Lich Monk?

[Olfgar]

As the title suggests, is it possible to get a Lich Monk?

Im not asking about the validity of building one right now or if its a stupid idea or not, I'm only asking if you CAN...because i find the prospect of dimension dooring behind a group of enemies and using the liches paralyzing touch thingie on a flurry of blows would be HILARIOUS.

[Yora]

You still need a caster level of 11th to be able to become a lich. With the Practiced Spellcaster feat, you could make 1 cleric 7/monk x. Maybe expand it into sacred fist.

[Human Paragon 3]

Ah, the Lich Monks. Such fond memories from my childhood.

I told the Lich Doctor.

Lichmas Time is Here.

Acererack, Simon, and Theodore.

[Olfgar]

ha...everything will be comatose!

[FMArthur]

The touch attack that delivers the paralyzing touch can only be used once per round.

[Olfgar]

Haha, everything will be EVENTUALLY paralyzed

[Psyren]

Haha, everything will be EVENTUALLY paralyzed

Except your avatar :smalltongue:

[Rossebay]

Does Abundant Step come with a caster level?

[Psyren]

Does Abundant Step come with a caster level?

Half monk level, so no dice. By the time you get it high enough for lichdom, yay, time for epic!

[Rossebay]

Half monk level, so no dice. By the time you get it high enough for lichdom, yay, time for epic!

Hahaha. Any ways to increase that?

[Feralventas]

Practiced Spellcaster perhaps? It'd probably need to be house-ruled to function for it.

Alternatively, if your DM will allow Manifester level to qualify, a Tashalatora monk build would probably suit your needs fairly easily, though Psionic liches are usually Elans rather than undead. I think Tatoo'd Monk might have a 'Caster level as well, though I'd want to double check that.

[druid91]

Well, if you can get your hands on the dead throne you'd be set. Just sit on it, accept the deal. Pay someone to shrink it, and contain it within an adamantine bauble.

The real danger here is if anyone else sits on the throne and accepts the deal you die. No save.

of course you also get the ability to command and create undead nearly at will.

[Kaeso]

Monk1/Wizardx/Enlightened Fist 10 would be quite funny, and perhaps even quite good, for a lich. Think about it, with some nice buffs you can pump your to hit rolls and damage rolls, you can use (one of the alternatives of) stunning fist, the lich's paralyzing touch AND channel any touch spell through your unarmed strike. This means that you can use all those delicious touch range damage spells normal wizards don't care for, flurry it AND paralyze your foe. Rinse and repeat until the good guys (:P) drop

[DonutBoy12321]

Quite cheesy, but Monk 1 (or 2 personal preference)/Magic Mantle StP Erudite could qualify, depending on your reading of the Magic Mantle. Would be used with Tashalatora (or Ascetic Psion, since Erudite is technically a Psion variant.)

[Grim Reader]

Monk/Archivist into Walker in the Waste, with Exemplar/Legacy Champion/Bloodline shenanigans?

[nedz]

I made a Monk/Death Knight as an antagonist a while back - I templated it quite heavily but it still got paggered. Damm action economy.

Monk 2 / Wizard X / Gish Y should work.

[Venger]

Well, if you can get your hands on the dead throne you'd be set. Just sit on it, accept the deal. Pay someone to shrink it, and contain it within an adamantine bauble.

The real danger here is if anyone else sits on the throne and accepts the deal you die. No save.

of course you also get the ability to command and create undead nearly at will.

what's a "dead throne" and where is it from?

[peacenlove]

Magical Training (a feat in Players guide to faerun that lets you cast cantrips as a sorcerer) and 10 intelligence gives you the requisite caster level at 11th level.

[Myth]

This won't work since the flurry of whiffs doesn't deliver your paralyzing attacks. I tried making a Vampire build where she used her level drain with similar desires for UAs but no dice. At least for level drain there's an awesome (up two) PrC that allows you to do it.

Anyway you must know that Freedom of Movement ruins this build right?

[Tenebris]

Or perhaps:
monk 1/cleric 3/walker in the waste 10/ sacred fist 6

Not exactly a lich (not a standard one), and no fun with paralyzing touch, but constitution drain is also nice.

[Obrysii]

Or perhaps:
monk 1/cleric 3/walker in the waste 10/ sacred fist 6

Not exactly a lich (not a standard one), and no fun with paralyzing touch, but constitution drain is also nice.

Having 5 phylacteries is also quite nice.

[druid91]

what's a "dead throne" and where is it from?

Artifact from an adventure in the back of sandstorm.

[Prime32]

i find the prospect of dimension dooring behind a group of enemies and using the liches paralyzing touch thingie on a flurry of blows would be HILARIOUS.Doesn't work though. Using dimension door ends your turn, so the enemies would get away (and a monk is far worse at dimension door than a wizard).

Options here, from worst to best:

The Sun School feat lets you make a single attack after teleporting.
Setting Sun maneuvers exist for teleporting as a standard, move or swift action, leaving you room to attack. Go Wizard/Unarmed swordsage/Jade phoenix mage.
If lich can be adapted to psionics, a Tashalatora monk/ardent can use powers like inconstant location to teleport-spam.
A warlock with levels in the Crinti Shadow Marauder or Telflammar Shadowlord PrCs can shadowpounce, teleporting and full attacking multiple times per round.

