Katawa Shoujo released!!!

[Water_and_Wind]

http://katawashoujo.blogspot.com/

brb, my life.

[Byrnbot08]

A quick summary for those of you who are unaware of what Katawa Shoujo is:


Katawa Shoujo is a bishoujo-style visual novel set in the fictional Yamaku High School for disabled children, located somewhere in modern Japan. Hisao Nakai, who has had a congenital heart disorder diagnosed just a few months ago, finds his life turned upside down when he moves to a new town and school after a long hospitalization. Despite his difficulties, Hisao is able to find friends and eventually have romantic relationships with one of five main female characters.

It is a freeware (meaning completely free of charge to download,) visual novel, created by 21 independent programmers, artists, writers and musicians in response to popular approval of a single doujin page released onto 4chan in 2009.

4Leaf Studios was created just to create that game, and over the period of 5 years this game was developed by them, completely free of charge.

It is a visual novel, a popular genre of game in Japan, which tells a story using illustrations, text and music, whilst having the user make crucial decisions at branching points in the story.

This story is about a boy who suffers from a dangerous heart disorder, and is sent to a specialist highschool for the remainder of his highschool year. In that highschool, he will meet many interesting people.

This game is not for under-18s, as it contains sexually explicit content at certain points, so please be aware of that. However, if you are over 18, but do not wish to view this explicit content, there is an option to disable this in the options menu before starting the game.

I highly recommend trying out the free demo if you are unsure of what to expect, which covers the first act of the game.

I think it is a remarkable independent piece of work by a talented group of people who honestly cared about what the internet wanted and banded together to create the game.

Otherwise, enjoy. :smallsmile:

[Elder Tsofu]

Thanks for the update, for some reason I thought it would never release. Glad to be proven wrong.
Now on to see if I like the final product. :smalltongue:

[Porkslope]

Only the dead can know peace from this evil.

[Porkslope]

Sorry, double post! Internal server error.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I only managed to finish one route of the demo. Guess that means I should go Shizune all the way, then.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

*shakes fist* WHY MUST MY COMPUTER GO DEAD ON ME?? Seriously, I'm borrowing a friend's computer now, and it's definitely not up to spec, and it's not my computer...

I'm gonna have to go to a library computer or something, install this to an external hard drive.

[Lifeson]

Whoo. :D I've been waiting for this since the demo first came out.

[tensai_oni]

Only the dead can know peace from this evil.

I'm confused now. Are you quoting something or do you genuinely say it's a bad thing this game came to exist?

[Newman]

I am very frustrated that I didn't have the option for the game to simply assume I had cleared the original story, and giving me the option of whichever girl I wanted.

Well, I went with Emi. She's everything I'm not. I like her very much.

As for the people who are prejudiced about this game because of the concept, I say they can go ahead and stuff it where the sun don't shine. The writing is good. There's these points where it makes me break into a HUGE GRIN. How I missed this...

[Nerd-o-rama]

I dunno, playing through Chapter 1 again is worth it so far just for Kenji.

[Newman]

You mean we have a gay option? Cool.

[Vauron]

You mean we have a gay option? Cool.

Unless its changed from when I played, no there isn't a gay option. The 'Kenji option' is the 'you messed up and didn't make a deep enough connection with one of the girls' option. If I recall right, at the night of the festival you and Kenji get drunk and you stumble off the roof.

[Newman]

you stumble off the roof

Rocks fall everyone dies? Do Not Want.

And here I was thinking he was awkwardly trying to seduce me... I mean Hisao. Such Enterprising Young Men those two are...

Why isn't meeting people in Real Life as fun as in these games? And why doesn't helping them with their problems work, even with no reward at the end but the help iself? Most of the time you never even get to find out what the problem is in the first place...

Because people are more complicated than characters, right. That's the whole reason we're playing these games rather than meeting actual girls...

Back to the game. Finally got to the "adult" parts. Best sex scene I have ever read in my life. Like the rest of the work, it didn't do much in terms of "arousal", but it had me giggling like a schoolgirl throughout. I couldn't help but feel very very happy for the characters. Rin's casual irruption was the icing on the cake.

[endoperez]

The writing is good. There's these points where it makes me break into a HUGE GRIN. How I missed this...

Yeah, I was surprised at the amount of quality writing this game had. It handled things in a much more mature way than I thought... and that isn't arousal-mature either, but well-thought, well-written, well-handled way.

There were some badly written sentences, and some scenes which I felt were dragged out for too long and/or didn't work quite right (like some scenes with Kenji), but this was surprisingly good.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Kenji needs no route. His awesomeness could not be contained in one storyline anyhow.

Also, finished up Act 1 for reals now, with Shizune. Bracing for being the Student Council's bitch for another five to seven hours of reading.

[Byrnbot08]

Three routes. In two nights.

Don't mind me. I spent the next 48 hours completely emotionally drained and lifeless.

Spoilers for my thoughts on routes as I played them, in the order I played them:

SRS BOUT DEM SPOILERS MAN.

Rin: In my opinion- HOOLEEEE [EXPLETIVE]. I went into the route expecting art club shenanigans and daydream times with Rin. Art exhibition pushed on by pushy teacher? Yowza, that a tall order Rin.

And then she started smoking.

And then I went up to the room and- [expletive].

Awkward sex with dazed and confused Rin.

Then actual exhibition, then she runs. Then we explode at each other. Then the teacher explodes at her. Then wow. I love dandelions. Oh and not as awkward sex. That is also fine.

Then I reloaded and pressed the other option for The Scene.

That was crushing Rin. So crushing. If it wasn't for the whiteout/cut to credits, I think Hisao would have collapsed to his knees.

Shizune: Hee-hee, student council mischief. Oh look, sign lesson class. Secret weapon for future confession-

Damnit Misha. Ehhh, whatever.

Oh hey Kenji, what're- Wow. I did not know he looked so... manly before.

*rushes to Gallery, finds CG.*

YESSSSSSSS~ Kenji is such a bro!

More wacky hijinks at Shizune's place. Hee, her bro is such a cutie- Lilly and Akira? First cousins?!

Then fishing. Hee, fish.

Then we meet Shizune's Dad. My gawd. He is scary as hell.

I am relaxing in guest room. Suddenly, I am tied down by Shizune and practically raped by her. Kinky... also dat sweater.

Oooh nooooo~ Misha and Shizune are arguing and fighting behind my back...

Oh hello Misha, what brings you to my dorm at night-

No. No. I will not comfort you like that.

Happy happy resolution, we graduate, do big photoshoot...

Eh what the hell? Reload, screw Shizune (metaphorically) and screw Misha (literally). Hmm, nothing else seems to have changed that much... what... Shizune? What?

That. Doesn't. Make. Sense.

Screw you Bad Shizune Ending. Leaving deaf-mute cuties on the steps like that is dickish.

Lilly: Oh Lilly, you are so erudite.

Aww man, this is awesome, we're going out, buying gifts for the child Hanako, enjoying the world. Yup, it's sure good to be crippled.

You're going to Scotland? Oh, Hanako and I will be just fine.

H-Hanako?! *dials Lilly's number,* "Lilly, she's locking herself up! Heeeeelp!"

No wait. Hanako is fine. Hmm...

"Hi Lilly, how's Scotland?" Mmm... love her voice...

Akira, despite being a woman, is the best bro. Ever. Free house for the weekend!

Woo~ feels top of the world- HHHHNNNNNG. (Forgot to take my meds. Stupid.)

Man, I love Lilly. So much. Wow... she's so... unrestrained. Oh wow... that's kinda k-kinky... :smallredface:

Oh god, I feel like I'm peeking now.

Hello again Akira. You're looking as lovely today as- *SPITTAKE* What? Use protection as well?! SHE KNEW. SHE KNEW.

Date date date.

Wow, is... is it getting hot in here? This is so... Hisao, you lucky bastard. Blindfolded sex- HHHNNNNNG. ([Expletive] my heart. Ruin a perfectly good moment.)

Mmm... feels like we're a couple.

What. No. Going away to Scotland forever? NO. NO.

Mope mope. Ah what the hell. RUN AFTER HER.

Yes. YES. Hisao, you might just make it to the airport! YES! YES-

Goddamn, I hate your heart.

Wait. Lilly! YOU CAME BACK FOR ME! YES YES YES.

Hooray for the only route with an epilogue of sorts.

I need to dredge up the other two routes soon.

I love Rin. She is so wonderfully vague and emotional.

[Moonshadow]

I only got Emi's good ending so far.

This game makes me feel horrible though. It's just so emotional. But in a good way. The writing is awesome.

Thatfeelwhentoomuchfeel.jpg

[Newman]

Hisao is such a nice guy.

[ninja_penguin]

Played Rin's path all the way through, as that was the one that had most interested me in the demo.

Very different then expected. The mid-path downer hit a few buttons I didn't know I still had; the ending was nice enough that I'm not sure I want to replay any other paths.

[littlebottom]

i hate you guys... i popped into this thread completely oblivious little over 24 hours ago, and now i have had to hand in my man-card because i almost cried like a little girl, thanks all.

but in all seriousess I WANT TO HOLD HANAKO SO TIGHT AND NEVER LET GO.

yeah i played it to the end of hanako... i thought "ahh ill go along with this, see what its like" i wasnt expecting much, infact i was expecting to get pretty annoyed with it pretty quick, but i found myself obligated to push on and on, becoming engrossed. i found myself randomly bouncing about at first, but then i was intruiged by hanakos first main part, and then decided to run in that direction, and god i wish i hadnt... well im glad i did, but kinda wish i hadnt. dont know why, i just related a bit too much.

Ive had a rough time in my life, but god i feel pathetic comparing myself now to any given person who has had it 1/10th as bad as hanako.

seriously guys, help me, cheer me up, im still sad now :smallfrown:

[Nerd-o-rama]

Katawa Shoujo: disabilities and manly tears.

[Astrella]

*snip*

I don't know, Hanako's path hit me pretty hard as well. I haven't had the heart to finish the other paths.

[Leecros]

I don't know, Hanako's path hit me pretty hard as well. I haven't had the heart to finish the other paths.

this.


it doesn't help that Hanako reminds me so much of my actual real life girlfriend...with the exception of the dead parents and the scars.

the fact that i can make that connection though...Well done, creators of Katawa Shoujo, well done.

[Newman]

seriously guys, help me, cheer me up, im haz a sad now :smallfrown:

Here. Have some Fluttershy.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtHKInrdM8I)

And now I'm thinking of a crossover between the two shows...
Very approximately, we could say that


Ibarazaki Emi overlaps with Rainbow Dash and Applejack, in their "proud athlete daredevil" aspect. Bearer of the element of ??????
Ikezawa Hanako overlaps with Fluttershy and Twilight in the "bookworm wallflower" aspect. Bearer of the element of Loyalty.
Satō Lilly overlaps with Rarity and Twilight in the "leading and cultured" aspect. Bearer of the element of the element of Kindness.
Tezuka Rin overlaps with Rarity and Pinkie Pie in the "excentric zany artist" aspect. Bearer of the element of BluntnessHonesty.
Hakamichi Shizune overlaps with Twilight and Applejack in the "proud but awkward leader". Bearer of the element of Generosity.
Mikado Shiina (Misha) is overlaps with Pinkie Pie and Rainbow Dash in their "teasing and boisterous sense of humour" aspect. Bearer of the element of Laughter.


Yeah, when I begun writing that list I thought I could pull a 1:1, but it just don't work that way. And that's just "Personality in Broad Strokes", don't get me started on the hidden depths and backstories. And I can't figure out Emi's virtue... Magic? *snort snort* (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSf9aEETnvE)

[littlebottom]

I don't know, Hanako's path hit me pretty hard as well. I haven't had the heart to finish the other paths.

Yeah. exactly the same i dont know how i could go with anyone else now.

I was part way into it going "ill do it again for someone else but who?" but now i just feel that if i did start it again, i couldnt no do Hanako, because i dont want to go off with someone else when i know what shes going through already...


this.


it doesn't help that Hanako reminds me so much of my actual real life girlfriend...with the exception of the dead parents and the scars.

the fact that i can make that connection though...Well done, creators of Katawa Shoujo, well done.

yes... very well done.

