Deepbluediver
2012-01-21, 02:20 PM
I've seen other skill systems (like Pathfinder's or any of the many alternates that get posted here) but generally I like the feel of the 3.5 method; I just find it to restrictive. Most of the DMs I've gamed with let you buy a whole rank in cross-class skills for 1 point because half-ranks where just a pain in the arse to deal with, but few people did because only having half as many as max-possible ranks in something seemed relatively weak, except for very rare situations.
I've decided to fix that. I would use this system with my rebalanced core-classes, but I'm pretty sure it can stand alone just fine, too. Some of this has been copied verbatim from the SRD, I'm only tweaking a few things.
Since skills are supposed to represent something a character learns, not a just a class feature, I figure everyone should be able to learn anything they want that they are willing to put the effort (skill points) into. This way if you want to make a warrior who happens to be a history-buff, or you want a rogue who can patch himself up after a fight or a Cleric with a passion for music, you can actually do that with multi-classing out the wazoo.
Skills Summary
If you buy any skill, your character gets 1 rank (equal to a +1 bonus on checks with that skill) for each skill point.
Your maximum rank in a skill is your character level + 2.
(there are no longer cross-class skills, and so there is no difference on the skill-cap)
Skill Ranks
A character’s number of ranks in a skill is based on how many skill points a character has invested in a skill. Many skills can be used even if the character has no ranks in them; doing this is called making an untrained skill check.
You are considerered Trained in a skill if you have ranks in it equal to half your CR/ECL or more, rounded down. This indicates you have recieved a level of training and/or dedicated enough practice to be appropriate for your experience.
Ability Modifier
The ability modifier used in a skill check is the modifier for the skill’s key ability (the ability associated with the skill’s use). The key ability of each skill is noted in its description.
Class Skill Bonus
Some classes may naturally be a little bit better at some things, because they do them as part of their everyday routine, instead of needing to practice them the way some one of a different class would.
If a skill is listed as a class skill for you character, you get a bonus to checks made for that skill if you are Trained in it.
The bonus increases as your character adventures and becomes more powerful, provided you keep up with your training.
Table: Bonus for Class Skills
{table=head]ECL|Bonus
1-4|+1
5-9|+2
10-14|+3
15-19|+4
20+|+5[/table]
Class levels stack for determining the bonus, so if you are playing a multiclass character and they have overlapping class skills, you do not get a double-bonus.
Skill Synergy
Some skills grant bonuses to related skill checks; the more ranks you have in the skill granting the bonus, the greater the bonus is.
{table=head]Ranks|Synergy Bonus
5|
2
10|
3
15|
4
20+|
5[/table]
List of Skills
{table=head]Skill|Suggestion
Appraise (Int)|rename to "Analyze"; let it figure out qualities of magic items, perhaps even discern the abilities of an enemy
Autohypnosis* (Con)|Combine with Concentration
Balance (Dex)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Bluff (Cha)|none at this time
Climb (Str)|none at this time
Concentration (Con)|Combine with Autohypnosis
Craft* (Int)|whole system needs reworking
Diplomacy (Cha)|remove most skill synergies, limit shifts in attitude, make temporary instead of permenant
Decipher Script|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Linguistics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/linguistics)
Disable Device (Dex)|combine with Open Lock; i.e. Pathfinder's Disable Device (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/disable-device)
Disguise (Cha)|none at this time
Escape Artist (Dex)|none at this time
Forgery|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Linguistics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/linguistics)
Fly (Dex)|use Pathfinder's version of Fly (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/fly)
Gather Information (Cha)|combine with Diplomacy (like Pathfinder)
Handle Animal* (Cha)|revise skill to make it more usefull for controlling an animal companion/pet/warbeast in battle
Heal* (Wis)|improve skill so it can actually restore HP, cure diseases, etc.
Hide (Dex)|Combine with Move Silently; i.e. Pathfinder's Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/stealth)
Intimidate (Cha)|none at this time
Jump (Str)|combine with Tumble; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Knowledge- Arcana* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Dungeoneering* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Engineering & Architecture* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Geography* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- History* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Local* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Nature* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Nobility* (Int)|combine with Knowledge (History)
Knowledge- Planes* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Religion* (Int)|none at this time
Listen (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Move Silently|Combine with Hide; i.e. Pathfinder's Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/stealth)
Perform (Cha)|reduce different variations of this skill (dance, instrumental, voice, etc).
Profession (variable)|calculate with different stats depending on job
Ride (Dex)|combine with Handle Animal
Search (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Sense Motive (Wis)|none at this time
Sleight of Hand* (Dex)|none at this time
Spot (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Survival (Wis)|none at this time
Swim (Str)|make more beneficial with fewer ranks
Tumble|combine with Jump; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Use Magic Device* (Cha)|make more user-friendly to non-casters
Use Rope|combine with another skill, possibly Survival or Sleight of Hand[/table]
*Cannot be used untrained
FAQ
Q: But DBD, this means that if I go up a level, and don't put any more ranks in a skill, I might lose my bonus, meaning I'd be LESS powerful than I was!
A: Yes, that's rights. As I see it, skills are things that you have trained at, not just gained as class features, and if you don't practice them constantly, you start to lose your edge. It's only 1 skill point every 2 levels, and if you are struggling to afford that you might need to take a deeper look at your build.
Edit: Added a list of all the 3.5 class skills I know about and their appropriate modifiers, IMO (some have been changed). I'll add links to any Homebrewed versions I replace the RAW with.
Edit 2: Recently learned about Skill Tricks from another poster. These are apparently sort of like mini-feats that cost 2 skill points apiece, and are found in the Complete Scoundrel splatbook. I need to track down a copy of that and read up on them, but in the meantime here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171328) is a list of Homebrewed tricks by RoC.
