How do you handle illusions?

[Myou]

I'm interested to know how you guys treat illusions, as it seems to vary a lot from group to group.

Under what cases do you or your group allow or deny will saves against them? When would they be totally invalidated with no save?

If a character sees an illusion do they get a save? Does the plausibility of the image make a difference? What sort of attempts to interact with it grant a save? If you throw a stone at an illusion and it passes through does that allow you to see through it with no save?

[JKTrickster]

I personally believe that "interacting" should always require an action. This makes sense because the Wizard/Sorcerer/whoever spent resources in order to put up that illusion (the spell slot they used). At the very least, it shouldn't be any random person that just walks by and doesn't even glance at the illusion.

Therefore even something such as "seeing" or "listening" or "throwing a rock" should definitely be some kind of defined action (probably move, unless they do something intricate). Even "studying" the illusion would take time and effort, and it shouldn't be just a free action.

[Flickerdart]

Looking at something is not interacting with it, unless it is a retinal scanner. The plausibility of the image would make people suspect its illusory nature (and thus be tempted to check it out), but by no means would it give people a free save.

[motoko's ghost]

Generally I would handle an illusion with a metaphysical glove.:smalltongue:

In all honesty we usually just go with whatever makes sense("you see a tarrasque charging at you" :secretly roll to see if they can recognise it:, then again if they stick a sword in it and it goes straight through,etc etc) there's no hard and fast way of doing it, try working it out with your players.

[TheOtherSidhe]

If someone just sees an illusion, they don't get a saving throw. The trick with illusions is getting something they won't question enough to study or interact with. I would say plausibility certainly makes a difference, because something completely off the wall is going to inspire whoever sees it to take a closer look, and thus study or interact with it. To give some examples, assuming this is exclusively the Image line of spells:

Let's say you make an illusion of a wall to cover up a hallway. Someone just walking past doesn't get a saving throw unless they have a reason to question that wall's existence. If they've been to that place before, a new wall might give them pause. However, they still don't get a saving throw until they actually examine it in greater detail. A move action, maybe, just to give it a second look, would give a saving throw, while poking it would get an automatic disbelieve.

Or you imitate a creature with it, like Elan sometimes does. A suddenly appearing creature is pretty believable if you look like a magic user, or if no one sees you create it, they aren't likely to question it. Again, no saving throw unless there is a reasonable doubt that the creature exists, or it's interacted with. Wondering why a creature suddenly appeared (assuming no one saw you casting) would call for a saving throw, as would an extremely bizarre creature that doesn't look real, subject to discretion. Attacking it would still be an automatic disbelieve.

The thing with illusions is being subtle and believable. Using things people won't question and think should be there works best. Creating a City Guard (or several) to break up a bar fight or raid any illegal function, for example, is perfectly believable and in the best case would make the criminals run away, rather than wonder if it's a real guard.

[Acanous]

Touching an illusion [Figment] normally gives a save, and attacking or passing through a "Solid" illusion immediately breaks it, as per the description.

If you have an illusory fog cloud, however, you would need to be cued in to it's nature somehow- by watching the caster as the spell was cast with a spellcraft check, by observing the fog with a Knowledge: Arcana or Knowledge: nature. Illusory Darkness would be extremely difficult to disbelieve, but that's using a higher-level spell to duplicate a lower, and things with low-light vision or darkvision would be able to see through it so it passes.

Really, if anyone is observing the casting of an illusion spell with a spot and a spellcraft, I believe they're entitled to a save immediately. They'll *Know* an illusion is being cast, and see immediate results. Exception to this would be if you cast Major Image (Nothing) on one round, and then had effects start taking place as you faked casting other spells in the same area. (Thus the target would know an illusion was cast, but see nothing [perhaps assuming the spell failed or they had already disbelieved it] and on further rounds, the monkey that appears seems to have been called in with Summon Monster)

Really, the illusion school is much different from Conjuration, Abjuration and Transmutation where proper application of knowledge wins the day, and closer to Divination, where creativity and personal resourcefulness are brought to the fore.

[Psyren]

In all honesty we usually just go with whatever makes sense("you see a tarrasque charging at you" :secretly roll to see if they can recognise it:, then again if they stick a sword in it and it goes straight through,etc etc) there's no hard and fast way of doing it, try working it out with your players.

You have to be careful with this method though, as you can end up metagaming instead of your players. For instance, I would expect a charging Tarrasque to make a lot of noise and even shake the ground. A Silent Image would have neither of these things - but by simply telling your players "You see a Tarrasque charging at you" without giving them any aural or tactile information, they'd have no reason to disbelieve what they see. Yet their characters would surely notice a conspicuous lack of sound or physical feedback and instantly get will saves.

[Rorrik]

As far as the probability to disbelieve the illusion, I like to accommodate a factor similar to the bluff tables. If they have reason to doubt it, bonuses on the save, on the other hand, if they want to believe its real (like a trap that makes an illusory bridge extend over a chasm when they pull a switch-perhaps complete with rumbling dungeon, or the lover who had spurned the young duke returning and begging his forgiveness) then they should get a penalty to disbelieve it, because they don't want to disbelieve it.

[Gavinfoxx]

Have you read this set of houserules?

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Book_of_Gears_%283.5e_Sourcebook%29/Magic#Illusion_Magic:_I_Don.27t_Believe_This_Crap

It works really, really, really well at fixing the illusion behavior...

[Myou]

Have you read this set of houserules?

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Book_of_Gears_%283.5e_Sourcebook%29/Magic#Illusion_Magic:_I_Don.27t_Believe_This_Crap

It works really, really, really well at fixing the illusion behavior...

That method seems a little overcomplicated to me.