3.5/PF - A proper zombie game

[Silus]

So I was thinking of adding a zombie type scenario to my roster of backup games. I'm looking for suggestions on how to run it however. I mean, zombies aren't really that scary for anyone above lvl 1.

Here's what I have thus far:

HP: Characters will only get the initial max HP + Con for HP at 1st level and only receive their Con bonus (Min of 1) each level (as opposed to rolling dice). All other stats scale as normal (Spell levels, feats, skills, ect. ect.)

Disease: How else would the virus spread? All zombies, when making a melee attack, have a % chance to transmit the virus, the % based on the armor (No armor = 90%, up to Plate = 30-50% due to coverage). Upon contracting the virus (Failing a Fort save), they take an unspecified amount of Con damage each...oh, hour or so. The virus/diseases works normally like other diseases in terms of getting rid of it (Countered by how easy it is to contract the virus). Dying by the virus/disease causes the deceased to rise as a zombie within a few hours. Destroying the body stops the process.

Zombies: Two variety initially: Slow and fast. The slow ones get +5-10 movement and represent those corpses that just went into rigor or those who's muscles have deteriorated. The fast ones are those in between (After rigor goes away but before muscle deterioration). They are attracted by noise and bright lights, so spellcasters are likely to take out hordes of zombies, but at the same time they're likely to attract lots more.

Plot: Survive and rescue as many NPCs as you can.

I'm thinking that given some tinkering, this could make a pretty good game (Got to watch out for the casters though)

*Goes back to reading the World War Z TvTropes page*

[stack]

Well, sun domain clerics will laugh, laugh even longer if they take the feat that lets them burn two turn undeads for a greater turning. Stuck after they use the turnings up, but untouchable until then.

[Rhaegar14]

HP: Characters will only get the initial max HP + Con for HP at 1st level and only receive their Con bonus (Min of 1) each level (as opposed to rolling dice). All other stats scale as normal (Spell levels, feats, skills, ect. ect.)

This is very bad. You will take away the only advantage melee has over casters. Melee deserves nice things every so often.

As for the rest, the infection thing could really suck depending on what level your PCs are at; if it's practical (not necessarily easy, but doable) for them to cure the disease, it'll be fine.

Basic slow zombies are represented fairly well by the zombie template in Monster Manual; they get one action per turn to represent their slowness. If you want different types of zombies, I would suggest refluffing some other undead.

Edit: @stack: Then they just take feats like Extra Turning and Exalted Turning! XD

[TheArsenal]

EL 6. This is THE best way to play against Zombies. A huge zombie giant, or a Bodak are going to be final bosses in this type of game, otherwise we end up with PCs calmly walking through cities of undeads at LV 15.

PS: Isn't there already an infectious Zombie Template in PF?

[Ernir]

Make this a low level game. You're right, (human) zombies aren't scary above level 1. Hacking on a Save-or-die-when-touched doesn't really change that.

Also, casters and ranged attackers are obviously the way to go in a situation like this. =/

[Z3ro]

Instead of zombies, you could always make the undead something like a wight. Even if they're not doing much damage, a negative level on an attack is still relevant at just about any level. Even a 1-in-20 chance of hitting is scary when everyone attack can give you a negative leve.

[TurtleKing]

Mmm. Interested. Especially if you do this as a pbp game. Do agree with both not changing health gain as well it being E6. If going E6 then check out Gnorman's classes: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215986 Done quite nice and seems fairly balanced. Actually gives melee nice things. Also for the zombies just grab Libris Mortis for ways to alter/enhance them.

[Pokonic]

Instead of zombies, you could always make the undead something like a wight. Even if they're not doing much damage, a negative level on an attack is still relevant at just about any level. Even a 1-in-20 chance of hitting is scary when everyone attack can give you a negative leve.

Rather than this, the virus is necromantic in nature and brings negitive levels on failed saves. Eventualy, unless cured, even the most stalwort of NPC's without spells that reverse such magical effects will be wandering around with the hords.