But i equally hate them for doing this to me, putting me through this pain:smallfrown:

i dont know why, its just hit me really hard. ive spent all day just shuffling around grunting because im just lost in my thoughts...

ahhh cheer up me! its not the end of the world for another 11 months.

[Inhuman Bot]

I'm confused now. Are you quoting something or do you genuinely say it's a bad thing this game came to exist?

Depends. What is your stance on objectifying people?

[ninja_penguin]

I'd say that in Rin's path, at least, there's no real objectification. I'll admit that when I first heard about Katawa Shoujo I rolled my eyes, and eventually wandered over from /tg/ with the backhanded praise of 'shockingly inoffensive' when the Act 1 demo came out. Played through it expecting to roll my eyes and go 'wow, how creepy.' Came out pleasantly surprised and actually interested in reading up the rest of Rin's story. Reading through it with the full release was actually pretty interesting and I feel like her disability was background information to the rest of the ongoing story. I obviously can't speak for any other areas of the game.

I guess I'm also impressed that they managed to actually release everything, given all its background.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I'd say the women of this game are generally speaking who the story is about. There's no real objectification, even if the viewpoint character obviously thinks about their attractiveness. So far what I've read so far has been pretty much entirely the drama of a few peoples' school lives, with a couple of sex scenes as tastefully done as in any mass-market non-romance novel I've read. In fact, even the disability angle becomes more or less background information, or at most thematic. Shizune's route, for example, seems to fundamentally be about communication and the best way to convey and receive emotions. Her deafness is at most symbolic of that, and in terms of actual text mostly added flavor to conversations. Oh, and of course it was the catalyst for her relationship with Misha, which is very important once you get on in the route, but...it's still not "oh, Shizune's deaf lol". It's a present thing, but it's neither the point of the story nor treated disrespectfully.

I'll get back to you on the other routes.

[Sheep Overlord]

Much respect.

Not the sort of thing I'd ever tried before, but here I am three hours later. . . Definitely quite emotional.

[AlterForm]

I'd say the women of this game are generally speaking who the story is about.

[snip]

I'll get back to you on the other routes.

Perhaps it's just the routes I've played so far (Hanako + Lilly), but I'd add that while the women absolutely get center stage most of the time, Hisao has his own subplot regarding (spoiler)what he'll do with his future(/spoiler). It's woven into the main romance plot and very apropos, IMO, considering the game is set in Yamaku High School, and anyone of at least Hisao's age should be able to relate to that particular source of angst.

And now, I'm off to win over Emi ... then I'm not sure if I should do Rin or Shizune next.

[hanzo66]

Yeah, I agree that the subject matter is handled tastefully. The H-scenes as well. "Do You Like Horny Bunnies" this game is not.

[Moonshadow]

I just like how it doesn't focus on the disabilities of the girls, and just treats them like they were just ordinary messed up people. You really get to know them as people, which really helps make it a great story.

[Inhuman Bot]

Objectifying wasn't the right word. Infantilizing, maybe, would be more accurate. Regardless on my thoughts on the quality of writing, this is just porn. {Scrubbed}

Let me try to explain, a little.

The game started off as a joke concept, because of of the tendency to fetishize dependency and vulnerability in Japan's nerd culture. Eventually, it was made into 'a real thing'. *

Subsets of Japanese culture have developed the habit of having (fetish or otherwise) porn masquerade as something else, because there's a lot of people who buy into it as a lifestyle. It's not just porn, porn, this is all porn for all your porny needs. It's supposed to be immersing, an escapist fantasy that lets the theoretical nerd pretend that they're actually talking and falling in love with the character. The actual, explicit content does not need to be the majority of the content. There doesn't even need to be much of that at all. The game (Visual novel?) is centered on building a fake emotional connection with these characters. The sense of attachment is also a desire to protect these characters; The aforementioned theoretical person condescendingly sees the character as needing them, and being incapable of rejecting them. This is how these games work.

This is how their fetish works.


Yeah, I agree that the subject matter is handled tastefully. The H-scenes as well. "Do You Like Horny Bunnies" this game is not.

I have no idea what this is beyond Something Awful having 'review' on it but I don't think I want to know.

*I do not have first hand knowledge of this. I have been told this by three people, two of whom viewed this in a much more positive light then I do.

[Water_and_Wind]

Subsets of Japanese culture have developed the habit of having (fetish or otherwise) porn masquerade as something else, because there's a lot of people who buy into it as a lifestyle. It's not just porn, porn, this is all porn for all your porny needs. It's supposed to be immersing, an escapist fantasy that lets the theoretical nerd pretend that they're actually talking and falling in love with the character. The actual, explicit content does not need to be the majority of the content. There doesn't even need to be much of that at all. The game (Visual novel?) is centered on building a fake emotional connection with these characters. The sense of attachment is also a desire to protect these characters; The aforementioned theoretical person condescendingly sees the character as needing them, and being incapable of rejecting them. This is how these games work.

This is how their fetish works.

Maybe, but this is not a Japanese game. The original concept yes, but all the actual development is done by an international team of volunteers.

More importantly, the disabilities are not being fetishized, nor are the girls weak and dependent on the main character Hisao. In fact, having played through 90% of the game, the story is as much about him coming to terms with his disability as it is about whatever problems his partner is facing.

I think you should play Hanako's route, it directly addresses some of the issues you have with this game.

[Astrella]

Objectifying wasn't the right word. Infantilizing, maybe, would be more accurate. Regardless on my thoughts on the quality of writing, this is just porn. {Scrub the post, scrub the quote}

*shrug*

If you think it doesn't fit here, report it; it's not your call to make.

Edit: And if anything, the message the game gives is the exact opposite of objectification.

[StrikeNoir105E]

Objectifying wasn't the right word. Infantilizing, maybe, would be more accurate. Regardless on my thoughts on the quality of writing, this is just porn. {Scrub the post, scrub the quote}


You make it sound like you played the game, when in fact you haven't, and thus cannot really make an objective assessment on the quality of the game. It is unfair to call Katawa Shoujo a "porn with plot" without seeing what it's about. It's labelling at its most inaccurate. And here's why:



Let me try to explain, a little.

The game started off as a joke concept, because of of the tendency to fetishize dependency and vulnerability in Japan's nerd culture. Eventually, it was made into 'a real thing'. *


There's actually nothing so "deep" about the origins of the concept. The concept for the game came about from a bonus sketch created by manga artist RAITA (who designed the characters for the critically acclaimed Valkyria Chronicles). He made a sketch about 5 girls with disabilities as a joking concept for a Visual Novel that he said he'd personally like to play. Cue 4ch's /a/ boards discovering the concept and finding it so interesting that after much discussion, a small team of developers from around the world who had heard the concept came together to bring it into fruition.

The only concern of 4 Leaf Studios in creating this game was... creating it and eventually telling their own story. Nothing about exploiting Japan's "tendency to fetishize dependency and vulnerability".



Subsets of Japanese culture have developed the habit of having (fetish or otherwise) porn masquerade as something else, because there's a lot of people who buy into it as a lifestyle. It's not just porn, porn, this is all porn for all your porny needs. It's supposed to be immersing, an escapist fantasy that lets the theoretical nerd pretend that they're actually talking and falling in love with the character. The actual, explicit content does not need to be the majority of the content. There doesn't even need to be much of that at all. The game (Visual novel?) is centered on building a fake emotional connection with these characters.



The first mistake in your assumption is that the game has to subscribe to Japanese mindsets just because of the Japanese title. The game itself was inspired by a Japanese drawing sure, but the final product itself was made by non-Japanese people - Americans, Australians, Indonesians, Filipinos etc. The game itself does not fall victim to the traditional Japanese entertainment mindsets as a result, and in fact the story itself is somewhat bent towards Western sensibilities.

As an aside though, ALL fictional stories, whether from Japan, America, Greece, Rome, England etc. throughout all times whether medieval, Renaissance or modern, are made to immerse the viewer into believing the fantasy of the story in the moment they partake in it, and emotional attachment to the characters of the story is the best way to achieve this.



The sense of attachment is also a desire to protect these characters; The aforementioned theoretical person condescendingly sees the character as needing them, and being incapable of rejecting them. This is how these games work.

The interesting thing about bringing this viewpoint up is that Katawa Shoujo actually addresses this idea directly, and then proceed to kick it in its proverbial nuts. One of the more heartbreaking bad endings of the story involves making choices that make Hisao (the main character) be a white knight: insensitive of the girl's feelings and seeing them only as fragile damsels in distress to be rescued, and thus ends up in her rejecting him - which you claimed they would be incapable of in this kind of story. (In fact, ALL the girl's story paths have the option of ultimately rejecting the main lead based on your choices, all of which aren't clear-cut black and white in their outcome). These characters do not need to be condescendingly looked down upon as broken personas in need of fixing, but like all desire only love and companionship as equals. Considering I used to have that kind of "White Knight" syndrome that led to me breaking up with an ex years before, the story really nails that particular lesson hard.

What makes it work in this story is the fact that the main protagonist himself is also broken. In fact has the worst disability of the lot - where all the other characters are only inconvenienced by their conditions, his can actually end his life at any second should be be careless (heart arrhythmia, or more precisely Long QT Syndrome (http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/health-topics/topics/qt/) according to the devs), - and thus is not in the best position to be the "protective white knight".

Thus, I can say with certainty that the "fetish" stereotype you attribute to this game is completely and utterly false. Visual Novels are not a genre of storytelling afterall, they are a storytelling medium, and thus the kinds of stories that they can tell aren't limited to one "fetish".



I have no idea what this is beyond Something Awful having 'review' on it but I don't think I want to know.


Well, he just described the game as not being "porn with plot", and I agree with him. Katawa Shoujo, like its subject matter, is a surprisingly well-written, sensitive, and mature story in its treatment of the issue of disabilities and how to view people with disabilities: as people, nothing more or less.

[Byrnbot08]

I would rather much discuss the actual game here, over the uninformed thoughts and opinions of one person.

I would like to point out that 4LS has yet to release the soundtrack. I am eagerly awaiting the ability to put Parity onto my MP3 player. Thoughts on soundtracks and their appropriate use within the story?

I still shake a bit when I hear Shadow of the Truth. :smallfrown:

[Nerd-o-rama]

I'm not going to get involved with defending this novel further than I have. Any statements I make about it would be made far better by actually reading the thing instead of making generalizations about its genre.


Perhaps it's just the routes I've played so far (Hanako + Lilly), but I'd add that while the women absolutely get center stage most of the time, Hisao has his own subplot regarding (spoiler)what he'll do with his future(/spoiler). It's woven into the main romance plot and very apropos, IMO, considering the game is set in Yamaku High School, and anyone of at least Hisao's age should be able to relate to that particular source of angst.

And now, I'm off to win over Emi ... then I'm not sure if I should do Rin or Shizune next.

That subplot is certainly present on Shizune's route, too. In fact, having finished Shizune's route (both endings) last night, I have a few comments on it. First of all, I'm glad I did it first, because...it's very simple. It's straightforward, episodic, very basic high school drama stuff. It's fun to read, but it lacks the High Drama I've heard about on other routes. If people are wondering about a reading order, I'd probably recommend reading it either first, to get a taste for the setting with only a few angsty moments, or as a breather between more emotional routes like (from what I hear) Hanako's or Rin's. It is the slice of life route, where the only thing really on the line is a couple of friendships. I am not saying this to get down on the route - I really enjoyed it. I just felt the need to articulate what I think works about it after seeing a number of complaints on other sites.

The episodic straightforwardness even works with Shizune's personality, as that is explicitly stated to be how she sees the world - a series of challenges to engage in, win or lose, then move on from. Which makes it appropriate that the only continuous plot thread in her route is actually the very subtle (until the end of act 3) Misha plot line: their entire conflict stems from the fact that Shizune compartmentalizes her life like that, and Misha can't.

Honestly, the only thing I'll complain about is you get one freaking dialog choice the entire route. Seriously. That's another reason I recommend it for a first route, even though I'm pretty sure it's non-indicative of the other stories. It's easymodo.

