Surprisingly good adaptations [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

Fri

2012-02-06, 05:05 AM

So, randomly, today I was thinking about adaptations that's surprisingly good, while it has no business to be.

This is not about simply good adaptations. It's about adaptations, that by all means, usually would be bad, but for some reason it turned out to be good.

An example that I was thinking of was Extreme Ghostbuster. By all account, it should be a typical 90's darker and grittier 'XTREME' adaptation of a classic series, which usually only ended up ridiculous. It even got what supposed to be ridiculous 'cliche' cartoon character like the wheelchaired guy. But for some reason, I remember that it's really good, everyone in the team has real personality, the darker and grittier setting was working, and so on.

Another example I was thinking about was Starship Trooper: Razack's Roughnecks. You know, the 3d animated series one. It should be the usual ridiculous premise of "R-Rated movie adapted into a cartoon series for kids" like, that Rambo the Animated Series.

But now I still consider that Razack's Roughnecks to be the best thing that ever came out of Starship Trooper 'franchise', if you could disregard the clunky early 3d animation. It combines the best things from the book and the movie, and filtered out the worst of them.

Can you think other examples?

Totally Guy

2012-02-06, 05:40 AM

The reboot of Doctor Who exceeded my expectations.

The remake of the mini cooper car was another that impressed me.

Those are both kind of old news though... And more "adaptions for a modern audience" instead of the above adaption paradigm.

dehro

2012-02-06, 06:06 AM

I'll bite:

MOTR... after Ralph Bakshi and several other previous attempts, when I first heard about the plan to filmify LOTR, I was huguelly skeptical.
PJ did a great job though..all considered (yes, we all have our pet hates in what he did...mines are Arwen, Gimli and Legolas' skating..but things could have gone a hell of a lot worse than they have)

following totally guy's idea..the new fiat 500... very well done, if 10 years to late to compete with the mini cooper.

The Princess Bride, anyone?..it's a freaking classic!

if remakes count..battlestar galactica.

maybe I have watched the movie first so that's why I'm biased, but "the name of the rose" is actually pretty good, if compared to the wonderful verbosity of the book it's adapted from.

DigoDragon

2012-02-06, 07:22 AM

I'd like to add the animated film "Horton Hears a Who" exceeded my expectations. The book is pretty short and simple, barely enough content for a quick kid's short, so I was quite entertained how well they kept the story's premise while expanding it to a feature length.

NikitaDarkstar

2012-02-06, 07:36 AM

The TV-show versions of Black Beauty and the Black stallion. Granted they might not hold up to an adult audience but they were never meant to, and for kids with an interest in horses (kids having just started to out-grow the cartoon stuff) they were very, very good in my opinion.

The last Herbie movie. I always loved Herbie, but the CGI really made him come alive. (And make me want a WV Beetle even more...)

I have to agree on the Lord of the Rings movies. I certainly have my pet peeves, and on occasion I get an overwhelming urge to slap PJ in the face with the books, but on the whole he did get the original story across quite well.

The Discworld cartoons Soulmusic and Wyrd Sisters (I think the second one is?), while the animation isn't the best it does feel like Discworld and again, could have been a whole lot worse considering some of the things going on in that setting. (For example.. Hogfather tried and failed at capturing Ankh-Mor-Porkh pretty badly...)

Fri

2012-02-06, 07:37 AM

I haven't watched it, but horton hears a who's receivement surprised me indeed, knowing what the original is about. Especially after the adaptation of cat in the hat.

Now, I wonder if someone could adaptate I Want My Hat Back (http://themetapicture.com/best-story-book-ever/) :smallbiggrin:

Maybe as a gritty detective story?

H Birchgrove

2012-02-06, 07:47 AM

I second the latest Herbie movie! :smallsmile:

People may disagree with me, but I love the Transformers live action films. :smallbiggrin:

dehro

2012-02-06, 09:09 AM

The TV-show versions of Black Beauty and the Black stallion.
[...]
The Discworld cartoons Soulmusic and Wyrd Sisters (I think the second one is?), while the animation isn't the best it does feel like Discworld and again, could have been a whole lot worse considering some of the things going on in that setting. (For example.. Hogfather tried and failed at capturing Ankh-Mor-Porkh pretty badly...)

I should get around to watching the cartoons..
in the colour of magic they cast an actor who was just too old to portray a convincing rincewind...imho.

NikitaDarkstar

2012-02-06, 09:39 AM

I should get around to watching the cartoons..
in the colour of magic they cast an actor who was just too old to portray a convincing rincewind...imho.

Nah I can accept an old Rincewind to be honest. I mean most of the wizards in the Discoworld series are portrayed as old, bearded and pretty insane men. The issue is he wasn't convincing as Rincewind, I can't quite put my finger on it, but he never felt like Rincewind.

Avilan the Grey

2012-02-06, 09:43 AM

The live action version of The Grinch

MASH (TV) must be counted; the concept was really weird when it was pitched as a show.

Tiki Snakes

2012-02-06, 09:43 AM

I kind of agree, because as far as I've always been concerned Rincewind is Eric Idle (only, after being on a starvation diet for a month or so).

But by the end of the thing, I think David Jason had done some pretty okay work with the character. He wasn't gangly or ginger enough, but he had a certain charm.

Ravens_cry

2012-02-06, 11:50 AM

The animated Grinch special. I don't suppose it is exactly surprising, considering who was working on it, but it was an still excellent adaptation.

Cazaril

2012-02-06, 11:56 AM

The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardobe as a movie turned out to actually be pretty good, and remained almost entirely faithful to the book. Prince Caspian and Voyage of the Dawn Treader, though, I had some pretty serious issues with. :smallannoyed:

Cikomyr

2012-02-06, 11:59 AM

Nerd-o-rama

2012-02-06, 12:09 PM

The movie adaptation of Watchmen was as good as they could have done with the classic constraints of movie-making.

Although I had 0 expectation, since I was introduced to the serie with the movie, which made me pick up the comic book...

I thought the action scenes were pretty crappily done, but those were never the point of Watchmen. The overall plot adaptation was as good as it was going to get (with some improvements to the ending, in my opinion), and the acting was far better than I ever expected, especially for Dan and Rorschach.

