Dominating Dominated Creatures

[Fyermind]

So if my wizard has the frenzied berserker dominated, does that protect him from the BBEG wizard dominating him so he kills us all?

More generally, what happens when a dominated character is the target of a different caster's dominate spell?

[Jack_Simth]

So if my wizard has the frenzied berserker dominated, does that protect him from the BBEG wizard dominating him so he kills us all?

More generally, what happens when a dominated character is the target of a different caster's dominate spell?
Check the Magic Overview, stacking section: (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#multipleMentalControlEffects)
Sometimes magical effects that establish mental control render each other irrelevant, such as a spell that removes the subjects ability to act. Mental controls that don’t remove the recipient’s ability to act usually do not interfere with each other. If a creature is under the mental control of two or more creatures, it tends to obey each to the best of its ability, and to the extent of the control each effect allows. If the controlled creature receives conflicting orders simultaneously, the competing controllers must make opposed Charisma checks to determine which one the creature obeys. (emphasis added)

So kind of. If the party Sorcerer Dominates the party Fighter, and then the BBEG Wizard Dominates the party fighter and starts issuing orders, then the Fighter will probably do the Sorcerer's bidding... if the Sorcerer remembers to directly countermand the BBEG's orders.

If the party Wizard Dominates the party Fighter, and the BBEG Sorcerer Dominates the party Fighter, however....

[legomaster00156]

Check the Magic Overview, stacking section: (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#multipleMentalControlEffects)(em phasis added)

So kind of. If the party Sorcerer Dominates the party Fighter, and then the BBEG Wizard Dominates the party fighter and starts issuing orders, then the Fighter will probably do the Sorcerer's bidding... if the Sorcerer remembers to directly countermand the BBEG's orders.

If the party Wizard Dominates the party Fighter, and the BBEG Sorcerer Dominates the party Fighter, however....
*gasp* We have found a place where the Sorcerer is better than the Wizard! Sort of niche, but I'll take anything.

[Fyermind]

Next question: can a dominating sorcerer control a frenzied berserker's frenzy such that he doesn't massacre the party?

[Jack_Simth]

*gasp* We have found a place where the Sorcerer is better than the Wizard! Sort of niche, but I'll take anything.
They're also better at Planar Binding for similar reasons (the negotiations are a Charisma check), and in controlling Charmed minions (charisma check to make someone do what they otherwise wouldn't), although as all of those are opposed ability checks, a prepared Wizard can make sure to win via Moment of Prescience and/or lots of crafted items to boost the check, so a prepared wizard who is spending more resources still wins... but it takes a larger resource investment to excel at that aspect than it does for the Sorcerer.


Next question: can a dominating sorcerer control a frenzied berserker's frenzy such that he doesn't massacre the party?
Depends on the exact working of the ability. Got the text handy? If it's just a matter that he can't distinguish anymore, then yes, the Sorcerer can say "Stand still and do nothing", although depending on the wording, it's also possible that such an order would grant a new Will save to the FB... or not work at all.

[candycorn]

Yes and no. Illusions tend to be better for this, as you can create simulated enemies, or hide allies. Heck, even summons can provide an outlet.

Even dominated, the character obeys to the best of its ability. Not attacking is beyond the ability of a frenzying Frenzied Berzerker. Such a character must attack. Now, you could use dominate to at least affect who the FB attacks, and how. For example, you could order the FB to drop his two handed weapon, and fight with a dagger (as light weapons cannot benefit from power attack). Or, you could order him to attempt to grapple the cleric, who has Freedom of Movement active.

In other words, you could influence the attack, but you couldn't stop it.

[Tenno Seremel]

Such a character must attack.
Can't you force it to attack ground, rock or something? (“This rock is actually polymorphed wizard”) Assuming he is capable of understanding such concepts in frenzy.

[HunterOfJello]

*gasp* We have found a place where the Sorcerer is better than the Wizard! Sort of niche, but I'll take anything.

Don't forget the Sorcerer Only spells from Races of the Dragon! Wings of Cover and especially Wings of Flurry are pretty cool spells. Hoard Life is also pretty cool if you need a nice quick heal during combat.

[CTrees]

Yes and no. Illusions tend to be better for this, as you can create simulated enemies, or hide allies. Heck, even summons can provide an outlet.

There are spells to summon swarms, right? Could be entertaining, actually, watching the FB furiously trying to step on a big pile of ants until he exhausts himself.

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Also, I think we have a case for a party sorcerer preemptively dominating his entire party. "okay, guys, this may seem a little sketchy, but it's totally a defensive measure! I'm super charismatic, right? So if I dominate all of you, and give you a standing order to only obey my mental commands, no one else is going to be able to mind control you! Oh, what? Perish the thought! I would never issue commands purely for my amusement! You guys really give far too much weight to the "CN" on my character sheet..."