[E6] Room than can be entered, but not left

[Gan The Grey]

Using the typical E6 rules, is there a way to create a room, by RAW, that can be entered via a limited set of means, but not left once inside? I'm envisioning some sort of vault whose contents may need to be accessed for some reason, but is designed so that things can be put inside to prevent them from becoming a threat to the world.

[Curious]

Using the typical E6 rules, is there a way to create a room, by RAW, that can be entered via a limited set of means, but not left once inside? I'm envisioning some sort of vault whose contents may need to be accessed for some reason, but is designed so that things can be put inside to prevent them from becoming a threat to the world.

Dead magic zone demiplane.

[Marnath]

Dead magic zone demiplane.

The portal still works though. Every demiplane has at least one entrance, if I read it right.

[SirFredgar]

Dead magic zone demiplane.

Great, and how do we do this at level 6?

[Curious]

Great, and how do we do this at level 6?

Ilhenoon (or however you spell that) Cleric 6. Use Heighten Spell and Earth Spell with DMM to boost a single spell to 10th level, then take the Extra Slot feat to gain 9th level spell slots to cast genesis with.

[SirFredgar]

Ilhenoon (or however you spell that) Cleric 6. Use Heighten Spell and Earth Spell with DMM to boost a single spell to 10th level, then take the Extra Slot feat to gain 9th level spell slots to cast genesis with.

Hmmm.... while granted this might work by RAW, it pretty clearly violates the spirit of E6, and is pretty questionable if a GM would allow Extra Spell to work like that in the first place.

[Gan The Grey]

Ilhenoon (or however you spell that) Cleric 6. Use Heighten Spell and Earth Spell with DMM to boost a single spell to 10th level, then take the Extra Slot feat to gain 9th level spell slots to cast genesis with.

I respect this as a valid answer, but...I was looking for something a little less cheesy and more...I dunno, adherent to the spirit of E6. Maybe a series of magic items created using the rules in the DMG. I don't actually need it to be COMPLETELY RAW. A little creative tinkering wouldn't hurt too badly. I just want it to be within the realm of logic based on the constraints of the campaign setting.

We could assume that spells higher than 3rd level exist, but only under the power of high CR outsiders and deities. As Gate shenanigans wouldn't be possible in E6, making use of these outsiders' special capabilities would be more difficult, but maybe not impossible.

[Daftendirekt]

really deep pit.

/thread

[sonofzeal]

really deep pit.

/thread
Druid5 is fine. Warlock1 is fine, with the right invocation. Sor/Wiz is fine, with the right spells. Anyone with a +10 climb modifier is fine.

[W3bDragon]

I have a couple of ideas, but again you'll have to decide what works and what doesn't under E6 in your game.

First, a room with only one door, made of adamantite or some other very strong material. The door has a hole in its side where a deadbolt lock would go, and another hole in the frame of the door to allow the dead bolt to slide in. Instead of using a dead bolt, use an immovable rod. When the door is closed, the rod's button clicks inside the door, holding it in place. The door would have no holes, handles, or any features from the inside. From the outside, it has a sliding opening that allows access to the rod to remove it.

This one depends on the existence of the rod in your campaign.

Second, a similar setup as above, but requires a bit of technological finglement. Instead of using an Immovable rod, you use a metallic rod of some sort. In the frame, you place a coiled electric magnet that would magnetize when exposed to electricity. The simply set a glyph of warding, keyed to electricity damage, to set off when the door is closed. Open door, go in, close door, zaaaaap, magnet kicks in, metallic rod pulled into place inside the door and locks it.

This one depends on how comfortable you are using technology in your campaign.

Last but not least, a self-resetting trap of Dimensional Anchor inside the room itself to keep anyone inside from leaving.

[sonofzeal]

I have a couple of ideas, but again you'll have to decide what works and what doesn't under E6 in your game.