Archpaladin Zousha

2012-02-06, 12:33 PM

I'd like to propose one most likely aren't going to know, but Hallmark's 1998 miniseries, Merlin (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/Merlin-1998), will always hold a special place in my heart as one of my favorite adaptations of the Arthur myth. It may be cheesy in some parts (usually when Martin Short's character's around), but it does a good job of telling the story of the rise and fall of Camelot, as well as the events that preceded it. Miranda Richardson manages to be a character you love and hate as Queen Mab, and I could really believe all the characters were who they portrayed (though Mordred probably went a bit over the top too). The fears about the death of magic and the coming change are treated very maturely. Though there are a few background details that the novelization expands on, I'd rank Merlin up there with Excalibur as one of the better King Arthur films (certainly better than the likes of Quest For Camelot and the odd semi-historical King Arthur with photoshopped Keira Knightley).

Radar

2012-02-06, 12:37 PM

Ravens_cry

2012-02-06, 12:46 PM

I thought the action scenes were pretty crappily done, but those were never the point of Watchmen. The overall plot adaptation was as good as it was going to get (with some improvements to the ending, in my opinion), and the acting was far better than I ever expected, especially for Dan and Rorschach.
It was pretty darn good, though some of the music choices felt cliché.
My least favourite part compared to the comic was Mars. In the graphic novel, it was so hauntingly beautiful its eternal stillness, that it almost gave credence to Dr. Manhattans argument.
The film, at least for me, did not capture that grandeur.

Cazaril

2012-02-06, 12:48 PM

I don't know, if it counts, but I was positively surprised by the recent Sherlock Holmes adaptation. The premise seemed a bit iffy - a well known crime solving duo, but with action and explosions. Yet the movie is excelent (character dynamic, pacing, dialog etc.) and portraits Holmes very well.

My problem with that movie was that the villain's motivations were insufficiently villainous.

I mean, seriously? He's using acts of sabotage and terrorism to plunge Europe into war, just as a get-rich-quick scheme? That's really pretty mundane; think about the "yellow journalism" types who ignited the Spanish-American War as a means of selling more newspapers. And it's an especially stupid premise because he already has huge piles of cash. Blackwood at least was attempting to take over the British Empire; Moriarty's ambitions aren't even that lofty.

Other than that, I thought it was pretty good.

Maybe, but I still think, that the BBC miniseries from 1988 was way better.

I'm vaguely aware that it exists, but I've never actually seen it. Maybe I should!

Serpentine

2012-02-06, 01:02 PM

The Rise of the Planet of the Apes.
When I first heard about it, I positively raged. I thought it was the absolute least necessary prequel in the history of cinema (and also I thought it was attached to the other remake of the original). But when I actually watched it, I thought it was great, and I really look forward to the next one in the reboot.

Cikomyr

2012-02-06, 01:27 PM

My least favourite part compared to the comic was Mars. In the graphic novel, it was so hauntingly beautiful its eternal stillness, that it almost gave credence to Dr. Manhattans argument.
The film, at least for me, did not capture that grandeur.

I have to strongly disagree on that part. If anything, the mix of music and narration on Mars was probably what really won me over during that movie. Pruit Igoe and Prophecies.

"I feel fear for the last time"

And something that God Himself could very well say, and he does say it in the movie:

"I am tired of Earth. These people. I'm tired of being caught in the tangle of their lives."

How else can you feel if the Black ants keep asking for your loyalty and help in their desperate struggle against the Red ants, to take control of the nearby trash can?

IrnBruAddict

2012-02-06, 01:38 PM

The old TV movie of Daredevil meets the Hulk was amazing. One of the best comic book movies I've ever seen. (Y'know what, its probably the best tied with the Ed Norton Incredible Hulk movie).

The TF2 Comics are often better than the games.

The Touhou anime of Perfect Cherry Blossom was great. The animation was better than many anime series and they got the characters of Reimu, Marisa and the rest well done and stuck to the canon versions. (not the flanderdised fan versions)

Pokemon Special is 20 times better than the Anime.

Arrietty was a brilliant take in the Borrowers in my opinion. But anything by Studio Ghibli is going to be great. I shouldn't have doubted them.

The Arkahm games are better than any game has a right to be. And thats just based on the engine and gameplay alone. Throw in Batman and the rest and its easy to see how its on of the big hitters in games nowadays.

And I agree a million times with the Starship Troopers cartoon. But I have to dissagree about Sherlock Holmes. While I love the new version (and I do) the best version was, is and always will be Basil the Great Mouse Detective. Never knew about Discworld cartoons so will have to check them out.

Nerd-o-rama

2012-02-06, 01:40 PM

My problem with that movie was that the villain's motivations were insufficiently villainous.

I mean, seriously? He's using acts of sabotage and terrorism to plunge Europe into war, just as a get-rich-quick scheme? That's really pretty mundane; think about the "yellow journalism" types who ignited the Spanish-American War as a means of selling more newspapers. And it's an especially stupid premise because he already has huge piles of cash. Blackwood at least was attempting to take over the British Empire; Moriarty's ambitions aren't even that lofty.

Other than that, I thought it was pretty good.

He actually had exactly the same plot in the novels. There was just less of Holmes and Watson getting shot at by howitzers.

One gets the impression that the money wasn't important in and of itself, but rather as points in the game, and he was going for the all-time high score.

Overall, I'd rate both Holmes films extremely highly at capturing the characters and setting for a modern moviegoing audience, although obviously they resemble the books very little in actual tone.

Xondoure

2012-02-06, 01:45 PM

Cespenar

2012-02-06, 01:48 PM

I thought the action scenes were pretty crappily done, but those were never the point of Watchmen. The overall plot adaptation was as good as it was going to get (with some improvements to the ending, in my opinion), and the acting was far better than I ever expected, especially for Dan and Rorschach.

Seconded. I mean, in my opinion, the action scenes weren't crappy, per se, but they were very, very unfitting with the general theme. There's supposed to be point of significance of their "hero, but not superpowered" kind of status, and they could have wonderfully done it with vicious yet more "normal" fight scenes, but instead they were throwing punches that punctured walls and pulverized bones and... overall every character was not unlike Neo. Seriously?

Nerd-o-rama

2012-02-06, 01:49 PM

Seconded. I mean, in my opinion, the action scenes weren't crappy, per se, but they were very, very unfitting with the general theme. There's supposed to be point of significance of their "hero, but not superpowered" kind of status, and they could have wonderfully done it with slick but realistic martial arts scenes, but instead they were throwing punches that destroyed walls and pulverized bones and... seriously?

