Geast/Quest

[Laniius]

Specifically, is there a "Greater" version, in any 3.5 book? Also, why does the higher level version of geas seem to be somewhat worse than the lesser version for high level play? I know geas doesn't allow a saving throw, and that lesser geas does; but the penalties of geas (3d6 damage per day) vs the effects of lesser geas (-2 penalty to an ability score each day, that stacks) seems a bit weaker. What's to prevent someone healing themselves each day via a wand or an outside source instead of doing what the geas wants them to?

The reason why I'm asking is I have the rare opportunity to cast this spell next session (along with mark of justice) but I am level 24 in an epic game. The target that I'm casting it on would barely feel the penalty and would still be a potential danger.

[Anxe]

I suppose by RAW it isn't worse. Interesting. However, I've made some houserule modifications to it.
1. Permanent.
2. Damage can't be healed until the quest is resumed.

You can suggest those changes to your DM or even have your character do spell research to create a greater version. Both of those have a DM permission caveat though. Might be easier to just cast Dominate.

[tyckspoon]

What's to prevent someone healing themselves each day via a wand or an outside source instead of doing what the geas wants them to?


Primarily the fact that it's a (Compulsion.) You can't voluntarily disobey the Geas- as long as you are subject to it, it makes you work towards accomplishing the job you were given. The penalties are there to encourage the Geas'd subject to keep working on that job in case they somehow get immunity/protection from the mind-controlling part of the spell, such as a long-term Protection From Evil or Mindblank-like ability, which let you ignore the Geas's commands without actually removing the spell.

[Demons_eye]

Specifically, is there a "Greater" version, in any 3.5 book? Also, why does the higher level version of geas seem to be somewhat worse than the lesser version for high level play? I know geas doesn't allow a saving throw, and that lesser geas does; but the penalties of geas (3d6 damage per day) vs the effects of lesser geas (-2 penalty to an ability score each day, that stacks) seems a bit weaker. What's to prevent someone healing themselves each day via a wand or an outside source instead of doing what the geas wants them to?

The reason why I'm asking is I have the rare opportunity to cast this spell next session (along with mark of justice) but I am level 24 in an epic game. The target that I'm casting it on would barely feel the penalty and would still be a potential danger.

Is there anything that says you can't add on both (If the target is lower then 7hd anyway)?

Missed the last part. Can you research a 9th/EPIC level spell that combines the best of both?

[sreservoir]

Primarily the fact that it's a (Compulsion.) You can't voluntarily disobey the Geas- as long as you are subject to it, it makes you work towards accomplishing the job you were given. The penalties are there to encourage the Geas'd subject to keep working on that job in case they somehow get immunity/protection from the mind-controlling part of the spell, such as a long-term Protection From Evil or Mindblank-like ability, which let you ignore the Geas's commands without actually removing the spell.

no, the spell itself is (compulsion), so you'd have immunity to the damage, too. the damage is against being prevented from carrying it out.

mind, it is more interesting to read the 3d6 damage to be 3d6 ability damage -- making it actually more powerful than lesser geas.

[Coidzor]

Craft contingent spell can get you something like it, I think, where you have something like a contingent greater bestow curse if they deviate from the course laid out by their geas?

Or a chain of contingent X's set to go off if he violates the geas or survives the contingent spell before it in the chain.

[sreservoir]

isn't mark of justice just contingent bestow curse with less cost and a higher level?

[Laniius]

no, the spell itself is (compulsion), so you'd have immunity to the damage, too. the damage is against being prevented from carrying it out.

mind, it is more interesting to read the 3d6 damage to be 3d6 ability damage -- making it actually more powerful than lesser geas.

Could that be what it actually is? It doesn't specify hp damage. Or am I just being hopeful?

[Laniius]

isn't mark of justice just contingent bestow curse with less cost and a higher level?

Possibly, but for rp reasons it makes more sense for mark of justice rather than straight up cursing.

[0nimaru]

Cruelty itself, I make the greater do 3d6 ability damage, rather than 3d6 hp damage.

Another options is to have it be that BoVD type. Vile I think. So you need somebody in a hallowed area to remove it.

[Strormer]

Vile would be rather vicious, which I like, but the Geas isn't an evil-only ability so vile damage wouldn't really fit there.

I understand this plight as Geas/Quest is actually one of my favorite spells, along with bestow curse, ironically. We've always played it that a character is compelled to complete their quest and the damage comes into play when something forces the character to deviate from their quest or they manage to willfully turn from their quest. It's more of a slap on the wrist telling them to keep on task than an actual consequence. That being said, I just take up Monstrous Thrall once I'm at 9th so if you're in epic that might be your best option. Contin. BC isn't a bad option either, or Mark, but both are situationally appropriate at best.

[Psyren]

I'd just use the PF version(s), (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/g/geas-quest) personally.