3.5 Help with dragon as a PC

[TypoNinja]

So, I'm playing a fang dragon, but having a hard time figuring out how to level up as said dragon.

I'm at 10th level, (so very young LA +4, 6 HD) and I'm just a little confused on if my next level is an LA (and age category) or if I take the hitdice first.

The Draconomicon provides tables for many of the more standard dragons, but not Fang.

I'm currently leaning towards the LA before the HD, because I swear I remember seeing somewhere an example of a Hatchling category for dragons as a sort of pre-wyrmling state where it had its full LA but not all of its hitdice yet, which leads me to conclude the HD for the age category come after the LA. Also that seems logical to me, if one were to think of each age category as its own template then I would have to possess the template before taking its racial hitdice. Sorta like a Were creature, Were first, then the animal.

But for the life of me, I'm either missing something or just can't make sense of the tables in the dragons as PC chapter, cause I've yet to hit the point where I can say "Yes, this is how its done!" rather than "This is how I'd do it".

Any aid here would be appreciated.

[Tvtyrant]

Personally I think the best method to advancing dragons is simply have them advance by HD and then evolve them to the next age category when they have the appropriate HD. It makes them viable without being OP, whereas LA makes them useless and CR makes them super OP.

[Marnath]

You should probably advance by character level unless enough in-game time has passed for you to actually get older. For instance, if I assume you are at 6 years old (the bottom of Very Young) you should only advance one racial hit die every ~3 years, since that's how many there are before you hit Young.

[Coidzor]

Go by character level, take levels in a class.

So your next level up would make you ECL 11, with 6 RHD, 4 LA,and 1 class level. A Martial Adept from ToB will give you an Initiator Level of 4 to start from the RHD combining with the level. Even better if Sovereign Archetypes are on the table from Dragons of Eberron, as the Wyrm of War is pretty solid.

A level of Barbarian would potentially net you pounce as well, if Complete Champion is on the table.

I imagine you're fighty if you're a fang dragon, of course.

[TypoNinja]

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough, I'm not looking for a build, I'm leveling it as a fang dragon for flavor reasons. The game is pretty laid back in terms of optimization so he does just just fine that way.

My problem is I can't figure out if my next level is an age category (and thus an EL) or a HD). I think its an EL, but I can't actually locate anything in the source material to justify that.

But yea, improved nat attack, improved multi attack, magic item to increase size category. It Ginsu's pretty good.

[Red_Dog]

You should probably advance by character level unless enough in-game time has passed for you to actually get older. For instance, if I assume you are at 6 years old (the bottom of Very Young) you should only advance one racial hit die every ~3 years, since that's how many there are before you hit Young.

Pretty much THIS. In my game one player is a full dragon. I gave him some breaks on some LA[as dragons are gimped especially when very very young]. Otherwise my BEST advise to advance as class & take at least ONE level of [B]Soul Eater .
[B]Soul eater 1 is THE greatest dip a character spotting 5 natural attacks can get. If you can't get it as back-story, try talking your DM in letting you do a side quest to get info on a ritual [book does not specify, just like MM doesn't for the Lich].

Yes it burns feats, yes you need to be "evil", BUT if you are tamed (as in not a rabid animal) you can be a great asset to a party. Potentially bestowing 5 negative levels per full attack with NO save is something VERY few things can give you.

If you do not want to be cheesy, just continue as a Soul Eater. On lvl7 you get to double the amount of levels you bestow! ^^ Also, class itself isn't that bad. Its not great, but its full BAB & monk saves (essentially an outsider HD without skills) and has some class abilities ^^

In related stuff, Kensai may be an interesting choice for a lawful dragons as you can enchant your natural weapons and be sure that you won't loose them. The only issue is that its a pair, not all.

Also do not disregard Fighter/Barbarian dips. Pounce and Bonus feats are often nice.

For feats, don't forget Flyby Attack & Multiattack. That's the basics ^^. If you dip Soul Eater, than Libris Mortis gives the great "negative level drain assisting" chain. One gives you health[and does it better with Charisma], the other boosts you[depending on how DM reads it/rules it it stacks anywhere from s#$*t to amazing], and third drains spells[sadly I doubt you can cash in on that too much].
Don't bother with breath stuff (especially for fang dragon) as you aren't big enough and do not spot substantial enough racial Con modifier to be ridiculous with it.

Hope this helps ^^

[Kobold-Bard]

I'd say alternate LA & HD, starting with whichever you need more of to get to the next age category.

If there's an official answer then Curmudgeon in the Q&A thread will know it, maybe try posting there.

[Kogak]

I do not have my book with me at the moment, but does it not specify that the fang dragon mimics a copper dragon for purposes of "fake" levels and HD levels? I seem to recall a little chart with "non standard" dragons and their standard counterparts on the next page following the full-page chart with all the metallic/chromatic leveling charts.

[Urpriest]

I do not have my book with me at the moment, but does it not specify that the fang dragon mimics a copper dragon for purposes of "fake" levels and HD levels? I seem to recall a little chart with "non standard" dragons and their standard counterparts on the next page following the full-page chart with all the metallic/chromatic leveling charts.

This. The book says Fang should be compared to Brass. You have one more LA than Brass and one less HD, but the advancement itself can be exactly the same.

[TypoNinja]

This. The book says Fang should be compared to Brass. You have one more LA than Brass and one less HD, but the advancement itself can be exactly the same.

Oh thanks, that helps a lot! According to the table then I take the LA/age category prior to the hitdice for the new age category. In other words, my HD play catch up to my age.

Many thanks.

Urpriest: totally reading through your monster guide now, I love playing anything but the base races, I've done various were creature, the aforementioned fang dragon, a pixie sorcerer, a centaur cleric, The list goes on :D