And all the slow-mo. Seriously, there is a special place in hell for the Wachowski Brothers for making that kind of shot mandatory in modern summer films.

Ravens_cry

2012-02-06, 01:51 PM

I'm vaguely aware that it exists, but I've never actually seen it. Maybe I should!
It's a real nostalgia trip, just warning you. That being said, the theme basically IS Narnia to me.

Xondoure

2012-02-06, 01:52 PM

And all the slow-mo. Seriously, there is a special place in hell for the Wachowski Brothers for making that kind of shot mandatory in modern summer films.

It lasts just a few seconds but those moments really seemed to stretch out for eternity. :smalltongue:

Cespenar

2012-02-06, 01:55 PM

And all the slow-mo. Seriously, there is a special place in hell for the Wachowski Brothers for making that kind of shot mandatory in modern summer films.

They couldn't have known it would come to this. And it made sense in Matrix, in some way, in which it's supposed to portray Neo's "enlightened" awareness, or so I imagine.

H Birchgrove

2012-02-06, 01:59 PM

I rather liked the film version of From Hell, but I knew that lobotomy wasn't performed that early (at least not to that degree), and I haven't read the graphic novel...

The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardobe as a movie turned out to actually be pretty good, and remained almost entirely faithful to the book. Prince Caspian and Voyage of the Dawn Treader, though, I had some pretty serious issues with. :smallannoyed:

I liked Prince Caspian (the movie) better than The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardobe (which wasn't *bad*).

Voyage of the Dawn Treader is the one I'm surprised they managed to make a film out of. IIRC, the novel was a bit like a series of episodes. I wonder how the latter films will turn out.

Cazaril

2012-02-06, 02:09 PM

Voyage of the Dawn Treader is the one I'm surprised they managed to make a film out of. IIRC, the novel was a bit like a series of episodes. I wonder how the latter films will turn out.

I guess The Silver Chair is going to be the next one out. It (hopefully) should not require any modifications, though I suppose they'll probably try and tie in the stupid green mist from Dawn Treader by connecting it to the Green Lady. Eustace should be fun; I actually thought they did a pretty good job with his casting.

After that it theoretically ought to be The Horse and His Boy, but I have a nasty feeling that they're just going to skip that one. Which is a pity, because it would actually make for a great stand-alone movie.

Edit: Actually, according to Wikipedia the fourth movie will be The Magician's Nephew.

Tengu_temp

2012-02-06, 02:14 PM

The first Pirates of the Carribean movie. It's an adaptation of a theme park ride, and when I went to see it I had exactly 0 expectations for it. And it turned out to be awesome.

Orsen

2012-02-06, 02:24 PM

I don't know, if it counts, but I was positively surprised by the recent Sherlock Holmes adaptation. The premise seemed a bit iffy - a well known crime solving duo, but with action and explosions. Yet the movie is excelent (character dynamic, pacing, dialog etc.) and portraits Holmes very well.

I liked the first Holmes movie when I saw it a year or two ago, whenever it came out. The latest one I thought was a fun movie but I didn't it like as much because I had watched BBC's Sherlock and in my opinion, Sherlock is some of the best....anything I've ever watched. That being said, they are both really different takes on the stories so comparing the two doesn't work great.
I'm happy that first movie inspired me to finally read some Holmes stories though, and after reading many, I can put a vote towards Sherlock, as mentioned above.

Radar

2012-02-06, 02:30 PM

My problem with that movie was that the villain's motivations were insufficiently villainous.

I mean, seriously? He's using acts of sabotage and terrorism to plunge Europe into war, just as a get-rich-quick scheme? That's really pretty mundane; think about the "yellow journalism" types who ignited the Spanish-American War as a means of selling more newspapers. And it's an especially stupid premise because he already has huge piles of cash. Blackwood at least was attempting to take over the British Empire; Moriarty's ambitions aren't even that lofty.

Other than that, I thought it was pretty good.
I was actually refering the one from 2009. I haven't seen the new one yet and forgot to specify it in my post (yes, almost 3 years is recent for me).
From what I remember from the book, Moriarty was into crime mostly for sport - it was an interesting intelectual exercise for him.

Serpentine

2012-02-06, 02:39 PM

Voyage of the Dawn Treader is the one I'm surprised they managed to make a film out of. IIRC, the novel was a bit like a series of episodes. I wonder how the latter films will turn out.They managed it in the old BBC telemovie series thingies...
I guess The Silver Chair is going to be the next one out.The Silver Chair was my favourite in the aforementioned BBC telemovie whatsit, and I'm looking forward to seeing a newer, slicker version.

Note: I haven't read any of the books, and all I know about the plots of them comes from the older adaptation. I have no idea how well they're regarded by people who have read the books.

An Enemy Spy

2012-02-06, 02:46 PM

The movie adaptation of Watchmen was as good as they could have done with the classic constraints of movie-making.

Although I had 0 expectation, since I was introduced to the serie with the movie, which made me pick up the comic book...

The movie struck me as a good concept done poorly. However, it did inspire me to go buy the book, which is now one of my favorite pieces of literature.

hamishspence

2012-02-06, 02:46 PM

Note: I haven't read any of the books, and all I know about the plots of them comes from the older adaptation. I have no idea how well they're regarded by people who have read the books.

I liked the The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe BBC version - and as I recall, the BBC adaptations tended to stick very closely to the book script.

There was also a cartoon version of The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe- changed one or two scenes, but again was pretty well handled.

Gnoman

2012-02-06, 06:01 PM

The old Rankin-Bass cartoon of The Hobbit was one I always found excellent, freakishly deformed elves aside.

MammonAzrael

2012-02-06, 06:11 PM

The first Pirates of the Carribean movie. It's an adaptation of a theme park ride, and when I went to see it I had exactly 0 expectations for it. And it turned out to be awesome.

I'm pretty sure this one wins. A ride with no discernible story was transformed into a fantastic and fun movie (and several decent squeals).

Ravens_cry

2012-02-06, 06:36 PM

I'm pretty sure this one wins. A ride with no discernible story was transformed into a fantastic and fun movie (and several decent squeals).

For some of us it was Monkey Island: The Movie.

Philistine

2012-02-06, 08:11 PM

There's always the Bourne movies. If you've read the books, you know what I mean - and if you haven't, I suggest you spare yourself.