First, a room with only one door, made of adamantite or some other very strong material. The door has a hole in its side where a deadbolt lock would go, and another hole in the frame of the door to allow the dead bolt to slide in. Instead of using a dead bolt, use an immovable rod. When the door is closed, the rod's button clicks inside the door, holding it in place. The door would have no holes, handles, or any features from the inside. From the outside, it has a sliding opening that allows access to the rod to remove it.

This one depends on the existence of the rod in your campaign.

Second, a similar setup as above, but requires a bit of technological finglement. Instead of using an Immovable rod, you use a metallic rod of some sort. In the frame, you place a coiled electric magnet that would magnetize when exposed to electricity. The simply set a glyph of warding, keyed to electricity damage, to set off when the door is closed. Open door, go in, close door, zaaaaap, magnet kicks in, metallic rod pulled into place inside the door and locks it.

This one depends on how comfortable you are using technology in your campaign.

Last but not least, a self-resetting trap of Dimensional Anchor inside the room itself to keep anyone inside from leaving.
Martial Adepts have maneuvers that ignore hardness and could break the door eventually. And even without that, anyone with Power Attack and a greatsword can hope to deal enough damage to overcome even Adamantine's hardness.

You'd have to use walls of force, but that breaks the spirit of E6...

[W3bDragon]

Martial Adepts have maneuvers that ignore hardness and could break the door eventually. And even without that, anyone with Power Attack and a greatsword can hope to deal enough damage to overcome even Adamantine's hardness.

Self-resetting traps of "Make Whole" on the door? That might work. Its only a second level spell.

[sonofzeal]

Self-resetting traps of "Make Whole" on the door? That might work. Its only a second level spell.
Sufficient immediately-resetting traps of Summon Monster 1 might actually do the trick. Sixty feet of celestial dogs are difficult to get past, if a new one is summoned the instant one leaves the square or is killed. You can tumble through occupied squares, but DC 47 is hard to pass in E6, and you'd need a land speed greater than 30 to even attempt it.

[W3bDragon]

Sufficient immediately-resetting traps of Summon Monster 1 might actually do the trick. Sixty feet of celestial dogs are difficult to get past, if a new one is summoned the instant one leaves the square or is killed. You can tumble through occupied squares, but DC 47 is hard to pass in E6, and you'd need a land speed greater than 30 to even attempt it.

Perhaps, assuming the area is too small for someone to fly over the dogs, and the dogs would be reset faster than someone can zap them off with say lightning bolt. I don't have enough experience with trap building to know if they can work as immediate actions, reacting to the death of the dog.

[Averis Vol]

theres a third level spell that opens a portal to the shadow plane (shadow cache, spell compendium) choose a spot, cast the spell and enter the plane, then its just a matter of building an area where no one can take said item and leaving the plane. sure putting an item there might not necessarily be "safe: seeing as everything on that plane is malevolent as ****, but you can only hope a powerful entity gets to it like a shadow dragon and puts it as part of his horde. and there ya go, no ones getting that item.

[sonofzeal]

theres a third level spell that opens a portal to the shadow plane (shadow cache, spell compendium) choose a spot, cast the spell and enter the plane, then its just a matter of building an area where no one can take said item and leaving the plane. sure putting an item there might not necessarily be "safe: seeing as everything on that plane is malevolent as ****, but you can only hope a powerful entity gets to it like a shadow dragon and puts it as part of his horde. and there ya go, no ones getting that item.
Shadow Cache doesn't let you enter the plane of shadows yourself. You'd need some other method of doing that, which won't be easy in E6.

[molten_dragon]

I can't' think of a way to do it without resorting to high-level spells.

That being said, if you're willing to use higher-level spells, you could have it set up so that when the door is shut, the walls are covered with antilife shell or repulsion spells. Again, it kind of breaks the spirit of E6 though.

[Cespenar]

Craft a new spell by referencing the "inward trap" usage of Magic Circle Against Evil. Apply the theory to a room.

[Telok]

I once converted to AD&D a dungeon with a room like this in it. Your biggest problem is that there isn't strictly a spell to do what you need in 3.x D&D. Spell research would get you what you needed though.

