Define Interaction

[LaughingRogue]

Is there clarification somewhere on what exactly qualifies as interaction for the purposes of Illusion spells such as mislead?

References would be appreciated,

thanks,

LaughingRogue

[Gotterdammerung]

Sadly the rules are vague on this issue. And other sources, such as novels, also flip-flop. So it is up to GM interpretation.

On a technical level, visual sight could be argued both ways. Your eyes are interacting with the illusion and therefore you should get a save. The counter being, your eyes are interacting with photons and therefore not interacting directly with the illusion. This argument spirals out of control and doesn't really go anywhere. Other methods of perception are introduced and argued. Touchsight, mindsight, tremorsense, darkvision, blind sense, blindsight, lifesense. It is unclear how any of these work on a scientific level and therefore hard to argue what the most likely reaction would be to an illusion.

Long story short. You have to just decide what you believe, and then enforce it as a GM. Be open about it so the players know what to expect.

Personally, I judge illusions like this:

An Illusion is not real.
It is designed to fool the senses.
But it can not actually accomplish real things unless it tricks someone into believing it is real.
Therefore, if an illusion is trying to accomplish a real thing, I give everyone involved a will save.

Examples:
You see a goblin (it is an illusion). In this scenario, you have no reason to disbelieve the existence of the goblin and the goblin is not trying to accomplish anything.

The goblin stabs you. (It is an illusion and can not cause any real harm unless you believe it to be a real threat.) In this scenario, the goblin has tried to accomplish something very real (stabbing you) with something very fake (it's sword), and therefore for it to succeed, you need to make a will save to see if you truly believe in it's existence.

[Darrin]

Is there clarification somewhere on what exactly qualifies as interaction for the purposes of Illusion spells such as mislead?


Off the top of my head, interacting usually means an attack roll (standard or full round action), a move action (attempting to move through a wall, jump over a pit, etc.), or a skill check of some sort (usually a Spot, Listen, or Knowledge check). Skill checks I think are usually a standard action, although some DMs may give you one freebie Spot/Knowledge check whenever you first detect something.

For a more formal discussion of what is "interacting", you'll want to check out Skip's Rules of the Game on illusions, in particular Part Three:

Rules of the Game: All About Illusions (Part One) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060207a)
Rules of the Game: All About Illusions (Part Two) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060214a)
Rules of the Game: All About Illusions (Part Three) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060221a)
Rules of the Game: All About Illusions (Part Four) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060228a)

[jackattack]

I think the general assumption is that "interaction" is active, as opposed to observation, which is passive.

Or, put another way, if the illusion is "just there" (and doesn't have some inherent flaw) there is no saving throw. Unless the character can tell by looking at it (or hearing it) that it is somehow "off", there is no reason for the character to think it isn't real. However, if the subject is more familiar with the subject of the illusion than the caster (impossible with the mislead spell) then some kind of saving throw (or an INT-vs-INT or skill-vs-skill contest) is completely justified.

Interaction involves any attempt to affect or influence the illusion, directly or indirectly. Talking to it counts, since the response (or lack thereof) may "contain errors" that the observer might detect.

Interaction also involves any attempt by the illusion to affect or influence the observer, but only directly (as the illusion itself is an indirect attempt to affect or influence the observer). Adding a new sense to the illusion (making it talk or grunt or roar, for example) should allow a new familiarity-based saving throw, if appropriate.

Note that the sense of touch does not come into play with actual interaction.