Tengu_temp

2012-02-06, 08:16 PM

The Witcher games, especially the second one. The books were already good, but who expected their spinoff to be possibly the best game of year 2011?

dehro

2012-02-06, 08:19 PM

has anyone mentioned Sin City?

Inglenook

2012-02-06, 08:35 PM

Goosefeather

2012-02-06, 08:37 PM

Another vote for Sherlock. Seriously, 'let's update Sherlock Holmes and put him in the 21st century' sounds a teeeerrible idea on paper, but worked out brilliantly.

And the films, while in my opinion not as good as the series, also qualify easily for 'surprisingly good'. I mean, Robert Downey Jr as Holmes? Jude Law as Watson? GUY RITCHIE directing it? To be honest, it has no right to be as entertaining as it is :smalltongue:

Devonix

2012-02-06, 08:43 PM

It might be a bit of an unpopular opinion but I thought Scott Pilgrim vs. The World was a great adaptation. They changed some stuff, sure, but the end result was 9000 times better and more entertaining than I expected it to be.

Really? I've not really heard anyone say that it was a bad adaptation. Pretty much everyone I know that liked the comics Loved the movie as well.

Cikomyr

2012-02-06, 08:46 PM

Really? I've not really heard anyone say that it was a bad adaptation. Pretty much everyone I know that liked the comics Loved the movie as well.

I sure enjoyed the movie more than the comic. But like Watchmen, I've seen it before the source material.

AtlanteanTroll

2012-02-06, 08:47 PM

Another vote for Sherlock. Seriously, 'let's update Sherlock Holmes and put him in the 21st century' sounds a teeeerrible idea on paper, but worked out brilliantly.

Sure. But what about the 22nd Century? :smallwink:

The Glyphstone

2012-02-06, 08:55 PM

Sure. But what about the 22nd Century? :smallwink:

Preach it, brother! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nkn8n18yS7A)

Devonix

2012-02-06, 08:55 PM

Sure. But what about the 22nd Century? :smallwink:

Hey we could even ad a Robot Watson :smallwink:

The Glyphstone

2012-02-06, 08:56 PM

A Robot Watson would be awesome. Cloning Moriarty would be stupid though.:smallcool:

STsinderman

2012-02-06, 09:02 PM

I just wanted to put in that in spite of the level of hate it seems to have generated, the Green Lantern wasn't actually done all that badly.

Devonix

2012-02-06, 09:13 PM

I just wanted to put in that in spite of the level of hate it seems to have generated, the Green Lantern wasn't actually done all that badly.

:smallconfused:
You sir lose 5 internets.

Lol to each their own. I saw it at a midnight release and me and my friends could not stop with the hate on the ride home.

HFool

2012-02-06, 09:15 PM

Clue, The Social Network and Moneyball.

Gnoman

2012-02-07, 12:12 AM

Silent Hill, despite some questionable choices, did an excellent job of capturing the essence of the game, and was genuinely creepy in ways that fit the atmosphere of the games.

Xondoure

2012-02-07, 12:29 AM

It might be a bit of an unpopular opinion but I thought Scott Pilgrim vs. The World was a great adaptation. They changed some stuff, sure, but the end result was 9000 times better and more entertaining than I expected it to be.

I love that movie. Has at various points been a favorite for the favorite movie position (it fluctuates.)

Fri

2012-02-07, 12:38 AM

The first Pirates of the Carribean movie. It's an adaptation of a theme park ride, and when I went to see it I had exactly 0 expectations for it. And it turned out to be awesome.

This is definitely the most surprising adaptation ever.

I wonder if we'll get some more major surprise. Like, might it be that the battleship movie would turn out to be awesome? Too crazy to be true? I bet people said that about potc back then.

Omergideon

2012-02-07, 06:48 AM

The movie struck me as a good concept done poorly. However, it did inspire me to go buy the book, which is now one of my favorite pieces of literature.

I, in all honesty and knowing the crime it is to say, prefer the Film to the Book. Especially with the ending. I think the film was interesting, exciting, well told, well acted and with great action. The book was good, but not as entertaining and no deeper really.

Also, I think Kickass was an excellent adaptation. And much, MUCH, MUCH better than the comic ever was. In a thousand ways.

And yes, I was suprised by how good the Silent Hill Film was. Though part of that could be the Sean Bean Factor.

This is all.

Totally Guy

2012-02-07, 06:59 AM

I should get around to watching the cartoons..
in the colour of magic they cast an actor who was just too old to portray a convincing rincewind...imho.

To be fair David Jason had been asking if he could play Rincewind for about 25 years.

Did anyone mention the latest My Little Pony incarnation? :smalltongue:

Morty

2012-02-07, 07:55 AM

I have to second the Colour of Magic being a surprisingly good adaptation, speaking as one of the weird people who prefer the older Discworld books to the new ones. Weird casting decisions aside, it got the feel of the book pretty well.

Hopeless

2012-02-07, 08:26 AM

:smallconfused:
You sir lose 5 internets.

Lol to each their own. I saw it at a midnight release and me and my friends could not stop with the hate on the ride home.

So it was as if it were made by someone wearing a red ring?

Sunken Valley

2012-02-07, 08:38 AM

Has anyone mentioned Harry Potter and Twilight? Also the Hunger Games.

STsinderman

2012-02-07, 09:01 AM

:smallconfused:
You sir lose 5 internets.

Lol to each their own. I saw it at a midnight release and me and my friends could not stop with the hate on the ride home.

Come on, it was never going to be as awesome as the comic series. Unfortunately it was a story that wouldn't ever have leant itself well to a live action film.

*Breaks into your house and steals his 5 internets back. Then spray paints your dog green*

Friv

2012-02-07, 09:01 AM

Clue, The Social Network and Moneyball.

Oh good, someone said Clue. :)

Seriously, it was based on a board game, and it still managed to be utterly hilarious.

And I may get a bit of flak for this one, but Street Fighter, inasmuch as I was very surprised to love it.

"Hmm, let's see, oh hey they adapted Street Fighter into a movie. That's pretty cool. Wait, they made Guile the lead? And he's played by Jean-Claude Van Damme? And Raul Julia is Bison? WTF? This is going to be atrocious!"