Oh, and it would have been nice to resolve some of her issues with Lily, but the fishing trip was enough of a detente, I guess.


EDIT: And as I sit here in the office, the thought occurs to me: Hisao drinks a lot of coffee for someone with a potentially terminal heart condition. Stuff plays merry hell with your blood pressure. He should really stick to lower caffeine drinks.

[AlterForm]

Emi route spoilers (Act 2); Bad End spoilers
Kenji: "If I were to kill someone, I'd do it by throwing them off the roof and making it look like an accident."

>> Act 1 Bad End
>> Manly Picnic
>> Hisao "stumbles" off roof

Damnit, Kenji, stop making me paranoid. :smallannoyed:

[Astrella]

Emi route spoilers (Act 2 or 3, I think); Bad End spoilers
Kenji: "If I were to kill someone, I'd do it by throwing them off the roof and making it look like an accident."

>> Act 1 Bad End
>> Manly Picnic
>> Hisao "stumbles" off roof

Damnit, Kenji, stop making me paranoid. :smallannoyed:

Oh, yes. :smallannoyed:
That certainly made me do a double take.

[ninja_penguin]

For what it's worth, plot theme wise:

Re: Rin's Path
One of the things that seems to come up with that one is the difference in perspectives of things. Rin seems to have issues with what's important, how to express that, and then having other people properly pick up on said meaning. Also some bits about balancing out what you're good at, what you enjoy, and what is meaningful to you. Hisao's end in this path seems to be the problem of being attracted to something because it's unique and different, but when you get right up next to it you can't fully comprehend it anymore.

[EifieFlare]

I would like to point out that 4LS has yet to release the soundtrack. I am eagerly awaiting the ability to put Parity onto my MP3 player. Thoughts on soundtracks and their appropriate use within the story?

I still shake a bit when I hear Shadow of the Truth. :smallfrown:

I don't know about the entire soundtrack, but they did put up all of the characters' themes for download (http://dl.katawa-shoujo.com/pr/sample/music/) on the website. So, at least you can get Parity now.

As for appropriate use of music, is it wrong for me to think that the song playing during Lilly's good ending is sort of annoying? Particularly,

It feels like the sound of that musicbox doesn't seem to fit the situation. You've got the girl you love crying over you in a hospital while the two of you discuss the event that sent you there along with your future, and suddenly you get treated to this high-pitched trill for 3 seconds. That sort of ruins the effect for me, I think. I understand that it was instrumental in showing that Lilly came back for you when the scene starts, but they still could have switched to a different song or something.

[Newman]

The music for this story is such a freaking earworm...

[Inhuman Bot]

You make it sound like you played the game, when in fact you haven't, and thus cannot really make an objective assessment on the quality of the game.

I had intended the quoted comment and the one immediately following to indicate that I hadn't actually played through it, and everything was second hand knowledge. When I talked about the quality of writing, "my thoughts" don't exist. I don't know what the writing is like, it could be amazing. My point is about how, as something referred to as a 'dating sim', it doesn't matter.


LOTS OF WORDS

You're saying that because it can't possibly subscribe to Japanese mindsets, because the developers weren't from Japan? That doesn't cut it. Japanophilla/Weeaboo/Whatever term people use isn't exactly rare. I'm not saying these people are unhealthily obsessed with Japanese culture, but as it's from a message board that was started by such people, it's not out of the question either.

Secondly, you brought up how every work of fiction is escapism. That's true. Escapism, in and of itself, isn't bad. What I consider questionable though, is the porn. I mean, if this is supposed to be an outstanding piece of writing, why does there even need to be 'on camera' sex? It's part of some relations, but if it can easily be cut out with the press of a button, why is it there at all? The existence of it just weakens the point of it being anything other then something for people to use as porn.

I don't object to porn itself, either. I really don't care. But this does come across as trying to pretend to be something it isn't. All media effects everyone. From what I saw it came across as a creepy 'moe' sort of thing.

Fake edit: I haven't actually played the whole game or anything, but I watched someone else play it over her shoulder. From what I saw, the writing does have at least one problem. The narration. Aside from being rather.. Dull, it also felt like it was being used to skip over a lot of stuff in what I assume was an attempt to avoid writing dialogue or create new scenes. I'll concede that there may have been one part of exceptionally mediocre writing vs the rest.


*shrug*

If you think it doesn't fit here, report it; it's not your call to make.



It has been clearly stated (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151960) that if anything could be even potentially, vaguely constituted as sexuallized, then it doesn't belong here.


I would rather much discuss the actual game here, over the uninformed thoughts and opinions of one person.


I'll make sure I read the wiki before I post here again.

[tensai_oni]

The thread you linked is about images. Not discussion. There is nothing NSFW about this thread.

Also do you realize that by going "now I am not saying these people are not weeaboos, but I am not saying they are not either" you are being very offensive?

Do you object to any works having sexual content, or just Japanese* ones? Sex is a natural thing, and not unexpected in a relationship. It's a beautiful and creative force. As long as it's done tastefully and the viewer is mature, it is not a bad thing. And Katawa Shoujo's is done tastefully.

*Includes Japanese-inspired multinational titles.

[Nerd-o-rama]

And carefully, loudly, and repeatedly marked "18+", just in case. Aside from that, we're not discussing anything explicitly in this thread or anywhere on this board. Before this line of discussion was started people only mentioned the sex scenes in vague terms discussing literary quality.

[AlterForm]

As for appropriate use of music, is it wrong for me to think that the song playing during Lilly's good ending is sort of annoying? Particularly,

It feels like the sound of that musicbox doesn't seem to fit the situation. You've got the girl you love crying over you in a hospital while the two of you discuss the event that sent you there along with your future, and suddenly you get treated to this high-pitched trill for 3 seconds. That sort of ruins the effect for me, I think. I understand that it was instrumental in showing that Lilly came back for you when the scene starts, but they still could have switched to a different song or something.

(Same topic)
The worst part of it, for me, was that it was only set to play for about 3 or 4 text boxes, so I only heard it for a few bars before being interrupted rather harshly by the BGM. Kinda spoiled the moment. :smallyuk:

[Newman]

Secondly, you brought up how every work of fiction is escapism. That's true. Escapism, in and of itself, isn't bad. What I consider questionable though, is the porn. I mean, if this is supposed to be an outstanding piece of writing, why does there even need to be 'on camera' sex? It's part of some relations, but if it can easily be cut out with the press of a button, why is it there at all? The existence of it just weakens the point of it being anything other then something for people to use as porn.

I don't object to porn itself, either. I really don't care. But this does come across as trying to pretend to be something it isn't. All media effects everyone. From what I saw it came across as a creepy 'moe' sort of thing.

I'll make sure I read the wiki before I post here again.

You know, I always fail to understand why the inclusion of explicit depictions of sexuality is supposed, by iself, to affect the quality of a work one way or the other. There also seems to be a double standard: there are many films with very racy sex scenes in them that no-one suspects even remotely of being porn. The most recent example that comes to mind is the Game Of Thrones miniseries, but I could also mention The Matrix Revolutions, Watchmen, Mr. & Mrs. Smith, Troy, Avatar...

The sex scenes in Katawa Shoujo are there to increase the emotional load. You can omit them, if you're a delicate prude, but the implication of sex does not have the same narrative impact as the full depiction thereof. You won't miss any key elements of the story (unlike, say, in Game of Thrones, where the sex scenes invariably feature absolutely vital exposition and are therefore unskippable if you want to actually understand the plot), it won't be crippled, but it certainly won't be in peak condition.

Katawa Shoujo isn't pretending to be anything. Katawa Shoujo is Katawa Shoujo, a well-written illustrated novel with alternate narrative paths that depicts crippled teenagers having sex. That's what it does, and it does it well. Whether it's usable as porn or not, intended as porn or not, is utterly irrelevant to its quality as a narrative work.

That said, I will certify that, as porn, it is worse than useless. The seer amount of hours of gameplay and character building you'd go through before getting anywhere near undressed is so titanic, the person who'd have played the game expressly for that purpose would have given up halfway in. And once you get there, you're so emotionally invested that the very idea of fapping simply never crosses your mind.

And yes, it's slow-paced and subdued. It's a freaking romance novel featuring normal people living in a normal setting. What did you expect? Something like this?


Overcome with his intense passion, Drake manfully thrust hard with his throbbing equipment, again and again, oblivious to the inevitable consequences of his actions and reveling in the sensual pleasure of using his electric toothbrush in a simple to and fro motion rather than brushing in small circles as his dentist had advised, and hoping that Cecelia would appreciate his minty fresh breath over dinner later that evening more than the damage he was doing to his enamel.


I'll make sure I read the wiki before I post here again.

Don't read the wiki, play the darned game. At least finish Act 1 (it's mostly the prologue that decides which girl you'll try to end with: nothing exciting happens, and there's zero drama, but it's your opportunity to meet everyone, and, hopefully, grow attatched)

[Nerd-o-rama]

Or if sex is that much of a sticking point to you, there's always the old Act 1 demo that is 100% free of all sexual content, unless you count one scene of thoroughly censored male nudity that's there strictly for comedy.

[Deme]

So, I just got this, because I'm a fan of visual novels and dating sims.

And, oddly enough, the discussion of porn vs not porn has actually gotten me to turn the mature content back on. I'm generally kind of annoyed by dating sims and/or visual novels with mature content, but this sounds... Well... Relatively mature, if you understand my meaning.

Like even though I've got no interest in sex, and seeing sex depicted without concern for the sort of character dynamics involved or the like is, in its own right, just sort of 'uninteresting' to 'annoying, in various grades, from mildly to extremely' to me, there'd still be something worth seeing for me in the adult scenes here. Am I about right in this belief, or would my interests be better served with the filter on again?

[Nerd-o-rama]

Oh, I'd say it avoids the pitfalls you mention. I can't speak for scenes I haven't seen, but on Shizune's route at least, the characters involved have their personalities come through a great deal, and it's not just rote description with no concern for storytelling flow or purpose in the larger narrative, if you know what I mean.

[A Rainy Knight]

I've never really played a visual novel or anything like this before, but I got it today after seeing it here on the forums, and I'm enjoying it so far. Currently going for Hanako's route since I'm a sucker for the nervous, shy types.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I've never really played a visual novel or anything like this before, but I got it today after seeing it here on the forums, and I'm enjoying it so far. Currently going for Hanako's route since I'm a sucker for the nervous, shy types.

Haaaave fun with that.

[Leecros]

Haaaave fun with that.

aww...don't sound so ominous. It's a perfectly enjoyable route



Until...:smallamused:

[Newman]

I've never really played a visual novel or anything like this before, but I got it today after seeing it here on the forums, and I'm enjoying it so far. Currently going for Hanako's route since I'm a sucker for the nervous, shy types.


http://www.plumasdecaballo.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/chico.jpg
"You're a sucker (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sucker_%28slang%29) alright."

(Quick, someone give Chico Light Yagami's earphones (http://spb.fotolog.com/photo/27/21/91/alzophokuz/1226422522977_f.jpg)...)

Seriously, you've been HAD, HAD I tell ya!

[A Rainy Knight]

Well, now I'm just even more curious than I was before. :smallamused:

[ex cathedra]

Rin's path is likely the most intensely depressing and emotionally exhausting thing that I've experienced in months. Unfortunately, it was also the last path that I finished, and it left me feeling really terrible for a couple of days. This is kind of the first time I've felt comfortable thinking about it since.

Shizune was kind of endearing, but writing was sloppy and I didn't feel like her path had any real focus in the third and fourth acts. A shame, really.

Lilly's path, and to a lesser extent Hanako's, struck me as the most fulfilling. To be fair, it was quite straight forward, but I found that kind of charming.

There was one particular minor character that I didn't understand; Mika. She has an ambient presence in a variety of paths, and then she randomly shows up at certain path branches as some super friendly girl with oddly relevant advice. She might have had an additional scene or two that I missed, but I don't know where it was or how to access it and last time I tried I was too upset to make any real progress. I'm sitting at a library completion percent of something in the high 90s, so I wouldn't be surprised if she's a poorly fleshed out as she seems.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Yeah...based on what everyone's said, I think the ideal way I personally could go about finishing this is Shizune -> Rin -> Emi -> Hanako -> Lily.

