want to tell you how to run your game or anything but if your players actually get enough going to start a subsector revolt, the Inquisition is going to hunt your players down and destroy them. They have literally the entire Imperium at their disposal and should the players actually succeed in any way, the boardering sectors are going to launch a new crusade to 'cleanse' the sector.

Im not entirely sure what the Force of Chaos have at their disposal to challenge Battlefleet Calixis, regardless, the Calixis Sector is completely screwed should your players succeed. I mean without resorting to working with Chaos, there is little to nothing your players can get together to challenge the Imperium but whatever, its your game.

Personally I don't think your running a game set in the 40K universe, the point being that the evil, suppressive, indoctrinating, fanatical, brutal and bloody regime ruling humanity are the good guys, they are the lesser of two evils and everything and everyone else are bad guys. Free thought, human rights, and worst of all Hope? That is heresy, that way lies the Chaos God Tzeentch, Lord of Change. Though I dont know whats really going on and if your having fun it doesnt matter. Just suggesting that if your going to freedom fighters of an evil Empire you might just prefer a Star Wars setting.



One more thing. In Rogue Trader the ship crews are tens thousands strong. As a GM I have cut those numbers by five because I simply doesn't have any idea what those people should do on a starship. Except inhaling precious oxygen. Are there any reasonable explanation for such high numbers except "Black Industries made this up"??

Okay, dont think Star Trek, think Age of Sail. Think a single cannon team is manned by 5 or 6 people, there is manual reloading of a gun with powder, shot and firing. That is how ship in Warhammer 40,000 work. There are so manual loading systems. Instead you have teams of 1000+ crewmen, attaching chains to the GIGANTIC shells that need to be launched and hauling these shells from the ammunition storage to their gun, which then needs to be manually loaded AND repositioned by even larger teams to point at an accurate target. All of this requires personal information to be Voxed down from firing teams who then receive their orders from the bridge.

The ship needs these people. Not to mention the larger ships are literal cities with population centres, food growth, merchants and everything that goes with it. In the 41st Millenium, people are born, live and die all on the one ship.


Why wouldn't an Imperial ship have a working central computer? I'm fairly certain it's what Techpriests patch into when they talk to the Omnissiah.


Yea there is a central Machine Spirit but its not connected to anything of importance. It is a massive calculation system that the techpriests then manually interact and reinput this data elsewhere.

There was a time where the Ships AI did everything. It is now referred to as the Dark Age of Technology.



I'm fairly-ish certain Farseers are the Eldar's Navigators. I am also fairly certain the number of Farseers willing to act as navigators for a human ship is close to none, especially if you compare it to the number of rogue human psykers.


The Eldar dont enter the warp, they use the Webway for FTL transport. No eldar would ever willing serve a human and would barely tolirate their presence if something profoundly important was at stake.

Jack of Spades
2011-12-30, 09:16 AM
I am currently running a dark heresy campaign which took unexpected turn. To make long story short: My players decided to go against Inquisition and allied themselves with Heretek magos biologos, which were lesser evil in my campaign. And they have their own destroyer (yes it is badly damaged and horribly understaffed, capable of only short jumps, but it is their own).
Now I'm going to give them one or two BSG'que sessions before they can reach the secret rebel base. The question is since Imperium does not know about the ship (it was a derelict), but know about the treason - what opposition they should expect?
For Heresy? Probably some Inquisitorial scrutiny, which is to say a good number of agents and troopers looking to bring your PC's the "mercy" of death. Once they find out about the ship, however, anything from Mechanicus agents to assassins to Kill Teams of Space Marines could be sent to take care of the problem. Even derelict, that ship is a Holy Relic of the Emperor's Glory.

Is there a FTL communication system, other then courier ships? Does photos of PC' are now in every world in the system with MOST WANTED caption?
Their main form of FTL communication is the warp (which is to say, the psykers sending messages to one another through it). News of the heresy will probably be all over the sector in whatever ears the Inquisition wants it to be in within a month or two. However, it will never get everywhere. The Inquisition would never allow the rumors to propagate that much.

Should they want to restock their food supplies in some backwater system - what are possible defences?
How should those defence forces react to an unexpected guests?
Where they could find a navigator?
For the first two questions: Whatever you want. 40k operates on almost every scale simultaneously.
For the last question: Reliable psykers are hard to come by, let alone trained navigators. I'd say their best bet is to try to get into contact with one of the Rogue Trader houses.

One more thing. In Rogue Trader the ship crews are tens thousands strong. As a GM I have cut those numbers by five because I simply doesn't have any idea what those people should do on a starship. Except inhaling precious oxygen. Are there any reasonable explanation for such high numbers except "Black Industries made this up"??

Everything in 40k can be counted on to be two things: overly complicated, and then taken to 11. Anyone who isn't doing something, is probably praying that the things will work. Also, that number is probably about half to three-quarters servitors, so those will be doing anything that a machine could probably be doing just as well without the husk of a human attached. That, and a navigatorum alone takes hundreds of mind-slaved psykers to work. In short, anyone who doesn't have a defined duty is probably in the business of wishing they were dead.