And then it was, but in the most gloriously enjoyable way and all of the actors were just having a grand old time, Raul was just chowing down on the scenery, and JCVD managed to get through the whole thing straight-faced, which greatly increased my opinion of his acting skills.

STsinderman

2012-02-07, 09:11 AM

The Witcher games, especially the second one. The books were already good, but who expected their spinoff to be possibly the best game of year 2011?

Sorry guy, but Skyrim was easily the best game of 2011!

At this point I would root for an Elder Scrolls adaptation, however I saw how the Dungeons and Dragons films went.

Nerd-o-rama

2012-02-07, 09:21 AM

And the films, while in my opinion not as good as the series, also qualify easily for 'surprisingly good'. I mean, Robert Downey Jr as Holmes? Jude Law as Watson? GUY RITCHIE directing it? To be honest, it has no right to be as entertaining as it is :smalltongue:

Robert Downey Jr. is amazing at playing a functional substance abuser as both entertaining and kind of tragic. Make of that what you will. And Jude Law overall is excellent, and manages to give Watson just enough gravitas that he works in serious scenes and as a straight-man foil to Holmes's weirdness. Guy Ritchie...well, it needed explosions to be successful.

Cloning Moriarty would be stupid though.:smallcool:

Yeah, then it'd just be Doctor Who.

Silent Hill, despite some questionable choices, did an excellent job of capturing the essence of the game, and was genuinely creepy in ways that fit the atmosphere of the games.

Oh lordy agreed. Frankly, the games haven't aged that well, so the movie's probably better at scaring the hell out of you, being one of the few genuinely scary horror films. The plot was altered, sure, but I think it was nicely distilled.

Radar

2012-02-07, 10:24 AM

Oh good, someone said Clue. :)

Seriously, it was based on a board game, and it still managed to be utterly hilarious.
It involved Tim Curry, so it couldn't go wrong. :smalltongue:
Still, any adaptation of a board game is a very risky task.

Tengu_temp

2012-02-07, 11:29 AM

Sorry guy, but Skyrim was easily the best game of 2011!

Witcher 2:
Deep, interesting plot.
Memorable NPCs.
Handles mature topics in a tasteful way.
Quests that make you think and often don't have clear good and evil choices.
Your choices have real effects in the game world.
Meaty, exciting and challenging combat.
Lots of funny dialogues and references.

Skyrim:
Generic plot that does its job but is nothing to write home about.
Derpy NPCs.
Quests that railroad you and are filled with headbangers.
Terrible, simplified dialogue.
Illusion of choice - what you do doesn't matter in the long run anyway.
Decent, but way too easy combat system.
The main source of humour are unintentional game bugs (and there's a lot of them).
Spawned two terribly unfunny internet memes.

Short version: Nope. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvdf5n-zI14)

Xondoure

2012-02-07, 11:29 AM

Come on, it was never going to be as awesome as the comic series. Unfortunately it was a story that wouldn't ever have leant itself well to a live action film.

*Breaks into your house and steals his 5 internets back. Then spray paints your dog green*

I respectfully disagree. What made the Green Lantern movie so bad was that you had this train wreck of a film with tiny little glimmers of the film that could have been. It was almost like there had once been an amazing consistent story but it had been hacked out with a machete some time in the middle leaving the actors scarred and dead inside before they were pumped full of camp.

To sum up how bad it was I shall paraphrase:
Guardians: Parallax sought to use the power of fear but it corrupted him and turned him into a terrible abomination.
Sinestro: There is only one option then. We must do what he did!
Guardians: Very well.
Audiences everywhere: Wait WHAT?

dehro

2012-02-07, 11:55 AM

oh, yes, Clue is made of WIN

STsinderman

2012-02-07, 12:35 PM

Witcher 2:
Deep, interesting plot.
Memorable NPCs.
Handles mature topics in a tasteful way.
Quests that make you think and often don't have clear good and evil choices.
Your choices have real effects in the game world.
Meaty, exciting and challenging combat.
Lots of funny dialogues and references.

Skyrim:
Generic plot that does its job but is nothing to write home about.
Derpy NPCs.
Quests that railroad you and are filled with headbangers.
Terrible, simplified dialogue.
Illusion of choice - what you do doesn't matter in the long run anyway.
Decent, but way too easy combat system.
The main source of humour are unintentional game bugs (and there's a lot of them).
Spawned two terribly unfunny internet memes.

Short version: Nope. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvdf5n-zI14)

Unfortunately most of these points are entirely within the realms of opinion and as such open to speculation. Though yes at times the main plot can be a little flat, their in the beauty of the Elder Scrolls as many of the side quests are highly immersive. At the end of the day we just disagree on game choice.

Tengu_temp

2012-02-07, 12:41 PM

I'd like to point out I'm not the one who called my game of choice easily the best game of 2011. If you state an opinion as a fact, then expect people to argue with it.

STsinderman

2012-02-07, 12:53 PM

Well yes, it is easily the best game of 2011. i was being polite in deciding to defuse. The mechanics are beautiful, the engine elegant and yes there are several memorable characters throughout the game. Complain about the memes? Yes they are far from humorous after their 1000000th telling but at least that means it had enough of an impact that people felt the need to share these little aspects of the game they have found together. How much cultural impact has the Witcher 2 had? Not very much. Its not a bad game but its a meh story built from an ok engine and as for dynamic world, its far from world shattering or even the best attempt. Im not saying its bad, but its not hugely memorable. A play through once and back on the shelf kind of game.

I dont really intend to peak on this subject again so feel free to go big and crazy in your response, contratz you have the last word. Feel happy.

Tengu_temp

2012-02-07, 12:56 PM

Feel happy.

I shall. Let's go back on topic now.

TheEmerged

2012-02-07, 02:37 PM

I respectfully disagree. What made the Green Lantern movie so bad was that you had this train wreck of a film with tiny little glimmers of the film that could have been. It was almost like there had once been an amazing consistent story but it had been hacked out with a machete some time in the middle leaving the actors scarred and dead inside before they were pumped full of camp.

Emphasis/corrections mine.

My recommendation for a *surprisingly* good adaptation was the first Fantastic Four movie. I emphasized *surprisingly* because I expected it to be horrifying beyond words. I was able to seperate the villain in the movie from the character of Doom, though, which may be why.