I've decided to fix that. I would use this system with my rebalanced core-classes, but I'm pretty sure it can stand alone just fine, too. Some of this has been copied verbatim from the SRD, I'm only tweaking a few things.
Since skills are supposed to represent something a character learns, not a just a class feature, I figure everyone should be able to learn anything they want that they are willing to put the effort (skill points) into. This way if you want to make a warrior who happens to be a history-buff, or you want a rogue who can patch himself up after a fight or a Cleric with a passion for music, you can actually do that with multi-classing out the wazoo.
Skills Summary
If you buy any skill, your character gets 1 rank (equal to a +1 bonus on checks with that skill) for each skill point.
Your maximum rank in a skill is your character level + 2.
(there are no longer cross-class skills, and so there is no difference on the skill-cap)
Skill Ranks
A character’s number of ranks in a skill is based on how many skill points a character has invested in a skill. Many skills can be used even if the character has no ranks in them; doing this is called making an untrained skill check.
You are considerered Trained in a skill if you have ranks in it equal to half your CR/ECL or more, rounded down. This indicates you have recieved a level of training and/or dedicated enough practice to be appropriate for your experience.
Ability Modifier
The ability modifier used in a skill check is the modifier for the skill’s key ability (the ability associated with the skill’s use). The key ability of each skill is noted in its description.
Class Skill Bonus
Some classes may naturally be a little bit better at some things, because they do them as part of their everyday routine, instead of needing to practice them the way some one of a different class would.
If a skill is listed as a class skill for you character, you get a bonus to checks made for that skill if you are Trained in it.
The bonus increases as your character adventures and becomes more powerful, provided you keep up with your training.
Table: Bonus for Class Skills
{table=head]ECL|Bonus
1-4|+1
5-9|+2
10-14|+3
15-19|+4
20+|+5[/table]
Class levels stack for determining the bonus, so if you are playing a multiclass character and they have overlapping class skills, you do not get a double-bonus.
Skill Synergy
Some skills grant bonuses to related skill checks; the more ranks you have in the skill granting the bonus, the greater the bonus is.
{table=head]Ranks|Synergy Bonus
5|
2
10|
3
15|
4
20+|
5[/table]
List of Skills
{table=head]Skill|Suggestion
Appraise (Int)|rename to "Analyze"; let it figure out qualities of magic items, perhaps even discern the abilities of an enemy
Autohypnosis* (Con)|Combine with Concentration
Balance (Dex)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Bluff (Cha)|none at this time
Climb (Str)|none at this time
Concentration (Con)|Combine with Autohypnosis
Craft* (Int)|whole system needs reworking
Diplomacy (Cha)|remove most skill synergies, limit shifts in attitude, make temporary instead of permenant
Decipher Script|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Linguistics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/linguistics)
Disable Device (Dex)|combine with Open Lock; i.e. Pathfinder's Disable Device (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/disable-device)
Disguise (Cha)|none at this time
Escape Artist (Dex)|none at this time
Forgery|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Linguistics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/linguistics)
Fly (Dex)|use Pathfinder's version of Fly (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/fly)
Gather Information (Cha)|combine with Diplomacy (like Pathfinder)
Handle Animal* (Cha)|revise skill to make it more usefull for controlling an animal companion/pet/warbeast in battle
Heal* (Wis)|improve skill so it can actually restore HP, cure diseases, etc.
Hide (Dex)|Combine with Move Silently; i.e. Pathfinder's Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/stealth)
Intimidate (Cha)|none at this time
Jump (Str)|combine with Tumble; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Knowledge- Arcana* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Dungeoneering* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Engineering & Architecture* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Geography* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- History* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Local* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Nature* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Nobility* (Int)|combine with Knowledge (History)
Knowledge- Planes* (Int)|none at this time
Knowledge- Religion* (Int)|none at this time
Listen (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Move Silently|Combine with Hide; i.e. Pathfinder's Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/stealth)
Perform (Cha)|reduce different variations of this skill (dance, instrumental, voice, etc).
Profession (variable)|calculate with different stats depending on job
Ride (Dex)|combine with Handle Animal
Search (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Sense Motive (Wis)|none at this time
Sleight of Hand* (Dex)|none at this time
Spot (Wis)|combine with other skills; i.e. Pathfinder's Perception (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/perception)
Survival (Wis)|none at this time
Swim (Str)|make more beneficial with fewer ranks
Tumble|combine with Jump; i.e. Pathfinder's Acrobatics (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/acrobatics)
Use Magic Device* (Cha)|make more user-friendly to non-casters
Use Rope|combine with another skill, possibly Survival or Sleight of Hand[/table]
*Cannot be used untrained
FAQ
Q: But DBD, this means that if I go up a level, and don't put any more ranks in a skill, I might lose my bonus, meaning I'd be LESS powerful than I was!
A: Yes, that's rights. As I see it, skills are things that you have trained at, not just gained as class features, and if you don't practice them constantly, you start to lose your edge. It's only 1 skill point every 2 levels, and if you are struggling to afford that you might need to take a deeper look at your build.
Edit: Added a list of all the 3.5 class skills I know about and their appropriate modifiers, IMO (some have been changed). I'll add links to any Homebrewed versions I replace the RAW with.
Edit 2: Recently learned about Skill Tricks from another poster. These are apparently sort of like mini-feats that cost 2 skill points apiece, and are found in the Complete Scoundrel splatbook. I need to track down a copy of that and read up on them, but in the meantime here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171328) is a list of Homebrewed tricks by RoC.