The room in question was built in four dimensions. Normal rooms exist in a building in three dimensions, they have the normal height-length-width measurements. This room is in a building that has four dimensions (magic was used to access the extra dimension, not to build anything). The room has height, length, width, and tilt.

In appearance the room is simply a large round stone room with thirty doors on the walls, all of the doors open to blank stone walls except for the entrance door. When most of the mass in the room is on the side opposite of the entrance door then the room acts normally. If more of the mass in the room is on the side with the entrance door then the room tilts in the fourth dimension. The entrance door, if you can pick it out of thirty identical doors, now opens to a blank stone wall. Additionally magnetic north now appears to be toward the ceiling, and spells behave as if you were in an extra dimensional space (you partially are, and sort of not). Gravity does not change.

The most basic method of adding items to the room is to use the Unseen Servant spell to take them to the other side. Subtracting items from the room usually involves summoning a heavy creature to stand opposite the entrance door.

[nazgulnine]

really deep pit.

/thread

I just wanted to relate how much of a laugh I got out of this one, picturing a very cartoony situation where the dm says, "and you all fall into a chasm. the end."

That said, I'm thinking Deep Slumber could have a niche in this kind of situation. :smallconfused:

[Gan The Grey]

I am completely unfamiliar with Psionics, but is there anything there that might help?

[Flickerdart]

Sufficient immediately-resetting traps of Summon Monster 1 might actually do the trick. Sixty feet of celestial dogs are difficult to get past, if a new one is summoned the instant one leaves the square or is killed. You can tumble through occupied squares, but DC 47 is hard to pass in E6, and you'd need a land speed greater than 30 to even attempt it.
"Sixty feet of celestial dogs" is my new favourite phrase.

[sreservoir]

"Sixty feet of celestial dogs" is my new favourite phrase.

so fifteen lame celestial dogs? :smallamused:

[ahenobarbi]

Craft a new spell by referencing the "inward trap" usage of Magic Circle Against Evil. Apply the theory to a room.

Make big extradimensional space (bigger bag of holding). Everyone is outside there. Setup inward Magic against <alignement> circles.

Would it work?

[Daftendirekt]

Druid5 is fine. Warlock1 is fine, with the right invocation. Sor/Wiz is fine, with the right spells. Anyone with a +10 climb modifier is fine.

Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

Enjoy.

/thread

[Cespenar]

Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

Enjoy.

/thread

Damage the wall with Stone Dragon maneuvers. The wall is now not "perfectly smooth". Proceed to climb.

thread

:smalltongue:

[Marnath]

Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

Enjoy.

/thread

Those examples can all fly, save for the last.:smallconfused:

[ahenobarbi]

Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

You can tie a rope to something above the pit and use it to climb up (or tie it around you and have someone pull you up).

[nedz]

Major Image on a Purple Worm
Nom, Nom, Nom


Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

Spiderclimb or Levitate ?

[Flickerdart]

Grappling hook to the top of the pit/the ceiling, plus sovereign glue.

[Lapak]

Damage the wall with Stone Dragon maneuvers. The wall is now not "perfectly smooth". Proceed to climb.

thread

:smalltongue:OK. We can do this.

- Find a naturally-occurring magic dead zone.
- Carve out a pit - a GIANT pit. Leave a spire of solid rock in the center that leaves a 10' square platform inside the magic dead zone, 60' below the surface of the pit. Make the pit 10' across in every direction.
- Build aqueducts / redirect a river / whatever such that all four walls of the pit are raging waterfalls that will wash anyone attempting to scale them into the pit. The waterfalls (and pit) drain into a vast underground lake with no exit.
- Construct a cap for the pit. The cap should completely cover the pit except for two things: the edges should have a gap wide enough to create the waterfalls, and there should be a 1" hole drilled through the center of the cap. Make the cap 10' thick, just for kicks.

Entering the room is straightforward: Gaseous Form is an E6-valid, potion-capable spell that will get you through the one-inch entry hole and down to the platform.