In terms of an actually good adaptation? I love the changes to the Batman mythos made by the movie Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. Andrea Beaumont is a canon character as far as I'm concerned.

dehro

2012-02-07, 04:07 PM

teenage mutant ninja turtles..the first 3 movies, that is.
I remember watching the animated series and quite liking the first 3 movies...well..2 of them anyway.. the last one made a few years ago I haven't seen.
anyhoo..the movies were actually better than the animated series, I seem to remember.

Tiki Snakes

2012-02-07, 04:17 PM

I actually watched the Green Lantern not that long ago (and not entirely by choice) and was unsuprised by how bad it was given it's reputation. But with a couple of broad but simple editing choices it all would have made infinately more sense as a film.

My memory is fading, but I think it was basically along the lines of, cut the pointless prologue exposition (Because it is explaining what we then see moments later anyway, really), then leave film intact up until the point where he would have rocketed off to the alien world. Instead, film continues with the section where he came back to earth (From near the end, ish) to just kind of hang out. He does his flying off to get trained after the bit with the party and the roller-coaster-save-thing. Training sequence happens as normal, basically, only he doesn't leave, so the scene where he asks to be allowed to go to earth doesn't happen immediately after he just...left earth voluntarily. :smallconfused:

Something like that, anyway. It would also help if his character was not a complete jackass.

Karoht

2012-02-07, 05:31 PM

@Green Lantern
I remember being moderately entertained when any of the lanterns were on screen doing anything, but being horribly bored any time they weren't. This wasn't because I'm ADD or anything. But between the parts of the film where the main character actually is doing his job as a superhero space cop, there's just this... mush... where stuff is happening but there's no attachment. It's almost as if they maybe lifted the lantern scenes straight from the comic, arranged them in the order they needed them to occur, then someone from the writing department went "hey wait, what about the stuff between those parts" and they rushed to film the stuff in between.

I almost feel like the parts with Hal and girly were really just them off set, not really being characters, if that makes any sense.

Oh, and the "you have to be chosen" part that movie bob highlighted just feels so counter to the character. I get the intended context, no problem. He meant that you don't just take things. He was also commenting about his own worthiness. But it comes across like the high school jock saying 'sorry, coach says you ain't good enough for the [insert sports team]' followed by kicking you in the junk and walking away.

As for a decent adaptation of a story... so many of them really aren't adaptations but usually entire reimaginings made for the silver screen. I do think that this is why some stories suffer in the transition from [medium] to film, or even from original film to new film. There's just so much extra crap that they cram in for modern audiences as to completely make a mess out of it, if they aren't extremely careful.

Night at the Roxberry. From an SNL skit to a memorable, quotable, totally enjoyable, with characters that were both intentionally shallow and yet relatable. Textbook example of how to pick up a smidge of source material and expand on it well.

AtlanteanTroll

2012-02-07, 09:31 PM

This is an odd one, but the Nolan Batman films. Honestly though, there have been some godawful Batman movies.

Xondoure

2012-02-07, 09:52 PM

Response to Narnia: I loved the first film, hated the second and didn't bother watching the third. The source material didn't need changing just acceleration which movies naturally provide, and turning Peter into a whiner is the opposite point the books make. Which is that he is now self assured enough to enter the real world without needing to learn more from his experiences in Narnia. It just rubbed me wrong in a lot of ways.

Don Julio Anejo

2012-02-08, 12:08 AM

MammonAzrael

2012-02-08, 01:32 AM

I'm honestly surprised no-one mentioned The Game of Thrones. Is there some kind of a special hate against the HBO version on this forum? Because I honestly found it was pretty damn good, especially with how Tyrion turned out. The only thing that turned me off... (err... on.. but not in the sense of the series being bad) was the 10 minute long lesbian scene with Littlefinger and two "ladies of the night."

The key you're missing is surprisingly good adaptations. I don't think anyone was particularly surprised at how well GoT turned out; HBO had a proven record of being able to make very high quality shows, Martin was very involved in the creation, and all the trickling details of it's production promised good things.

Cespenar

2012-02-08, 10:18 AM

The key you're missing is surprisingly good adaptations. I don't think anyone was particularly surprised at how well GoT turned out; HBO had a proven record of being able to make very high quality shows, Martin was very involved in the creation, and all the trickling details of it's production promised good things.

Still, even in the face of all those positive points, any given book-to-movie adaptation carries within itself an inherent %50 chance to fail miserably. In which case, any good book-to-movie adaptation can be classified as a surprisingly good adaptation. :smalltongue:

Aotrs Commander

2012-02-08, 10:24 AM

Did anyone mention the latest My Little Pony incarnation? :smalltongue:

If you haven't, I would have; I think it's certainly the biggest surprisingly good awesome adaption I've seen in the last twelve months.

I would mention the Lord of the Rings BBC Radio version, but I suspect that's not quite "surprising" enough...

I was pleasently surprised by the newest Star Trek film. I wasn't expecting much out of it at all, so when it turned out to be pretty solid, I was quite impressed.

Edit: Ooh, I knew there was another one - the Tintin movie. I was very much impressed by that (even if I'm not very familiar with the mythos); I think that did a very good job.

DiscipleofBob

2012-02-08, 10:57 AM

It might be a bit of an unpopular opinion but I thought Scott Pilgrim vs. The World was a great adaptation. They changed some stuff, sure, but the end result was 9000 times better and more entertaining than I expected it to be.

The best part is since the script for Scott Pilgrim the movie was done before Scott Pilgrim the comic, the original author decided he had to change the ending of his comic to make it different from the movie.

But yeah, Scott Pilgrim. Friggin' A.

As for new suggestions:

Batman: the Brave and the Bold. Sure, Batman has succeeded in other material before, but not with all the Silver Age goofiness not only present, but flaunted, and it turns out awesome.

Closet_Skeleton

2012-02-08, 11:13 AM

At this point I would root for an Elder Scrolls adaptation, however I saw how the Dungeons and Dragons films went.

Elder Scrolls as a narrative movie would be terrible. There's pretty much nothing to adapt and if you do adapt what story is there you miss the point of everything that's actually interesting.

Best elder scrolls movie would be an in universe documentary.

This is an odd one, but the Nolan Batman films. Honestly though, there have been some godawful Batman movies.

Meh. Christian Bale is a dull Batman. Batman Begins has a terrible plot "its a magic machine that can evapourate water underground but not in the people near it and we're doing the same gas thing that Burton's film did".