The goal here is to alternate "simple and relatively low-key plot" with "things people are talking about being emotionally draining". And I've gotten spoiled on Lily's ending and that honestly sounds like the best note to end the game on.

[ex cathedra]

The goal here is to alternate "simple and relatively low-key plot" with "things people are talking about being emotionally draining". And I've gotten spoiled on Lily's ending and that honestly sounds like the best note to end the game on.

I think that this is an accurate assessment.

[Dragonus45]

Been waiting for this for so long, so worth the wait. Plus the option to make it pg13 is nice. Now if only they would stop trying so hard to make me cry.

[ninja_penguin]

Rin's path is likely the most intensely depressing and emotionally exhausting thing that I've experienced in months. Unfortunately, it was also the last path that I finished, and it left me feeling really terrible for a couple of days. This is kind of the first time I've felt comfortable thinking about it since.

The good ending actually went pretty well and was very good to me and my mental state at the time. I do agree that partway through is pretty soul crushing.

[ex cathedra]

The good ending actually went pretty well and was very good to me and my mental state at the time. I do agree that partway through is pretty soul crushing.

That's fair. Unfortunately, I actually got the good ending before the bad (well, worst. technically the path has several bad endings) ending, and my curiosity compelled me to load up and see how that ended. So, that was more or less my last impression of the game, unfortunately.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Yeeeeah...I made sure to do Shizune's bad end first and then go get the good one to cheer myself up.

Then again, you have to try to get Shizune's bad end. Honestly going from President Linear to looking at Rin's route on a flowchart...holy crap, man.

[A Rainy Knight]

Thoughts on Hanako's route:
After seeing how it played out (pretty sure I got the good ending), I almost feel ashamed of myself after realizing how frighteningly spot-on Lilly's warning to you at the final choice is. For lack of better terminology than the ones from TV Tropes, in hindsight, it seems like her entire story beats you over the head with a deconstruction of the whole "woobie" character. Perhaps even a little jab that your instinctive reaction to protect her doesn't help her any more than other people's instinctive reactions of revulsion at her scars? Still enjoyed it, though.

[EifieFlare]

Thoughts on Hanako's route:
After seeing how it played out (pretty sure I got the good ending), I almost feel ashamed of myself after realizing how frighteningly spot-on Lilly's warning to you at the final choice is. For lack of better terminology than the ones from TV Tropes, in hindsight, it seems like her entire story beats you over the head with a deconstruction of the whole "woobie" character. Perhaps even a little jab that your instinctive reaction to protect her doesn't help her any more than other people's instinctive reactions of revulsion at her scars? Still enjoyed it, though.

That's actually exactly what they were going for, and I'll admit that I felt the same after everything was over. They drive the point home even more in Lilly's route, actually:

Hanako develops more as an individual in Lilly's route than in her own. While you and Lilly are managing your relationship instead of doting over her, she manages to socialize and make new friends since she's on her own more often. Funnily enough, towards the end of the route she even has better vacation plans and more friends than Hisao. Reading Lilly's route right after reading Hanako's excellently amplifies the message you get from Hanako's, in my opinion.

[Newman]

There's a reason Lilly is the hardest girl to get. I think you're intended to go from easiest to hardest, and from extrovert to introvert.

[A Rainy Knight]

That's actually exactly what they were going for, and I'll admit that I felt the same after everything was over. They drive the point home even more in Lilly's route, actually:

Hanako develops more as an individual in Lilly's route than in her own. While you and Lilly are managing your relationship instead of doting over her, she manages to socialize and make new friends since she's on her own more often. Funnily enough, towards the end of the route she even has better vacation plans and more friends than Hisao. Reading Lilly's route right after reading Hanako's excellently amplifies the message you get from Hanako's, in my opinion.

Well, that just solidifies my choice to do Lilly's route next, mainly since seeing her so often in Hanako's got me more interested in her background. As an aside, though: are all the routes as emotionally gripping as Hanako's? Because I've been taking advantage of the fact that I have a lot of time to play this on my laptop on my bed at night, and I'm thinking it isn't coincidence I slept pretty uneasily right after playing through
Hanako's panic attack.
Maybe I should just stick to playing this when I can during the day...

[Leecros]

As an aside, though: are all the routes as emotionally gripping as Hanako's?

Well, i'm playing through Emi's route now and i definitely think that Hisao should have definitely considered the possibility of
running off and becoming a pirate with her.

[Tome]

Having played Shizune, Rin and Emi's routes, I'll say that Emi's route - barring any suprises from Lilly, is probably the most upbeat of them. There's some dark moments but overall it's a pretty bright route with one of the more satisfying endings - almost certainly so for Hisao when you think about it.

Shizune's route is pretty upbeat too though. The relationship stuff is mostly over and done with by the end of Act 2, and the remaining Acts actually focus more on slice of life, the Student Council and getting to know Shizune. The only downer part is possibly the Misha subplot, but Shizune takes care of it in the good end.

[ex cathedra]

There's a reason Lilly is the hardest girl to get. I think you're intended to go from easiest to hardest, and from extrovert to introvert.

I don't follow. Lilly's route, as far as I recall, was very easy, and she isn't particularly introverted. Rin's route was relatively difficult, since there were multiple choices that led to bad endings in multiple acts, and many of the decisions that you make were extraordinarily vague. In most of the paths, in my opinion, most of your options are pretty cut and dry. If you do the 'right' thing everything ends well. Rin's route doesn't make it that easy, since some of the decisions are conflicting and even seemingly random.

While I hesitate to put it this way, I think that Emi and Lilly have the least "baggage" of all of the possible girls, while Rin and Hanako have the most. I feel that this generally correlates to how arduous their respective paths are.

[Inhuman Bot]

Don't read the wiki, play the darned game. At least finish Act 1 (it's mostly the prologue that decides which girl you'll try to end with: nothing exciting happens, and there's zero drama, but it's your opportunity to meet everyone, and, hopefully, grow attatched)

I was basically saying "so I'm done" but I figured I'd be more mature then that.

I tried the first act and the writing quality doesn't jump out at me. Especially the narration which is just bad.

As for the rest of my points.. I don't really feel swayed. But we can agree to disagree, and I'll never post in this thread again, which I'm sure works for the rest of you.

[littlebottom]

@inhuman bot: personally, i got what you were saying 90% of the time, its more perspective than anything, the only bit i didnt get was the whole "its just porn" thing, i would make the same point as someone else did, that many other books and films have sex scenes in them and are not porn.. but yeah, anyway.

@everyone: still not gone back to it after hanako... i related too much i guess, i never expected to virtually ever face something in any media format so... emotional and saddening to me. i mean, i read a book and yeah its emotional and sad, but i dont get to feeling it myself much, i just go "aww, that was sad" ive only felt more sad at real life than hanako's story:smallfrown:

maybe im just a big wuss?

i was thinking of starting again and going after rin, but from what people are saying here, rin is a bad idea for sad and emotional?:smallconfused: i suppose ill head lilly then

[Lawless III]

I'm not usually one for VNs. I mucked around a bit in Tsukihime, but never had enough interest to finish a single route. The same friend who nagged me to get into type-moon highly recommended this. I thought this game would be so terrible and offensive that it would give me an excuse anytime he tried to these sorts of thing...

72 hours later, I have 100% completion and have cried like a kindergardener multiple times. I have rarely so enjoyed being proven wrong. I'm going to cut myself off here before I write multiple incoherent paragraphs of babbling praise for aspects of the game that other playgrounders have more eloquently covered, and simply state that since finishing it 24 hours ago, I have experienced a lingering melancholy of an intensity to rival that of when I finished Deathly Hallows, the last of a series I followed for the better part of decade.

I hope that terrible run on sentence is testimony enough.:smallredface:

[littlebottom]

i... just... what? yeah, found the kenji ending:smallannoyed: trying to get to rin, somehow missed by a mile :smalleek:

funny though.

[Astrella]

i... just... what? yeah, found the kenji ending:smallannoyed: trying to get to rin, somehow missed by a mile :smalleek:

funny though.

Were you dishonest on the evening walk with Lilly and Rin? Because that sends you straight for Kenji if you were on Rin's path at the time.

[ninja_penguin]

Yeah, getting rin's route generally requires some active work; it's not one you can fall into like Shizune's or Emi's.

[EifieFlare]

i... just... what? yeah, found the kenji ending:smallannoyed: trying to get to rin, somehow missed by a mile :smalleek:

funny though.


Were you dishonest on the evening walk with Lilly and Rin? Because that sends you straight for Kenji if you were on Rin's path at the time.

More advice:

There's also another, final option that determines whether you get to go to Rin's route or the bad end again. The one I'm talking about should be a no-brainer though, since there's really no reason to say the wrong response.

Incidentally, the choice pointed out above also prevents you from reaching Lilly's and Hanako's routes.

Does choosing one of the "bad choices" in part 1 automatically doom you to Kenji's bad end, regardless of whatever flags you've tripped thus far? Haven't really tested it myself, but it seems like it.

[ninja_penguin]

There's a few specific ones that more or less immediately put you down to the bad end. Most of them involve refusing to talk about your condition as the major offenders; otherwise if you're continually blowing off all the girls you'll end up there as well.

[Dragonus45]

I don't really feel swayed. But we can agree to disagree, and I'll never post in this thread again, which I'm sure works for the rest of you.

Best news i have heard all day.

So i just finished Rin's story as my first go through, got the good ending by pure chance so i decided to look at the rest of them as well to get the full scope of the story. And now im off to go watch some MLP to try and turn on the cheer. I think ill get a whole play list ready for Hanako's route.

[Nerd-o-rama]

So...better go with alternating normal/depressing/normal/depressing/normal like I planned then.

On the plus side I successfully got on Rin's route last night, so now for the first depressing one! I hope I don't end up feeling stoned just reading my way through it like I did her chapter 1 scenes, but I get the feeling that's what's going to happen.

[A Rainy Knight]

Another parting thought that just occurred to me about Hanako's route:
Does anyone else think there's an intentional connection between the recurring chess motifs and the fact that the ending (in one way or another) calls Hisao out on being a "white knight?"

[littlebottom]

Another parting thought that just occurred to me about Hanako's route:
Does anyone else think there's an intentional connection between the recurring chess motifs and the fact that the ending (in one way or another) calls Hisao out on being a "white knight?"

well they did say that he always moved first, which would make him white if playing chess, so quite possibly

[druid91]

If I may ask, where on the end of Movie-Game sliding scale of control would you put this?

Is it like a choose your own adventure story? Or is it more like an RPG in the literal sense?

[Newman]

I don't follow. Lilly's route, as far as I recall, was very easy, and she isn't particularly introverted. Rin's route was relatively difficult, since there were multiple choices that led to bad endings in multiple acts, and many of the decisions that you make were extraordinarily vague. In most of the paths, in my opinion, most of your options are pretty cut and dry. If you do the 'right' thing everything ends well. Rin's route doesn't make it that easy, since some of the decisions are conflicting and even seemingly random.

While I hesitate to put it this way, I think that Emi and Lilly have the least "baggage" of all of the possible girls, while Rin and Hanako have the most. I feel that this generally correlates to how arduous their respective paths are.

I meant that Lily was the hardest girl to get in the prologue, followed by Rin, followed by Hanako. Emi and Shizune are incredibly easy to get though. Emi's the only one I got past act 2 with. I thought she was kinda delicate to handle, what with her distance-keeping issues (and how badly Hisao took it... I know your pain, man...).

[Sheep Overlord]

Druid - it's more of a 'choose your own adventure', though the number of choices you will make in a single playthrough will total less than two dozen if I had to hazard a guess. You don't make choices constantly but the choice you make is important to the plot. Mostly it's like a book with anime-styled pictures and backdrops. Also, catchy music and occasionally awkward teenager sex but it's tastefully done and has plot relevance.

Of the two, I would definitely put it closer to 'movie' though very few sections are animated.

[A Rainy Knight]

If I may ask, where on the end of Movie-Game sliding scale of control would you put this?

Is it like a choose your own adventure story? Or is it more like an RPG in the literal sense?