Leaving it is not: once you float down into the dead-magic zone of the platform you'll lose Gaseous Form and be unable to regain it. The pit is too narrow for any natural flyer with less than Good maneuverability to get back up to the top without hitting a wall, the waterfalls will wash anyone who gets to the wall into the pit where they will be trapped and/or drown. Spellcasting and supernatural abilities are useless, smashing the walls or the spire won't get you any closer to escaping.

The only easy escape I can see is for a natural flyer with Good or Perfect maneuverability who ALSO has a way to get through a 10' thick stone cap while in flight. It's not impossible, but it's a reasonably tough nut to crack.

(Cue someone solving this with a trivial method I've overlooked.)

[Lapak]

(That's weird. My post isn't showing up for me, but it does show up on the Post a Reply screen. Persists even after clearing my cache.)

Edit: There it is.

[Gan The Grey]

OK. We can do this.

- Find a naturally-occurring magic dead zone.
- Carve out a pit - a GIANT pit. Leave a spire of solid rock in the center that leaves a 10' square platform inside the magic dead zone, 60' below the surface of the pit. Make the pit 10' across in every direction.
- Build aqueducts / redirect a river / whatever such that all four walls of the pit are raging waterfalls that will wash anyone attempting to scale them into the pit. The waterfalls (and pit) drain into a vast underground lake with no exit.
- Construct a cap for the pit. The cap should completely cover the pit except for two things: the edges should have a gap wide enough to create the waterfalls, and there should be a 1" hole drilled through the center of the cap. Make the cap 10' thick, just for kicks.

Entering the room is straightforward: Gaseous Form is an E6-valid, potion-capable spell that will get you through the one-inch entry hole and down to the platform.

Leaving it is not: once you float down into the dead-magic zone of the platform you'll lose Gaseous Form and be unable to regain it. The pit is too narrow for any natural flyer with less than Good maneuverability to get back up to the top without hitting a wall, the waterfalls will wash anyone who gets to the wall into the pit where they will be trapped and/or drown. Spellcasting and supernatural abilities are useless, smashing the walls or the spire won't get you any closer to escaping.

The only easy escape I can see is for a natural flyer with Good or Perfect maneuverability who ALSO has a way to get through a 10' thick stone cap while in flight. It's not impossible, but it's a reasonably tough nut to crack.

(Cue someone solving this with a trivial method I've overlooked.)

I like this. Unless someone can come up with a way to overcome this...sounds good. Now, if I could just figure out what exactly to use it for.

I initially pictured this as a vault of some sort used for storing dangerous but also useful arcane items. Maybe people need access (somehow) to whatever is in there, but they don't want anyone to be able to take anything out.

[ahenobarbi]

The only easy escape I can see is for a natural flyer with Good or Perfect maneuverability who ALSO has a way to get through a 10' thick stone cap while in flight. It's not impossible, but it's a reasonably tough nut to crack.

(Cue someone solving this with a trivial method I've overlooked.)

Actually natural flyer/hot air balloon/regular rope to go above dead magic zone and you get gaseous form back (unless dead magic starts right below hole...).

[TuggyNE]

Actually natural flyer/hot air balloon/regular rope to go above dead magic zone and you get gaseous form back (unless dead magic starts right below hole...).

Yeah, this would have to be constructed very precisely, but I can't think of any way to get out ... hang on, what about Ex earth gliding? (Assuming you wish to protect against someone calling -- not summoning -- an earth elemental and getting it to fetch whatever's inside for you.)

[sonofzeal]

Okay, how about perfectly smooth walls on said pit, covered in grease. Per the PHB Climb rules, "A perfectly smooth flat, vertical surface cannot be climbed".

Enjoy.

/thread
Druid5 is fine. Warlock1 is fine, with the right invocation. Sor/Wiz is fine, with the right spells. So are Bard, Duskblade, Archivist, Cleric, and Wu Jen.

Please stop saying "/thread" on things that were thoroughly rebutted in the post you quoted.

[nedz]

OK. We can do this.

...

(Cue someone solving this with a trivial method I've overlooked.)

