[PF] Vestigial Arms and Feral Mutagen

[Flob]

Well, it's that time again, where I must ask the internet for guidance. I have an Alchemist (4th level if you must know) in Pathfinder who has the Feral Mutagen discovery, who is considering taking the Vestigial Arm discovery. I am simply wondering if I will be granted an additional claw attack every time I take a full round attack action or not, as it is not covered by the rules.

Thanks, Flob.

[RndmNumGen]

By RAW, no. You can always ask your DM of course, but there isn't any precedent for gaining more natural attacks. Otherwise, if you took the Tentacle discovery instead, you could use that as a natural attack(1d4 damage if Medium, 1d3 if Small).

[Bhaakon]

The tentacle suffers from the same rule as the vestigial arm, specifically prohibiting you from using it to gain additional attacks. The only way to use it is to sacrifice on of your other attacks.

The only way to get another attack is to employ armor spikes, which leave your hands free to claw.

[Flob]

The tentacle suffers from the same rule as the vestigial arm, specifically prohibiting you from using it to gain additional attacks.

What I'm saying is that I should gain another claw attack as part of my full round natural attack routine due to having, well, another hand with a claw. I'm not saying that I want 2 claw attacks, a bite, and a melee attack with a weapon of some sort. The tentacle could be added to my natural attack routine becuase it's a natural attack, and I'm wondering if the arm will allow me the same.

[Bhaakon]

Neither will. There are specific provision in the description of both the vestigial arm and tentacle discoveries that prevent you from using them to gain an extra attack.

link 1 (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/vestigial-arm-ex)

The arm does not give the alchemist any extra attacks or actions per round...

link 2 (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/tentacle-ex)

The tentacle does not give the alchemist any extra attacks or actions per round...

The only way to use those discoveries for claw/tentacle attick is to have it replace another attack you would have gotten anyway, hence the armor spikes suggestion (you don't even have to e proficient with armor spikes, you just need to be able to attack with them so that you may substitute the clw/tentacle attack, though there's a good chance that you DM will throw a book at you for circumventing the spirit of the rules).

[Flob]

I guess by RAW I don't get the extra attack in my full round natural attack action, but I'll have to check with my DM. It certainly feels like with a third arm I should get another natural attack added to my full round, but we'll see... Thanks guys.

[Stone Heart]

I always felt that it was dumb that you can't use the extra arms like that (especially because they can be used instead of your original arms just as effectively), but they did that apparently for balance reasons. On the Paizo messageboards one of the developers responded to a similar question, basically the arm was designed more for carrying and retrieving items, not combat.

[Bhaakon]

Without that provision, an Alchemist could have 12 attacks, 10 at full BAB, at level 18 before buffs.

Maybe not up to high-level wizard standards of game breaking, but still pretty ridiculous (particularly if you go vivisectionist and stack a full SA progression on top of that).

[Stone Heart]

Why 12? I am AFB right now, but you are not counting on them getting extra arms for that many right? Because they can only get 2 more which people miss a lot

[Bhaakon]

Oops, you're right, though an alchemist can still get 12 attacks using weapons that don't take an arm to wield and the full TWF feat tree:

4 claws, 1 tentacle, 1 bite, 3 main-hand (spiked armor), 3 off-hand (blade boot).