Wit's End With a Moronic Computer

[Mando Knight]

Unofficial steps for tech support:
1.) Google
2.) Playground
3.) Professional tech support

I'm at part 2 now. Problem?
My computer is running super-slow... its processors (Intel Core Duo T2250) are running at 46% maximum clock speed (~798 MHz instead of 1730) despite the cores being relatively cold (~40 C) and the processor load frequently reaching maximum. Switching SpeedStep on or off and using Active cooling mode rather than Passive do nothing. Actually, no. Turning off SpeedStep (something that several forums that Google turns up) makes the problem worse, since it'll make the processors report that their current clock frequency is their maximum to the Windows Resource Monitor.

It's enough for normal browsing applications, but any online games drop to about .5 fps when in vicinity of another player (it's not the network, I can get 50-100 ms ping, and siblings can play games fine), several flash apps slow down to compensate for the processor load...

Worse, it's a semi-recurring problem. Sometimes it'll seem like it fixed itself, but then return a couple months later. Weirdly, it seems to correspond with the location as well. It likes the middle of Missouri more than the backwoods of St. Louis-area Illinois.
Anyone think of something to try? I'm considering pulling apart the computer to clean its cooling system, to see if something's jammed (it hasn't even tried to run the fans lately, and they occasionally make a weird clicking noise when they do run). Anyone familiar with processors should recognize that it's way past its warranty... it's on the last leg of making it 5 years. And a laptop, so I can't just replace parts willy-nilly. As for replacing the computer in its entirety, I'm a poor college student. I can't afford that.

[missmvicious]

You said it yourself... it's on it's last leg. Windows lappys aren't famous for their durability. You've done good making it last 5 years.

Here are some things you can do to squeeze a bit more life out of it, though. Keep in mind, these are old tricks; my husband switched to Mac years ago (and I'm not very computer savvy, but he used to have to squeeze the last drops of life out of old PCs too, so he's giving me some advice on this to pass on to you:

1. Strip it. Copy everything that isn't relevant to system operations onto back up storage devices, then delete those programs from your main system. If you can, just have only the operating system on your main drive and run everything else from externals, jump drives, CDs, etc. When graphic intensive games chew up RAM (most modern games will be graphic intensive for a 5 year old lappy), it will use hard drive space as virtual memory, but it's inefficient with the space. The more space you give it, the longer it will work smoothly.

2. Clean it. Blow a duster on the components... especially the fan. If those fans give up, it's lights out for the lappy, which tends to run too hot in the first place. On that note, always use your lappy on a cold hard surface. No carpets or lap, despite what the name suggests. Laptop motherboards warp easily and there's not enough room in there for good air circulation. If you can afford it, get a cooling dock for it. Lappys aren't build for all-day long term usage, though that's how they tend to be used by college students. The cooler you can keep it, the longer you can have it.

3. Organize it. Run a virus detector on it, then run ScanDisk and Defrag. This may take all night, especially if you haven't done it in a while. And make sure, from here on out, that at least once a day you completely shut down your laptop and restart it. Cold boot.

4. Start saving money. Instead of stopping at the drive thru, nuke some Ramen for a few months. New laptops can come at reasonable prices, and you can even buy some display models at a reduced price. I purchased the Mac I have now for $700 off the listed price because it was a display model. Windows lappys can be found brand new for under $200... not so high a price. But if that still stresses your budget, look into used (refurbished) laptops. You can find those mostly online, since refurbished computer stores are dropping like flies, but still, that will give you more bang for your buck with a semi-retired lappy that still has a few more years left to give.

I hope this helps.

[Mando Knight]

It's not the RAM or the hard drive. The latter's been recently defragged, and even though it only has 2GB RAM, that's rarely been the source of my problems... issues arise even when it's reporting that about half the RAM is in use. Like I said, the issues seem to be focused around the processors running at half speed even when system temperature is roughly nominal.

[Erloas]

The fans on the system should always be running, always. Sometimes they run at relatively slow speed, so you can't hear them, but they should always be on.
If your fans aren't turning or are making clicking noises then the fan has gone out or is in the process of dieing.
Even in a laptop you should be able to replace the fans, if just cleaning them out doesn't do anything.

What are you using to measure your processor temperature? 40C is pretty low, especially if you have a fan out, though it might be something like the CPU fan is still ok but the system or northbridge fan is dead and that could cause some problems.

It could actually be something as simple as the system not running past idle speeds when the fan is not working and virtually every motherboard has the ability to monitor fan speeds. Most programs that allow you to monitor temperatures should also monitor fan speeds.

It is also possible that something internal just died, and was just cutting in and out before. It happens. And maybe at this point the processor just happens to keep running in a downgraded state.
Although it wouldn't seem like it with electronics, not having any moving parts, they can still fail for seemingly no reason because of latent defects in the manufacturing process. Which is of course is why companies have their warranties set up the way they do.

[Mando Knight]

The fans on the system should always be running, always. Sometimes they run at relatively slow speed, so you can't hear them, but they should always be on.
If your fans aren't turning or are making clicking noises then the fan has gone out or is in the process of dieing.

What I mean is that it hasn't tried to spin up the fans lately. The clicking usually only occurs when it spins them up, and it's less of a click than a hum.

Both CoreTemp and the Intel Processor Diagnostic display a ~40 C core temperature.