In terms of why it's enjoyable, I'd put it pretty close to the "movie/choose your own adventure" side - you probably don't make any more than ten choices in the first act to determine which route you go down, and in each route you make maybe five or six choices to direct you towards two or three possible endings. I've found that the actual decision-making parts seem pretty rare and that all the fun is in watching the story play out.

[Nerd-o-rama]

It's a book. An extremely long version of a picture book. Hence, "visual novel".

It also has background music, the rare animation, and choices that make it very re-readable, mind, so it's a bit more complex, but it is, in essentials, a book with added features.

[AlterForm]

Shizune route:
Wow, yeah, that was easy modo. And pretty downbeat, IMO, when you consider Shizune has been fighting herself for pretty much her whole life. Misha's subplot (and associated bad end, which made me feel like a terrible person when I went back to get it) put their relationship in a weird sort of light. Glad everything turned out fairly well (bittersweet sounds about right) in the end.

Rin's route up next. I shall prepare my tissues and flowchart.


It's a book. An extremely long version of a picture book. Hence, "visual novel".

It also has background music, the rare animation, and choices that make it very re-readable, mind, so it's a bit more complex, but it is, in essentials, a book with added features.

KS is my second VN, so maybe it's more common than I think, but the fully animated sequences were a great surprise, especially coming from a team of indie game makers. Animation ain't easy or cheap, as I understand it.

[Nerd-o-rama]

They'd have been even better if they were on-model with anything else, but yeah, the little Route Start cartoons I've seen so far have been amazing for free work, and the opening sequence gave me actual chills.

[littlebottom]

just finished Rins story. quite sad, but didnt hit me anything like hanakos, maybe i didnt relate as much? ah well, whatever. still enjoyed it very much.

i guess ill have to do it again, but with who now?:smallconfused:

[AlterForm]

Just finished. Well, short of 4% scenes/CGs

Rin's Route:
In restrospect, this was definitely the right route (for me, at least) to end on. As opposed to:

All other route spoilers

Emi's route, which was too predictable/straightforward for me
Hanako's route, which had uncomfortable meta overtones
Lilly's route, which was depressing and hammered home the overtones from Hanako's route
Shizune's route, which ended on such an incredibly bittersweet note


Rin's route ended with the great line, "What's the word for when it feels inside your heart that everything in the world is alright?" [/tears]

And maybe it's just because it's the freshest in my mind, but I feel like Rin's route was also the best-written one. I definitely feel she was the most interesting character with the most interesting struggle.

Now hurry up and release the soundtrack so I can listen to Aria de l'Etoile all day, every day.

[A Rainy Knight]

A quick reaction to Lilly's route:
Oh god. I was so sure I had ended up with the bad ending and had a gnawing pit in my stomach, then Hisao decides to go after Lilly and I have hope again, then she's already gone and I'm scared again, then he runs to the airport and I have hope again, then he collapses and wakes up in the hospital and I'm scared again, then I hear the music box... ;_; My heart isn't cut out to be a rollercoaster!

[Water_and_Wind]

A quick reaction to Lilly's route:
Oh god. I was so sure I had ended up with the bad ending and had a gnawing pit in my stomach, then Hisao decides to go after Lilly and I have hope again, then she's already gone and I'm scared again, then he runs to the airport and I have hope again, then he collapses and wakes up in the hospital and I'm scared again, then I hear the music box... ;_; My heart isn't cut out to be a rollercoaster!

I guess you haven't played Rin's route then.

[littlebottom]

Rin is a deep character, its kinda of wonderful just watching her thought processes... most of the time, when she isnt busy making you upset.

[Pie Guy]

Playing through Emi's route made me want to start running, and I don't even like running.

[littlebottom]

3 down 2 to go. just did shizune's story, the ending felt... wrong, only slightly.

the whole "i want to see you again sometime soon" felt like "what?" he just admitted he loved her (although im sure by that point its self evident anyway) and they are like "well were all heading in different directions now, bye!" when to be perfectly honest, im pretty sure there wouldnt be too much difficulty with atleast hisao and shizune basically living together. okay fair enough with the direction misha was taking they might not see her for a while, but hisao decided he wanted to become a teacher at the school and shizune decided she was going to start a business of some kind (i lost what it was supposed to be, maybe it didnt say:smallconfused:) but why cant he study near where she opens her business or vice versa? kinda annoyed me a little like they were just going to put their love lives on hold for several years and not see each other for no good reason.

mild rant over, i was very... surprised at her boldness and directness with everything especially after having to coax hanako into not being too shy to talk and to try to make sense of the random babblings of rin and especially their difficulties and shizunes stories difficulty was... well... stupidly trivial, i feel that the whole misha is upset thing, although was fine overall, i kept feeling that hisao should just say "X, Y and Z" at several points i was like "why dont you just say that, its much easier and would solve the problem" ah well.

i guess it will be emi next, my least favorite character as things stand, im saving lilly for last because of her closer connection to hanako.

also rin and emi get left out of the plot lines a lot even in rins plot line there isnt much emi, i dont know about the other way round yet, but in hanakos and shizunes lilly, hanako shizune (and of course misha) all still feature atleast a bit and adds character depth you didnt know from another route.

[Astrella]

Emi's path really makes up for her sorta subpar Act 1 if that's any consolation.

[psilontech]

Just finished my first run of the game, first go being with Hanako.

Why Hanako? By God, you take one look at her and you say to me she doesn't need a giant hug and a friend.

I was a little frustrated with the main character a couple of times, but it felt pretty spot-on as to how it probably should have gone.

During Hanako's birthday party / Lily's going away party when Hanako got a little wasted and awkwardly tried to put the moves on the main character I was going to be PISSED if the situation were taken advantage of... It wasn't, not even the option. I was very pleased over this.

The circumstances concerning the H-scene left me very uncomfortable. Really thought it was a bad idea, but I guess it all worked out in the end... What constitutes the Good-End?

[Sheep Overlord]

Psilon, if I remember correctly Hanako's good end


Occurs while Lilly is still out of the country in Scotland - there is a public confession in the park, but it feels as if it ends rather abruptly. The story cuts off right after they confess, despite the fact that in other routes your relationship can continue for a longer period of time. Without spoiling any other routes, I can safely say that during Lilly's path she comes back from Japan and is at school for quite a while afterwards before her path ends. Despite the high quality of Hanako's characterization, it feels like the actual relationship between her and Hisao is never fully explored. If you like her, I would suggest doing Lilly's route next - though she isn't the focus, she does get some added character in the time after Lilly returns to Japan.

[AlterForm]

General rule: If you get an art evolution animation playing alongside your credits roll, you got the good end. If your credits are alone in a center-roll, you got the neutral/bad end, depending on your route. To wit:

Possible Endings (Good/Bad/Neutral, no spoilers) by Route
Hanako has a bad end, a neutral end, and a good end
Lilly has a neutral end and a good end
Rin has a bad end, a neutral end, and a good end
Emi has bad end and two paths to her good end
Shizune has a good end and a bad end

[Nerd-o-rama]

3 down 2 to go. just did shizune's story, the ending felt... wrong, only slightly.

the whole "i want to see you again sometime soon" felt like "what?" he just admitted he loved her (although im sure by that point its self evident anyway) and they are like "well were all heading in different directions now, bye!" when to be perfectly honest, im pretty sure there wouldnt be too much difficulty with atleast hisao and shizune basically living together. okay fair enough with the direction misha was taking they might not see her for a while, but hisao decided he wanted to become a teacher at the school and shizune decided she was going to start a business of some kind (i lost what it was supposed to be, maybe it didnt say:smallconfused:) but why cant he study near where she opens her business or vice versa? kinda annoyed me a little like they were just going to put their love lives on hold for several years and not see each other for no good reason.

As kind of anticlimactic as Shizune's ending is, it's probably the most realistic one. The trio goes their separate ways after high school, because they all have different goals. I have faith in the happy ending, though, since by this point in the story neither Hisao nor Shizune is going to let a little thing like completely different interests get in the way of what they want.

And I think Shizune's business goals are left just as vague as her dad's actual occupation. They're not important and I still have a sneaking suspicion that that family is Yakuza, so maybe we don't want to know.

[ninja_penguin]

As kind of anticlimactic as Shizune's ending is, it's probably the most realistic one. The trio goes their separate ways after high school, because they all have different goals. I have faith in the happy ending, though, since by this point in the story neither Hisao nor Shizune is going to let a little thing like completely different interests get in the way of what they want.

And I think Shizune's business goals are left just as vague as her dad's actual occupation. They're not important and I still have a sneaking suspicion that that family is Yakuza, so maybe we don't want to know.

And I know it doesn't really happen that way, I now can't stop imagining a WAHAHAHA Misha as that stereotypical 'guy who does all the talking' in those yakuza scenes where the head gangster only whispers or doesn't talk at all.

[littlebottom]

not really a spoiler but in reply to you both:stop it you too... your making me paranoid hisao started dating a mafia boss' daughter... :smallannoyed:

the problem is its all becoming believeable... i wonder what her bad ending is? being bumped off by the yakuza after an upset shizune complains to her father? :smalleek:

[EifieFlare]

stop it you too... your making me paranoid hisao started dating a mafia boss' daughter... :smallannoyed:

the problem is its all becoming believeable... i wonder what her bad ending is? being bumped off by the yakuza after an upset shizune complains to her father? :smalleek:

I find this idea quite hilarious, considering some of the dialogue you get in Lilly's route.

[littlebottom]

ive not read any of lilly's story yet, shes the last one im going to do, so ill have to wait and find out...
im about to start emi's story, thank god for skip mode, fed up of reading the intro now :smallyuk:

as you can proberbly tell, im a slow reader how long its taking me to get through all these stories.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Hakamichi side of the family: yakuza
Satou side of the family: Irish mafia

It would explain a few things about them, at least.

[A Rainy Knight]

Thoughts on Shizune's path:
I found it hard to get as attached to this one after playing through Hanako and Lilly's routes. I mean, it feels right for her character to not seem really affectionate in the conventional sense, but she came across to me as pretty irritating and abrasive for most of the story, and I never felt as much of a connection between Hisao and Shizune as I did with Lilly. Heck, the scenes in this route with Akira or Lilly in them were some of the high points for me. In short: Shizune's good and bad endings left me respectively going "Well, I guess everything turned out all right after all" and "Well crap, that's pretty depressing" where Hanako and Lilly left me more like "HAPPY TEARS ;_;" and "Oh god I have a lump of pure regret festering in my guts." Maybe the different routes are just meant for people with different tastes... after all, I've admittedly got a fondness for sappy sweetness and dramatic tearful confessions, and Shizune really isn't the type for either of those.

[JadedDM]

I couldn't really emphasize with Shizune myself. I just found her overall...unlikable. The whole time I played through her route, I found myself more drawn to Misha, actually.

Of the five girls, I liked her the least. Not to say she was badly written or anything, she just didn't resonate with me at all.

Then came the ending, where Hisao signs to Shizune "I love you" and she...doesn't sign it back.

I would rank them as thus (by own preferences, mind you):
Emi
Lily
Hanako
Misha
Rin
Emi's hot mom
Shizune

[Astrella]

The thing about Shizune is just that really isn't much attraction between them to be honest; it's more a "good friends who's groins sometimes collide" kinda thing I feel. I actually liked that Misha featured so much.

The Rose Dragon was sorta annoyed about it though, cause he really likes Shizune. Que to me suggesting that Misha shoulda run of with Shizune, not only stealing her path that way, but also Shizune herself. :smalltongue:

[littlebottom]

ive got a... conspiricy... CRAP IM TURNING INTO KENJI...

spoilers ahead, although its all about side characters so, not that bad i guess.
long story short, Kenji has talked about having a girlfriend before, and yuuko talked about having a boyfriend younger than herself, and kenji has always made himself scarce when he thinks the librarian is coming when he is in the library (well atleast that once) so... did they used to date?:smallconfused:

Ive not done Lilly's route, and im still on emi's so if the answer is somewhere along there, feel free to ignore me.

