Advice for someone new to ADnD

[Riverdance]

I recently bought the legendary Tomb of Horrors module for a friend as a present, meaning I am now obliged to learn ADnD. I started playing 3.5, and then transferred to Pathfinder (which I love), so I have a fairly strong roleplaying base.

I'm looking for advice on building and playing ADnD characters. Is there anything I should know about the core mechanics that's crucial? What should I be aware of in transferring to ADnD? I don't want any spoilers about Tomb of Horrors. I welcome any advice.

As a side note I do expect to die repeatedly. We will definitely try something else in first edition to get the hang of it before attempting the tomb. On the bright side, I will get very good at making characters.

[Jay R]

You asked for no spoilers, so this comes with no supporting explanation.

DON'T start with Tomb of Horrors.

Just don't.

Really.

[Riverdance]

Yeah I definitely intend to try a lot more before tomb of horrors. I don't know of I could even make a tenth level character yet.

[LibraryOgre]

Which edition are you looking at? That helps to answer some of the questions. Also, it matters if you're the DM or the player. However...

1) Stats matter less, except at the extremes. Under 15, you're not likely to see much of anything on Stats. You can play a great wizard with a 13 intelligence, even if another wizard in the party has an 18. It requires careful husbandry of resources, but that's pretty much the name of the game.

2) Prefigure your ThAC0, especially in 2e when you're always looking at a smooth progression. Just doodle the numbers 1-20 down the side of the page, and what you hit when you roll that. Since your bonuses will be mostly static, it's pretty straightforward to do.

3) One thing I have noticed is that most AD&D is less about CHARACTER skill and more about PLAYER skill. Your character is a character, but he's also a swiss army knife. Look at what tools he has on him... if all you see if your fighter is a big sword, all you're going to be able to use him as is a big sword. Just because it isn't written on your character sheet doesn't mean you can't do it. Suggest solutions and reasons... e.g. "I know my fighter doesn't have Move Silently, but we're ten yards away from the guy and his buddies are being pretty loud... I should be able to sneak a little bit closer, since I'm only in leather armor. Maybe a surprise check?"

4) A big one... Failure on a thief skill does not mean automatic catastrophe. Just because you didn't Move Silently doesn't mean you dragged along a brass band... it means you weren't completely silent. There may be a surprise check, he may not hear you for some other reason, but just because you're not invisible and noiseless doesn't mean you're automatically detected.

[Kenneth]

I have ot agree with Matt Hall on this.

AD&D is more about innovation and inventive and cool thought/actions not so much on rules and dice rolls

You didn;t go

GM: “A ten-foot wide corridor leads north into the darkness.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “I check for traps.”
GM: “What’s your target number for checking?”
Sneekz the Rogue: “15.”
GM: Decides that the spear trap in front of the party is “standard,” so all Sneekz has to do is roll a 15 or better. “Roll a d20.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “18.”
GM: “Probing ahead of you, you find a pressure plate in the floor – it looks like there’s a spear trap.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “Can I disarm it?”
GM: “What’s your target number for that?”
Sneekz the Rogue: “12. I rolled a 24.”
GM: “Okay, moving carefully, you’re able to jam the mechanism so the trap won’t depress.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “We walk across. I go first.”

you went

GM: “A ten-foot wide corridor leads north into the darkness.”
John the Roguish: “We move forward, poking the floor ahead with our ten foot pole.”
GM: Is about to say that the pole pushes springs atrap, when he remembers something.
“Wait, you don’t have the ten foot pole any more. You fed it to the stone idol.” [if the party still had the pole, Sneekz would have detected the trap automatically]
John the Roguish: “I didn’t feed it to the idol, the idol ate it when I poked its head.”
GM: “That doesn’t mean you have the pole back. Do you go into the corridor?”
Sneekz the Rogue: “No. I’m suspicious. Can I see any cracks in the floor, maybe shaped in a square?”
GM: Mulls this over, because there’s a ppressure plate for a spear trap right where Sneekz is looking. But it’s dark, so “No, there are about a million cracks in the floor. You wouldn’t see a trap that easily, anyway.” [A different referee might absolutely decide that Sneekz sees the trap,
since he’s looking in the right place for the right thing].
Sneekz the Rogue: “Okay. I take out my waterskin from my backpack. And I’m going to pour some water onto the floor. Does it trickle through the floor anywhere, or reveal some kind of pattern?”
GM: “Yeah, the water seems to be puddling a little bit around a square shape in the floor where the square is a little higher than the rest of the floor.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “Like there’s a covered pit trap, or a pressure plate?”
GM: “Could be.”
Sneekz the Rogue: “Can I disarm it?”
GM: “How?”
Sneekz the Rogue: “I don’t know, maybe jam the mechanism?”
GM: “You can’t see a mechanism. You step on it, there’s a click, you get speared. What are you going to jam?”
Sneekz the Rogue: “I don’t know. Okay, let’s just walk around it.”
GM: “You walk around it, then. There’s about a two-foot clearance on each side.”


its less about what the d20 says or what the numbers say you can do with your character and more about what your imigination thinks it can do.