Insider
2011-12-30, 11:22 AM
The destroyer location was scribed as a series of orbital parameters on the edge of ancient star-map. The map was made by a Rogue Trader, but he was killed before he could try to salvage the ship


If your running a Dark Heresy campaign, and they've managed to piss off the Imperial Inquisition there won't be any kind of WANTED posters. This will be quiet. The Inquisition, depending on the threat the playesr pose will simply drop an assassin who will make their way aboard the ship and murder them while they sleep.
I love that i see them running on Adeptus Arbitres with fear, only hear "carry on citizen" and then boom:smallbiggrin:


Quote:

Originally Posted by Insider View Post
How should those defence forces react to an unexpected guests?
So I think your trying to say that the rebel base has been destroyed by the Imperium? ...
actually i meant that how Imperial Planetary Missile Defence System would react when they detect a ship that is not in any register, or at best found as LONG lost in some forsaken database.
However I like the idea that their safe haven could give them only illusion of safety. Maybe not all out assault, just some sabotage.

Dont want to tell you how to run your game or anything but if your players actually get enough going to start a subsector revolt, the Inquisition is going to hunt your players down and destroy them. They have literally the entire Imperium at their disposal and should the players actually succeed in any way, the boardering sectors are going to launch a new crusade to 'cleanse' the sector.

I know but being killed in horrible ways or succeeding to reach a dream only to see it perverted or destroyed is a part of this setting. Im pretty sure that players know this, they choose DH in first place.


free thought, human rights, and worst of all Hope? That is heresy, that way lies the Chaos God Tzeentch, Lord of Change.
:smallbiggrin: Yes...


No eldar would ever willing serve a human
I agree, of course the Eldar however may make things look that they are subservient. Until it stops to suits them.

A like to say that if PC's want hang themselves only what DM can do is give them a length of rope.
Thanks for support

GolemsVoice
2012-01-02, 06:17 PM
How their chosen port reacts might depend on what kind of port it is. An unknown ship likely won't be a problem per se, but the port authorities will ask identification, and then check it against a database of known fugitives and their vessels. How thorough they are is up to you, and whether and old vessel thought lost is still listed in any way. If the port has little to no Imperial authority, or the people plain don't care, they will encounter little problems. Expecially at the fringes of Imperial space, there are places where Imperial law holds little power, and Rogue Traders, who appreciate that, flock. In these ports they might be able to recruit and restock with almost no consequences. There may still be some files declaring the ship finally lost to the void or something, to let other traders and contractors know, just like I imagine it was handled back when merchant ships still sailed the seas.


As for the treason, the news would be broadcastet via intern channels, and if there are no outward signs of corruption, other authorities might also be notified, albeit they will be given a different or unspecific crime that these people are wanted for. Depending on how the Inquisition judges the damage your players can do, the reaction might range from "these are no longer our friends, capture/kill them when you see them" and several dedicated kill teams, assassins and Inquisitors actively looking for them and investigating everything they did so far to pick up their tracks (which is when they might learn of the ship), and if the Inquisition really wants somebody, they WILL find you.

Also, if they somehow pissed off the AdMech, they might go hunting for them as well, and they are in their way nearly as dedicated as the Inquisition, and bound by equally little laws.

Extra_Crispy
2012-01-03, 05:32 AM
Information about the traitors would be made available to the people that need to know fairly quickly, couple of months probably, IF the inquisition knows they went traitor. If they announced they are turning and made it known to the inquisition then they were really stupid. Better to make their master think they died and then go by different names. If they think they died or "disappeard on the last mission" then there is no reason to hunt for them untill they start to stir up a rebellion. Once that happens then yes there will be a assassin sent to take them out. If they are using different names and such then the amount they will me harrassed by the imperium depends on how much trouble they are causing. Starting a rebellion, well if it can be stoped with an assassin they send that but if it takes more...your PC's may see a whole chapter of space marines, or whole armies of imperial guard sent to stop the rebellion.

If they are just missing then there would be no reason to even look for them. Acolytes go missing, die, etc all the time. Thus the athorities will not even be looking for them. As to an unregistered ship. It was said before depends on the planet. Some would impound the ship others, the ones on the fringe of imperial control, might welcome them.

As to the navigator. Getting a trained one is not completely impossible but very very close to it, i would forget it. A rogue psyker who can feel the eddies in the warp and is able to guide the ship by feeling where and how far to go is not as reliable as a trained astropath but can still do the job. Chaos does not use emperior trained astropaths but they use their ablility to feel the currents of the warp and pray to patron gods for delivery to the correct place. That is one reason why chaos space marines can be lost in the warp for centuries.

As to the numbers of people on the ship, realize that these ships are huge. They are miles long flying super cities. AI has been outlawed by the Mechanicus, thus a thinking computer is out. Their computer tech I would say is at the most only a few years ahead of were we are now. Add in the fact that machines are literally holy objects to the mechanicus and you need thousands of staff, most servitors, to do maintance and observe the proper rituals so that the machines keep going. Chaos gets around this many times by making a deamon inhabit the machine and keep it going. A tainted ship needs a fraction of the people working it as it keeps itself going and is a thinking "computer". Add to this, again as was said before, weapons that are basically VERY huge cannons and you need thousands more just to reload and fire the hundreds of cannons a large ship has. Not to mention carrier class ships that hold hundreds if not thousands of strike craft each with up to 3 crew members and all the support staff for them. Now you see how it can take 15000+ crew depending on the size of the ship. The last US battle ship in use, built in WWII, had a crew of 2700. A nuklear class "super carrier" aircraft carrier currently has an overall length of 1,092 ft (333 m) and full-load displacements of over 100,000 long tons, they are the largest capital ships in the world. The ships' companies can number up to 3,200, not including an air wing of 2,480. That is 5680 people for a ship that is a little less than 1/4 mile long and the ships of the imperium are MILES long.