1) A Pick-Axe

What holds the platform up again ?
It must have a stone support - so you can mine a tunnel through that.
Its not quick and its not pretty.

2) A 5th level Druid
Wildshape is SU. Change into a fish or something and swim out of the dead zone

3) Patience
The underground lake must have an exit or the water will back up eventually. This gives you the option of floating up to the surface.
Getting out at the end is harder, but not impossible.

(Cue someone adding more caveats)

[dextercorvia]

Su abilities are suppressed in DMZs, so no fish for you.

Also, an Initiate of Mystra will be able to cast spells to get out of a DMZ/AMF. That feat is available at level 3. I forget off the top of my head whether Mystra offers the spell domain, but that would make things easiest, as you could Anyspell Alter Self, or Levitate right up. It might take a while to break the cap, but you have time.

[Wyntonian]

3) Patience
The underground lake must have an exit or the water will back up eventually. This gives you the option of floating up to the surface.
Getting out at the end is harder, but not impossible.



About the water...

Maybe a bunch of metal stuff and a permanencied Heat Metal to boil a limited amount into steam, which is then recirculated into the waterfalls? I dunno. It's a shot in the dark.

[Darkomn]

How about a room that you could get out of, but which would kill anybody who did.

For example being fully submerged in acid does 10d6 damage per round according to SRD, and could quickly kill any character below level 6. So have like an elevator submerged in acid with a pulley on the outside to pull it out of the acid when you need to let someone in or out. Then once they are submerged they can't escape.

Acid does 10d6 a round for a max of 60 damage a round magically treated Obdurdium for stronghold builders guide has a hardness of 60 so it should be able to last indefinitely in a pool of acid. See below

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[dextercorvia]

How about a room that you could get out of, but which would kill anybody who did.

For example being fully submerged in acid does 10d6 damage per round according to SRD, and could quickly kill any character below level 6. So have like an elevator submerged in acid with a pulley on the outside to pull it out of the acid when you need to let someone in or out. Then once they are submerged they can't escape.

Acid does 10d6 a round for a max of 60 damage a round magically treated Obdurdium for stronghold builders guide has a hardness of 60 so it should be able to last indefinitely in a pool of acid. See below

Acid immunity or sufficient resistance isn't all that hard to come by in E6.

[Darkomn]

oh well making the diagram was fun at least:smallbiggrin:

[Cespenar]

OK. We can do this.

- Find a naturally-occurring magic dead zone.
- Carve out a pit - a GIANT pit. Leave a spire of solid rock in the center that leaves a 10' square platform inside the magic dead zone, 60' below the surface of the pit. Make the pit 10' across in every direction.
- Build aqueducts / redirect a river / whatever such that all four walls of the pit are raging waterfalls that will wash anyone attempting to scale them into the pit. The waterfalls (and pit) drain into a vast underground lake with no exit.
- Construct a cap for the pit. The cap should completely cover the pit except for two things: the edges should have a gap wide enough to create the waterfalls, and there should be a 1" hole drilled through the center of the cap. Make the cap 10' thick, just for kicks.

Entering the room is straightforward: Gaseous Form is an E6-valid, potion-capable spell that will get you through the one-inch entry hole and down to the platform.

Leaving it is not: once you float down into the dead-magic zone of the platform you'll lose Gaseous Form and be unable to regain it. The pit is too narrow for any natural flyer with less than Good maneuverability to get back up to the top without hitting a wall, the waterfalls will wash anyone who gets to the wall into the pit where they will be trapped and/or drown. Spellcasting and supernatural abilities are useless, smashing the walls or the spire won't get you any closer to escaping.

The only easy escape I can see is for a natural flyer with Good or Perfect maneuverability who ALSO has a way to get through a 10' thick stone cap while in flight. It's not impossible, but it's a reasonably tough nut to crack.

(Cue someone solving this with a trivial method I've overlooked.)

The platform is only 60 feet below the pit's surface? Easy. :smalltongue:

Jump 5' up, Shadow Jaunt the rest 50', stick to the cap using Dance of the Spider stance. After that, stop, Mountain Hammer time.