[Venger]

Artifact from an adventure in the back of sandstorm.

thanks! that's a really cool item. sounds like a fun oneshot, but a little problematic for PC use. since you're not a wizard astral projecting from your 180 foot demiplane, being tethered to within 100 feet of a throne might be problematic.

[FMArthur]

Doesn't work though. Using dimension door ends your turn, so the enemies would get away (and a monk is far worse at dimension door than a wizard).

Options here, from worst to best:

The Sun School feat lets you make a single attack after teleporting.
Setting Sun maneuvers exist for teleporting as a standard, move or swift action, leaving you room to attack. Go Wizard/Unarmed swordsage/Jade phoenix mage.
If lich can be adapted to psionics, a Tashalatora monk/ardent can use powers like inconstant location to teleport-spam.
A warlock with levels in the Crinti Shadow Marauder or Telflammar Shadowlord PrCs can shadowpounce, teleporting and full attacking multiple times per round.


Actually, the teleportation chain of maneuvers are Shadow Hand.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

You're talking about its Paralyzing Touch (Su), right? Let's take a look at the type of action this entails:

Supernatural Abilities (Su) (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#supernaturalAbilities)
...Using a supernatural ability is a standard action unless noted otherwise....

Full-Round Actions (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#fullRoundActions)
A full-round action requires an entire round to complete. Thus, it can’t be coupled with a standard or a move action, though if it does not involve moving any distance, you can take a 5-foot step.


I'd also like to see where it says a supernatural touch attack can be delivered via an unarmed strike. From what I've seen, this is only allowed with touch-range spells. A Lich who unarmed strikes an opponent will not deliver his paralyzing touch on any such attack. You are entitled to making a melee touch when activating the paralyzing touch, but you cannot replace it with an unarmed strike. Also, there's no such thing as holding the charge for supernatural abilities, you either deliver the touch when you activate the ability (via a standard action), or you don't deliver the paralyzing touch at all.

[Tenebris]

I'd also like to see where it says a supernatural touch attack can be delivered via an unarmed strike. From what I've seen, this is only allowed with touch-range spells. A Lich who unarmed strikes an opponent will not deliver his paralyzing touch on any such attack. You are entitled to making a melee touch when activating the paralyzing touch, but you cannot replace it with an unarmed strike. Also, there's no such thing as holding the charge for supernatural abilities, you either deliver the touch when you activate the ability (via a standard action), or you don't deliver the paralyzing touch at all.
There is actually such a statement in the attack section of the lich's description. It says that liches using natural attacks can deliver their touch attack on one of them. Thus it's fine for lich to paralyze opponents with their fists. Well, as often as once per round, but that's something.

[Flickerdart]

This won't work since the flurry of whiffs doesn't deliver your paralyzing attacks. I tried making a Vampire build where she used her level drain with similar desires for UAs but no dice. At least for level drain there's an awesome (up two) PrC that allows you to do it.

Anyway you must know that Freedom of Movement ruins this build right?
That's why you use Savage Vampires from Libris Mortis. They drain 1 level per claw attack, with no restrictions, so just load up on claw attacks (hello Undead Meldshaper!) and go to town.

[nedz]

There is actually such a statement in the attack section of the lich's description. It says that liches using natural attacks can deliver their touch attack on one of them. Thus it's fine for lich to paralyze opponents with their fists. Well, as often as once per round, but that's something.

I don't see where it says that ?
In the full attack section it does say that you can use the touch attack as a natural secondary attack.
In the damage section it says that if the Lich uses its natural attacks: it can deal 1d8+5 points of extra damage on one natural attack.

So Mr Monk/Lich could Flurry (with one Stunning Fist and one attack at +1d8+5) and then a secondary touch for permanent paralysis.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

There is actually such a statement in the attack section of the lich's description. It says that liches using natural attacks can deliver their touch attack on one of them. Thus it's fine for lich to paralyze opponents with their fists. Well, as often as once per round, but that's something.

Attack
A lich has a touch attack that it can use once per round. If the base creature can use weapons, the lich retains this ability. A creature with natural weapons retains those natural weapons. A lich fighting without weapons uses either its touch attack or its primary natural weapon (if it has any). A lich armed with a weapon uses its touch or a weapon, as it desires.

Full Attack
A lich fighting without weapons uses either its touch attack (see above) or its natural weapons (if it has any). If armed with a weapon, it usually uses the weapon as its primary attack along with a touch as a natural secondary attack, provided it has a way to make that attack (either a free hand or a natural weapon that it can use as a secondary attack).

I see its options as either using the paralyzing touch, or making a natural weapon attack that doesn't paralyze. On the full attack entry, it can make a secondary attack with either the paralyzing touch or a natural weapon that doesn't paralyze. With a full attack of unarmed strikes it could still use the paralyzing touch as a secondary attack, but none of its unarmed strikes would deliver the paralysis. I see no benefit to making a Monk Lich over using any standard Gish build with a (Persistent) Bite of the Werecreature spell to gain natural weapons, or just wearing a Monk's Belt and substituting everything else with spells.

[Tenebris]

Hmm, true, as I check it now... I must have had another creature on mind. Sorry for disinformation.