The Dark Knight is a so so movie propped up by Heath Ledger, but compared to the previous movie its surprisingly good.

Eldan

2012-02-08, 11:58 AM

Elder Scrolls as a narrative movie would be terrible. There's pretty much nothing to adapt and if you do adapt what story is there you miss the point of everything that's actually interesting.

Best elder scrolls movie would be an in universe documentary.

That would be quite awesome. An adventurer/Scholar traveling around and explaining weird customs, phenomena, creatures and locations. Probably a series of ten to twenty minute films.

Worguron

2012-02-08, 12:01 PM

They managed it in the old BBC telemovie series thingies...The Silver Chair was my favourite in the aforementioned BBC telemovie whatsit, and I'm looking forward to seeing a newer, slicker version.

Note: I haven't read any of the books, and all I know about the plots of them comes from the older adaptation. I have no idea how well they're regarded by people who have read the books.

As a kid, I absolutely loved the BBC telemovies, and like you, The Silver Chair was my favorite. There are a couple reasons for this - namely it had Tom Baker as Puddleglum and Warwick Davis as Glimfeather (sure, Prince Caspian/Dawn Treader had him as Reepicheep, but the addition of Baker pushes this one up). Watching this as a six year old when it came out, I was entranced. I already had VHS tapes of the first two series that had come out and watched them religiously (I actually wore out the tape on them all over the years), and even now I look back at them all fondly.

Other surprisingly good adaptations include the comic books (and RPG) for The Dresden Files, several of the recent movies based on Marvel comics, and the American version of Shameless.

Cespenar

2012-02-08, 12:12 PM

That would be quite awesome. An adventurer/Scholar traveling around and explaining weird customs, phenomena, creatures and locations. Probably a series of ten to twenty minute films.

Pitch the idea to Studio Ghibli, I'd say.

thompur

2012-02-08, 01:02 PM

Tengu_temp

2012-02-08, 01:09 PM

Batman: The Animated Series. Up until then, virtually all dramatic versions of Batman had been campy or crappy, or both.

Batman TAS is great, but come on: what about the 1989 movie?

Tyndmyr

2012-02-08, 01:23 PM

I just wanted to put in that in spite of the level of hate it seems to have generated, the Green Lantern wasn't actually done all that badly.

Oh, yes it was.

Silent Hill, despite some questionable choices, did an excellent job of capturing the essence of the game, and was genuinely creepy in ways that fit the atmosphere of the games.

Now this WAS a great adaptation. The best video game to movie adaptation that I can think of, honestly.

Watchmen and Scott Pilgrim were both fantastic as well.

Nerd-o-rama

2012-02-08, 01:33 PM

Batman TAS is great, but come on: what about the 1989 movie?

Please don't compare the two. My wife and I have gotten into arguments over whether Mark Hamill or Jack Nicholson is the definitive Joker.

Karoht

2012-02-08, 01:34 PM

Batman TAS is great, but come on: what about the 1989 movie?Tim Burton's Batman, even Batman Returns I still feel is better than Batman Begins and Dark Knight. And yes, the Animated Series is probably the best adaptation of Batman thus far, along with being one of the best animated television shows of all time.

Worguron

2012-02-08, 01:41 PM

Please don't compare the two. My wife and I have gotten into arguments over whether Mark Hamill or Jack Nicholson is the definitive Joker.

Jim Carrey is the definitive Joker and Jack Nicholson is the definitive Riddler. Seriously, they might have been wearing the other costume, but that's who they were each portraying.

In all seriousness though, Mark Hamill is the voice I hear when I think Joker and the Animated Series really is one of the best cartoons of all time. I love the Tim Burton Batman movies, but the fact that Batman openly does things that will kill people (such as shoving explosives down their pants) keeps them from being the best adaptation for me.

DiscipleofBob

2012-02-08, 01:50 PM

Karoht

2012-02-08, 02:07 PM

I don't really think the Tim Burton Batman movies were all that great in hindsight. Sure they were good for their time and got the franchise rolling, and are certainly better than say Batman & Robin. But come on: the Joker as an "art lover" and can apparently shoot down the Batjet with a pistol? The Penguin with his own evil circus? If you take off the nostalgia goggles the two movies really start to show how ugly they've aged. I prefer Jim Carrey's Riddler to Nicholson's Joker or Devito's Penguin.You got me on bat jet. As for Joker, he says the same thing in Dark Knight at one point, funny how no one seems to remember it there yet everyone makes something of it in the Tim Burton films.

He was a lover of grim and gruesome artwork (or even just photos of dead/mutilated people), and greatly disliked any of the modern or contemporary or post-modern works. He treated his crimes as works of art. That was some serious character depth IMO, the kind you didn't see in superhero villains in movies at the time.

I rather enjoyed the aesthetic mostly. It was comical yet serious. Lighting and mood I thought were much better than anything in Batman Begins or Dark Knight.

I liked the phoney oppulance that Penguin was trying to surround himself with, only for him to completely tear it away when it was time to be the real badguy after his bid for mayor failed.

Tim Burton Batmobile was frikken awesome. While the Chris Nolan vehicle is cool and all, I think the sheer imposing yet sleek appearance of the Tim Burton Batmobile was so very very spot on.

As for Batman using dynamite on someone, he's actually alive and only rubbing his belly in a later scene. Bats also has Bat grenades doesn't he? I would assume that he uses them for their intended purpose, namely to blow stuff up.

Oh, and Mark Hamill is the definitive Joker. Argument solved. :smalltongue:Agreed. Though Jack Nicholson is an incredibly close second IMO.

Axolotl

2012-02-08, 02:10 PM

Mark Hamill is the definitive Joker but Jack Nicholson is the definitive Jack Nicholson.

Personally I love the Burton movies but I hate Batman so I'm probably biased.

Soras Teva Gee

2012-02-08, 02:53 PM

Batman: The Animated Series. Up until then, virtually all dramatic versions of Batman had been campy or crappy, or both. I had no expectations of this being any better. I was blown away! The writing was strong, the voice casting was perfect, and the animation was exquisitly stylistic and moody. I was in my late 20's when it first came out, and I acted like a little kid on Saturday morning every weekday at 4, when it came on. I still consider it the best dramatic presentation of the Batman ever produced!

That this took until page 3 to be recalled probably says something.

And what it says of course is that it so completely subsumes and distills its mythos that it cannot be identified as an adaptation because for anyone that watches it becomes The Batman.