[Lapak]

Hmm! So far I don't see anything that we can't change to improve the pit.

Actually natural flyer/hot air balloon/regular rope to go above dead magic zone and you get gaseous form back (unless dead magic starts right below hole...).You've got nothing to attach a regular rope to, and if you think to cart a hot-air balloon (and are able to carry a nonmagical balloon small enough to carry in Gaseous Form but strong enough to float you) into the oubliette then you deserve to escape. I figured that this would be possible to escape, as short of divine intervention it's not going to be possible to be totally escape-proof even without the E6 cap.


1) A Pick-Axe

What holds the platform up again ?
It must have a stone support - so you can mine a tunnel through that.
Its not quick and its not pretty.It's a solid stone spire. You could mine the whole thing out, but that just leaves you in the underground lake with nowhere to stand.

2) A 5th level Druid
Wildshape is SU. Change into a fish or something and swim out of the dead zoneCan't Wildshape in a dead magic zone. Also, the lake doesn't go anywhere, so that's no help.

3) Patience
The underground lake must have an exit or the water will back up eventually. This gives you the option of floating up to the surface.
Getting out at the end is harder, but not impossible.

(Cue someone adding more caveats)Let's assume that the lake drains into an aquifer - which is what most underground water sources DO, after all. No exit that way!


The platform is only 60 feet below the pit's surface? Easy. :smalltongue:

Jump 5' up, Shadow Jaunt the rest 50', stick to the cap using Dance of the Spider stance. After that, stop, Mountain Hammer time.Let's say that the dead magic zone extends at least 20 or 30 feet above the platform and pad the top of the spire. Bit of a rough landing for the entry, but this IS supposed to be a room you put things in that you don't want back after all. Maybe it's possible to pad the top of the spire to make for a softer landing. :smallsmile: Is a 30' vertical leap from a standing start enough to discourage most E6 characters?

[Qwertystop]

Break the wall far enough back that there's an empty space behind the waterfall. Then climb up there, digging the hole in front of you.


In other words, Minecraft your way out.

[TuggyNE]

Drop a rope through the hole before heading down in gaseous form, making sure it's at least 60' long or whatever (i.e. goes down into the dead magic zone) -- edit: and attached above the cap with some simple anchor. Then just pop a single potion, go down, do whatever, grab the rope and head back up.

Obviously, this fails if the rope somehow blocks gaseous form; if that's the case, either get some magically thin cord to go through the hole (the dead magic zone obviously doesn't go that far), or use mountain hammer work beforehand from the outside.

[ahenobarbi]

Hmm! So far I don't see anything that we can't change to improve the pit.
You've got nothing to attach a regular rope to, and if you think to cart a hot-air balloon (and are able to carry a nonmagical balloon small enough to carry in Gaseous Form but strong enough to float you) into the oubliette then you deserve to escape. I figured that this would be possible to escape, as short of divine intervention it's not going to be possible to be totally escape-proof even without the E6 cap.

I meant tie rope to something above the entrance (party member, mule corpse you carry in your extra dimensional storage,... ) drop one end of rope down the hole, then become gaseous, go down, take what you want climb up the rope above dead magic zone, become gaseous again, leave.

Another idea:


Make cave in natural dead magic zone. Give it a hard to break door (wall of force would be best but permanent WoF would be to expansive). Make something that will open door for 1 round every 24 hours (or another long time). Put inside a lot of yellow mold, brown modl and green slime (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Dungeons#Brown_Mold_.28CR_2.29).

[Lapak]

Break the wall far enough back that there's an empty space behind the waterfall. Then climb up there, digging the hole in front of you.


In other words, Minecraft your way out.This would definitely work, but I'm not sure how most characters are going to start the mine. At the level of the platform, the walls are ten feet away and through a waterfall; at the bottom, you're swimming and I assume that makes it difficult to get the right kind of motion going without drowning. A natural water-breather could probably dig his way out, though. It's worth noting that any creature with the natural or extraordinary ability to dig or pass through stone is going to be able to get out, for that matter.