[Riverdance]

Thanks, this is really helpful, especially because I tend to have trouble roleplaying over what you described as 3rd edition play-style.

[Kenneth]

your welcome.

and It is not so much a roleplaying. as much as what your imigination can limit you to do. SO peopel do go all stormwind fallaxy on me I have to put down definitions. to me the 3rd ed playstyle is 'i have to roll a d20'
and if it reqiures more though that that its not allowed or one cannot do it. the AD&D play style is " no rules for this but It will look, and be cool' like swinging from teh chandalier to drop in amongst some orcs thugs.

I am not saying that one cannot use their imagination in 3rd ed.. is just teh rules are a hindrance to that.

The biggest gripe Ive seen about 3rd ed/all teh d20 rule sets is teh whole Melee can't have nice things argument.

They can, if you just bend the rules a sbit.. Yes by the actual rules in 3rd ed Archery and teh Paladin is VASTLY underpowered.

But if you just let the player playing ... say a paladin. do the things that a literary Paladin has done.. THen well everybody has had some fun. (you might need to come up with rule son this for other people as I have had to do when I posted my won homebrewed retakes on teh standard classes)

Ive just never been keen on punishing somebody who wanted to be a paladin just becuase WoTC created them incorrectly.

EDIT:: also.. i have no idea why everybody is alwasy so anti- ToH.. ive played it in 3 (i think..?) iterations and have yet to get upset and throw my hands up in despair and cry about ' wy i no do tomb of horros'?

[hamlet]

Thanks, this is really helpful, especially because I tend to have trouble roleplaying over what you described as 3rd edition play-style.

Don't think of it as "roleplay" neccessarily. Your character is your portal to interacting with the game world. His capabilities are not wholly, or even majorly, defined by the numbers on the page, but by what you decide you want him to do and what the DM will allow you to do. Don't think in terms of character abilities as defined by the PHB, think in terms of actual characters acting on reasonable actions.

This means that non-theives can sneak, climb, and check for traps, but that the thief skills by those names are qualitatively different.

And, as far as I'm aware, there are no actual rules for creating non-1st level characters. It was greatly assumed that you would start at 1st level and play up through the ranks. That's really part of the whole game.

[Premier]

A point about the rules themselves (assuming it's 1st edition AD&D): you won't be using all of them. You don't have to. And that's normal.

I've never seen a group actually use the Weapon modifier vs. AC table or the advanced initiative system with weapon speeds and the like. And that's fine. One of the strengths of the old editions is that the rules are modular: you can easily omit some parts, and the rest will still work just the same.


I'm looking for advice on building and playing ADnD characters.

See, this is the beauty of simplicity: you don't need advice. You ask the DM which stat generating method to use, you roll up your stats, then you pick a race and a class and you're done. (With 2nd ed., there's also weapon and non-weapon proficiencies, but don't sweat it - just pick what feels close to your mental image of the character.) You don't need to "plan" your character to make sure it qualifies for one Prestige Class or the other, and you don't need to worry about "falling behind the others in efficiency", because they've all generated their characters the same way. Obviously, if you get your stats first, then Strength, Constitution and a bit of Dexterity makes for a good Fighter, Ranger or Paladin, high Wisdom makes for a Cleric, etc..


Is there anything I should know about the core mechanics that's crucial?

Well, others have made good points already, even if they're more about DM-ing style than strictly rules mechanics as such. Understand how THAC0 works, if you're playing 2E, understand how Non-weapon proficiencies work. If you're a spellcaster, read the relevant chapter carefully - especially the paragraphs right before the spell lists in 1E about how long it takes to memorise spells - and ask the DM if he runs it differently. Others have pointed out how failure at a thief skill roll shouldn't mean an automatic catastrophe. Really, that's all.


What should I be aware of in transferring to ADnD?

There is no "appropriate encounter level", and there is no "wealth by level guideline". Do NOT expect to always encounter situations which are calculated to be solvable by combat. Part of being a skillful party is knowing how to recognise situations where a direct approach won't work, and then figuring out how to solve, bypass or otherwise deal with them.