Double-checking numbers, I've found that the multiplier for the processor should be a 13, but it's running at 6. Is it possible that this is a motherboard or BIOS restriction? I can't directly modify the multiplier from the BIOS without installing a different one...

Due to the computer's age, I've run into a bit of this problem (http://xkcd.com/979/), as well.

[valadil]

Try booting up a live linux cd. I'm not suggesting you actually switch to linux (that's for another thread) but you can see how well the processor runs on another OS. If the cpu stays stuck at low speeds, odds are it's a hardware problem. If the cpu runs at full throttle, odds are it's a windows configuration problem.

[Erloas]

What I mean is that it hasn't tried to spin up the fans lately. The clicking usually only occurs when it spins them up, and it's less of a click than a hum.
Have you actually opened the laptop up to make sure the fans are spinning freely? Or at very least used a fan monitoring program to see that the system thinks the fan is running?

Double-checking numbers, I've found that the multiplier for the processor should be a 13, but it's running at 6. Is it possible that this is a motherboard or BIOS restriction? I can't directly modify the multiplier from the BIOS without installing a different one...
That is usually the way the processors idle, they don't have the FSB speeds, they change the processor multiplier to save power when the system isn't being used. And yeah... I haven't seen a laptop with an open BIOS that lets you mess with those things. I'm pretty sure processor idle speed is controlled by the processor itself, not the OS, but its possible the OS might do some. I assume you've got the laptop plugged in to make sure its not going into some power saving mode?

[Mando Knight]

Have you actually opened the laptop up to make sure the fans are spinning freely? Or at very least used a fan monitoring program to see that the system thinks the fan is running?
They decided to spin up again this afternoon for a while, so they may not be the problem.

That is usually the way the processors idle, they don't have the FSB speeds, they change the processor multiplier to save power when the system isn't being used.
The multiplier stays down even when the CPU is reading 100% load.

[Runestar]

Seems like the motherboard is going to kick the bucket any time. Other than changing parts or toning down on the usage, I don't think there is anything you can do. :smalleek:

[Mando Knight]

Seems like the motherboard is going to kick the bucket any time. Other than changing parts or toning down on the usage, I don't think there is anything you can do. :smalleek:

It might be, but there isn't much you can replace on a 5-yo laptop.

[Traab]

Just to throw out a different option, and take it with a grain of salt, but are you certain you dont have any malware type applications on your laptop? Its happened to me once or twice that ill get one that bogs down my computer BIGTIME. Suddenly everything is running slow as hell, and instead of cpu usage being between 1-6% its jumping up to 45-70% or higher.

[Moonshadow]

I think your problem is that, while Wit's End is a great item, you should be optimising for AP, not for Aspd. Maybe try a Rylai's Crystal Scepter?

[Erloas]

Well I did find this, and the poster said it was a Dell laptop

Before you go turning off Speedstep, consult your manual and your BIOS comments to see what the Off/Enabled option does! Here's what mine says:

Off - Place the system into the lowest performance state and prevent the Intel Speedstep(tm) applet or native operating system driver from adjusting the processor's performance.

Enabled - Allow the Intel Speedstep(tm)-enabled CPU to operate in multiple performance states.


Now, with that in mind, I did turn mine off shortly after setting up my computer how I wanted it. The system felt slower, but games still ran at full FPS, so I thought it was all in my head. Later I did a benchmark and knew something was seriously wrong. 15 minutes later I felt stupid.

Moral of the story: Don't assume that turning off Speedstep is going to be a good thing!

The other thing to check out and possible enable/disable is C1E in the BIOS.

I've also found a few references to the power saving settings in Windows, setting the maximum and minimum processor state to 100%. As well as automatic power savings depending on battery life. All of which is stuff that has pretty much already been mentioned.

[Mando Knight]

Problem... solved?

Switching locations made the CPU behave like I'm used to. I'm beginning to think that it was automatically reducing the power draw due to high load on the house circuitry (particularly due to the holiday season and family being home).

Still can't play Jamestown (http://store.steampowered.com/app/94200/), though, and I haven't been getting any replies from their tech support...

[The Succubus]

I think your problem is that, while Wit's End is a great item, you should be optimising for AP, not for Aspd. Maybe try a Rylai's Crystal Scepter?

I'm at my wight's end, as the exasperated Tsukiko once said.

[dgnslyr]

I think your problem is that, while Wit's End is a great item, you should be optimising for AP, not for Aspd. Maybe try a Rylai's Crystal Scepter?

But Wit's End is so disgustingly efficient, it's not even funny. For a small combine cost of about 1k, you're getting an ENTIRE BFSWORD and most of a Null-Magic Mantle, after stacks. The only downside is the on-hit damage isn't "real" AD, only effective AD, so it doesn't scale with crits, but that's a small price to pay for the tanky dps who can't afford much more crit than an Atma's.

Besides, you don't buy Rylai's for the AP or bulk, you buy it for the slow, silly. It costs about the same as a RoA, but instead of the mana, you get the slow passive. The passive's not really useful on some mages, anyways, as it's mostly the domain of mages with good spam like Kennen, Vladdy, or maybe Singed.

I'd recommend the Rod of Ages instead. For a similar price, you can get the same bulkiness and AP, with some lane-winningly good mana. Plus, it build out of a catalyst, so how could you say no?
thread derail over