Mark Hamill is the definitive Joker but Jack Nicholson is the definitive Jack Nicholson.

Yeah Jack Nicholson doesn't really act so much as so up and be Jack Nicholson.

Serpentine

2012-02-08, 05:49 PM

Dude.
Dudes.
Dudettes.
Maaaaaaate.
Adam West. Duh.

Morty

2012-02-08, 05:51 PM

Elder Scrolls as a narrative movie would be terrible. There's pretty much nothing to adapt and if you do adapt what story is there you miss the point of everything that's actually interesting.

Best elder scrolls movie would be an in universe documentary.

Hmmm. A silent protagonist who just nods and shakes his head as people explain things to him, then goes and kills a couple dozen other people. Yeah, not a very good movie material...

Dienekes

2012-02-08, 06:02 PM

Tim Burton's Batman, even Batman Returns I still feel is better than Batman Begins and Dark Knight. And yes, the Animated Series is probably the best adaptation of Batman thus far, along with being one of the best animated television shows of all time.

Must disagree. While I enjoy Jack Nicholson whenever he doesn't try to be romantic he was the only good thing about Burton's Batman, even if he wasn't really playing the Joker so much as Jack Nicholson wearing odd make-up. The soundtrack is by Prince. Keaton may as well have been a smirking plank, Jim Gordon was a joke, Vicki Vale was boring (admittedly about as boring as Rachel Dawes but they at least tried to do something interesting with her in TDK), Batman explodes villains, the Penguin was Killer Croc, and the end involved an army of penguins with rocket launchers on their backs.

Mind you BTAS is the best outside a selection of the best of the actual comics.

Closet_Skeleton

2012-02-08, 06:38 PM

Hmmm. A silent protagonist who just nods and shakes his head as people explain things to him, then goes and kills a couple dozen other people. Yeah, not a very good movie material...

...but I liked the Matrix...:smallfrown:

Prime32

2012-02-08, 07:56 PM

Batman: The Animated Series. Up until then, virtually all dramatic versions of Batman had been campy or crappy, or both. I had no expectations of this being any better. I was blown away! The writing was strong, the voice casting was perfect, and the animation was exquisitly stylistic and moody. I was in my late 20's when it first came out, and I acted like a little kid on Saturday morning every weekday at 4, when it came on. I still consider it the best dramatic presentation of the Batman ever produced!Really, the whole Diniverse (tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Diniverse) is awesome (Batman TAS and Justice League most of all). Even when they had to make a series which was "Batman in high school" they produced Batman Beyond.

Something I saw pointed out about the opening of Batman TAS (http://www.youtube.com/v/lEx9r5enZsk)...
The name of the series is never shown. It doesn't need to be.

H Birchgrove

2012-02-08, 08:09 PM

Dude.
Dudes.
Dudettes.
Maaaaaaate.
Adam West. Duh.

He was great as the Gray Ghost (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_Ghost_%28DC_animated_universe%29) in Batman: TAS. :smallwink:

I do love the live-action camp series. :smallbiggrin:

I just wish Swedish TV would air The Green Hornet with Van Williams and Bruce Lee. :smallfrown: (It's even in the same universe as Adam West's Batman!)

Soras Teva Gee

2012-02-08, 10:16 PM

Really, the whole Diniverse (tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Diniverse) is awesome (Batman TAS and Justice League most of all). Even when they had to make a series which was "Batman in high school" they produced Batman Beyond.

Don't you mean Justice League Unlimited? I mean while it puts most things to shame compared to the rest of the DCAU the Justice League portion has some definite problems with pacing and knowing what to do with the characters.

Though speaking of Batman Beyond I think it a great compliment that I found their retcon of Terry a disappointment since I felt he'd more then earned the title long since and that the creators should have been more confident in their work.

DigoDragon

2012-02-09, 07:41 AM

Even when they had to make a series which was "Batman in high school" they produced Batman Beyond.

Oh yes, I second Batman Beyond as being surprisingly good despite the idea of doing a "high school" version of Batman. Heck, I think there are moments where Beyond was better than TAS... mostly due to the fact that Beyond villains never lived as long as TAS villains did.

Though speaking of Batman Beyond I think it a great compliment that I found their retcon of Terry a disappointment since I felt he'd more then earned the title long since and that the creators should have been more confident in their work.

I agree. Case in point- the Return of the Joker film. :smallbiggrin:

Fri

2012-02-09, 08:06 AM

Emmerask

2012-02-09, 10:07 AM

After hating against the harry potter movie adaptations :smallbiggrin:

The bbc (I think it was?) Discworld adaptations are surprisingly good, pretty close to the books, above avg acting and overall enjoyable :smallsmile:

Prime32

2012-02-09, 11:09 AM

Yes, I very much second Batman Beyond for the premise of "Batman in highschool." Who would've thought that it'd be good.

And Batman Brave and Bold. Who would've thought that a silly campy silver age series would be so succesfull in this age of dark superheroes.You know, I actually liked The Batman more before it started trying to stick closer to canon. (Batwave rather than Batsignal, Clayface having a Harvey-Dent-like backstory...)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0_0dXJ89U4
www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWBIGd6BvKs
www.youtube.com/watch?v=I237jEC-zRU

The episode "Artifacts" also gave us the closest thing we've had to an animated adapatation of The Dark Knight Returns.

thompur

2012-02-10, 12:00 PM

I forgot possibly the greatest adaptation, where the movie is better than the book that inspired it: WHO FRAMED ROGER RABBIT!!! I had read the book "Who Censored Roger Rabbit" about a year before the movie came out, and enjoyed it well enough. When I heard there was a movie in the works, I was very sceptical. WOW! Was I off! Awesome film!!!

Serpentine

2012-02-10, 12:06 PM

I always forget that Who Framed Roger Rabbit? is an adaptation. What's the book like?

thompur

2012-02-10, 04:56 PM

I always forget that Who Framed Roger Rabbit? is an adaptation. What's the book like?

The novel, written by Gary K Wolf, is lots of fun, but very different. Roger is a comic strip character, and is the victim, rather than the suspect. It's been almost 30 years since I've read it, so I don't remember a whole lot of it. I do remember that all the cartoon characters spoke in word baloons, which are tangible. As I recall, Rogers' last baloon is aclue to his murderer.