Also, though this can vary depending on the DM, old-school D&D is a resource management game on various levels. Your Hit Points and your spells (healing, buffing or otherwise) are resources which you deplete and regain - and you typically regain them at a much slower rate than in new editions. On a different level, so is ammo, food and light (torches, lamp oil, Light spells). Keeping track of what resources you have and then making sure you get to safety before you run out is designed to be part of the game. As an example, don't blow all your spells and potions in the dungeon and then start heading back to town - you can easily bump into a tough and hostile random encounter in the dungeon, or several in the wilderness, and you'll be unprepared for them. And resting inside the dungeon can be a very, very bad idea. Turn around and go home while you're still ahead.

And the mention of random encounters reminded me - "encounter" does not equal "combat"! Sure, SOMETIMES it does, but it's not a given. Don't attack everything you find - a beast might be avoided simply by backing off, or maybe throwing some raw meat at it. Bandits could be possibly intimidated into letting you pass, or even recruited to work for you!

The topic of avoiding fights leads back to the resource game idea: loot is also a resource, and you want to maximize it while minimizing the expenditure of all other resource. In 1E at least, always keep in mind that typically you get more experience points for loot than for killing things. Therefore, it's often a good idea to try and get the treasure WITHOUT fighting its guardians, or at least fighting as few as you can get away with. You go home with most of the XP, and you've avoided the expenditure of precious resources (and quite possibly character death).

[hamlet]

The topic of avoiding fights leads back to the resource game idea: loot is also a resource, and you want to maximize it while minimizing the expenditure of all other resource. In 1E at least, always keep in mind that typically you get more experience points for loot than for killing things. Therefore, it's often a good idea to try and get the treasure WITHOUT fighting its guardians, or at least fighting as few as you can get away with. You go home with most of the XP, and you've avoided the expenditure of precious resources (and quite possibly character death).

That's a key thing to remember, especially if you're playing "in the old style" which means that your character, no matter how good he might be, is probably self interested and out for financial gain more than anything else. Or at least has a healthy level of lust for shiny things.

Fighting monsters in AD&D is exceedingly dangerous. They are quite capable of handing you your spleen, especially at low levels. Even at high levels, things like kobolds (the quintissential 1st level monster) can be very dangerous to an unwary party.

Your best option, if you have it, is to take the treasure and avoid the monsters somehow. Lead them off into another area of the dungeon and then ditch them. Sneak in behind them. Intimidate them. Bargain with them. Etc. Fighting is most likely not going to be your best option early on.

[viking vince]

You have a lot of excellent advise here. Only one thing to add


ALWAYS ask the DM about houserules

[Particle_Man]

And, as far as I'm aware, there are no actual rules for creating non-1st level characters. It was greatly assumed that you would start at 1st level and play up through the ranks. That's really part of the whole game.

1st ed. AD&D Dungeon Masters Guide has an appendix to let people roll up high-level characters. The low chance of getting "fabbo" magic items is instructive, IMHO.

[hamlet]

1st ed. AD&D Dungeon Masters Guide has an appendix to let people roll up high-level characters. The low chance of getting "fabbo" magic items is instructive, IMHO.

Hmmm, I had forgotten about that . . . Have to go look at that later on.

And yes, I've always been a believer in scanter, lower magic in general. Rather than handing out gauntlets of ogre power, dwarven throwing hammers, mauls of the titan, etc., keep it less. Make that lowly +1 sword really special when they find it. Make it unique, and make sure that when others learn about it, they come looking for it for themselves.

[ken-do-nim]

Um, a word about why you shouldn't start with Tomb of Horrors is in order. Success is all about in-depth experience with the game system; divinations in particular. If you just start at the entrance, characters will die fast. Successful parties start in town, cast a boat load of spells up front and track down legends so they know what they are up against, and write scrolls of spells that will likely be needed over and over again. With advance warning thanks to divinations and a large supply of summoned monsters, the party should be able to master that module with nary a life loss.

[hamlet]

Um, a word about why you shouldn't start with Tomb of Horrors is in order. Success is all about in-depth experience with the game system; divinations in particular. If you just start at the entrance, characters will die fast. Successful parties start in town, cast a boat load of spells up front and track down legends so they know what they are up against, and write scrolls of spells that will likely be needed over and over again. With advance warning thanks to divinations and a large supply of summoned monsters, the party should be able to master that module with nary a life loss.

Also also: the module is a test of player skill. Character skill is, in some ways, incidental. One can conceivably "win" that module with a first level character if you're thoughtful, patient, and clever.

As a starting player in the system, you don't have enough skill and mastery to pull it off even with a 10th level character. Best to stretch your legs with lower level modules first.