Drop a rope through the hole before heading down in gaseous form, making sure it's at least 60' long or whatever (i.e. goes down into the dead magic zone) -- edit: and attached above the cap with some simple anchor. Then just pop a single potion, go down, do whatever, grab the rope and head back up.

Obviously, this fails if the rope somehow blocks gaseous form; if that's the case, either get some magically thin cord to go through the hole (the dead magic zone obviously doesn't go that far), or use mountain hammer work beforehand from the outside.Digging in from the outside would definitely work, but I don't think that creating an indestructible inescapable room was part of the goal. :smallbiggrin:

The rope-trick can be resolved by making the entryway less linear and smaller. Have a druid Stone Shape the cap before it's placed; rather than a straight 1" hole you've got a series of tiny air-hole-type gaps that thread through the 10' cap in several directions before coming out at the bottom. Sort of a combination air-vent and labyrinth. Still passable with Gaseous Form, not threadable with a rope.

[Cespenar]

Let's say that the dead magic zone extends at least 20 or 30 feet above the platform and pad the top of the spire. Bit of a rough landing for the entry, but this IS supposed to be a room you put things in that you don't want back after all. Maybe it's possible to pad the top of the spire to make for a softer landing. :smallsmile: Is a 30' vertical leap from a standing start enough to discourage most E6 characters?

Leaping Dragon Stance + Sudden Leap would clear that 30' easily. Also, as I said before, why jump when you can Shadow Jaunt?

[Lapak]

Leaping Dragon Stance + Sudden Leap would clear that 30' easily. Also, as I said before, why jump when you can Shadow Jaunt?Sure, but if you Sudden Leap you can't then Shadow Jaunt unless I'm failing to remember what kind of action each involves. Shadow Jaunt is Supernatural IIRC so you can't do that while standing in the field.

[Daftendirekt]

Sure, but if you Sudden Leap you can't then Shadow Jaunt unless I'm failing to remember what kind of action each involves. Shadow Jaunt is Supernatural IIRC so you can't do that while standing in the field.

Unfortunately, RAW, none of those Shadow teleportation maneuvers are explicitly listed as SU, thus they default to EX.

[Lapak]

Unfortunately, RAW, none of those Shadow teleportation maneuvers are explicitly listed as SU, thus they default to EX.
Really? That's kind of silly. What's the maximum range on 3rd-level or lower maneuvers? Can we resolve this just by making the pit another 20' deeper?

[Cespenar]

Sure, but if you Sudden Leap you can't then Shadow Jaunt unless I'm failing to remember what kind of action each involves. Shadow Jaunt is Supernatural IIRC so you can't do that while standing in the field.

Jaunt is standard action, Sudden Leap is swift. Combine with normal jump as a move action for extra effect.


Really? That's kind of silly. What's the maximum range on 3rd-level or lower maneuvers? Can we resolve this just by making the pit another 20' deeper?

Probably that and more can be cleared with some mild cheese, so just say it's "deep enough that only flight can reach".

Still, without cheese, it's probably feasible to pump your relevant skills/stats to not be fazed by the waterfall, reach the edges of the cave, and as people have said, minecraft your way into freedom using... Mountain Hammer.

[Lapak]

Jaunt is standard action, Sudden Leap is swift. Combine with normal jump as a move action for extra effect.



Probably that and more can be cleared with some mild cheese, so just say it's "deep enough that only flight can reach".That's probably sensible. Woe to my poor laborers who have to dig the pit without magic, but them's the breaks!

[nedz]

...
It's a solid stone spire. You could mine the whole thing out, but that just leaves you in the underground lake with nowhere to stand.

What does the Spire stand on ?
Water ?
Maybe the base is permiable rock and so it part of the aquifer ?

Anyway I might be able to dig down far enough to get our of the DMZ ?
Or does it go all the way down ?

How about this :

Mine a shaft down the middle of the spire with a cowling to keep the water out.
Undermine the spire to cause it to fall against the wall.
From the top of the now leaning spire mine though behind the waterfall.