[Water_and_Wind]

ive got a... conspiricy... CRAP IM TURNING INTO KENJI...

spoilers ahead, although its all about side characters so, not that bad i guess.
long story short, Kenji has talked about having a girlfriend before, and yuuko talked about having a boyfriend younger than herself, and kenji has always made himself scarce when he thinks the librarian is coming when he is in the library (well atleast that once) so... did they used to date?:smallconfused:

Ive not done Lilly's route, and im still on emi's so if the answer is somewhere along there, feel free to ignore me.

There's also the fact that Yuuko finds the "advanced cryptography" book fascinating, and guess who else also reads that book.

[Murska]

I actually liked Shizune the most, as she was the one easiest to identify with for me. Rare, that - I don't usually find any characters I can identify with well in stories. But I just imagine we'd get along if we met, due to the whole competitive drive thing.

Not that it means I liked her route the most. Just the character.

[littlebottom]

There's also the fact that Yuuko finds the "advanced cryptography" book fascinating, and guess who else also reads that book.

yeah that was one of the other points that got me thinking it, and i forgot about it when i came to mention the ... conspirisy *SHHHHH!* DONT TALK SO LOUD! THEY MIGHT HEAR YOU!... "whos they and stop shouting, Kenji"

[Nerd-o-rama]

I am pretty sure that whole thread is intentional.

And I really like Shizune as a character, and her route as a nice, breezy low-key thing compared to most of the others (ironic, considering her personality). Could have used more path splits, but whatever, I'll live.

The reason I'm still repeating myself about Shizune's route is, of course, because I haven't had the courage to move on with the ungodly mess of choices that is Rin route.

[littlebottom]

just finished emi. it was a good route, but i was put off quite a lot by Hisao's constant idiocy... he can not put 2 and 2 together to make 4 to save his life, yet he was talking about string theory and black holes, if he is the future of our scientists i worry..

the whole "I dont know what happened to your dad" thing, She virtually told him, Her mother virtually told him. HELL the NURSE basically told him, but no, he didnt get it, it annoyed me too much to fully enjoy her story...

Lilly next (last) atleast for the good play throughs...

@nerd: Rins route is a mess, i had a look at a flow chart after i finished her story, and found out that it for the most part really doesnt matter what you say, you just get slightly different reactions or drop out of art club or something. i think its something like only the final 1 or 2 decisions that decides what ending you get with her and those are pretty obvious right choices.

[Nerd-o-rama]

@nerd: Rins route is a mess, i had a look at a flow chart after i finished her story, and found out that it for the most part really doesnt matter what you say, you just get slightly different reactions or drop out of art club or something. i think its something like only the final 1 or 2 decisions that decides what ending you get with her and those are pretty obvious right choices.

Sadly, I'm a completionist, so I'll be going back and looking at all the subroutes anyway.

[littlebottom]

ah fair enough, good luck with that one :smalltongue:

also act 2 Lilly:WHAT?! kenji thinks shes part of the mafia...? but... but... i thought you guys came up with that on your own, now im actually scared because i thought "yeah we can come up with crazy ideas doesnt make them the case" but it being hinted actually in the story... by kenji no less, the man we all know is 100% correct 100% of the time! we should totally find his journal and have a statue made of him... Gah, sorry i feel more and more like kenji everyday now:smalleek:

[AlterForm]

whatisthisidonteven (http://katawa-shoujo.com/secret/paritytime/)
(WARNING: Bright, strobing visuals)

[Nerd-o-rama]

Looks like Homestuck, somehow.

[Vauron]

The music has no connection to Nicolas Cage, so I'm not sure what made you think of Homestuck.

[dgnslyr]

Space Jam is like Guile's Theme, in that it's notorious for fitting everything. I've seen songs like that for Gurren Lagann and Evangelion. These things are pretty hilarious, in their own atrocious way.

Also, this game intrigues me, though I've never played a dating sim besides Fire Emblem. Why does this curiosity fill me with some kind of horrible fear of what I'm getting into?

[Water_and_Wind]

Fire emblem is a .... dating sim !?

Katawa shoujo is more akin to reading a romance novel (or five) than a dating sim.

[dgnslyr]

You've never realized it? It's like, 4/5 tactical RPG, 1/5 dating sim. Sure, you don't notice it as much in either Path of Radiance, where none of the supports have any kind of ending, and Radiant Dawn, which doesn't have any actual support conversations, but in the GBA games, playing around with supports amounts to something like that. Also, the conversations in Blazing Sword are hilarious. Also, if you look at Sword of Seals, there are five ladies Roy can end up with.

[ex cathedra]

Fire Emblem's dating sim side isn't as obvious as it once was. In FE4, Genealogy of the Holy War, the game is divided into two main parts, and the characters available in the second part are the children of the relationships established among the characters in the first part of the game. Just sayin'.

On the other hand, FE has actual gameplay, so... minor differences, yeah.

Anyways, this was my first experience with the genre, and I'm not sure that I really know what to think. The game was interesting, and even well-written at times, but I do hesitate to call it a game, and if that's what you're looking for I would go ahead and suggest that you move on. The name of one of the genres associated with this-- "Visual Novel"-- gives you a good idea of what you're getting into.

[Leecros]

just finished emi. it was a good route, but i was put off quite a lot by Hisao's constant idiocy... he can not put 2 and 2 together to make 4 to save his life, yet he was talking about string theory and black holes, if he is the future of our scientists i worry..

the whole "I dont know what happened to your dad" thing, She virtually told him, Her mother virtually told him. HELL the NURSE basically told him, but no, he didnt get it, it annoyed me too much to fully enjoy her story...



Based on my interpretations, i think he knew, but he didn't want to jump to conclusions.
There's several other possibilities that could have resulted from Emi's dad being in a severe car accident.
and he didn't want to guess wrong because he was afraid that emi would react hostilely* and it kind of goes back to him being a scientist a little bit. Even if you're sure about something, you don't go around theorizing about everything without at least some kind of evidence.
All he had were vague comments from a few people saying that something bad happened to Emi's dad and it probably happened on the same day of Emi's car accident. That could really have been anything at that point and he,Hisao, didn't really seem that surprised when they ended up at the graveyard either.


*That's probably one of the worst word spellings in the English language. that e wedged between two l's always frustrates me.

[littlebottom]

well i thought that too, but you get to know what hisao is thinking, so why couldnt once he go through that thought process, maybe the dad is this, maybe that? he just doesnt.:smallannoyed:

also, that spacejam mashup... is scarily good.:smalleek:

[Nerd-o-rama]

The music has no connection to Nicolas Cage, so I'm not sure what made you think of Homestuck.

I said looks like. It's the art style combined with the eye cancer.

[StrikeNoir105E]

Speaking of music, they just released the OST (http://katawashoujo.blogspot.com/2012/01/katawa-shoujo-soundtrack-up-for.html), which includes the music used for the animated cutscenes. And it's glorious.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Speaking of music, they just released the OST (http://katawashoujo.blogspot.com/2012/01/katawa-shoujo-soundtrack-up-for.html), which includes the music used for the animated cutscenes. And it's glorious.

You are a wonderful person with a fine taste in mobile suits.

[AlterForm]

Speaking of music, they just released the OST (http://katawashoujo.blogspot.com/2012/01/katawa-shoujo-soundtrack-up-for.html), which includes the music used for the animated cutscenes. And it's glorious.

As well as the extended 4LS splash video theme Spin (nice techno-y sound), and Focus, which I don't recognize. Anyone know the source on it?

[Alaris]

Teh Spoilers for EMI:
So, I don't even know how I really stumbled into her route, as I was going for Hanako initially, but I managed to just get thrown into Emi. Some decision or another, I have to assume.

While a good part of her backstory is predictable, I did really like how they portrayed her, and all of her interactions with Hisao. It was really... heartwarming at the end of the day.

Now, I'm curious too... if there's is really a way to get a "Bad End" with one of the girls, after you go onto their route. The only BAD END I've managed was the first time I played, I SOMEHOW got the Kenji-Roof Ending... yikes.

Good the Good End for her (I assume), with them being together at the end, though I was kinda hoping for more of an epilogue of sorts for Hisao himself. With Emi's Story, he starts running, getting more exercise and whatnot.. but all I really know about his plans is "Science Club."

I think I'll try for Shizune next... I'm curious how that 'relationship' will go.

[A Rainy Knight]

Thoughts on Emi's route (or at least the good end, for now):
This route was... nice, really. Emi's a fun character, and though her backstory didn't turn out to be too much different than I was expecting, I couldn't help but smile at how it ended up playing out. I felt like some of the same overtones in Hanako's route were present here, but Hanako and Emi are different enough to make it feel unique. Also, it seems like Hisao really develops himself the best in this route - I mean, he's physically healthier here, and he seems to hit it off with Mutou a lot better and develop his own passions the most.
I guess my current ranking of favorites would be:
Lilly > Hanako > Emi > Shizune
although Hanako only beat out Emi by virtue of her fantastic good ending. Now, onto Rin after having my interest piqued by her presence in Emi's route...

[JadedDM]

Regarding Emi, Alaris -

When you were running with her, did you take it easy or go for it? If you go for it and get into a race with her, that boosts your relationship with her significantly. (Also, when you were going for Hanako, did you tell Kenji she was cute or not? And did you introduce yourself to her in the library, or apologize for startling her?)

And yeah, each girl has a bad ending. Some have more than one bad ending, in fact.

[EifieFlare]

Teh Spoilers for EMI:
So, I don't even know how I really stumbled into her route, as I was going for Hanako initially, but I managed to just get thrown into Emi. Some decision or another, I have to assume.

While a good part of her backstory is predictable, I did really like how they portrayed her, and all of her interactions with Hisao. It was really... heartwarming at the end of the day.

Now, I'm curious too... if there's is really a way to get a "Bad End" with one of the girls, after you go onto their route. The only BAD END I've managed was the first time I played, I SOMEHOW got the Kenji-Roof Ending... yikes.

Good the Good End for her (I assume), with them being together at the end, though I was kinda hoping for more of an epilogue of sorts for Hisao himself. With Emi's Story, he starts running, getting more exercise and whatnot.. but all I really know about his plans is "Science Club."


It is indeed possible to get bad ends once you've gotten onto a route. You don't die in any of them though. If memory serves, Kenji's ending in Part 1 is the only ending in which you die.

[Alaris]

It is indeed possible to get bad ends once you've gotten onto a route. You don't die in any of them though. If memory serves, Kenji's ending in Part 1 is the only ending in which you die.

Moar Emi Spoilers:
Well, I went back and found Emi's bad end. Ouch... just... ouch. You do have to screw up with two choices (Screwing up by going after her at the dinner, and then LYING to Misha), but you can get a total relationship end with her... and it was... ouch. Feels crushing to have that happen...

[StrikeNoir105E]

You are a wonderful person with a fine taste in mobile suits.

Why thank you. The Noir is a sexy suit no doubt :) It's just too bad it has the least animated appearances of any main character MS ever. :(


As well as the extended 4LS splash video theme Spin (nice techno-y sound), and Focus, which I don't recognize. Anyone know the source on it?

Focus was the music used on the release trailer.

[0Megabyte]

Okay, you people.

I really didn't want to trust this game. I mean, when I heard about it in the past, it really, really sounded like it was fetishizing disabilities, and that seemed incredibly crass and creepy.

But... because it's you people, people I've been reading and occasionally talking to for awhile, I'll... *sigh* take your word for it that it isn't. That it's actually as good and well written and respectful as you claim.

If it was anyone else saying that, I would never believe it. But hey... I'm strangely curious.

[littlebottom]

Okay, you people.

I really didn't want to trust this game. I mean, when I heard about it in the past, it really, really sounded like it was fetishizing disabilities, and that seemed incredibly crass and creepy.

But... because it's you people, people I've been reading and occasionally talking to for awhile, I'll... *sigh* take your word for it that it isn't. That it's actually as good and well written and respectful as you claim.

If it was anyone else saying that, I would never believe it. But hey... I'm strangely curious.

well, 1: i cried manly tears... something that makes a man cry manly tears has to be reasonably well written at minimum. and 2: you do have the option (in options) to essentially skip the more erotic scenes incase your still afraid.

