PDA

View Full Version : What changed between 3 & 3.5 on LA?



Niren
2012-01-10, 11:48 AM
In Savage Species They have a very complete way to determine Level Adjustment (LA) but the monsters in the MM,MM2,MM3,MM4 dont come out with the same totals.example. In MM3 the Rakshasa Naztharune is listed as a +5 LA: But these advantages give LA. Spell Resistance +1, Unbalanced Stats, +1(or even +2 because of the +10 dex & +8 con among others) Natural AC +1, at will spells +1, Nat attacks (a 5th lvl fighter gets 1 the monster gets 2) +1, Damage reduction Good& piercing +2, Bab of +11, +1, so all ready have a +8 LA(or+9) not a +5 LA
so does anybody know what changed because I cant get many of the monsters to add up right.

Cog
2012-01-10, 11:58 AM
In Savage Species They have a very complete way to determine Level Adjustment (LA) but the monsters in the MM,MM2,MM3,MM4 dont come out with the same totals.example. In MM3 the Rakshasa Naztharune is listed as a +5 LA: But these advantages give LA. Spell Resistance +1, Unbalanced Stats, +1(or even +2 because of the +10 dex & +8 con among others) Natural AC +1, at will spells +1, Nat attacks (a 5th lvl fighter gets 1 the monster gets 2) +1, Damage reduction Good& piercing +2, Bab of +11, +1, so all ready have a +8 LA(or+9) not a +5 LA
so does anybody know what changed because I cant get many of the monsters to add up right.

The formula given in Savage Species was never meant to be definitive; it's only meant as a guideline for doing your own calculations when LA isn't otherwise provided, and sticking to it is not going to give you good results.

Those poor results may still be better than actual printed LAs, however.

Lapak
2012-01-10, 12:01 PM
Your basic problem is that LA is pretty well hopeless as a mechanic to begin with beyond +1 or +2 at most, because most of the abilities that it gives don't scale as a character increases in power.

Typically this means that high LA makes you too weak at any level except right around the CR of the original monster, because its abilities are scaled to that level of threat. At lower levels than that, the abilities are powerful but don't necessarily make up for the basic stats (like hit points, caster level and BAB) that they cost you; at higher levels, you're still suffering the LA but the abilities have become irrelevant.

3.0 significantly overvalued non-scaling abilities like the ones you mention: a bonus to Natural Armor is nice at low-medium levels, but at very low levels you're super-vulnerable to one lucky shot because you're missing hit points due to LA and at high levels it's replaceable with (relatively) dirt-cheap magic and is no longer worth the level. Same with DR, same with non-scaling SR, same with an extra +1 modifier to one stat.

They recognized this in 3.5, and LA was generally lower than you'd expect from 3.0 to make monster PCs somewhat more viable. That's why things aren't adding up. That said, PCs with more than one or two LA are still going to have issues.

Niren
2012-01-10, 12:32 PM
@ Lapak that is the most reasonable info about the differance bteween the two versions I have read yet. I wished they would have updated Savage Species to 3.5.