A PC could, in essance, not tell the other party members of his infection and probalby hide it until the DC level is too high to not show he is suffering.

[SamBurke]

EL 6. This is THE best way to play against Zombies. A huge zombie giant, or a Bodak are going to be final bosses in this type of game, otherwise we end up with PCs calmly walking through cities of undeads at LV 15.

PS: Isn't there already an infectious Zombie Template in PF?

There are three templates, actually.

Also, I think that you should really, really, check for Clerics. Even in PF they can spam healing and damage to Undead at the same time, making undead fighting easy.

Besides that, the Disrupt Undead cantrip may come up a lot; it's one trait away and as a spammable solid action at level one, a really, really, easy way to take them down.

[TurtleKing]

If going 3.5 then can also get its Greater version of Disrupt Undead that can deal upto 10d8 positive energy damage. Another spell that is useful is Healing Sphere from BOEF...yes that book...that is a healing version of Flaming Sphere that can heal for 2d8+1 per level/+10 for a minute. With that spell can bounce it around healing and damaging from one turn to the next. Another spell suggestions are the Light of Lunia/mercuria/Venya spells. All deal damage at twice base damage to undead and evil outsiders, shed light, and for Venya heal a little bit at medium range.

[Silus]

This is very bad. You will take away the only advantage melee has over casters. Melee deserves nice things every so often.

As for the rest, the infection thing could really suck depending on what level your PCs are at; if it's practical (not necessarily easy, but doable) for them to cure the disease, it'll be fine.

Basic slow zombies are represented fairly well by the zombie template in Monster Manual; they get one action per turn to represent their slowness. If you want different types of zombies, I would suggest refluffing some other undead.

Edit: @stack: Then they just take feats like Extra Turning and Exalted Turning! XD

Well the idea behind the HP nerf is that getting mobbed by undead in this situation should be deadly. It would, I'd hope, force the players to think about strategy more than putting a straight up fight. The idea is to, occasionally and when the terrain call for it, throw one or two zombies at the players. Usually in houses or back allies or the like. The more open the area, the more zombies. We're talking like L4D Hordes times 3. Walk into the market square and there's like 1/8th of the city's zombified population and they're oh so hungry. And the PCs are, at most, lvl 3.

On the topic of melee, they're likely to have better armor than the casters and other T1 classes and will therefore be in a better position to resist zombie attacks. Higher AC and better Fort saves are likely to do more than a fireball in terms of survival.


Make this a low level game. You're right, (human) zombies aren't scary above level 1. Hacking on a Save-or-die-when-touched doesn't really change that.

Also, casters and ranged attackers are obviously the way to go in a situation like this. =/

While I agree with Casters and Ranged being kings in this sort of game, they still have to watch out just like any other players. Casters will run out of their "Pwn Undead" spells or Turnings (Or they can turn only so many) and the Ranged players need to be careful about getting overwhelmed. Fireballs will take out a good number of zombies, but it'll just serve as a beacon to draw more to the players. The clerics will have to decide whether they're going full on undead slaying or act as support to keep their Cleave/Great Cleave from succumbing to zombies and the virus. And unless we're firing siege weapons, ranged can only hit one target at a time (Exception would be a Gunslinger with a shotgun/blunderbuss).

This picture is great at describing what I'd be throwing at the PCs at lvl 1-2.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/SilusCrow/4ec19e16f006-xl.jpg

To add onto the campaign scenario,the PCs would have to last for ~7-10 days for aid to arrive (in the form of Clockwork soldiers from the PF Bestiary 3 being sent by a neighboring city). Rescuing survivors would not be mandatory, but it would result in allies, contacts and store discounts if/when the NPC survives and makes it out of the city. I am pretty adamant about the monsters all being zombies due to the fact that this would likely be the intro game for a campaign, so the players would likely be lvl 1-3 for the duration. The suggestions of higher level undead (Wrights, undead giants and the like) are appreciated but are more suited for higher level games than I am planning for.