[Triscuitable]

EDIT (+wipe):

Almost finished with Lilly's story. It's really amazing, and, in my opinion, blows the other girl's routes out of the water. The only other girl who I thought was this interesting was Hanako. Of course, her route was just kind of "fire damage, tragic losses, shyness, don't pity me." I don't know why I enjoyed Lilly's more than Hanako's, but the former seems like a more believable tale, in contrast to the extreme sadness I felt when playing Hanako's route.

But you want SAD? Intentionally play Rin's route badly. You. Will. Cry.

And if you do not, you are a sick, mindless monster.

[Partysan]

I love this game. I haven't cried in several years, but damn this game brought me closer than anything I could ever imagine. I actually get slightly teary if I think about it too much.

I started out with Hanako. A purely instinctive choice - when I play a game the first time I try to play by instinct and not metagame too much - the beginner's route clearly seems to be Shizune. But I like shy girls and I am somewhat heavily scarred myself (not in the face though) and I basically latched onto her the first time she scurried into the classroom.
Goodness that one threw me around. Also, it was somewhat sadistic how they destroyed me when I followed the more defensive path... you see I have somewhat of an overactive protective instinct anyway... hero complex so to speak. Not a good thing if you play this game without metagaming, it can screw up at least two of the girls completely. But I still loved it, and her.

I immediately played Lilly afterwards, since she was close to Hanako anyway and a lot of the paths runs parallel. I also liked that one a lot, but the emotional impact of Hanako was definitely greater. That might however have been because it was more suited to my personality or because I played them in succession.

I made a pause of more than one week and played Emi. I found her path very enjoyable, although I agree that Hisao seems a bit dumb in it. Of all the paths I have played up until now, this seems to be the best for Hisao. Not only does it massively improve his health, it also sets him up for a good carreer.
Actually I had wanted to play Rin, since she is so delightfully strange and I'm kinda the same way, but Emi was easy to get into and I went along. I don't regret it one bit.

I'm going to play Shizune next, since she jumps out at one from the beginning, and save Rin for last. Rin is probably going to be a piece of work, but I'll be damned if I won't enjoy it, one way or another.

[psilontech]

Oh hey, this thing again.

I couldn't do Lilly's path again because an odd thought occurred to me:

I'm fairly certain Hanako's "I'm going to head off and TRAVEL!" thing was code for "I'm going to kill myself and don't want anyone worrying about me when they can't find me."
The whole 'I have other friends now, don't worry about me' bit didn't quite sit well with me because you never see her interact with her supposed new friends.


Lemon Lube

[AlterForm]

I love this game. I haven't cried in several years, but damn this game brought me closer than anything I could ever imagine. I actually get slightly teary if I think about it too much.

I started out with Hanako. A purely instinctive choice - when I play a game the first time I try to play by instinct and not metagame too much - the beginner's route clearly seems to be Shizune. But I like shy girls and I am somewhat heavily scarred myself (not in the face though) and I basically latched onto her the first time she scurried into the classroom.
Goodness that one threw me around. Also, it was somewhat sadistic how they destroyed me when I followed the more defensive path... you see I have somewhat of an overactive protective instinct anyway... hero complex so to speak. Not a good thing if you play this game without metagaming, it can screw up at least two of the girls completely. But I still loved it, and her.

My favorite part of Hanako's route is her bad end:
Treat her like she's fragile (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheWoobie)and can't do anything herself (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WhiteKnighting?from=Main.WhiteKnight) so it's up to you to "save" her (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IWillProtectHer)?

NOPE. TRY AGAIN. YOU HORRIBLE, TERRIBLE PERSON.

The only ending in the game that I would classify as worse than that one is Shizune's bad end:
After the huge fallout and breakup, Shizune is left pretty much alone. Hisao will no doubt drift away from her, Misha won't be talking to her much (besides council stuff) either, and she didn't have any other friends (having pushed the other students away with her personality). In essence, Shizune is left with no one to talk to as a youth-peer. That is some terrifying isolation.


I immediately played Lilly afterwards, since she was close to Hanako anyway and a lot of the paths runs parallel. I also liked that one a lot, but the emotional impact of Hanako was definitely greater. That might however have been because it was more suited to my personality or because I played them in succession.

FWIW, I think Lily-right-after-Hanako is the best way to play those two routes. Really drives home the impact of the theme of Hanako's route.


I made a pause of more than one week and played Emi. I found her path very enjoyable, although I agree that Hisao seems a bit dumb in it. Of all the paths I have played up until now, this seems to be the best for Hisao. Not only does it massively improve his health, it also sets him up for a good carreer.
Actually I had wanted to play Rin, since she is so delightfully strange and I'm kinda the same way, but Emi was easy to get into and I went along. I don't regret it one bit.

Emi Route is Pleasant Route (mostly). However, on this topic:



Lemon Lube

http://dl.dropbox.com/s/hvz18bvmnz40cys/emi_DAT_FACE.png
:smalltongue:

I'm going to play Shizune next, since she jumps out at one from the beginning, and save Rin for last. Rin is probably going to be a piece of work, but I'll be damned if I won't enjoy it, one way or another.

Rin's route is ... very ... Rinish (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ShapedLikeItself). Her good end is hands-down my favorite ending in the game though. Mad props to Aura (Rin's writer).

[Partysan]

NOPE. TRY AGAIN. YOU HORRIBLE, TERRIBLE PERSON.
*sob* I just wanted to help the girl I like...

FWIW, I think Lily-right-after-Hanako is the best way to play those two routes. Really drives home the impact of the theme of Hanako's route.
True, Lily supplements Hanako very nicely, but at the same time "using" her that way diminished her own impact a bit. I don't regret it though, as Hanako was more important to me personally.

http://dl.dropbox.com/s/hvz18bvmnz40cys/emi_DAT_FACE.png
:smalltongue:
They kinda go out of their way to repeat how they didn't like it. Gee, so it's not your thing, we got it :smallwink: Doesn't stop others...

[Triscuitable]

I couldn't do Lilly's path again because an odd thought occurred to me:

I'm fairly certain Hanako's "I'm going to head off and TRAVEL!" thing was code for "I'm going to kill myself and don't want anyone worrying about me when they can't find me."
The whole 'I have other friends now, don't worry about me' bit didn't quite sit well with me because you never see her interact with her supposed new friends.


I'll let you know one thing that'll let you enjoy the best route of the game, instead of letting fear prevent you from playing.

Your concept of Hanako in that route is wrong. The "friends" are real people, not an excuse for a horrible end.

I don't mean this in any bad way, but I hate to see someone avoid something due to speculation. Would you avoid something if you knew what would happen? Yes, but you guessed, and you're avoiding it by that logic. That's not how you read a book, and it's not how you play a visual novel either.

[Nerd-o-rama]

*sob* I just wanted to help the girl I like...

Hanako's route is there to teach an important lesson.

The people you like are just as capable of taking care of themselves as you are, and don't need to be mothered and protected. Doing so does **** for their self-confidence, and is disrespectful.
I think the choice of moral there was due to the fact that so many of the original writers had to deal with men on /a/.

[ninja_penguin]

I personally liked how her pre-act 2 animation scene is hidden in chess speak 'white knight'

[Partysan]

Hanako's route is there to teach an important lesson.

The people you like are just as capable of taking care of themselves as you are, and don't need to be mothered and protected. Doing so does **** for their self-confidence, and is disrespectful.
I think the choice of moral there was due to the fact that so many of the original writers had to deal with men on /a/.

I am quite aware of that. I just wanted to remark on that it can be somewhat hard on someone with perfectly good intentions and without "/a/" (whatever that means).
Emi's storyline has a similar thing when she shuts out Hisao and he suffers because of it. Yes, she might be able to deal with everything by herself, but the fact that he cares for her is not a bad thing.
I think some expectations are rather extreme considering that Hisao is just a teenage boy. Offering help to people who you care about and who are obviously suffering is not wrong. The important choice is that it is their choice whether to take you up on it. I think it's for that reason that Hanako's storyline has Lily explicitly warning us about this, it would be an unreasonable expectation otherwise.

[Triscuitable]

/a/ is the 4chan thread that the game's concept was posted on. The team met there, and began development. They call themselves 4Leaf Studios as an homage to their origin.

[Aerodynamik]

Okay! I just picked up this game a couple of days ago, and I'm truthfully not very far into it, but I figured I'd throw my opinions so far into the mix.

First off, just so you know where I'm coming from, I work at a book publishing company as a writer and editor, and I'm extremely picky about prose. I picked up this game because I was very interested in the idea of visual novels as an alternative form of storytelling, but hadn't really played many before.

Before I get started, let me just say that I've enjoyed the game, and will continue playing it. But I feel like outlining exactly why I think the game is great would be preaching to the choir, and I'm looking for a discussion instead of general agreement all around.

The first thing I noticed was that a lot of the writing in the narration wasn't that great. The dialogue was good, don't get me wrong, but it's easy to write dialogue. About half of the narration seemed kinda... stilted, I guess. That's not quite the word I was looking for, but it's close. Speaking as an editor, it seemed like they could have used an editor, one that really went through that stuff with a fine toothed comb and rewrote the stuff that wasn't working.

To be truthful, if this were a book, I would have put it down long ago. In a book, if it's poorly written, I usually just put it down and find something else to read, whether or not the plot is interesting. But it's not a book. It's mostly dialogue, which as I said before is quite good, and the sub-par narrative sequences were kept to a minimum. Again, not all of the narration is bad, but there were parts where I found myself mentally correcting line after line of narration in order to make it flow better.

Also, I think that the choices could have been done more elegantly. They didn't come up often, which I was fine with– I didn't expect bioware style dialogue trees after all. But they always seemed to be very much one way or the other. You either tell Kenji that Hanako is cute, or you tell her that she's not cute. There's no sort of non-committal grey area. You either side with Lily against Shizune, or you leave her in the lurch. There's often not an option to do what I personally would do, and I guess there's not an easy way to fix it. It's not a huge complaint, but... I don't know. I wish there was a slightly more granular way to control your characters actions, even if the end results of what you did always wound up pushing you toward one of two different story results.

Again, I'm not finished with the game. Assuming I'm not shot down for having a slight disparity of opinion, I'll post more about my thoughts on the game as I play and once I'm finished. I'm not playing for any particular character or ending, but I seem to be going down either the Emi or Hanako paths. I don't know which at this point. As I said before, I'm enjoying it, despite the problems that I have pointed out.

[Raistlin1040]

So on recommendation from this almost-creepy levels of devotion in this thread, I decided to try out this game. So far it seems pretty good, two hours into it, somewhere into Act II. I think I stumbled into Emi's path without meaning to considered I see her all the time now and very little of anyone other than her or Rin.

[JadedDM]

When Act II began, you should have seen an anime cutscene of one of the girls. Whichever girl it was, that's the path you are on now.

[Raistlin1040]

Oh, so that's what it was. Then yes, I'm on Emi's path. Have to wonder how since there are only a few options you can choose in Act I for dialogue anyway.

That was a pretty high quality animation for something made by volunteers.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Oh, so that's what it was. Then yes, I'm on Emi's path. Have to wonder how since there are only a few options you can choose in Act I for dialogue anyway.

That was a pretty high quality animation for something made by volunteers.

Emi's path is the easiest to get onto; you can get set onto it with very few choices, and it's not like they're obscure ones. If you skipped her and went with, I dunno, Lilly, it would be a different story.

And yeah, it really is.

[Triscuitable]

Emi's path is the easiest to get onto; you can get set onto it with very few choices, and it's not like they're obscure ones. If you skipped her and went with, I dunno, Lilly, it would be a different story.

And yeah, it really is.

Ironically, Lilly was the first route I got into, and Rin was (intentionally) my last. The only character I used any guide for was Shizune, because at parts, I didn't know what the hell to do. Lilly and Emi were very straightforward. I think the hardest to get into is the secret route.

EDIT: You may be wondering "what is this secret route?" In order to get it, be a total jerk to every person at the school, and try and remain as secluded as possible. Don't present yourself to the class, don't offer to join the council, and diss Lilly, force your agenda on Hanako, insult Rin, etc.

[Dragor]

After much scepticism about the intents of the game when it came to what it was trying to achieve (yes, my first impressions were incredibly reactionary), I downloaded and began to play the game for myself. It's absolutely brilliant. Slowly but surely making my way through Emi's storyline (I was originally 'going for' Rin, mainly because nearly all of her lines make me laugh, but hey ho).

It really gets you into its world and doesn't let you go.

[Triscuitable]

It really gets you into its world and doesn't let you go.

Makes me want to stop working on my current avatar project (SO SORRY, LEA!), but I don't have the heart to. When I am finished, I'll be running a Tezuka Rin, though!

[EifieFlare]

Ironically, Lilly was the first route I got into, and Rin was (intentionally) my last. The only character I used any guide for was Shizune, because at parts, I didn't know what the hell to do. Lilly and Emi were very straightforward. I think the hardest to get into is the secret route.

EDIT: You may be wondering "what is this secret route?" In order to get it, be a total jerk to every person at the school, and try and remain as secluded as possible. Don't present yourself to the class, don't offer to join the council, and diss Lilly, force your agenda on Hanako, insult Rin, etc.

The "secret route" should actually be the easiest one to get onto, cause there's an option for it no matter what route you're actually trying to get to (except for Emi I think). It's usually very obvious too, since there's really no reason to ever say any of its flag lines if you want to befriend someone. And you only need to choose any one of the options; picking any of them automatically redirects you to the "secret route" regardless of your standing with anyone. Doing what you listed only makes you miss flags for the other characters, and doesn't actually affect anyone's opinion of you negatively or bring you closer to the "secret route."

Edit: According to one guide, statistically speaking (in this case essentially meaning "pick options with your eyes closed" :smalltongue:), the "secret route" has the highest frequency; for the heroines, Rin should be the most frequently reached, followed by Emi as the second, Shizune as the third, and finally both Lilly and Hanako as the least frequent. Odd to me, since Rin was the only one I had to look up the choices for.

[Raistlin1040]

Well I completed Emi's route, going Good-Bad-Good for full completion. I also got the secret ending for kicks. Now to try and shoot for another start. Preferably Shizune.

[littlebottom]

when did this thread come back to life? and why didnt anyone tell me:smallcool:

yeah, the choices in this are very one way or the other near the start, to help you find which path you want to start. once you get onto a couple of the characters act 2 onwards (mainly a certain character) you will be lost for which one to choose, they will often seem like a pointless choice of complete grey area.

being as i havnt actually posted here since i finshed the game (or atleast all the good endings, i think i need to go back and get one or two bad endings still) ill give you my personal favorites list.

1. Hanako.
2. Lilly
3. Rin (very hard to decide between lilly and rin for second)
4. Emi
5. misha
6. Shizune

I have to say, that even though shizune is last, and unfortunately least of this list, i can not deny that i still enjoyed her story very much, just not AS MUCH as the others. and Misha is more bubbly and pretty much a main character anyway, so she just about beats Shizune, because i dont like it when she scolds me:smalleek: her dad is scary too.

[Dragor]

Just finished my first story (Emi's). Excuse me while I weep. (Although, I did miss out on getting two scenes... I know I've got to play it through again and listen to Mutou instead of rushing off, but I'm not sure I can be bothered right now, even though Mutou's awesome.)

I guess it kind of hit close to home for me because Emi's personality- the "you can't help me, I've got to help myself" attitude- really reminded me of my ex-girlfriend in regards to the issues she had. Superbly written.

[Raistlin1040]

Just finished Shizune's story. Really liked it. Got 100% completion on it.

Time to work on a new one.

[Dragor]

Just finished Shizune's story. Really liked it. Got 100% completion on it.

Almost finished myself. Dat reveal.

Damn, Misha, who would've known?

[Triscuitable]

Almost finished myself. Dat reveal.

Damn, Misha, who would've known?

You never really get filled in on why Misha hangs out with Shizune. It was one of my first guesses, actually.

[Raistlin1040]

In somewhat unrelated news, the soundtrack is pretty great. I downloaded it the other day and there are some really good songs, even if they all sound a little Pro Tools-y.

[MeatShield#236]

This looks... fascinating. Everything I've heard about this game seems very positive. Thing is, I've never played a visual novel before and really have no idea what to expect other than the setting. So, what will I be getting into if I play this game?

[Vauron]

Have you ever read one of those 'Chose your own Adventure' books? Its kinda like that, but with pictures and sounds added. Essentially, you read text until you reach a decision point, where your choice changes what happens next.

[Triscuitable]

Have you ever read one of those 'Chose your own Adventure' books? Its kinda like that, but with pictures and sounds added. Essentially, you read text until you reach a decision point, where your choice changes what happens next.

Except you won't fail prematurely if you pick the wrong choice. No, that's if you're a total screw-up. :smalltongue:


This looks... fascinating. Everything I've heard about this game seems very positive. Thing is, I've never played a visual novel before and really have no idea what to expect other than the setting. So, what will I be getting into if I play this game?

Well, you can kiss your life goodbye, and make sure to have a shoulder to cry on.

[littlebottom]

what you will be getting yourself into is a scarily thought provoking story of love. need i say more?:smallconfused:

to be honest before i first read it, i read through what people were saying here on giant, and my first thought was "oh my god, this sounds horrific and degrading to the whole human race" but yeah, giant convinced me otherwise and i tried it, i am extremely glad i did. im shocked just how far off my first thoughts were of katawa shoujo.

i think the best way to find out what your getting yourself into is getting into it:smallamused:

[MeatShield#236]

You weren't kidding when you people said to kiss your life away. I've just gotten to Act 2, I'm on Rin's story. I'm really enjoying the story thus far, and the music is great.

Thank you Playgrounders for convincing me to try this, I'm pretty sure I would have just blow this off as "just another weird Japanese thing."

[Triscuitable]

You weren't kidding when you people said to kiss your life away. I've just gotten to Act 2, I'm on Rin's story. I'm really enjoying the story thus far, and the music is great.

Thank you Playgrounders for convincing me to try this, I'm pretty sure I would have just blow this off as "just another weird Japanese thing."

Katawa Shoujo: 30% more likely to assimilate you into a land of love and friendship than My Little Pony.

[littlebottom]

Katawa Shoujo: 30% more likely to assimilate you into a land of love and friendship than My Little Pony.

true that, i resisted my little pony! but this... no person in their right mind cannot feel nothing reading katawa shoujo, you just cant do it!

[Raistlin1040]

So I finished Rin's route. Curious.

The ideas in Rin's route were very interesting and hit on some real-life situations I am familiar with, so that was good. The bad ending was sad, but I almost think the neutral one was worse, especially when you contrast it with the good ending and what is revealed there. I keep getting the good endings first and then I have to go back and get the bad ones and it is quite sad.

I'd rank Rin's as about equal with Shizune's, although completely different in almost every imaginable way. Both are above Emi's, even though I liked that one as well. Just Hanako and Lilly left.

[A Rainy Knight]

So I finished Rin's route. Curious.

The ideas in Rin's route were very interesting and hit on some real-life situations I am familiar with, so that was good. The bad ending was sad, but I almost think the neutral one was worse, especially when you contrast it with the good ending and what is revealed there. I keep getting the good endings first and then I have to go back and get the bad ones and it is quite sad.

I'd rank Rin's as about equal with Shizune's, although completely different in almost every imaginable way. Both are above Emi's, even though I liked that one as well. Just Hanako and Lilly left.

Well, brace yourself, because although I admittedly haven't done Rin's route yet, Hanako and Lilly were my favorite two routes by far. :smalltongue:

[ninja_penguin]

So I finished Rin's route. Curious.

I'd rank Rin's as about equal with Shizune's, although completely different in almost every imaginable way.

I think Rin's route depends a ton of how much you're able to relate. For me it was nearly mind blowing and epiphany causing, mostly due to events when I was a lot younger.

[Triscuitable]

Well, brace yourself, because although I admittedly haven't done Rin's route yet, Hanako and Lilly were my favorite two routes by far. :smalltongue:

Nobody likes Shizune's route?

You know who had the best route?

Saki Enomoto. :smallbiggrin:

[littlebottom]

I think Rin's route depends a ton of how much you're able to relate. For me it was nearly mind blowing and epiphany causing, mostly due to events when I was a lot younger.

yeah Rin's route got me a bit too, but that said i had that problem with emi, i couldnt relate as much, okay i related with her main issue a little, but it didnt hit that hard.

i think peoples favorites are based on the ones that they relate to the most, and as such shizune the "easy" route, doesnt relate too much to most people, (white text for mild spoilers) falling easily in love, and having really good close friends with a small falling out of friendship that shakes up your relationship (slightly) and back into friendship is either mundane to people or just completely out of their scope of experiences.end of white text.

[Raistlin1040]

I don't think that's a fair representation of Shizune's route. Slice of Life can have a lot of nuance and depth that isn't immediately apparent. I think Shizune's route has a fair amount of depth. It doesn't angst as hard as Rin's route, which might make it seem bland or shallower, but I think there's a lot to relate to in Shizune's route, especially if you take it somewhat metaphorically.

[littlebottom]

yeah, i suppose your right, i guess i just related a little less, and what with the constant third wheel to that plot line it possibly just threw me out a little. who knows?

i dont think its bad at all, i just dont like it as much as the others.

[Triscuitable]

What I interpreted that relationship as is completely different: It's about what we do in the name of love and friendship. Hisao learned another language (sign language is a language, yes) so he could pursue a relationship with a girl who would otherwise be impossible to get to know.

I think what describes that relationship the best is "overcoming a language barrier". It's simple goal, easier said than done, but it's done so well that you shouldn't really care.

[littlebottom]

What I interpreted that relationship as is completely different: It's about what we do in the name of love and friendship. Hisao learned another language (sign language is a language, yes) so he could pursue a relationship with a girl who would otherwise be impossible to get to know.

I think what describes that relationship the best is "overcoming a language barrier". It's simple goal, easier said than done, but it's done so well that you shouldn't really care.

yeah your right, i cant argue with you even a little, still think its all totally awesome. but still my least favourite story (or 5th favourite, depending which way you look at it):smalltongue:

[Raistlin1040]

Finished Hanako's. It was pretty good. Not my favorite but pretty good. Only Lilly's left to go.

[Pie Guy]

I wanted to like Hanako's story, but something just didn't connect for me. It just felt like everything was resolved too... cleanly at the end.

[Triscuitable]

Finished Hanako's. It was pretty good. Not my favorite but pretty good. Only Lilly's left to go.

If you managed to save Lilly's till the end, follow Hanako's prologue, and the very last choice (don't go to the library, go for a walk!) will net you Lilly's route. The third option will net you the wild card route.

And, y'know, MANLY PICNICS. :furious:

So manly...

[Raistlin1040]

Yeah, I had the foresight to save at the "Go to the Library/Go into town" option because I figured it would branch the paths.

Anyway, beat Lily's ending, got her Good and "Neutral" (that definitely felt bad, if not as bad as Shizune's or Rin's). I now have 100% completion.

I will type up all my thoughts at a later date, although probably not with any promptness or haste since I'd probably be preaching to the choir for the most part.

[MeatShield#236]

So I just finished Rin's route, I'm pretty sure I got the good ending, thoughts are in the spoiler.

Mother of God, that was an emotional roller coaster. I don't whether to be cry or to be extremely happy. Maybe I'll do both. Either way, I think I need to take a break before I do another route.

"What's the word for when it feels inside your heart that everything in the world is alright?" ...beautiful ending.

[Dragor]

So I just finished Rin's route, I'm pretty sure I got the good ending, thoughts are in the spoiler.

Mother of God, that was an emotional roller coaster. I don't whether to be cry or to be extremely happy. Maybe I'll do both. Either way, I think I need to take a break before I do another route.

"What's the word for when it feels inside your heart that everything in the world is alright?" ...beautiful ending.

I know that feel, bro :smallfrown:

Finished the game in its entirety by finishing on Lilly's route with the good ending. I was literally on the edge of my seat throughout the entire ending. When...
The music box began to chime
I almost wept with happiness.

I want to hug every single developer of KS and thank them. Seriously, this game. This damn game...